richedie
Frequent Contributor (1K+ posts)
Member # 14689
posted
Has anyone seen any research on what type of food borrelia spirochetes, babesia protozoas, etc live on in our bodies? I understand the whole candida thing, but what about borrelia and friends? Are they adaptable or do they need sugar to survive?
If so, could we starve them for years till they die off? I know, from reading research, starving the bacteria causes them to encyst. In the cyst form, I read they can remain for years but evenually die if they can not come out of this form.
Any thoughts on starving the suckers?
Rich
-------------------- Mepron/Zith/Ceftin Doxy/Biaxin/Flagyl pulse. Artemisinin with Doxy/Biaxin. Period of Levaquin and Ceftin. Then Levaquin, Bactrim and Biaxin. Bactrim/Augmentin/Rifampin. Mepron/Biaxin/Artemisinin/Cat's Claw Rifampin/Bactrim/Alinia Plaquenil/Biaxin Posts: 1949 | From Pennsylvania | Registered: Feb 2008
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clairenotes
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posted
I spent many years abstaining from sugar and wheat, carbs. Maybe solidly, 3-4 years. No borrelia deaths occurred that I am aware of during that time. But it did help me tolerate the disease much better. Maybe it curbs their growth?
I hear dramatic health recovery stories from time to time with regard to fasting... but I am not really sure about this. I don't have enough information about those individual cases.
Claire
Posts: 1111 | From Colorado | Registered: Oct 2006
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richedie
Frequent Contributor (1K+ posts)
Member # 14689
posted
Yes, I think the sugar, refined food is more for when you take abx to avoid candida, that is it. Who knows what borrelia live on.
Fasting poses some interesting questions though.
-------------------- Mepron/Zith/Ceftin Doxy/Biaxin/Flagyl pulse. Artemisinin with Doxy/Biaxin. Period of Levaquin and Ceftin. Then Levaquin, Bactrim and Biaxin. Bactrim/Augmentin/Rifampin. Mepron/Biaxin/Artemisinin/Cat's Claw Rifampin/Bactrim/Alinia Plaquenil/Biaxin Posts: 1949 | From Pennsylvania | Registered: Feb 2008
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Keebler
Honored Contributor (25K+ posts)
Member # 12673
posted
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A body needs carbohydrates (best as complex sugars, preferably from vegetables, low-sugar fruits and health whole grains), good fats and protein in the right balance or that body will suffer.
You cannot starve lyme before your body would starve, suffer tremendous neurological damage and die.
Buhner backs this up in his book, "Healing Lyme . . ."
In addition, fasting can cause neurological damage if an excess of porphyrins is in play. As the liver's Cytochrome P-450 detox system is often stressed from the lyme toxins, a condition known as porphyria can result from excess porphryin buildup.
Fasting increases that - and the damage from it - tremendously. A steady supply of healthy carbs can help prevent that.
In some cases of those with genetic - or even acquired - porphryia, if it is a life threatening emergency, IV glucose may be required to save a life. That is one case of a simple sugar saving brain cells.
Complex carbs in the right balance is a very good idea to prevent problems. We need to eat 5 small-medium meals a day to help our liver and our brain.
richedie
Frequent Contributor (1K+ posts)
Member # 14689
posted
Very good points. In cyst form, they can survive quite a while, long after you damage your body so it is not worth it. In diet, I agree, we still need to eat healthy, preferrably intact carbs such as whole oats, red skin potatoes, veggies, whole, preferrably intact grains like brown rice, etc. I eat a very balanced whole food diet right now with virtually no sugar or refined foods, barely any packaged foods. I stick to fresh foods and home cooked meals. I typically eat one fruit a day, something like a handful of blueberries, a grapefruit, kiwi, or green apple. I used to eat lots of fruit but taking abx and reading Dr. S's book has me cutting back the fruit.
Anyone heard of the Weston Prince study where the guy claims to have beaten Lyme with diet alone? Supposedly just eating meats and veggies, nuts, seeds did the job?
I also hear people claiming to win with a raw diet.
-------------------- Mepron/Zith/Ceftin Doxy/Biaxin/Flagyl pulse. Artemisinin with Doxy/Biaxin. Period of Levaquin and Ceftin. Then Levaquin, Bactrim and Biaxin. Bactrim/Augmentin/Rifampin. Mepron/Biaxin/Artemisinin/Cat's Claw Rifampin/Bactrim/Alinia Plaquenil/Biaxin Posts: 1949 | From Pennsylvania | Registered: Feb 2008
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Keebler
Honored Contributor (25K+ posts)
Member # 12673
posted
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You asked: " . . . guy claims to have beaten Lyme with diet alone? "
This would be a very risky bet. Please read the science on spirochetal infections.
If "Supposedly just eating meats and veggies, nuts, seeds did the job" no one would be at this web site.
posted
Can't starve the lyme. You would die before they did.
What does everything need to survive? Food, Clothing, Shelter.
You can ge rid of their "shelter" (cyst form) and you can get rid of their "clothing" (biofilm).
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Ocean
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Member # 3496
posted
I don't know if diet cures, but I have gone into remission twice before (although I didn't know I had Lyme) with diet. Have started eating like my old diet and feel at least 60% better now (changed my eating 2 weeks ago). I eat a lot of fruit, but I also have never taken antibiotics long term, so no risk of lots of candida. My energy is much better, anxiety is greatly improved (although last night I woke up with a start, heard a noise, my husband heard it too, sounded like a wild animal running on our deck), muscle twitching LOADS better. I used to lay down to sleep and the twitching would keep me awake, my legs, arms, face, everywhere! I'm not slurring words any longer, word recall is better.
I don't know what diet does for sure, but it's working for me! Oh, my family had a surprise birthday party for me yesterday, so I had some ice cream. About 30-60 mins after eating it, I started feeling kinda weird, started getting anxiety. So, I'm not doing that again! I learned my lesson!
I drink lots of raw carrot juice (I have a champion juicer) and have been making raw cranberry juice, since I figure it has antibacterial properties.
So we'll see how this helps in the long run. I'm hoping for remission again and since I know now I have Lyme, I'll have to stay on the diet (modified at times) for the rest of my life.
posted
Lyme does not need iron -- babesia requires iron.
I think both Lyme and babesia require choline -- the reason why the gallbladder and memory both suffer. a good reason to eat eggs -- especially the yolks.
Lyme needs magnesium.
Many people are deficient in magnesium even before they get Lyme -- need B6 to absorb or utilize magnesium. Whole grains are a good source of magnesium.
Antibiotics often deplete many of the B vitamins.
Rumor has it that the mystery bug or BLO needs arginine.
One of the best things you can do other than try to eat organic is to take digestive enzymes if needed and or hydrochloric acid or apple cider vinegar. Many people are deficient in stomach acid.
Protein requirements increase if one is chronically ill.
I think people who have arthritic symptoms may have underlying food allergies or sensitivities.
The good fats are needed to heal the brain and may help with inflammation elsewhere in the body.
Sugar depresses the immune system -- also simple carbs that are converted to sugar.
And I agree -- you can't starve out the bugs. They get the nutrients first before the rest of your body.
This is not medical advice, just my opinion.
Bea Seibert
Posts: 7306 | From Martinsville,VA,USA | Registered: Oct 2004
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david1097
Frequent Contributor (1K+ posts)
Member # 3662
posted
FYI: I was able to put the disease complex into remission through a very intensive weight loss program. I lost 50 lbs in 4 months. It stayed in remission during the weight loss and for about 6 months after. It started to re-appear as joints pains and took about 4 years to progress to severe neurological manifestations.
During that time I am pretty sure I was in ketosis much of the time and this may be what suppressed the bugs. I am confirmed as having lyme. babesia and mycoplasma fermantans (I am not however convinced that the mycoplasma is a factor int the illness). Also thought to have a BLO (due to previous fast reoccurance on stopping abx).
It all may have been due to to the constellation of infections but other may have seen the same thing.
It took years of various IV drugs to get things under control. Curerntly off all drugs but lyme symtoms are slowly coming back. Never did get rid of the recurrent flareups which happen like clockwork every 15 days.
Posts: 1184 | From north america | Registered: Feb 2003
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