posted
Wondering if anyone has an experience taking the two at the same time.
I go thru jags of insomia and related anxiety and 5mg of Ambien works like a charm for me when I need it.
LLMD has recently put me on 100mg of diflucan for lyme and yeast every other day (along with 400mg doxy and 100mg plaquenil 2 x day).
Since starting the diflucan, I started have some herx stuff going on - mostly increased joint pain and some stomach cramps.
But last night, I took my abx and diflucan @ 7pm with dinner and had to take an ambien around midnight. This am I woke up all brain foggy and woozy - almost like I feel when I take 10mg of ambien (higher dose). It's noon and I still am feeling it.
So, talked to LLMD, he said it was fine to take together but when I looked it up, here's what I found:
Use of drugs that inhibit the isoenzyme CYP450 3A4 may decrease the metabolism and increase the plasma levels of zolpidem. This can result in increased clinical effectiveness and risk of toxicity associated with zolpidem. Monitoring for signs and symptoms of altered zolpidem effect is recommended. Patients should be advised to notify their physician if they experience nausea, vomiting, diarrhea, confusion, daytime sedation, dizziness, or unconsciousness. A reduction in zolpidem dosage may be necessary.
At first, I thought it was a herx, but now I'm thinking it was the ambien/diflucan combo.
Sometimes I just really need the help to sleep and am kinda freaked about not being able to take my ambien when I need it. Why didn't LLMD mention this?
Any help would be appreciated.
Thanks.
Posts: 14 | From Ticksville, USA | Registered: Nov 2008
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Marnie
Frequent Contributor (5K+ posts)
Member # 773
posted
Ambien binds to a specific GABA receptor.
GABA A ...only.
"A clinical trial on a single patient performed at the Toulouse University Hospital using PET shows that zolpidem repeatably improves brain function and mobility of a patient immobilized by akinetic mutism caused by
hypoxia."
"The United States Air Force uses zolpidem as a substitute for temazepam, under trade name Ambien, as "no-go pills" to help pilots sleep after a mission."
"the inhibitory action of glutamate on evoked ACh release. However, the effect of glutamate was fully blocked by simultaneous delivery of the GABAA receptor antagonist.."
ACh = acetylcholine = REM sleep which looks to be when we can have nightmares.
Antagonist is something that works AGAINST something else.
The acetylcholine receptors are also called the nicotinic receptors. Yes, nicotine.
The glutamate receptors are called NMDA and they are the most complex and are gated by nutrients that are...in lyme...way too deficient.
Read my post today re: PKC, photons, TRPM8...scroll down where I talk about GABA.
Also research in depth diflucan with regards to ethanol and the link between ethanol and TRPM8.
Incidentally when TRPM8 is activated, we feel cold.
Sorta explains how a drink warms us up.
BUT...
ethanol does alter proteins (OURS and Bb's) and Bb is quite capable of rebuilding its cell walls that are damaged.
Posts: 9481 | From Sunshine State | Registered: Mar 2001
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posted
Thanks for the reply Marnie! But even without this brain fog today, I'm not following. If you could dumb it down for me, I would totally appreciate it.
Anyone else?
Thanks!!
Posts: 14 | From Ticksville, USA | Registered: Nov 2008
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Marnie
Frequent Contributor (5K+ posts)
Member # 773
posted
Drugs and other chemicals/toxins are broken down primarily thru the actions of our liver (via enzymes) or thru the kidneys. Those are our main "detox" routes though we do eliminate some toxins thru our skin and our breath.
We girls make less of the enzyme that is needed to break down alcohol (for example)...which is why many of us are "cheap dates". Men have more of that enzyme...called alcohol dehydrogenase.
So...bottom line...we gals are at a disadvantage when it comes to breaking down some chemicals/toxins.
In olden times...Romans ate almonds (with the brown skin on, but not salted) prior to their drinking "parties". This looks to protect/help out the liver.
If you get a migraine after drinking red wine, you won't IF you eat a handful of almonds first.
Almonds are high in MAGNESIUM and the skin has "tannins" in it...for starters.
It takes Mg to MAKE enzymes. And Mg works with B6 (sublingual form of B6 is vital).
Americans are already too low in Mg. Our diets are skewed to high calcium foods.
Be SURE you are taking a lot of good probiotics one hour before meals with a full glass of water!
Researchers:
"members of the aldehyde dehydrogenase and cytochrome P450 enzyme families catalyze the irreversible oxidation of retinal to
retinoic acid"
Google: yeast and aldehyde dehydrogenase...
I think the WFL is still able to *bind* All trans retinoic acid (atRA) -> activating the G protein, transducin -> closes Na-Ca channel, TRPM8.
And I think that is how far infrared is working too...closing the Na-Ca channel...temporarily.
Posts: 9481 | From Sunshine State | Registered: Mar 2001
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Hoosiers51
Frequent Contributor (1K+ posts)
Member # 15759
posted
HatingLyme,
These kinds of interactions with drugs are common. I have found most LLMD's don't stay on top of every interaction. It would be nice if they could, but I think it might be too much to expect with how busy they are.
Do you have any other sleep medications you can use?
Maybe you could split the Ambien pill in half and take 2.5 mg at night.
Or you could try something like Trazodone (trazadone?) or Rozerem.
Diflucan can be bad for interacting with other drugs. There isn't really a replacement for Diflucan, but some people take Nystatin instead.
I use Drugs.com a lot....they have an interactions checker on their site.
Posts: 4590 | From Midwest | Registered: Jun 2008
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