Topic: horsy people...does this sound like lyme to you?
lpkayak
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posted
"and a third contracted the equivalent of equine multiple sclerosis."
Hampton Mounted Patrol Back After Year Off
POSTED: 10:44 am EDT July 14, 2008 [NEWSVINE: Hampton Mounted Patrol Back After Year Off] HAMPTON, N.H. -- After a year off, the mounted police patrol is back patrolling the beach in Hampton.
The patrol's return comes after taking last summer off to regroup when three of its four horses were forced to retire. Two horses were too old to continue, and a third contracted the equivalent of equine multiple sclerosis.
The remaining horse, Arrow, and a new horse, Butch, will help control crowds at the beach.
-------------------- Lyme? Its complicated. Educate yourself. Posts: 13712 | From new england | Registered: Feb 2004
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Melanie Reber
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Very odd...I can't find a single reference for Equine MS.
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lpkayak
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hi melanie-i've been with horses 56 years now and never heard of it...but i've seen horses with lyme stumble around. i thought it was easy to dx lyme in horses and dogs...they live in a very endemic area...i don't understand why they aren't considering lyme and trating. sad.
i thought there were a bunch of horsey people on here and a lot would answer this.
-------------------- Lyme? Its complicated. Educate yourself. Posts: 13712 | From new england | Registered: Feb 2004
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posted
There are neurological a few conditions, many congenital that one may describe as "like MS in humans".
My brothers horse was TB and Quarter Horse. He was a love. He unfortunately inherited a condition.
At onset, he began losing weight and acting lathargic (tired). My brother put him through many tests for disease, toxins - everything possible.
Finally he sent him to a highly regarded equine hospital in San Diego. At first he seemed to stablize somewhat, even though they had no diagnosis. Then he lost the battle quickly.
He lost muscle tone and could not even hold his head up. My brother was heartbroken when he had him put down. He tried so hard to save his life.
These are a couple inherited diseases from the stallions Impressive and Poco Bueno line:
Another inherited disorder, which affects extensive numbers of Quarter horses descended from the stallion Impressive, is hyperkalemic periodic paralysis (HYPP).
Unlike SCID, this is a dominant disorder. Only one affected parent is needed to pass the gene on to the foal.
The mutation causes a defect in a sodium channel gene that regulates the movement of sodium into and out of muscle tissue.
Horses with HYPP experience muscle tremors and can become temporarily paralyzed. Severe attacks can lead to heart and respiratory failure, resulting in death.
Horses with two copies of the defective gene (homozygous) usually do not survive very long. Horses with one copy of the mutation can lead functional lives if fed a controlled diet.
In fact, the disease causes enlargement of the muscles in these horses, which gives them an advantage in halter classes at shows.
Again, a DNA test is available to determine which horses carry this mutation, and matings that would produce a foal homozygous for the mutation can be avoided.
A DNA test is not yet available for Equine Hyperelastosis Cutis, which occurs in Quarter horses descended from the Poco Bueno/King bloodline.
It does not occur in all horses descended from these sires, and its expression is variable, with some horses being more severely affected than others.
Skin layers in affected horses are not attached normally, creating loose areas of skin that are easily stretched away from the body.
This makes the skin very susceptible to trauma, and the condition is often initially diagnosed when the horse goes into training and is subjected to saddle pressure.
There is no treatment, and currently there is no genetic test.
Of course Horses can get Lyme also. I've heard it's any easy test only costs $20.00 and is sent to UC Davis.
I don't know about you all - but it costs $100.00 for the call fee - just to have the vet out here in OC.
When a neighbor needs a vet - I plan to "split" the call fee and get my trail horse tested. I'll let you know how it goes.
Best of Health Peedie
Posts: 641 | From So. CA | Registered: May 2008
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lpkayak
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lymetoo-i thought i did...maybe our posts crossed in cyberland or something!
hi peedie-alot of info! my favorite horse ever comes from the poco line-he's 28 and still doing well-just walk/trot these days-but he's happy and many kids love him.
the horses i am talking about have vets very close and are owned by the town-there should not be a problem with regular care and testing. i don't know if it's ignorance or cover up. there has been so much in the paper lately about lyme going crazy here-they really should know better.
i'm wondering if new strains-new bugs-whatever are making it harder to dx horses...
the way the research is , i would think they would try abx on any similar symptoms...just to see
my dog always test positive-but i only tx him when his symptoms get worse or i pull an attached tick off him. he is pretty happy at 10 1/2 yrs-even tho he has been treated at least once every year of his life.
horsy people: i'm really close to buying a horse - the first since i broke up my barn in 98 when i started tx. i'm happy and excited but also worried about how i will keep my horse lyme free... there are other posts on here about it... maybe i should take this to support.
i am looking at:
Hamlet-a 13.2 really chunky haflinger
Duke-a 16.2 , 2200 lb belgion
and
Tess-a new forest pony and percheron cross (owners still don't know how that happened)
guess you can tell i'm one of the 80% that gained weight with lyme!!!
-------------------- Lyme? Its complicated. Educate yourself. Posts: 13712 | From new england | Registered: Feb 2004
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posted
Hmmmm....well yes horses will probably increase your exposure to ticks. If you have never had horses in your life it will remain a mystery why
anyone would go out of their way to be with them. I agree with the poster who said horses are good for people. Kids benefit greatly from riding and caring for a horse.
I had 4H at my house for three years. Kids came twice a week for three hours and rode and cared for my horses.
For kids - try 4H. I usually recommend riding lessons for people who want a horse.
Even if they already know how to ride - try something new.
Dressage lessons, Jumping lessons, if you ride western - try English.
Let the riding instructor know you would like to ride more often and exchange for doing chores and post a sign at the stable. Will exercise horse and clean stable.
I spent most of my youth exercising other people's horses and caring for them with no expense at all.
Where you live could make a very big difference in monthly boarding charges.
You don't need a fancy place to keep a horse happy. Check out the bulletin boards in the feed store or tack shop as well as stables.
A few people in my neighborhood board horses at a reasonable rate. If you can keep a horse on your own property, like I do, the cost is minimal.
I also vaccinate my own horses which saves a lot of money. They are all IM.
I don't think dental and a vet check-up every year are necessary. In fact - I don't know anyone who vaccinates their own horse - who does that.
Look for signs, losing weight, dull coat any unhealthy discharge from nose or eyes - you will know if your horse needs a vet.
Do keep your horse wormed - everytime the horse shoer comes out, worm with ivermectrin or something just as good. In a boarding stable - worm once a month.
Do not keep your horse in a minimal 12'x12' stall like a dog in a crate. They need more room than that.
Provive shelter for bad weather and warmth of a horse blanket when it's especially cold.
Horses are W O N D E R F U L !!! ENJOY
Peedie
Posts: 641 | From So. CA | Registered: May 2008
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posted
I had a Poco mare for years without any health issues. I have a 9 years old thoroughberd gelding now who has RER, which is a genetic disorder that causes him to tie up if he's not kept on a strict low carb diet. He's fine as long as you keep him on the correct diet.
I do shots twice a year and have his teeth and sheath done once a year.
Kathy
-------------------- You never know how strong you are until being strong is the only choice you have. Posts: 807 | From South Dakota | Registered: Jul 2005
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posted
We only have to do the west nile once a year here. We're cold about 6 months of the year. We do the Rhino-flu shot twice a year. I use Repel-X on his legs, it will burn him if I put it any where else, and Bronco for his body.
My husband puts the fly spray on him. The smell makes me sick.
I've had him since birth. We were there when he was born. I have two daughters who show Dressage and Hunter-Jumpers. He was suppose to be one of their's, but ended up mine.
My two year old grand daughter rides him and is madly in love with him!
Kathy
-------------------- You never know how strong you are until being strong is the only choice you have. Posts: 807 | From South Dakota | Registered: Jul 2005
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i have heard that gorses get lyme and have heard they respond well to doxycycline. I can't ride anymore because of Lyme, but I haven't given up. Everytime I start feeling a little better I startthinking about getting back in the saddle.. It would take alot of rehabbing, but would be worth it. My two horses have kept me alive over the years, especially before diagnosis and during tough herxing times and while I had no doctor because the #$&*#! put my LLMD temporarily out of business. I would be totally ready to throw in the towel, but then I would look ou the window, see my horses and think, "who will take care of them???" my husband can find a nice new wife, but my horses need care. They force me to get out of bed on those days I am just too tired to move... Yep, love horses, they are good for the soul and good for suicide prevention. Don't know what I would do without my two girls, Thoroughbred cross and Arabian mares.
Posts: 49 | From Florida | Registered: Dec 2003
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lpkayak
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in another post on lyme and horses there was a discussion on a good spray---can't go get it now. i'm late for my riding lesson!!!!!
-------------------- Lyme? Its complicated. Educate yourself. Posts: 13712 | From new england | Registered: Feb 2004
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Marnie
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posted
I wonder if it really was this:
Navicular disease, also termed navicular syndrome or caudal heel syndrome, in horses cause much foot pain and lameness.
Once you link the following, use your edit to find multiple sclerosis
Now...that form of gallium can be harmful to the kidneys in certain circumstances, so read very carefully.
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Tell us about your lesson! Does the Lyme make your legs weak or is it other things that present a problem.
Peedie
Posts: 641 | From So. CA | Registered: May 2008
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lpkayak
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marnie-it's probably not navicular. thats pretty common and known about. it doesn't cause tremors..its a very specific lameness. they know the cause , and what it looks like etc and how to control it til it gets too bad
stuff happened and i didn't get to ride...i had close calls with two moose the night before and i guess slamming the brake on made my back start to spasm.
i'm supposed to ride tomorrow. the back is a little better but it's gonna be 90 and T showers and no indoor-so we'll see
so far the only problem i am having riding is mounting-even with a block its hard to bend and straighten up my left knee (it won't be 4 months old til the 26th)
also-i am getting twinges in my lower back where i have bad arthritis. now that my knee pt is over i am supposed to start back pt.
i'm thinking about getting this 13.2 haflinger cuz he drives too. anyone know if sitting in one of those carts is hard on your back?
-------------------- Lyme? Its complicated. Educate yourself. Posts: 13712 | From new england | Registered: Feb 2004
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posted
Ipkayak - Hey! When you start looking at "those carts" you will find they vary greatly. Some are quite nice. I would suggest a cart that has road tires.
The inflated motor cycle types have great traction and a much smoother ride.
I don't think there is a better book on driving than "Breaking and Training the Driving Horse" by Doris Ganton.
She also has a good video. My neighbor picked up a terrific cart from a guy that was training for the driving course competition that was all tricked out and was cheap.
I've never known a Haflinger. My horse shoer's daughter has one and he speaks very highly of them. I understand they are calm and sensible.
Sorry to hear about your back. Darn Moose thought they were in a commercial.
Use Absorbine Horse Linement (the gel) on your back tonight and before you ride. It really helps. If you start to whinny as you talk - you've used too much.
Have Fun! Peedie
Posts: 641 | From So. CA | Registered: May 2008
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lpkayak
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posted
i've used lots of absorbine in my time. also mane and tail-after i saw what it did to the horses-and the price at the tack shop-can't beat it.
thanks for the heads up on the book. many years ago---ummm, about 39 i think-cuz my son was one...i had a neat pony and cart and drove all over town. but i think it came as a package deal and i remember it may be hard to get everythign to work right. i do need a good book now.
he (the pony) seems like a good guy-but there is a bit of an attitude when he is ridden more than a few minutes with a bit vs a halter (rubber snaffle). but he sort of twists his head around and says, "what...you expect me to go all the way around the ring again??? it's hot out here. there's the gate and everone else is munching hay in a cool stall..."
i'm wondering what will come after the head twisting and i say,"yes...we are going around again, and again, and again..."
i know i can't handle bucks any more-probably not even spooks...
a caution: you now that black sticky tar like stuff-word retrieval problem here-well i used some on a mosquito bite that wasn't getting better---i was far from doc and hosp...well it turned into celulitis-i almost died. it was the first and only time they approved IV rocep for me. ended up with vanco. in hosp a week and they had to cut the thing out of me twice. so be careful. it's like drinking out of streams. can't do what we used to do as kids. everything is all messed up.
-------------------- Lyme? Its complicated. Educate yourself. Posts: 13712 | From new england | Registered: Feb 2004
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a caution: you now that black sticky tar like stuff
Was it pine tar that you put on hoofs??
Kathy
-------------------- You never know how strong you are until being strong is the only choice you have. Posts: 807 | From South Dakota | Registered: Jul 2005
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lpkayak
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posted
no-not pine tar...mol-a-men-tum???? or something like that? you put it on a wound to draw out the infection---it keeps flys off too
maybe i'm so old they don't have it any more.
the pony-his name is hamlet...is 18. but i don't think he has worked very hard in his life. i thought we might just get old together. someday i might end up with grandkids too.. he is very chunky and i'm sure more is fat than muscle. his legs are clean-lungs good...teeth look 18, but healthy...the stable he is at belongs to a vet---he's there to sell. i would have him vetted before i bought him-but i know they wouldn't have a sick horse there and i know he's up to date on shots and good coggins.
today at my lesson i talked to the barn manager/instructor and she pretty much told me i could work with him on the ground if i wanted. the more he is tried by possible buyers and the stable girls...the brattier he is getting. until i work with him myself i won't know which way he will go.
i have only been taking 1/2 hour lessons. today it was my hands that hurt the worst(i shouldn't have vacumed) and my right knee felt like an icepick was going thru it when i posted. i get tired just trying to get a decent walk out of the very safe, 1/4 mare school horse i ride. i can only trot about 10 min of it-most of it sitting. i don't know..i may end up with a tennesee walker! that would be a switch from dressage.
next week i'm doing a whole hour but on the trail and the instructor will ride hamlet so i see how he is out of the ring.
they need an instructor to work with beginners...they are so busy...and i am -well, was-great with beginners. i have taught hundreds of kids to ride. but if it's hard to tack up and ride for 1/2 an hour...i probably would get really sick trying to give 3-4 lessons on a saturday. i want so much to offer-just to get free riding time. but i'm pretty sure i couldn't. i'd do it once and be in bed for a month.
oh-i almost forgot! i cantered about 6 strides...she's really pokey...i couldn't keep her going...but it was a nice canter while it lasted.
this has been a nice conversation-but i'm thinking we should take it to support ...
-------------------- Lyme? Its complicated. Educate yourself. Posts: 13712 | From new england | Registered: Feb 2004
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