So confused! I'm trying to find out who is having the most success doing what. I have lymes, babs and probably some bart. I have been doing collodial silver, art, teasel root, other herbs and vits for support. I'm paranoid that I should be on hard core antibiotics but some people say that causes the cyst form and causes more trouble later. Can I really get rid of this with the protocol I'm on and no pharmaceutical abx. What do you all thing. I've had lymes for about six years without knowing and have been on this protocol for 5 months. I still feel like hell but the night sweats have stopped. Any advice, experiences much appreciated. Thanks Vanessa
-------------------- vanessa Posts: 4 | From virginia | Registered: Feb 2008
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Keebler
Honored Contributor (25K+ posts)
Member # 12673
posted
-
Have you been tested/evaluated for lyme and co-infections ? While tests are not always accurate, having a specialist evaluate you can be vital. There may be other things going on besides lyme, too.
Regarding your question about "can herbs cause Bb to go into cyst form?"
ANY stressors can cause lyme (no "s") to go into a cyst form, from what I've read. While some of the abx, like, doxycycline do I can't say for sure that the herbal antimicrobials do. I've not read that specifically. But I've not read everything.
A protocol I've been on here and there (funds to low to stick to that one for me), does incorporate an anti-cyst measure.
And, I have read that ANY stress can cause the Bb to go into a cyst - it does not like to be disturbed. Vibration for sure, irritates them.
And, we know certain abx can - as they cause a chemical "stress" to the Bb (borrelia - the lyme sprirochetal bacteria), then it may follow that strong herbal anti-spirochetal formulas MIGHT.
Others may know for sure, however, even on herbal protocols, anti-cyst products are use.
There are books by several authors - with several different protocols. If you choose herbs and vitamins, it may be best to follow a particular protocol that has studied and addresses all the life cycles/shapes/forms of Bb. As well, co-infections, as you know, require attention- and timing of that may need to be adjusted.
Amazon has many books on lyme and babesia. you can see the customer reviews and look inside some of the books to get an idea.
I'm out of steam, but you might want to check out the NEWBIE section here. Others will be along soon who have more experience than I or who have specific passages from authors addressing this very important question.
This paper summarizes the major clinical issues surrounding chronic Lyme disease and the underlying pathophysiology of the disease. This information will serve as a foundation for the herbal practitioner's clinical approach to chronic Lyme disease.
The corresponding presentation at the AHG conference will focus on specific case studies and the nuts and bolts of seeing clients with Lyme disease.
14 pages pdf
not sure of date, but there are citations for articles written in 2007.
---
this is the link for the tread here where it was posted:
klutzo
Frequent Contributor (1K+ posts)
Member # 5701
posted
I don't know if you are familiar with the now defunct Bowen QRiBb Lyme test, but it was considered cutting edge at one time. It has now been replaced by the flow cytometry test.
I had two positive Bowen tests,and both of them found only the cyst form. I have the pictures of these cystic L-forms that came with my test results. (The QRiBb test used a fluorescent stain to see actual organisms,rather than antibody testing.)
The relevant point here is that one of those tests was done before I had any treatment whatsoever, and yet cyst forms were found.
The second test was done after 8 months of herbal treatment only, and showed a reduction in the numbers, but it was still quite high. (The QRiBb test also provided a "serial dilution", ie. the amt. of organisms seen in blood).
The second test was done 8 months after the first one. The herbal protocols I did before the second test were the complete Zhang Protocol for 6 months, followed by the first (very simple) Cowden Protocol for 2 months. That early model of the Cowden Protocol was just Samento and Burbur and I dropped Burbur, because it did not help me, replacing it with chlorella.
I have never had any ABX, yet both tests found only L-forms. I continue to take a low dose of Samento only, and have been taking it about 4 years now. I am by no means cured, but can't take ABX, due to severe allergy to all of the ones that kill Borrelia.
Klutzo
Posts: 1269 | From Clearwater, Florida, USA | Registered: May 2004
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sixgoofykids
Honored Contributor (10K+ posts)
Member # 11141
posted
There are also meds for the cyst form, so that can be treated while on abx.
In my case, my immune system seems to be very strong, so we cut back on abx to see if we could eliminate this more naturally. I do much, much better on the stronger meds.
In addition to the pharmaceuticals, I also use many herbs. I think you can find the right combo that works well for you.
-------------------- sixgoofykids.blogspot.com Posts: 13449 | From Ohio | Registered: Feb 2007
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sparkle7
Frequent Contributor (5K+ posts)
Member # 10397
posted
I took antibiotics for about 8 months & had no change in my symptoms other than worse issues with yeast & pain in my abdomen (which I didn't have prior).
Some people think the only way to get well is by doing massive amounts of abx. It just didn't work for me & I don't want to continue with them. I think they are good to use for a limited time but I think it's counter-productive to be on them for a long period of time.
There are many good herbal protocols. I'm doing the full Cowden right now. I started getting some pain in my abdomen & yeast issues so I started using a product called Yeast-Cleanse. I got a pretty intense herx from it & someone posted a thread about the fact that grapefruit seed extract can bust cysts. Yeast-Cleanse has garlic, caprylic acid, & grapefruit seed extract among other ingredients.
Some feel it's good to change the herbs you use fairly often to make sure you are still killing the bacteria. I feel it's important to stick with it & try different things if the herbs you are using aren't working. The Cowden protocol is pretty good since you rotate the key herbs after a month or 2.
I believe that you can get rid of Lyme by using herbs & supplements. Many people who use abx still get relapses. I guess it's an issue of what you feel is more comfortable. Some people have good results with abx but it's not for everyone.
I'm going to stick with the herbal protocols for now.
Posts: 7772 | From Northeast, again... | Registered: Oct 2006
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posted
I have sincere doubts you can get rid of Lyme, babs, and bart without abx. I just don't see it happening!
If you're not going to use abx, then I would suggest the strongest herbs possible. Teasel and Samento have very limited action against Lyme and probably none against babs and bart.
In my opinion, artemisinin without a macrolide is useless. Your body will become very used to the art very quickly and it will do nothing for the babs.
Colloidal Silver? Doubtful.
-------------------- --Lymetutu-- Opinions, not medical advice! Posts: 96239 | From Texas | Registered: Feb 2001
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sixgoofykids
Honored Contributor (10K+ posts)
Member # 11141
posted
quote:Originally posted by Lymetoo: In my opinion, artemisinin without a macrolide is useless.
The Dr. B guidelines say this as well.
-------------------- sixgoofykids.blogspot.com Posts: 13449 | From Ohio | Registered: Feb 2007
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posted
it's simply not true that you must use ab's to treat lyme and other tbd's to efficacy. i agree that ab's can be prudent, if not lifesaving at times.
i have experienced the need and efficacy of both ab's and alternative treatments. i feel fortunate i could take and had access to both.
however, there is also a considerable subset of patients who cannot possibly take ab's. ie: anyone who contracts c.diff can't take them for quite a lo0ng time, there are other gastro obstacles that can occur, some people have allergies to whole classes of ab's, or -- an allergy to the particular one that would be most effective for them, and on and on.
people who cannot use ab's have indeed gotten well!! it's in no way hopeless if you can't take them.
there must be more resources made available to those that can't do the ab's. i know doc h. in ny will use chinese herbal protocols with patients who cannot take ab's. he is an excellent llmd.
that said:
from all of my research, the top herbs i would try in treating these diseases are:
artimisinin - must be top quality, properly administered.
olive leaf extract - same deal - and this one has alot of research behind it as far as natural medicines go.
teasel root - again, only with those practitioner's protocols that have worked, and the product itself is important
sarsparilla is excellent for supportive means, and was even used to treat syphillis prior to the existance of ab's.
alternative treatments can work
in my experience and years of research, i do not believe ab's alone can make you fully well. (as necessary and effective as they can be at certain times)
what it takes to get well is deep awareness and understanding of your illness and body and a staunch committment to wellness, a committment to educated focus on overcoming these diseases and rebuilding your immune system and health. what you use is beside that point.
mo
[ 17. May 2008, 06:14 PM: Message edited by: Mo ]
-------------------- life shrinks and expands in proportion to one's courage -- anais nin Posts: 8337 | From the other shore | Registered: Jul 2002
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daise
Unregistered
posted
Hi vanessa,
You are new to Lymeland and you are confused. I hear you!
Here's how I see it.
Prolonged, high-dose multiple antibiotics while under the care of an LLMD (Lyme-literate MD) who is also an ILADS (International Lyme and Associated Diseases Society) doctor has helped most patients who were compliant to meds (unless a med was wrong for them.) Beware, because any doctor can call themselves an LLMD.
Typically, this would include a number of supplements for support, to help your immune system to work in partnership with the antibiotics, and supplements that support your body overall.
There are MANY protocols that do not have a track record. Their protocols are theoretical. At the least, for those starting chronic Lyme treatment, I see these as being marketable. Some patients approach these methods being fanatical and naive'.
Klinghardt is so far out there it can't even be considered, in my opinion. I am not about to inject myself with my own pee.
An example is coconut oil. Coconut oil has been heavily marketed for years in health food stores and supplement-type ads.
Fact: It is one of the foods with the highest concentration of saturated fats known to man and beast! High cholesterol and lipids are common with Lyme patients. So is weight gain.
But so is wear and tear on the GI tract, having to deal with shovefuls of saturated fats!
Another example: coconut oil has been heavily marketed to help hypothroidism. That could not be more false. But some people choose to believe the marketing.
When a patient runs down those roads, their body can get worse, even permanently worse. The idea is to treat right away and agressively to try to kill Lyme germs and those of other pathogens. Adults and children can die from Lyme / coinfections.
There is no "equivalent" alternative to high dose, prolonged multiple antibiotics--but there are a number of people selling theoretical protocols, and in addition, some don't realize that they are selling these protocols.
You hear their marketing talk. Their fanaticism. But when it doesn't work they typically won't say so.
Some are not at all well after years of high dose, prolonged multiple antibiotics. Well ... could it be a virus? What shape is their GI tract in? What else might they have? Did they do steroids (prednisone, etc.) What shape is their immune system in? These are the tricky things they think about. My heart goes out to them.
No one is saying that high dose, prolonged multiple antibiotics will cure you. It seems to be common that fatigue is left over. Some have other concerns.
Some say they can't take antibiotics. But what exactly does that mean? Does it mean that their GI tract can't handle the antibiotics? To me, that means they need to see a great gastroenterologist to find out what is wrong--and try to fix it as best they can. Some just can't take certain antibiotics.
Please understand that some people come to this board to sell supplements. We see that all the time. There are probably hundreds of supplements, theoretical protocals and therapies "said" to greatly help or cure Lyme. Wait a minute!
Some medical research papers seem to be the result of a study that was "bought" by profiteers: especially the painkiller, statin and antidepressant superindustries.
Often, medical research papers must be seen in light of the whole. If one cellular factor is found in a study--well--what about the other 999 cellular factors? Ideally, they all need to dance together.
When I see a research paper one of the things that runs through my mind is whether a lay person, like me, could take it's conclusion out of context.
A number of people cite medical research--yet have never--or seem to have never--made a copy of Dr. B's 33 pages of tips for 2005 at www.ILADS.org (on the left menu click "Treatment Guidelines.")
I don't understand why anyone would fully dismiss this body of work--representing the result of blood, sweat and tears of doctors and their patients--and what is rational and seems to help, by clinical observation and research.
See above Dr. B's on the website: The ILADS Guidelines! I get the idea that a number of patients have never read those. That is not rational. And for a newbie, all of the confusion of information overload can blind them to the fact that these bodies of work exist!
Now you know about these two important bodies of information!
It's known that some supplements can help put you in remission. But that doesn't mean anything when Lyme is well known to go in remission and then to come roaring back, worse than before. It can disable. It can turn brain to mush, so-to-speak, from a practical standpoint! That can be wholly frightening.
I've come a great, long way on antibiotics and I'm working on the other tick infections. I see myself as eventually going on a low dose maintenance antibiotic, probably for life or until something better comes along. I am so very grateful for my antibiotic program.
Some say that all the LLMD's do is experimental and we are their guinea pigs. Wait a minute!
Nearly all treatment for diseases and conditions of humans must be considered experimental. Thank God! That's how most of us get better. That's how those who come behind us will have an easier time of it, due to a more refined treatment program. Just as we are the benefactors of those who were treated in the past.
If you got cancer, would you try some unproven protocol--even with a bunch of testimonials--in lieu of what was known to help? Or would you go the route of treatment known to help others? I'm not at all saying that cancer treatment is perfect--and it's an industry with entities lurking that are also interested in profits over patients.
1.) Chronic Lyme is serious and the longer you have it, the harder it is to treat.
2.) Those who say "antibiotics are bad for you" are the IDSA doctors (Infectious Disease Society of America.) They represent your local infectious disease doctors and except for a little handful of these doctors, they are the enemy of every Lyme patient. (Do a "search" at the top of this page!)
But some Lyme patients say the same thing as IDSA: antibiotics are bad for you.
"I say, antibiotics need to be taken "smart."
3.)The overwhelming responsible body of work that's been done (or research brought forward)has been by ILADS doctors (and sometimes patients!) to help the real, live human being who is hurting ... looking to them for help.
4.) Please remember, some people are selling things on this board for profit.
5.) LLMD's who are ILADS doctors practice medicine to help us at risk of loosing their license to practice. Who would do that? Hero doctors, that's who! They are individuals too, and typically approach each patient from their individual view of what they're seeing that you need.
6.) Untreated, chronic Lyme is sooner or later painfully disabling. Financial ruin is common. Lyme made me disabled and poor. I finally figured-out what I have: Lyme disease and company! I get SSDI. That's real.
I hope that's not you, or if it is, that you can find enough social help to get you by.
Typically it takes 1-3 years of antibiotic treatment and more is not unusual.
7.) These supplement protocols being sold are: one size fits all. However, most LLMD's who are ILADS doctors realize how different all of our needs are and how different all of our bodies can react and how different all of our diseases affect us. Then there are genetics! Good grief!
Therefore, most treat us as individuals as best they can.
8.) Some chronic Lyme patients are not helped much by long term antibiotics and they've desperately tried to figure-out why--and often come here to this board--and they've come to a conclusion that Buehners or Cowdens protocol, or whatever, might help them. I dearly hope so.
9.) In great part, because of IDSA the snake-oil salespeople abound.
10.) It's a shame that too many posts here tout garbage. It's confusing for newbies! But living in a free society means that anyone can fall for garbage and anyone can market garbage--along with free speech.
11.) I think most would agree that getting far on the other side of chronic Lyme requires one foot in conventional medicine and one foot in sound alternative medicine / sound therapies.
12.) Many with chronic Lyme are poor. We only have so much to spend. You're trying to spend it wisely to help yourself--good for you!
13.) Many are too poor, have no insurance, or insurance turned them down for meds. They are suffering badly. They wish with all their heart that they could afford Lyme treatment for themselves or their children.
14.) Priorities are important. For example (I better use an example from outside the Lyme field,) garlic has been touted to help high cholesterol and lipids. However, it helps so very little that it is not at all worth spending time and money on.
The garlic pills industry disagrees. Their marketing is still seen, to this day, repeated in magazines, books and on the Internet. That bull goes along with a free society (though I wish some reporters, writers and editors would not believe--or go along with--what their advertising clients promote. Stop it!)
15.) Not all supplements sold in a health food store are potent--and some can hurt you. The most expensive is not necessarily the best quality. That alone is confusing, I know. Maybe you aleady know that!
16.) I expect to receive a rash of nasty private messages from those whose toes I've stepped on.
17.) Chronic Lyme is always a personal journey. What's said often as a great saying because it's all too true: Hang-in there, vanessa! Chronic Lyme is a long road. It just is.
It's a fact that the best LLMD doctors can not explain in stick-figure terms exactly why antibiotics work or certain antibiotics work. They have theories, thoughts and ideas about some things. In human terms (as opposed to stick-figure medicine,) they observe their patients and along with research they make discoveries!
To help us.
One thing, they know that we have cells. Hurray! Most conventional doctors do not know that we have cells, and proceed, with the belief that we are all stick-figures. Stick-figure medicine!
18.) Using the "search" button near the top of any page might answer questions or give options. You're welcome to post questions, of course. None of us are doctors (or if some are they don't say so!)
19.) You said you are confused. That's typical! Why wouldn't you be confused? Lymeland means information overload for newbies, in every way. I'm sorry.
Did you get BettyG's newbie package? If not, just send her a private message. (i.e. go to the top of any page and click "directory." Type her name, click, and then click "more" under her name. Once on your computer, it is searchable information.
20.) I've tried some off-the-wall supplements that I later wished I hadn't. That's common in Lymeland because we're all desperate to get better.
And we are besieged on all sides in every way. IDSA says chronic Lyme does not exist. Does that mean we don't exist? They wish! But oh yes, we're here!
21.) For emotional support you might check the General Forum from time to time. Special things happen there.
________
In many ways, all chronic Lyme patients, even those who don't know yet that they have Lyme, are like one big voice crying out Help Me!
That can be said in every way: physically, financially, socially, within families, within ourselves as we have to find the patience to stay with treatment and herxes, mentally, emotionally, spiritually ... and many more ways.
Right when we need to learn, we Lymies have brain problems with learning, recalling and prioritizing. Ugh!
"11.) I think most would agree that getting far on the other side of chronic Lyme requires one foot in conventional medicine and one foot in sound alternative medicine / sound therapies."
I agree, but hopefully, the conventional comes first.
-------------------- --Lymetutu-- Opinions, not medical advice! Posts: 96239 | From Texas | Registered: Feb 2001
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daise
Unregistered
posted
Hi TuTu,
I was referring to basics like fish oil, magnesium, B-complex and so forth--from Dr.B's guidelines plus sound therapies like myofascial work.
sparkle7
Frequent Contributor (5K+ posts)
Member # 10397
posted
I just don't believe that the only way to get rid of Lyme is by taking a long term treatment with antibiotics. I'm not a fanatic or anti-drug. I'm also not selling any particular protocol or way of thinking about illnesses.
I don't have time to present a long, drawn out statement about it. I respect whatever your opinion may be, daise, but there are other approaches to illness. It's not all black vs. white.
IDSA & ILADS are not the only voices & opinions about how to treat Lyme. It's a personal decision for each person with Lyme after doing research & considering the options.
There are people on other message boards (& probably on this message board) who have gotten over Lyme by using the alternative protocols. It's not fiction. We all are different & respond in different ways to treatment.
BTW - Your statements about coconut oil are incorrect. Cold pressed oils are different than hydrogenated fats. Do further research & you will see what the differences are.
As far as I know, no one has claimed being cured from Lyme by using coconut oil. It's a food that may be of use to reduce bacteria... just like broccoli may be useful in preventing some forms of cancer.
Posts: 7772 | From Northeast, again... | Registered: Oct 2006
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AZURE WISH
Frequent Contributor (1K+ posts)
Member # 804
posted
I would never tell anyone which direction they should go we have different combos of infections, different immune symptoms, diferrent severity, different durations, and there are multiple strains... one size doesnt fit all with tbds.
But my expereince is that i need the abx or i will get much much sicker very fast.
You really should be under the care of a lyme literate dr whatever combination of traditional/alternative you decide to take.
quote:Originally posted by sparkle7: I just don't believe that the only way to get rid of Lyme is by taking a long term treatment with antibiotics. I'm not a fanatic or anti-drug. I'm also not selling any particular protocol or way of thinking about illnesses.
I don't have time to present a long, drawn out statement about it. I respect whatever your opinion may be, daise, but there are other approaches to illness. It's not all black vs. white.
IDSA & ILADS are not the only voices & opinions about how to treat Lyme. It's a personal decision for each person with Lyme after doing research & considering the options.
There are people on other message boards (& probably on this message board) who have gotten over Lyme by using the alternative protocols. It's not fiction. We all are different & respond in different ways to treatment.
BTW - Your statements about coconut oil are incorrect. Cold pressed oils are different than hydrogenated fats. Do further research & you will see what the differences are.
As far as I know, no one has claimed being cured from Lyme by using coconut oil. It's a food that may be of use to reduce bacteria... just like broccoli may be useful in preventing some forms of cancer.
luvs2ride
Frequent Contributor (1K+ posts)
Member # 8090
posted
Daise said:
Some say that all the LLMD's do is experimental and we are their guinea pigs. Wait a minute!
Nearly all treatment for diseases and conditions of humans must be considered experimental. Thank God! That's how most of us get better. That's how those who come behind us will have an easier time of it, due to a more refined treatment program. Just as we are the benefactors of those who were treated in the past.
So, in a nutshell, what I understand Daise to be saying is "she is willing to experiment with antibiotics but not alternatives."
That is fine. Like all of us, Daise has a right to choose her preferred treatment.
We just have to recognize she has a personal bias against natural, alternative (which was standard and conventional before laboratories invented synthetic drugs) healing methods.
BTW, I totally disagree with your position on Coconut Oil too.
Luvs
-------------------- When the Power of Love overcomes the Love of Power, there will be Peace. Posts: 3038 | From america | Registered: Oct 2005
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daise
Unregistered
posted
Hi Luvs to ride,
I don't at all have anything against natural or alternative methods. I've used many myself. Please don't write things about me that are not true. Please don't comment when you haven't read my post, above.
There is "alternative" ... and then there is "irresponsible."
This thread is for a newbie who is confused. Who wouldn't be, with some of the garbage threads?
Michelle M
Frequent Contributor (1K+ posts)
Member # 7200
posted
The Dr. Burrascano Guidelines are an excellent place to start.
Even those who go on to herbal remedies often start out for at least a time with antibiotics.
However, there are some people who either cannot, or do not want to, take antibiotics. I cannot speak for those people. Nor can I speak to their cure rate since I do not know what it might be.
I was on antibiotics for about 18 months for lyme and babesia WA-1. I was rebitten again and did even more antibiotics after half a year off all of it.
No matter what course you choose to take, you should find a lyme literate doctor who will treat you according to the type of treatment you choose. There are so many things that need attention, such as your liver and your general health. You really should not self-treat unless it's a matter of life and death! If you have an LLMD already, make sure and ask questions and understand your treatment.
While this board is invaluable for support, there are so many remedies spoken of on here that I would hate to be new and confused and trying to determine which one was the correct one for me. I would consult an LLMD who was an expert in the type of medicine I chose (either conventional, herbal, or a combination) and go from there. Otherwise, you are very likely to be overwhelmed.
Do you presently have an LLMD helping you with treatment?
Michelle
Posts: 3193 | From Northern California | Registered: Apr 2005
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AZURE WISH
Frequent Contributor (1K+ posts)
Member # 804
posted
This is the link to dr b's guidlines that michelle was talking about.
The way I see it -- doing nothing is not an option. I know there are some people who say Lyme can go into remission on its own -- maybe it can. But even if that is true -- do you want to take the chance that you wait too long to treat and end up like someone with undiagnosed syphilis?
Hubby has been sick and disabled for over 7 years. The first two years he was undiagnosed. Treatment has been interupted many times due to financial reasons and trouble finding physicians etc.
In my opinion, the number one priority is knowing what bugs you are dealing with. With both herbs and antibiotics there are specific protocols for each infection. And don't believe anyone who says Babesia or Bartonella cannot be chronic infections.
If the book had been available when hubby first was diagnosed I would have put him on the Healing Lyme protocol. But at that time we didn't know he had Bartonella so we would not have known to treat for it.
Hubby did 4 -6 months of the core protocol a couple of years ago and remains on several of the herbs. He never could tolerate the andrographis which is probably one of the reasons he didn't make more progress with this protocol.
I feel a combo of both herbs and antibiotics works best.
Hubby tried for several years to just treat one infection at a time -- Lyme, Babesia or Bartonella -- he would start doing better for awhile, but never got rid of any of the infections. Is currently treating all 3 infections at the same time -- has never done this before so can't say how it will turn out.
Hubby has done all sorts of treatment -- everything from IV colloidal silver to numerous different IV antibiotics.
In my opinion worrying about the cyst form is not even relevant in the early stages of treatment. The goal is to reduce your overall bacterial load so your immune system can take over and keep the infection in check.
Read and talk to as many people as you can and then make your own decisions. Lyme treatment is evolving -- there are new tests and new treatments all the time. Don't lock yourself into one protocol. It took time to get sick and it takes time to get healthy.
If something is not working then move on to something else.
As for the teasel -- hubby's herbalist says only 2% of patients have success with this herb. Yes, hubby tried it, but didn't notice anything. He has primarily neuro and G.I. symptoms and no arthritic symptoms so that may explain why it didn't help.
i don't know if herbs alone are enough. I do know that hubby has ended up in the ER and in the hospital from both herbal treatment and from antibiotic treatment.
The main problem with these tickborne infections is to know when to back off on the treatment so you don't make yourself so sick that everything comes to a crashing halt and you are back to square one literally. Herxheimer reactions are real and need to be taken seriously. That is why you need a good doc who can advise you.
Docs who specialize in lyme and tickborne illnesses can clinically diagnose the coinfections based on symptoms. They also know what to look for in regards to herb or drug side effects. Find a doc you can communicate with.
There are other forums where more of the patients use herbal treatments. I would seek out others on the internet or in person who have used the specific herbs or treatments you are taking.
You might try posting several different topics. Ask for people to share experiences on the Cowden protocol or the Zhang protocol (Chinese herbs) or the Healing Lyme protocol etc. Most people seem to be on just one of these protocols at a time. Homeopathy never seemed to do anything for hubby, but there are others who believe strongly in that.
During treatment one of the most important things you can do is keep a diary. Make notes when you change meds or herbs or supplements. Then list changes in symptoms. Every 3 or 4 months or more frequently reevaluate your progress and see what is working for you or not working.
Glad you found us here on LymeNet. Ask all the questions you like. Just realize that most people on LymeNet primarily use antibiotics although some take both antibiotics and herbs. Ones who use herbs only are in the minority here.
Bea Seibert
[ 21. May 2008, 08:26 PM: Message edited by: seibertneurolyme ]
Posts: 7306 | From Martinsville,VA,USA | Registered: Oct 2004
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posted
Hi Vanessa - I just wanted to chime in with some hugs for you. Lyme and all can be very overwhelming. All the treatment options, weighing the pros and cons, is very confusing at times.
I hope you have a good doctor and wish you much luck.
And FWIW - I'm also using a good quality silver product that I really like. I feel like it has done me a lot of good. And while some disagree as to the benefits, I don't let them discourage me. I'm also on abx, and lots of other good things like B's, vitamin C and vitamin D. Vitamin D is necessary to develop natural killer cells.
Keep researching and learning. Take it one day and at a time.
Posts: 101 | From USA | Registered: Apr 2007
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