posted
how do you know if you're using too much progesterone cream? what symptoms would you have?
what dose of progesterone cream do you use?
also how can you tell the difference between the agitation from PMS and the agitation from bartonella?
Posts: 255 | From where we don't have Lyme disease | Registered: Jan 2007
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kelmo
Frequent Contributor (1K+ posts)
Member # 8797
posted
Does your progesterone container have a premeasured pump? Do not use the kind in jars.
A premeasured pump should give you your daily requirement of progesterone. You can adjust to how you feel.
If you have been low for a while, it may take a while to wake up the estrogen receptors.
Sometimes, as these receptors are coming to life again, you will have some PMS symptoms. Back off to 1/2 a pump once a day and see if that helps.
I draw a line on my pump and do half pump in the morning after I shower, and half pump before bedtime.
Your body will produce 20mg daily normally. During pregnancy, it shoots up to 400mg daily. Your body can handle A LOT.
Even my obgyn says that you would have to take an entire bottle to get the side effect of sleepiness. That's all.
If you have your period count from the first day. That will be day one. Start on day 12, and end on day 26. Your period should start within 48 hours.
If you don't have a period, take it for 25 days, and give yourself a five day break. I start on the first of the month and go through the 25th.
My daughter has needed more. She does one full pump in the morn and one full pump at night. Her body is under a lot more stress than mine, and progesterone gets eaten up very quickly under stress.
Hope this helps.
Posts: 2903 | From AZ | Registered: Feb 2006
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daise
Unregistered
posted
Hi catwoman,
Have you been tested by blood or saliva to see if progesteroine is what you need?
In the women's hormone field the docs say never mess with your hormones without testing.
I took progesterone for a time and that was exactly the wrong thing to take, for me.
Too much progesterone can cause flat fatigue, if you don't need it. I know!
Just some food for thought. Being cautious! Now I've tested to where I do need it. I'll have to look for the pump kind.
Agitation for bart or agitation from PMS? Don't know.
Because of my condition (PCOS) I never had PMS. But I have probably had bart for decades. I wasn't agitated, but I was somewhat restless. No anxiety due to high cortisol 'til much later.
Rianna
Frequent Contributor (1K+ posts)
Member # 11038
posted
You can get a saliva estrogen/progesterone run to check this throughout the month
Here in the UK we use an amazing lab called NP Tech services - samples will travel from the USA and saliva tests are more reliable and stable for hormones than blood.
It is a great way of knowing that your hormones are set correctly.
posted
Thanks everyone for replying. I've never even heard of progesterone being delivered through a pump; i was never given this option. I use a tsp scoop (20 mgs) once daily.
The reason I'm confused about this is my first luteal blood test (done on day 20) showed my progesterone was REALLY low. so I started on the cream and after a few months the numbers came up. Then recently I did saliva testing that showed my progesterone is three times the maximum limit. So I was advised by one doctor to stop using the progesterone cream but my other doctor says to double it. He is not familiar with saliva testing and he thinks I did the test incorrectly (I did it correctly according to the instructions provided by the saliva hormone company testing lab).
Anyhow I don't know if what I'm having now is due to PMS or what but I have had horrible agitation/anger mixed with very sudden severe drops in mood.
To complicate the picture I have been tapering off my sleep meds and getting a TON of REM sleep and no real sleep to speak off so I figured that can mess with mood too. I went back up to the higher dose of sleep meds (even though the meds don't work anymore I am having a hard time coming off them - right now anyway).
I do have untreated bartonella and a severe yeast infection or what I think is yeast anyway.
As well my period isn't due to start until April 12th. I wonder if PMS would start as early as March 28. I suppose it's possible. I have no other PMS symptoms to speak of though.
My last period only lasted 3 days which is not normal for me. My periods are not normal though. They usually last 5-6 days and they ALWAYS stop on the third day and then restart the next day. I have no idea what that means but it started before the progesterone and continues to be a problem. Last month I thought "OH it's stopped on the 3rd day it'll start up again" but it did not.
I have no clue if my doc is right and the test wasn't accurate; if this is PMS or just a bart relapse. Well not a relapse but just bart symptoms.
I just feel like tearing my hair out and jumping out of my skin and at the same time I feel very low and hopeless. I feel frantically burned out and like I can't handle anything anymore. I just want to escape and finally get some sleep.
Posts: 255 | From where we don't have Lyme disease | Registered: Jan 2007
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kelmo
Frequent Contributor (1K+ posts)
Member # 8797
posted
IT's VERY important to get a vaccuum sealed pump. progesterone degrades very quickly exposed to oxygen.
By the time you are halfway down the jar, the progesterone is gone.
Posts: 2903 | From AZ | Registered: Feb 2006
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daise
Unregistered
posted
I've never seen these progesterone pumps for sale. I'll ask at Vitamin Cottage. Or is it a prescription?
Catwoman:
1.) Possibly Lyme disease depression and Bart anxiety/restlessness.
2.) Possibly Lyme or bart caused your adrenals to overwork, producing too much cortisol. Bad infections are hard on our adrenals, as our adrenals are called upon to overwork and can lead to adrenals making too much cortisol. That brings anxiety and hurts your immune system and muscles.
Your cortisol levels can be "off" at different times of day, in the interim. (Mood and energy levels can be affected at different times of day.)
Can you get a saliva test: a 4-spit saliva test with samples taken at specific times over the course of one day? That can tell a lot! If your levels are off then your LLMD or a good alternative doc can advise you from there.
When your adrenals are overworked for awhile they can put out too much cortisol (and other hormones.) Then, being overworked, the adrenal levels drop to normal on the way to low.
Sometimes the adrenals are still making too many other hormones, yet cortisol levels are low. You'll notice a bad reaction to exersize.
If cortisol levels test low, there are supplements to support your adrenals or if levels are bad enough the doc can prescribe a tiny amount of hydrocortisone (Cordef.) (I suggest also taking the supportive supplements.) Cordef is bioidentical to what your body makes.
Low corticol levels mean atleast adrenal fatigue/adrenal insufficiency. The idea is to give your adrenals a rest--if that is the problem, with cordef--so your adrenals can then "rest" and resume normal production.
We ask a lot of our adrenals, with Lyme and bart.
The far low scale of this is Addison's disease, if low cortisol and the other extreme, high cortisol, can bring Cushing's with a cortisol hump at the back of your lower neck / top of shoulder.
[EDITED] Cordef is not at all the same as prednisone and other non-bioidentical steroids.
Cortisol levels need to be balanced to help you fight Lyme and bart. Maybe your LLMD already has a saliva testing lab they feel is good.
My Medicare Advantage Plan paid for my cortisol saliva test.
A really good book for understanding this is, Feeling Fat, Fuzzy or Frazzled by Richard Shames MD and Karilee Shames RN PhD.
Here is a recent thread on Lymenet called Hydrocortisone and Adrenal Insufficiency:
PCOS can cause stress on the adrenals bringing high cortisol (stress, anxiety, etc) and then dropping past normal to low adrenal cortisol levels, bringing adrenal fatigue/adrenal insufficiency.
3.) Severe yeast infections can bring fatigue and moods.
Stay with it. You already know about saliva testing! You'll get it figured out, whatever the reason.
posted
thanks for replying daise. yeah i had a 4 point saliva cortisol test and it shows elevated cortisol in the evening/night and low cortisol in the AM. when i first got really sick a few years ago i was investigated for addison's disease (my cortisol levels were that low) but looks like it is just adrenal burnout not addison's.
wish i knew where to get the prgesterone pump thing. i am in canada and i don't know if we have that type of thing here.
Posts: 255 | From where we don't have Lyme disease | Registered: Jan 2007
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cantgiveupyet
Frequent Contributor (1K+ posts)
Member # 8165
posted
Catwoman- do you have any compounding pharmacies, they might have a pump. It might only be available when you fill the script, I dont know.
-------------------- "Say it straight simple and with a smile."
"Thus the task is, not so much to see what no one has seen yet, But to think what nobody has thought yet, About what everybody sees."
-Schopenhauer
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