Topic: Changed my mind...I WILL continue to post here
jamescase20
Unregistered
posted
Sorry I just get sick of "alarmists" here freaking out over this or that post of my experimental protocols, Be sure to read the disclaimer at the bottom.
I am going to respond to some nonesense replies to some of my posts recently below now.
Quote from poster: "fipronil is toxic" they say...yet it takes about 59 130lbs dog doses of front line rubbed on human skin all at once to "poison a human". Wow, thats 58 doses higher then the dose needed to kill insects for a full 30 days. I'd say thats a drug with a very high margin of safety. (docks know what that means)
It took OVER 2000mg of tech pure (98percent pure) fipronil applied on a shaved 1 kg rat to kill it. So, thats roughly 1 gram+ of fipronil for every pound of a backboned animal applied to a shaven animal to kill it.
Frontline contains only 9.8 percent fipronil, how many grams of fipronil is in a dog dose? Not sure, but cant see how it could be more then 1 gram if that. So...I applied about 1 gram of fipronil on my skin...and the alarmists are FREAKING OUT SCREAMING TOXIC TOXIC..PEOPLE DIE!!! OMG OMG OMG
Guess what folks, since fipronil has been on the market...theres been ONLY 1 reported death from fipronil poisoning to date. And btw, yes, (insecticide deaths ARE reported) Yes, 1, just think about how many people babies children, ingested fipronil and DIDNT die. I used 1 single dose, actually I ended up using 4 doses of fipronil, and I DIDNT DIE...I herxed. With a margin of safety that high, I would have to use another 55 doses of fipronil (assuming frontline dose has 1 gram of fip in it-but I dont think its even got that much) AT LEAST, and likely all at once to even come close to death. I know fipronil is NOT a true insecticide, its a drug, its a zole drug in fact..it does not kill bugs directly, it overloads there GABA channels, these spineless animals use gaba channels we backboned humans dont have. Fipronil is sprayed on crops and fed to cows.
Then the other active in frontline plus is methoprene. Methoprene and its cousins are widely used on crops on our livestock...even sprayed in our homes, and india adds it to the water supply.
TOXIC TOXIC TOXIC........omg your going to die!
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djf2005
Frequent Contributor (1K+ posts)
Member # 11449
posted
SO relieved
-------------------- "Experience is not what happens to you; it is what you do with what happens to you."
djf2005
Frequent Contributor (1K+ posts)
Member # 11449
posted
these kinds of experiments and threads although legal and conforming to the rules of this forum (as far as i can tell) harm the accreditation of this website and only further contribute to the mockery of the disease that impedes many of us.
i would ask the mods and any of you who have the main objective (or what should be) in the forefront of your minds to concede to removing these threads and considering possible ways to better filter information.
not only do these novel and often ridiculous experiments often serve to defame LN they are planting ridiculous UNPROVEN ideas into people's IMPRESSIONABLE ENCEPHALOPATHIC heads.
(this means they already cant think straight)
SWEET! flea collars will solve my lyme.! and thus goes the line of reasoning in the desperate lyme afflicted patient's head.
i suggest it should be stopped.
nothing personal james. you have the right to do whatever you like.
we as members of this community should keep the main objective more in our sights and be more careful on what topics we choose to post info about.
if LOUb and others are right, and people truly come here to scavenge for info, then what better info to make us all seem crazy than all the threads like these, largely, by james?
again james, no offense, but WHO is being served by these threads?
your own curiosity and need to have others pat you on the back for being willing to do experiments that have no medical or scientific training or supervision OR the LYME COMMUNITY.
THINK ABOUT IT PEOPLE
enough said
derek
-------------------- "Experience is not what happens to you; it is what you do with what happens to you."
posted
There are plenty of us with scientific and intelligent minds that take and can learn and do learn things from his posts and I admire the fact he takes the time to look at things in a different light than just a face to face with the doctor and the lab reports and >> well I enjoy reading his posts and I take what I can and they really make my mind engage in a new refresshing way.. I think us who read them are not negatively influenced nor are we poor souls who can not think for ourselves or sort through information and take and pick and choose from that information.. I thought that was the whole point of the site. I have gotten a lot of mixed responses and I do not get upset at anyone when and even if I disagree or think they are way off etc. I take what I can where I can and learn.. Lets stay open I say... There are no answers or rights or wrongs in this disease we all are trying to combat and learn about. THANKS for listening God Bless James.. sorry you go through this. .. But I have sensing this is one controversal forum Are there other forums that you hang out in?? Let me know. THANKS D
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posted
I totally agree with Derek.....the fact that people respond to these threads so favorably just supports my concerns. I don't doubt James has a microscope and I don't believe he intends to harm anyone but he has no idea what he is studying through is microscope. C'mon, do we really believe he is seeing Borrelia regularly in his blood?
It is actually these threads that makes me uncomfortable being a member of this forum because I feel it is counter-productive to why most people come here....either for support or to learn more about lyme and the latest research (not this kind of research).
Posts: 561 | From mass | Registered: Jul 2007
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seekhelp
Frequent Contributor (5K+ posts)
Member # 15067
posted
No disrespect either, BUT do you think a scouring medical professional / health enthusiast looking to derail Lymnet is going to have respect for Bio-tensors? Posts that say one makes ALL treatment decisions both in type and quantity which changes EVERY SINGLE DAY? Taping vials to one's forehead?
It's either all or nothing here. I find trusting a bio-tensor to tell me what I am hormone-deficient in is utterly frightening.
I am not degrading treatment options. I am making an analogy. I don't have to believe in everything here. I do believe GiGI is extremely intelligent and maybe if I was with this person face-to-face, I'd be swayed. The swme may hold true with James. I don't know what he sees under his scope so I'm not going to question him.
Now, does everyone have to see eye to eye with me? Of course, not. If a non-energy medicine person takes these posters' threads seriously and attempts to do it without training, what may happen? What if the biotensor swore I needed fipronil?
If we all want traditional treatments only, it's all going to have to be censored, right/
Posts: 7545 | From The 5th Dimension - The Twilight Zone | Registered: Mar 2008
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-------------------- You never know how strong you are until being strong is the only choice you have. Posts: 807 | From South Dakota | Registered: Jul 2005
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posted
James, Gigi, and many people here are trying lots of different approaches on themselves, and I applaud both their guts as well as their sharing of findings with the group.
Until a "magic lyme cure for everyone" is found, I prefer to keep an open mind to these different approaches. IMO the worst thing we can do is squelch discussion of new/radical treatments, one of which may end up helping all of us.
Posts: 727 | From USA | Registered: Mar 2006
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Keebler
Honored Contributor (25K+ posts)
Member # 12673
posted
-
Maybe some were not able to find the basic research on the substance being "tested" - Here's just a bit of that:
================
It's a killer to mice - and they have backbones. I don't know where it says this is okay - other than on sites that sell it.
Google has over 120 results for "fipronil poisoning"
posted
As usual Keelber has a very nice way with words. And why are there double threads with the same topic?
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D Bergy
Frequent Contributor (1K+ posts)
Member # 9984
posted
I think people have a right to have access to information whether they agree with it or not is also a right.
Is not freedom of information a cornerstone of our rights in America? You have the responsibility of what you do with the information. Do not try to expand your responsibility to protect me. I will take responsibility for my own actions. It is still a semi-free country.
To place a ban on one experimental treatment then puts someone in charge of sorting what should be banned and what should not. Who has the knowledge in advance of what will be a promising new treatment?
How many new treatments do you see coming from the established medical community? Please count them and give a total.
How many have we seen come from unconventional sources? I am only aware of some.
Rife based frequency treatments.
Miracle Mineral Supplement. (Chlorine Dioxide)
Natural antibiotics (Samento Cumnda etc)
Microcurrent treatments.
Salt-C
Homeopathy
Far infrared treatments.
Now if all of these were banned, how many people would basically be going untreated? Keep in mind if you are unable to get a proper diagnosis, you are not going to get standard antibiotic treatment either.
The first three one the list have been used by my wife and they all help knock down the load of bacteria. They work more often than not.
Also keep in mind all of the dire warnings concerning most of these treatments in the past. Here are some I remember.
Rife causes Cancer. No basis what-so-ever for this statement. It cannot possible work. For those that really dig into it, there are several similar treatments using exactly the same principle for killing bacteria and even Cancer.
MMS is like drinking Pool cleaner and surely many will be harmed. The truth is that I have only found stomach upset to be the main side effect. The same ingredients are used in the Dioxychlor product that has been around for many years.
Since my wife was unable to get a diagnosis you would have in effect condemned her to no treatment options. That puts her at least in a wheel chair and likely worse.
I do not think you realize the long term ramifications of your proposal.
I will ask one other question. Who is more likely to find an effective treatment?
Someone who is looking for one, or someone who is not? James is one person who is looking.
He is taking the risk. He is not asking anyone else to join him. Your average logger or construction worker has a higher risk of being killed on the job than the people who use experimental treatments. Maybe we should ban these occupations also.
D Bergy
Posts: 2919 | From Minnesota | Registered: Aug 2006
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posted
Just because I have issues with the info. that is being posted, doesn't mean I don't have an open mind. I'm very interested in what is working for people, whether traditional or alternative treatments.
Since we don't understand everything about TBDs, we obviously have to keep an open mind. However, there is a difference between being open-minded based on some factual information/foundation (including patient experiences, although it can be somewhat subjective of course) versus the work being reported here. I am a microbiologist and not knowing what we are experimenting on (ie microorganisms) cannot translate into anything....regardless of how open-minded one is.
Posts: 561 | From mass | Registered: Jul 2007
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sparkle7
Frequent Contributor (5K+ posts)
Member # 10397
posted
It used to be common practice to treat syphilis with mercury. This was accepted as scientific.
People used to use leeches for medical treatment...
Views change about medicine all of the time.
I would not ingest Frontline.
It's a tricky question about censorship...
Why are people concerned that IDSA will be looking at this message board? Who cares?
Many people in the medical community deny that chronic Lyme exists, anyway.
We all can't be responsible for what one individual posts. That's what freedom of speech is about.
I guess it's up to the moderators to decide on this one.
Posts: 7772 | From Northeast, again... | Registered: Oct 2006
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djf2005
Frequent Contributor (1K+ posts)
Member # 11449
posted
this debate is not merely about this one topic it is in regards to the large and growing number of threads that serve little to no purpose and are bordering on dangerous suggestions.
it serves no one and no purpose except to defame our cause.
i understand the controversy already surrounding lyme and that there are already little to no published data on how to treat a disease that does not exist but to go down these paths lies ruin.
i am simply appealing to the common sense (or lack thereof lately) of the members on LN who take this cause seriously.
there are many here including me who have spent and continue to spend lots of time on this crusade. to see it made a mockery of with info such as these threads contain is sad.
but, surely as the sun shines, and rises the next day, this behavior will continue.
perhaps the fact that many (and apparently james) people on LN have lost their better reasoning skills and now lack the common sense needed to appropriately absorb and comprehend data that would otherwise not be useful.
the long story short is this people:
its one thing to try alternative ways to gain one's health back. its another to publish and encourage dangerous and ridiculous ways that desperate brain fogged people will jump on.
its almost as bad as big pharma itself.
hopefully you all will prove to have the wisdom needed to sort through all the junk on LN as of late.
LN used to be somewhere that reliable and concise info could be found. upon the advent of many moving to LN europe there was a period of peace and tranquility only to be followed by mass chaos and confusion.
derek
-------------------- "Experience is not what happens to you; it is what you do with what happens to you."
seekhelp
Frequent Contributor (5K+ posts)
Member # 15067
posted
Lastly, the IDSa spies will love the fact they are called "ducks" every minute of every day. As long as we stick to discussing conventional treatments only, these insults will go right under the radar with them, right? C'mon everyone. IDSA members may scan by, but I don't think they care.
Posts: 7545 | From The 5th Dimension - The Twilight Zone | Registered: Mar 2008
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posted
Thanks, Derek, for being a voice for reason and common sense.
Posts: 345 | From East Coast | Registered: Apr 2008
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D Bergy
Frequent Contributor (1K+ posts)
Member # 9984
posted
You have not proven by reason or science that the treatment being discussed is either "dangerous" or "ridiculous" At best all that can be known for sure is that the danger is unknown or unproven.
And as I have stated earlier most of the alternative treatments used by many today were described in exactly the same manner in the last three years. Some have proven to be very useful and they all have risk, like all treatments do.
There is no risk free treatment out there. It is just a matter of which risk/risks you are willing to take.
The Doug Coil was independently developed by an engineer who did his research under a microscope. He was not a scientist and could correctly identify Lyme under the scope. People are capable of learning from experience. He found the correct frequencies to treat himself and his family. He did this in the 80's before Lyme Disease was widely known.
I am virtually certain that people rolled their eyes at the nut who was going to cure himself with frequencies. Heck, most people still do. Luckily he had one quality that most successful people possess. He had confidence in his abilities and he focused on his work and not popular opinion. He also was successful, and now many others are benefiting from his "nutty" experiment.
I do not think people should run out and use Frontline as a treatment. My wife will not be using it. I still want to know what is learned from the experiment. Since he is doing it anyway we may as well learn what we can from the experience, good or bad.
D Bergy
Posts: 2919 | From Minnesota | Registered: Aug 2006
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djf2005
Frequent Contributor (1K+ posts)
Member # 11449
posted
bergy-
i trust from your emphatic support of these ridiculous experiments (oh wait i CANT prove that can i? that you are wearing your frontline collar right now?
come ON!
ps- frequencies = science as does 880nm, etc.
frontline= ridiculous as does a circus clown
-------------------- "Experience is not what happens to you; it is what you do with what happens to you."
seekhelp
Frequent Contributor (5K+ posts)
Member # 15067
posted
The last paragraph said he and his wife are not nor will use a frontline collar. Can't get much clearer than that!
No, I am not either.
Posts: 7545 | From The 5th Dimension - The Twilight Zone | Registered: Mar 2008
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DebAz
Unregistered
posted
Why dont you guys leave the guy alone and if you do not want to read his posts then dont. I mean the rest of us can use our intelligence by ourselves. FREE Speech and FREE press.. Remember that.. I do not get why he is getting treated the way he does. He is a human who deserves as much respect as anyone else even if you do not agree with him.
Lets live side by side and learn from one another for our own healing.. PEACE> Think about it
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posted
All I have to say, is we should have an alternative site for those of us who want to see what others are doing. The last I checked we don't have a 100% cure.
Most of us are hoping and praying that we don't become another statistic.
There are people still dying of this disease.
James, I appreciate you and your out of the box thinking. Madame Curie did kill herself,even though she had a great discover, so be very, very careful.
df et al pass by the posts if you don't like them.
-------------------- Gail Posts: 234 | From Sterling, Ma | Registered: Jan 2008
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D Bergy
Frequent Contributor (1K+ posts)
Member # 9984
posted
I have emphatic support of the free exchange of information and ideas. That is at the foundation of our freedoms. Sorry if that seems like a radical notion in this day and age.
This is a privatly owned site and the owners are free to delete or ban content that they think is inappropriate. That is their right.
There are plenty of people willing and ready to regulate all aspects of our lives under the guise of doing so in "our best interest".
I have no axe to grind with anyone. I just do not agree that we need protection from members that object to experimentation of one kind or another. We are all responsible for our own actions, for better or for worse.
Freedom has responsibility attached to it. If you give up responsibility you also give up freedom.
I have lost enough freedom already in my life time.
D Bergy
Posts: 2919 | From Minnesota | Registered: Aug 2006
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C'mon everyone. IDSA members may scan by, but I don't think they care.
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