posted
I just found out I tested positive for lyme today, but my regular doctor tells me it is in it's early stages.
I am looking at all the symptoms and I have had a few of these symptoms for at least 3-4 years.
The symptoms I have are speratic joint pain that moves from one joint to the next usually the knees, ankles and now the elbow.
Ocassionally I get pain in my toe this made the doctor believe it was gout. I tested the fluid in my knee and it came back negative for gout.
I also have rage issues so bad that I am now on cymbalta.
I also have had terrible rashes on my lower back groin and legs. These symptoms have all been going on for years.
Today my doctor told me that my western blot test shows negative for all bands in the IgG profile but I am positive for bands 41,39 and 23 in the IgM profile.
He said this means the disease is in its early stages or I would have seen positives in the IgG profile.
Is this correct of him to assume?? Please help with any answers I am new to the awareness of this illness and I can use all the help I can get. Thank You
[ 21. March 2008, 09:06 AM: Message edited by: steven loge ]
Posts: 2 | From dix hills, ny | Registered: Mar 2008
| IP: Logged |
"With most infections, your immune system first forms IgM antibodies, then in about 2 to 4 weeks, you see IgG antibodies. In some infections, IgG antibodies may be detectable for years.
Because Borrelia burgdorferi is a chronic persistent infection that may last for decades, you would think patients with chronic symptoms would have positive IgG Western blots.
But actually, more IgM blots are positive in chronic borreliosis than IgG. Every time Borrelia burgdorferi reproduces itself, it may stimulate the immune system to form new IgM antibodies.
Some patients have both IgG and IgM blots positive. But if either the IgG or IgM blot is positive, overall it is a positive result.
Response to antibiotics is the same if either is positive, or both. Some antibodies against the borrelia are given more significance if they are IgG versus IgM, or vice versa.
Since this is a chronic persistent infection, this does not make a lot of sense to me. A newly formed Borrelia burgdorferi should have the same antigen parts as the previous bacteria that produced it.
But anyway, from my clinical experience, these borrelia associated bands usually predict a clinical change in symptoms with antibiotics, regardless of whether they are IgG or IgM."
Glad you found us!! If you need a Lyme Literate MD, go to Seeking a Doctor. From the sounds of it, you DO need one!!
-------------------- --Lymetutu-- Opinions, not medical advice! Posts: 96222 | From Texas | Registered: Feb 2001
| IP: Logged |
bettyg
Unregistered
posted
WELCOME, would you like a copy of my newbie package of 112 pages info galore includes TREEPATROL'S LINK of his archive of over 1000 links of good lyme info?
I've been completely REORGANIZING it; NOT DONE YET; but up to page 60 of 112 pages since I have now created a TABLE OF CONTENTS WITHOUT PAGE NUMBERS since it changes DAILY!
also, please go to TREEPATROL'S NEWBIE INFO IN MEDICAL; at top being features; mark it as a favorite! over 1000 links of good lyme info. He/I have some duplicates.
most of mine is very DETAILED info on certain thigns: SSDI/ss diability insurance benefits; FINANCIAL BURDENS; about IGENEX blood testing, symptoms lists for the basic types, NOIR, no infrared SUNGLASSES, etc. and how to use this board!
if yes, please send me a PM, PRIVATE MESSAGE, it's 2 people standing together icon asking me to send it to you. i will send within 1 day of receipt of your pm; thanks
IP: Logged |
posted
My doctor told me the same thing, that my disease is in the early stage because I have positive Igm and negative IgG. And the quote you posted does support that. What is wrong about what the doctor said?
Posts: 25 | From South Florida | Registered: Mar 2008
| IP: Logged |
Geneal
Frequent Contributor (5K+ posts)
Member # 10375
posted
Well, I would say.....based on 3-4 years of Lyme symptoms,
It is probably not in the early stages.
You need to find a LLMD asap so that you can get the right treatment.
If your doc thinks this is "early" stages, then he/she may not treat
You long enough or with high enough antibiotics.
And please do remember co-infections like babesia and bartonella.
A specialist in Tick Borne Diseases not only knows about these
They also specialize in treating them.
I only had (Quest) band IgM 23 come back positive....
Yet, I have also had symptoms off and on for many years.
I am now in my 18th month of treatment and while winning battles here and there,
Have by no means won the war yet.(Also have babesia and have treated for bartonella)
My LLMD initially thought I had contracted Lyme earlier too.
Like 3-4 months prior to onset of various symptoms.
It is only now as some symptoms disappear that he and I recognize
How long I've had some of these (like since '94).
I just thought I was over tired or doing too much.
Welcome to the board.
Hugs,
Geneal
Posts: 6250 | From Louisiana | Registered: Oct 2006
| IP: Logged |
posted
Lyme is different than other illnesses. Most people with LATE stage will test IgM positive, but not IgG positive. It's one of the wacky natures of Lyme Disease. Very few test IgG positive.
There are theories as to why .... but it's common knowledge amongst those physicians educated on Lyme that IgM and IgG can't differentiate early disease from late.
If you've had symptoms for about four years, you're late stage. I'd find an LLMD .... if you had any other disease, you'd find a specialist, this one needs a specialist, too.
-------------------- sixgoofykids.blogspot.com Posts: 13449 | From Ohio | Registered: Feb 2007
| IP: Logged |
posted
I was bitten by what I thought was a dog tick in September. I suppose the tick could have been a deer tick? Anyway I developed symptoms shortly thereafter. I have positive IgM and negative IgG. So does that mean I am early stage? Sorry to hijack this thread.
Posts: 25 | From South Florida | Registered: Mar 2008
| IP: Logged |
"With most infections, your immune system first forms IgM antibodies, then in about 2 to 4 weeks, you see IgG antibodies. In some infections, IgG antibodies may be detectable for years.
Because Borrelia burgdorferi is a chronic persistent infection that may last for decades, you would think patients with chronic symptoms would have positive IgG Western blots.
But actually, more IgM blots are positive in chronic borreliosis than IgG. Every time Borrelia burgdorferi reproduces itself, it may stimulate the immune system to form new IgM antibodies.
Some patients have both IgG and IgM blots positive. But if either the IgG or IgM blot is positive, overall it is a positive result.
Response to antibiotics is the same if either is positive, or both. Some antibodies against the borrelia are given more significance if they are IgG versus IgM, or vice versa.
Since this is a chronic persistent infection, this does not make a lot of sense to me. A newly formed Borrelia burgdorferi should have the same antigen parts as the previous bacteria that produced it.
But anyway, from my clinical experience, these borrelia associated bands usually predict a clinical change in symptoms with antibiotics, regardless of whether they are IgG or IgM."
-------------------- --Lymetutu-- Opinions, not medical advice! Posts: 96222 | From Texas | Registered: Feb 2001
| IP: Logged |
The Lyme Disease Network is a non-profit organization funded by individual donations. If you would like to support the Network and the LymeNet system of Web services, please send your donations to:
The
Lyme Disease Network of New Jersey 907 Pebble Creek Court,
Pennington,
NJ08534USA http://www.lymenet.org/
UBBFriend: Email this page to someone!
![[Smile]](smile.gif)
Printer-friendly view of this topic