posted
It has been almost 10 years since hubby had his last tetanus booster shot.
Do most LLMD's suggest Lyme patients get these shots or not? Hubby has an appointment with his LLMD in a couple of weeks, but I was just curious as to what others have done or been told by their docs.
Bea Seibert
Posts: 7306 | From Martinsville,VA,USA | Registered: Oct 2004
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Hoosiers51
Frequent Contributor (1K+ posts)
Member # 15759
posted
DON'T DO IT!!!!!!!!!!!
I can only say that from personal experience, especially if it is the DPT or whatever it's called, where it does diptheria and pertussis too.
I got this vaccine about a year and a half ago, and at that point I was as good as I had been since I had first gotten sick 7 years ago. I was working a few hours a week as a waitress, taking a couple classes.....
I got the vacccine, and it was horrible. I can't remember if it was the first day I got it or the next day, but I literally could not get off the couch. Some people, they say, can have reactions to this vaccine, but mine was far beyond "normal."
I was so weak I was terrified, and I still to this day don't feel like I have gotten back to where I was before I got the vaccine. ALL my symptoms got worse again. I was devastated.
I did eventually get up off the couch....after about a week I could do some things, but I never got it all back.
Tetanus sounds really harmless as a vaccine, but usually this booster shot isn't just for tetanus, as I mentioned. Even if he could just get tetanus on it's own, I wouldn't risk it!!!!
Keep in mind, what I have told you is just my personal experience, but I would hate to think what happened to me could happen to someone else....
I wish I would have never gotten that shot. I called my LLMD and he thought it was an okay idea, and afterwards, I told him about my reaction and he sounded really concerned.
This is just a warning....I would not wish what I went through on anyone! The effects were long-lasting. And honestly, after what I went through, I will never get another vaccine as long as I live, for fear of relapse.
(interestingly, I got a flu vaccine like 5 years ago and didn't see this problem, but then again, I was so sick then I don't know if I would have been able to tell)
Posts: 4590 | From Midwest | Registered: Jun 2008
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dontlikeliver
Frequent Contributor (1K+ posts)
Member # 4749
posted
I've been debating about getting it or not myself for the last 5 years. The last one I had was 1993. My LLMD said it's OK to have it, but my gut says no.
I was relieved recently though when I talked with my nurse practitioner (not my LLMDs nurse practitioner, but my local GPs). She told me that recent studies have shown that as long as you've had a certain number of tetanus shots/boosters in your life (I can't remember if it was 3 or 5) then you're OK for life. Anyway, she said I really didn't need anymore unless I was going to be doing high risk stuff or travelling to high-risk place for Tetanus.
So, it might be worth asking about what I was told. Sorry, I have not references for her statement about 'recent studies'.
Posts: 2824 | From The Back of Beyond | Registered: Oct 2003
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lymebytes
Frequent Contributor (1K+ posts)
Member # 11830
posted
No vaccine's of any kind flu, tetnus or otherwise....NO.
Some Md's believe that one tetnus shot lasts a lifetime...questionable, but I wouldn't risk any vaccination ever again.
NanaDubo
Frequent Contributor (1K+ posts)
Member # 14794
posted
My vote is no - not ever! no flu vaccine, no shingles vaccine, no DPT for sure!
It nearly killed my son when he was an infant. The doctor then decided it would be best if we left out the "P" as he thinks that's what made him sick.
That was 20 years ago so they knew even then there just might be a problem.
I don't believe I will ever get another vaccine as long as I live - how ever long that may be Posts: 1129 | From Maine | Registered: Feb 2008
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hiker53
Frequent Contributor (5K+ posts)
Member # 6046
posted
I will never get another vaccine. Got my one and only flu vaccine 9 months after my lyme symptoms (mainly ears problems and imbalance). I was doing much better and then after the vaccine my myoclonus jerks started.
Coincidence? Maybe, but I think the vaccine contributed as my immune system was still a bit weak. Up until my myoclonus I could still walk 3-5 miles daily. Now I use a walking stick and only walk every other day for 20 minutes or so. Hiker53
-------------------- Hiker53
"God is light. In Him there is no darkness." 1John 1:5 Posts: 8890 | From Illinois | Registered: Aug 2004
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Keebler
Honored Contributor (25K+ posts)
Member # 12673
posted
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Here are just a few of the search results from here:
Keebler
Honored Contributor (25K+ posts)
Member # 12673
posted
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Tetanus can be in soil. A dog or cat scratch can spread it - it's way more complex than I understood it to be.
I had some serious reactions to a vaccine about 20 years ago, but it may have been from the mercury in it. I had gotten a new puppy and was concerned about the scratches I'd gotten - that is one way it can be transfered from soil.
Tetanus is a medical condition that is characterized by a prolonged contraction of skeletal muscle fibers. The primary symptoms are caused by tetanospasmin, a neurotoxin produced by the Gram-positive, obligate anaerobic bacterium Clostridium tetani.
Infection generally occurs through wound contamination, and often involves a cut or deep puncture wound. As the infection progresses, muscle spasms in the jaw develop hence the common name, lockjaw.
This is followed by difficulty swallowing and general muscle stiffness and spasms in other parts of the body.[1] Infection can be prevented by proper immunization and by post-exposure prophylaxis.[2]
The clinical manifestations of tetanus are caused when tetanus toxin blocks inhibitory nerve impulses, by preventing the release of inhibitory neurotransmitters GABA and glycine. The result is disinhibition, or increased relative excitation.
This leads to unopposed muscle contraction and spasm. Seizures may occur, and the autonomic nervous system may also be affected.
The frequency of action potentials at the neuromuscular junctions increases above a threshold at which point muscle fibers enter a state of tetanus, a state of sustained maximal contraction. The term tetany refers to sustained muscle contraction that is not caused by tetanus.
* [incomplete] Association with rust
Tetanus is often associated with rust, especially rusty nails, but this concept is somewhat misleading. Objects that accumulate rust are often found outdoors, or in places that harbor anaerobic bacteria, but the rust itself does not cause tetanus nor does it contain more C. tetani bacteria.
The rough surface of rusty metal merely provides a prime habitat for a C. tetani endospore to reside. An endospore is a non-metabolising survival structure that begins to metabolise and cause infection once in an adequate environment.
Because C. tetani is an anaerobic bacterium, it, and its endospores, will thrive in an environment that lacks oxygen. Hence, stepping on a nail (rusty or not) may result in a tetanus infection, due to the ideal bacterial breeding ground provided by the low-oxygen environment of a puncture wound.
* Prevention
Tetanus can be prevented by vaccination.[5] The CDC recommends that adults receive a booster vaccine every ten years, and standard care in many places is to give the booster to any patient with a puncture wound who is uncertain of when he or she was last vaccinated, or if the patient has had fewer than 3 lifetime doses of the vaccine.
The booster cannot prevent a potentially fatal case of tetanus from the current wound, as it can take up to two weeks for tetanus antibodies to form. In children under the age of seven, the tetanus vaccine is often administered as a combined vaccine, DPT vaccine or DTaP, which also includes vaccines against diphtheria and pertussis.
For adults and children over seven, the Td vaccine (tetanus and diphtheria) or Tdap (tetanus, diphtheria, and acellular pertussis) is commonly used.[5]
* Several types listed. One is:
Generalized tetanus is the most common type of tetanus, representing about 80% of cases. The generalized form usually presents with a descending pattern. The first sign is trismus or lockjaw, followed by stiffness of the neck, difficulty in swallowing, and rigidity of pectoral and calf muscles.
Other symptoms include elevated temperature, sweating, elevated blood pressure, and episodic rapid heart rate. Spasms may occur frequently and last for several minutes. Spasms continue for 3-4 weeks and complete recovery may take months.
* Epidemiology
(MAP at site) Tetanus cases reported worldwide (1990-2004). Ranging from strongly prevalent (in dark red) to very few cases (in light yellow) (gray, no data).
Tetanus is a global health problem since C. tetani and Geravium tetani spores are ubiquitous. The disease occurs almost exclusively in persons who are unvaccinated or inadequately immunized.[1]
Tetanus occurs worldwide but is more common in hot, damp climates with soil rich in organic matter.
This is particularly true with manure-treated soils, the spores are widely distributed in the intestines and feces of many non-human animals such as horses, sheep, cattle, dogs, cats, rats, guinea pigs, and chickens.
In agricultural areas, a significant number of human adults may harbor the organism. The spores can also be found on skin surfaces and in contaminated heroin.[2]
Tetanus, particularly the neonatal form, remains a significant public health problem in non-industrialized countries. There are about one million cases of tetanus reported worldwide, causing an estimated 300,000 to 500,000 deaths each year.[2]
In the US, there are fewer than 100 cases and approximately five deaths each year.[6]
Nearly all of the cases in the US occur in unimmunized individuals or individuals who have allowed their inoculations to lapse, whereas most cases in developing countries are due to the neonatal form of tetanus.
Tetanus is not contagious from person to person and is the only vaccine-preventable disease that is infectious but is not contagious.
Thiomersal (INN) (C9H9HgNaO2S), commonly known in the United States as thimerosal, is an organomercury compound (approximately 49% mercury by weight) used as an antiseptic and antifungal agent.
It was developed and registered under the trade name Merthiolate in 1928 by the pharmaceutical company Eli Lilly and Company, and has been used as a preservative in vaccines, immunoglobulin preparations, skin test antigens, antivenins, ophthalmic and nasal products, and tattoo inks.
In the U.S., the European Union, and a few other affluent countries, the compound has been phased out from vaccines routinely given to children.
Packaging the vaccines in single-dose vials eliminates the need for bacteriostatics such as thiomersal.[citation needed]
. . .
In the U.S., the only exceptions among vaccines routinely recommended for young children are most formulations of the inactivated influenza vaccine.
Several vaccines not routinely recommended for young children contain thimerosal, including DT (diphtheria and tetanus), Td (tetanus and diphtheria), and TT (tetanus toxoid). Other vaccines may contain a trace of thiomersal from steps in manufacture.[1]
Also, four rarely-used treatments for pit viper, coral snake, and black widow venom still contain thimerosal.[4]
Outside North America and Europe, many vaccines contain thiomersal; the World Health Organization has concluded that there is no evidence of toxicity from thimerosal in vaccines and no reason on grounds of safety to change to more-expensive single-dose administration.[5]
Keebler I did do a search last night after I posted and found those threads. Several more people answered this thread that had not posted before so I'll leave this thread.
Personally I don't think hubby should get the shot, but I will leave it up to him and his doc.
Hubby had mercury toxicity and went through chelation before the tick-borne illness so that is definitely an additional consideration for him, especially since his primary symptoms are neuro.
Will post an update in a couple of weeks when hubby makes his decision.
Thanks again.
Bea Seibert
Posts: 7306 | From Martinsville,VA,USA | Registered: Oct 2004
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posted
I'd think you could get a titer test if you wanted to see if there's even a need for a booster in the first place. If the antibodies for the tetanus antigen are still present, then your husband wouldn't have to make a decision either way as to getting the booster as it would be unnecessary if this was the case, at least for now.
You can also check out Table 3, which I believe includes adult vaccines (which generally have thimerosal/mercury) for the listing of vaccines and their thimerosal content. While mercury is one concern with vaccines, from what I've come across, the effects vaccines can potentially have on immune systems and what becomes up-regulated or down-regulated and for how long, etc. is just as much a concern and relatively little is known in this area.
I remember reading a study from the Emory Vaccine Center in which a specific factor or protein or whatever was up-regulated as a result of the immune response to a vaccine, and it was quite unexpected by the researchers and something I believe they stumbled upon to even realize it had been up-regulated. I'm not recommending either way as to whether or not he should get one (though I personally would choose not to get one currently if faced with the choice), but I just wanted to briefly add this perspective.
Posts: 43 | From NJ | Registered: May 2007
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posted
I cut my finger really deep several months ago and they thought I needed to get that vaccine.
I considered it and tried to think about what I would advise someone else, like my child or family member, and based on that
Went ahead and accepted the vaccine.
The only thing that has been a problem that I am not sure I can connect to the vaccine or not, is pretty severe shoulder arthritis that I did not have at all to this extent before.
So it's a bummer, but all the rest of my symptoms are not related to the vaccine. And I can't even be sure that the shoulder is not just a progression of the lyme arthritis.
tdtid
Frequent Contributor (1K+ posts)
Member # 10276
posted
I was put in this situation within the last year as well and had posted a topic regarding this.
In the end, I wasn't given the shot, so I can't speak from first hand experience what MIGHT have happened, but atleast it was my plain ole PCP saying I was due, but due to my lowered immune system, she didn't feel safe giving it to without my LLMD's permission.
Considering she isn't very lyme literate, meaning she knows I'm seeing an LLMD, but basically looks the other way other than in cases like immunizations, I still don't have the shot.
I do know that I have traveled the globe pretty extensively before getting sick and needed typhoid shots for Asia and I wasn't diagnosed with lyme but was going through the "what is wrong with me time frame". Some days I was feeling like nothing was wrong and others were horrid.
But that shot really was rough on me, but I had no clue why since others in the family weren't having that reaction.
It's really a tough call and I know some people really have NO PROBLEMS and others do.....so I'm at the phase now that I'm just taking any precautions I can.
Good luck.
Cathy
-------------------- "To Dream The Impossible Dream" Man of La Mancha Posts: 2638 | From New Hampshire | Registered: Oct 2006
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bettyg
Unregistered
posted
well, my new PCP stated i hadn't had one in many decades so i had one several weeks after my FLU shot.
NO PROBLEMS AT ALL; FEEL NO DIFFERENT THAN BEFORE, ETC!! for whatever it is worth!
we'll all UNIQUE; no 2 of us are the same! i used to step on nails galore; so have had plenty in my lifetime especially when being just a snoopy kid and climging things galore!!
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posted
I get my tetanus shots and flu shots regularly with no problems.
Few years ago my cat bit my big toe...I stepped on her by accident..and it became severely infected...cellulitis. My doctor immediately gave me a tetanus shot saying the illness of tetanus is worse than my toe.
Have to get the flu shots, or I am laid up for up to a month with the flu.
Guess everyone is different.
Hugs, Perplexed Posts: 324 | From Lexington, KY, USA | Registered: Dec 2001
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Hoosiers51
Frequent Contributor (1K+ posts)
Member # 15759
posted
Though you saw my post above, and I am VERY leery of people with Lyme getting these, I will re-emphasize one point of advice:
If you get it, just get the tetanus. Don't get the diptheria or pertussis (whooping cough) with it [the DPT (dip, pert, tet) is often called a "tetanus shot", so be aware of that]. A naturopath I know told me my reaction was probably NOT due to the tetanus component of the vaccine, but more likely to either the diptheria or pertussis.
So basically, he believed the tetanus vaccine is a "safer" bet than the others in terms of "will it cause a negative reaction?" Honestly, I wouldn't loose much sleep over the possibility of getting diptheria anyways (not to sound insensitive). Tetanus, I would guess, is more common.
But for ME, I am still taking my chances, unfortunately.
[ 07. July 2008, 01:48 PM: Message edited by: Hoosiers51 ]
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