Topic: Lyme Disease - is it man made? Why so difficult?
Health
Frequent Contributor (1K+ posts)
Member # 6034
posted
I am not an expert and am not a Medical Dr, but I just am really feeling SICK to my stomach about this disease because it just does not make sense.
3 infections from a tick? I mean come on?
I was told Babesia hides the lyme. HIDES the lyme?? what other disease is spoken about like this? I know that Babesia HIDES lyme, because I have felt this reaction. I know what my old LLMD meant by this, I experienced this.
Symptoms overlap? what is going on? Does this really seem like this disease is from NATURE?
Am I sounding like an idiot?
I am sick of this stupid disease, it is so bizarre.
LETS get down to it? How do you treat it?
Which infection should be treated first?
In the OLD days, I was watching a Video that the Dr B said they only KNEW about lyme, so that is all they treated back then, and guess what??
They all got well, but it took lots of years of antibiotics.
My old LLMD said that a good immune system can hold in Bartonella? Is this true?
Because I can tell you that I have had some ODD things happen to me, and that even when my Babesia symptoms were bad, as long as I kept treating lyme, I did not die.
COME up, what is with this disease, it is like is is sent from somewhere OTHER then nature.
What is going on?
Trish
Posts: 1250 | From Canada | Registered: Aug 2004
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I am SO with you.... I have been asking the same damn things... It just DOESN'T make SENSE...
-------------------- "You'll be surprised to know how far you can go from the point you thought it was the end" Posts: 946 | From Massachusetts | Registered: Apr 2008
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Health
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posted
It does not make sense, It is like the Dolls you buy I think ours is from Sweden, and they are wood, there are about 5 of them, first there is the big wood doll, you open her up, and then
there is the 2nd doll, then you open this doll to get another. I think there are 5 dolls. This disease is like these dolls, Treating the Bartonella COAXES the Babesia out? who the heck ever heard of this with LUPUS or cancer?
Treating the cancer coaxes out the other cancer? NO, you dont hear this, or do you?>
Is this disease sent from somewhere to harm us?
to make our life a living hell? because it is, and what about all the other diseases you get from insects? there are not 3-5 you get from a BITE from other insects,
so why this disease.
AND to top it off, this disease is giving me BIZARRE sickness, like EMF sensitivity, what a dang sick disease.
Is someone NOW reading this site, laughing at what they did to us all?
Dont I sound nuts? I am trying not to go nuts but it is tough.
I am back at Church, after 18 years, maybe God can help me find the answer, I am going to ask each day, maybe I will have some news from God, because this is just not right.
Dear God, help us out.
Sorry people, I am on the brink of loosing it.
Trish
Posts: 1250 | From Canada | Registered: Aug 2004
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bejoy
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Member # 11129
posted
Here's my short answer, boiled down from lots of reading. Links to verified sources abound:
Lyme has been around for a long time, just like the other spirochete, Syphilis.
Antibiotic resistant lyme Borrelia Burgdorferi was developed by big boys trying to play God and ignoring the long term backlash on their very own grandchildren.
Lyme disease is a combination of pathogens - bacteria, virus, fungus, mycoplasma, parasite worms, etc carried by ticks and other blood sucking vectors, all in one neat little package.
Treatment resistant lyme disease is a result of war crimes, and much of it is man-made by breading resistant strains and combining them in the same vectors.
Lots of different treatments work, but the longer you've had it and the more extensive the list of pathogens, the tougher it gets.
The trick is in identifying and treating your own brand of tick soup, and the particular pathogens you carry.
Currently the treatment with the most experience and success behind it is the long term antibiotic approach, with antifungals and herbal supports - the ILADS method.
Up and coming treatments include biophotons and nosode therapies. These are my favorites, and they kick borrelia behind. Take your pick.
Those with the most success seem to be the ones who combine approaches.
Even the most expert Lyme doctors will tell you there is so much they still don't know.
At least we are in this together.
-------------------- bejoy!
"Do not go where the path may lead; go instead where there is no path and leave a trail." -Ralph Waldo Emerson Posts: 1918 | From Alive and Well! | Registered: Feb 2007
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posted
I also have EMF sensitivty.. NEVER EVER EVER EVER did I say NEVER had that or any kind of "symptoms" until I got sick with this craziness... Oh and this came out in my pregnancy and knocked me bedridden for 2 years while my daughter grow before my eyes...
It is MESSED up... You are asking some GREAT questions, Questions I ask all the time. It just DOESN't make sense... and maybe this sounds nuts but HOW do the ticks live with all this nasty bacteria in them??
I sometimes feel like this is an alien disease... I know THAT REALLY sounds crazy... BUT this WHOLE thing jsut makes no sense to me.
WHY is it that a bacterial infection weather it be CHRONIC or NOT does NOT respond to ABX????? WHY??? hmmmm I don't know?
I am with you on this... and I am also praying, asking for guidance etc... I have come to the comclusion that this is MY body and I am not going to stand for this anymore... If it is going to BE in my body than it is going to live with me in HARMONY because I am DONE with this illness.... DONE!
-------------------- "You'll be surprised to know how far you can go from the point you thought it was the end" Posts: 946 | From Massachusetts | Registered: Apr 2008
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oxygenbabe
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No, Health, you're not nuts. They are good questions and your image of the dolls is appropriate.
Posts: 2276 | From united states | Registered: Jun 2004
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Lymeorsomething
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I think it's common for some infections to compete. However, babs and lyme seem to be on the same team. Maybe it has something to do with lyme not needing iron whereas babs uses iron.... A LLMD told me they are somewhat supportive of one another...
-------------------- "Whatever can go wrong will go wrong." Posts: 2062 | From CT | Registered: Jul 2008
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posted
My understanding is that they may have been messing with ticks for about 100 years. Starting with the Japanese after 1909, then later by the US, Russia, Britain and Germany, including research done on islands.
Posts: 13116 | From San Francisco | Registered: May 2006
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posted
From all the reading and research online I have done to date, seems it just may by as some Man Made bacteria to be used as a Bio Weapon to create Havoc for the people.
Perhaps this is one Major Reason our Governments are so Low Key about it...
But One Day when all S**t hits the fan, Everyone will know the Truth, though it may take many peoples lives and many years for it to happen.
My LLMD agrees that this is not something that was produced in the nature on its own, and if it did then did how did it so quickly spread to people, and then why do most say that only Ticks carry it.
If it was produced by nature alone than how did it so quickly and efficiently start spreading to people here in US and only recently ? (the last 50 or so years right at the term of WW2)
It may have been in nature for many years or even from the very begining of time, and was somewhere far far away, but then somehow mysteriously made its way here to where people reside and spread like nothing else on Earth.
Most cases go unreported and many people who do have it still dont know they are infected with it, perhaps are all still very naive and think its just a rash, or perhaps due to their strong immune system, or just blame other illnesses for it again without knowing the truth of what Lyme & Company really is and eventally does, and Global Warming may also play a role in it somehwre down the line, and the Poor tests that are available today are of no help either.
And do keep in mind that most other diseases like MS, Parkinsons, FM, Arthritis, Neuro problems, Chronic Fatigue, Cancers and many others have all been studied and treated with drugs, based on just that one disease that the individual had, but only lately have they all been mostly contributed in some ways to Lyme & Co.
Perhaps Ticks do actually do the most spreading of it since they are easier to identify and/or blame, but then I read that mosquitos, spiders and many other insects like even dust mites can do just the same.
Seems that just about any living organizm can carry it and pass it on, through just about any bodily fluid, but most easily through blood.
Infact he even says that today our very own Governments still experiment with it but for the so called Offensive reasons, still as a Bio Weapon and these labs are all Hidden very well and Underground from the public eye.
Plus the Pharmaceutical Companies play a Huge role in not participating as if a Cure is to be had for this and many other diseases, they would all eventualy no longer be in buisness and they are the biggest money makers today.
I just simply feel that if it is a living creature within us all as it lives and replocates, than it can surely be killed, but unfortunately not enough truth out there, and not enough truth, support or testing by the Government to offer a killing of this bug letalone a Cure, since they are infact the ones perhaps responsible and trying to cover it all up.
But there will be that one day when the Truth is going to be out there, the question is When and How ???
Just my thoughts on Lyme & Company...
[ 09. January 2009, 06:39 AM: Message edited by: eric555 ]
Posts: 570 | From philadelphia, pa | Registered: Dec 2008
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My LLMD agrees that this is not something that was produced in the nature on its own, and if it did then did how did it so quickly spread to people, and then why do most say that only Ticks carry it.
It's interesting that the Steere camp insist that Lyme spread because of reforestation and increase in deer numbers, whilst at the same time, the US Army warns soldiers in Iraq to protect themselves from Lyme ticks.
The Iraqi desert is not a place where you would expect to find rich green forests or herds of deer.
It's also interesting that arch-Steerite Raymond Dattwyler recently patented a biowarfare vaccine in which a key component is OspA from Lyme. The OspA gene may be genetically grafted onto virulence factors from plague, anthrax and other diseases, then expressed in a harmless Lactobacillus.
The aim, he says, is to stimulate immunity in the ***mucosa*** of the human respiratory and gastro-intestinal tract.
Then he develops his test vaccine - based 100% on Lyme.
If Lyme is only ever acquired via tick-bite, why develop a Lyme vaccine that is specifically designed to create immunity in the breathing passages?
And if Lyme has no relation to biowarfare, why create a series of biowar vaccines every one of of which contains recombinant OspA from Lyme?
You may find some relevant information in a couple of articles I have written here:
-------------------- Justice will be ours. Posts: 786 | From UK | Registered: Oct 2007
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daystar1952
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Yes...check out Elena's articles...lots of good info. Also you may want to read some of the articles I have written on my blog www.lymesentinel.blogspot.com. If you have any articles you want to comment on...please feel free to do so as this creates discussion and I am told it helps get blogs on the map
Posts: 1176 | Registered: Oct 2002
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daystar1952
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I tried clicking on ther link to my blog and it is not working from this site? At least not at the moment....strange
Posts: 1176 | Registered: Oct 2002
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Is it written to help persuade us that the new level 4 biolabs are absolutely necessary? Will it contain some useful facts? Like info about the eight legged terrorists?
The book is on Amazon, it's by Professor Jeffrey Lockwood and costs about $20:
Six-legged Soldiers: Using Insects as Weapons of War Jeffrey A Lockwood
Release Date: 8 January 2009
Best wishes, Andromeda
Posts: 180 | From UK | Registered: Nov 2005
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bejoy
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I blamed myself for a very long time for having mysterious symptoms, for and being a tired, sick, cranky person.
There is some satisfaction and relief in the understanding that this is not my fault - not something I should be able to "just get over, but can't."
I am a victim of terrible war crimes, and grateful for my survival.
-------------------- bejoy!
"Do not go where the path may lead; go instead where there is no path and leave a trail." -Ralph Waldo Emerson Posts: 1918 | From Alive and Well! | Registered: Feb 2007
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posted
I keep reading things here and there about AIDS, and that HIV isn't the cause, or not the sole cause, of the illness. Mycoplasmas have been mentioned.
Perhaps it's necessary to have a mycoplasma to get ill with Lyme and co infections? Just speculation on my part, I haven't read enough yet to try and piece this together.
I've always thought that we are a lot like AIDS patients, not so bad though, but with very fragile immune systems all the same.
There is an interesting thing going on where 37 top scientists have written to Science magazine and elsewhere, saying the original papers on HIV by Dr Gallo were wrong.
A British journalist and author is writing about this:
Will any real disclosures come out from this? If something does get revealed, due to the brave scientists and doctors who have joined together to speak out about HIV, then we can take heart and hope that those who know the truth about Lyme will follow their lead.
Best wishes, A.
Posts: 180 | From UK | Registered: Nov 2005
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posted
Based on my own experience, I do strongly feel that people with very strong immune systems do not succumb to Lyme.
Take that a step further, and I think that when the "resisters" get old and their immune systems weaken, they start having aches and pains and then die.
For all we know, and with the slow pace of Lyme, eventually everyone gets infected.
Just a thought.
-------------------- 3 Strains Mycoplasma and Chlymedia 2001. After treatment fine for all 2004. Major symptoms since 2005. Diag Aug 2008 Lyme. 400 mg/d doxy 500 2/d Ceftin Posts: 164 | From Texas | Registered: Jun 2008
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posted
Feelfit, in answer to your question about some people never remembering any tickbite, I had an adult tick in my foot which was removed by a health clinic one week later.
No rash and no symptoms for three months. When the muscles in my neck and shoulders became sore then, I thought it was due to my work.
Thus I can date every symptom, ie, it took this many years after the tickbite for such and such a symptom to show up.
Lyme is in ticks, in 23 insects and also transmitted person-to-person, unfortunately.
Posts: 13116 | From San Francisco | Registered: May 2006
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blaze
Unregistered
posted
Like some of the others here, I've developed EMF sensitivity, and I do not believe that Lyme is special in any way, shape, or form from any other type of microorganism. This is further supported by the fact that most of us here not only suffer from chronic Lyme, but also chronic bartonella, chronic babesia,...
Can these all be chronic and special?
I do not believe that Lyme or any of these are man-created superbugs, at least not in the sense that it is being implied.
Lyme is an ordinary bug that's been around for a long time, usually easily kept in check by the immune system, at least until something weird happened, giving it super powers.
So what happened?
...
A couple of cell phone antennas went up on a water tower less than an eighth mile from my home. Nobody here liked tailz, but she was right.
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posted
Like you Blaze, I am really sensitive to EMFs, as well as vibrations in the sound spectrum. Sometimes I can hear or feel sounds that no one else can.
When you think about it, the first radio waves have only been around since erm...was it 1894? Before that the whole planet had no electro smog. Now it has beams of radiation that are bouncing off other beams and mixing in with them and perhaps multiplying a hundred times the power that was in the original beam. I hope this description makes sense.
Perhaps our cell membranes have been changed electrically and bugs can get into cells that were able to keep them out before. Or the bugs have been changed to have a different elecrical field around themselves which protects them?
There was some research I remember reading about in The Body Electric by Becker, where he'd read of Russian experiments with rabbits, done in the 60s and 70s. The ones that lived in a high EMF area were found to have many times the number of parasites compared to the controls. The parasites they counted were nematodes I believe.
The whole problem of these worms seems to keep cropping up.
Did you know that nematode worms are sprayed on the fields? One of the brand names is called Nemesis. There are several types of these nematodes used to attack beetles and crop pests. They are genetically modified and didn't have to pass the same safety tests as the other GMOs, I can't remember why.
In Australia there have been papers written on people getting infected with new species of nematode worm, that have never attacked mammals before, only insects. The research paper I'm thinking of said there appeared to have been a very recent horizontal transfer of genes into the normal species.
Greed and arrogance has made the genetic scientists and engineers rush to be part of the big corporate boom in biotechnology. I think they might have made some wrong assumptions about genes not jumping from one species to another. What they are messing with might cause this planet's Nemesis sooner than we realise.
Appologies for being so negative; perhaps we will evolve to survive the mess that's around us.
The problem is, bacteria and viruses and all the other creatures with short life spans, evolve thousands of times quicker than we do!
By "resisters" I mean people with healthy immune systems.
My thinking is that all of us have been exposed to Lyme, but young and old that have a good immune system resist getting sick from it.
But even those with a strong immune system eventually get old, their immune system will weaken, and then they too will start having symptoms of Lyme, that most people attribute to normal aches and pains of old age.
We just don't know.
-------------------- 3 Strains Mycoplasma and Chlymedia 2001. After treatment fine for all 2004. Major symptoms since 2005. Diag Aug 2008 Lyme. 400 mg/d doxy 500 2/d Ceftin Posts: 164 | From Texas | Registered: Jun 2008
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Re the immune system - I dont think its as simple as a question of "good" and "bad" immune systems. A very typical Lyme story is a person in their twenties or thirties, in the pink of health, holding down a demanding job, family responsibilities and doing lots of outdoor strenuous sports, suddenly loses everything and becomes weak as a baby.
And you dont often hear of AIDS sufferers dying of massive disseminated Lyme.
Everyone is genetically different, even within families, so it is more likely that those with a certain genetic make-up are more susceptible to borreliosis than others, whilst they may have good resistance to many other infections.
However, once a person gets infected with borrelia, it seems likely that their immune system is altered in very specific ways. This does not cause blanket immunosuppression in the way that AIDS or immunosuppressive drugs do, but it may lay us open to certain specific infections by disrupting ***specific*** defense pathways in the body that would otherwise have fended off those infections.
For example theres a lot of evidence that Lyme damages the Toll-like Receptor system (TLR's)which is a signalling pathway that helps the immune system co-ordinate its action against certain pathogens.
Elena
quote:Originally posted by janis1023: Hi eric555,
By "resisters" I mean people with healthy immune systems.
My thinking is that all of us have been exposed to Lyme, but young and old that have a good immune system resist getting sick from it.
But even those with a strong immune system eventually get old, their immune system will weaken, and then they too will start having symptoms of Lyme, that most people attribute to normal aches and pains of old age.
We just don't know.
-------------------- Justice will be ours. Posts: 786 | From UK | Registered: Oct 2007
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