I have been posting a lot lately. I just switched to pulsing M,W,F high doses of:
Omnicef 1200mg Zith 600mg Mycobutin 300mg.
Did any of these drugs make you have really dark feelings -too dark to mention. I am beginning to think that this is not herxing, but reaction to the drugs themselves.
I wasn't well, but I didn't have these thoughts when I was on doxy/rifampin/zith at lower doses.
Please advise if you know these drugs alter mood not related to herxing.
If you had had suicidal thoughts while herxing, what did you do to control them until it passes?
-------------------- Severe neurological problems. Probably sick for years. Became chronically sick in Aug 2007. Undiagnosed for another 15 months. Started treatment for lyme and bart Sept. 2008. Improving, but very slowly. Posts: 515 | From washington dc | Registered: Aug 2008
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posted
I just took some Ativan to see if it would help break this. I am also using burbur as directed by my LLMD.
-------------------- Severe neurological problems. Probably sick for years. Became chronically sick in Aug 2007. Undiagnosed for another 15 months. Started treatment for lyme and bart Sept. 2008. Improving, but very slowly. Posts: 515 | From washington dc | Registered: Aug 2008
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sutherngrl
Frequent Contributor (1K+ posts)
Member # 16270
posted
Xanax helps me! I can't take antidepressants.
I think about how much suicide would affect my family; the legacy that it would leave behind for them to have to deal with for the rest of their lives. How they would always wonder why they didn't or weren't able to do something to help me. How they would feel guilty even though they shouldn't; and how mean it would be of me to cause them to have to feel that way.
Posts: 4035 | From Mississippi | Registered: Jul 2008
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posted
sutherngrl - I PMd you. I wanted to know if these thoughts are herxes for you?
I am concerned that it is the drugs themselves.
Kathy
-------------------- Severe neurological problems. Probably sick for years. Became chronically sick in Aug 2007. Undiagnosed for another 15 months. Started treatment for lyme and bart Sept. 2008. Improving, but very slowly. Posts: 515 | From washington dc | Registered: Aug 2008
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Alv
Unregistered
posted
I was for more than 6 months when I was hitting hard lyme and bart.My son was staying on top of my head and watching him gave me the strenth to live.
he was suffering the same way .Imagine a child saying " I wish I am dead"
He does not say that anymore...but first year was tough for both of us...keep fighting
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posted
Flagyl with zith made me dark dark black. It was awful.
Posts: 845 | From Eastern USA | Registered: Jul 2006
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Melanie Reber
Frequent Contributor (5K+ posts)
Member # 3707
posted
Yes...Omnicef was NOT a good med for me for a few reasons, and this was one of them. Please speak with your doc about this. M
Posts: 7052 | From Colorado | Registered: Mar 2003
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posted
Thanks for your replies. It is good to know that I am not alone. In spite of these thoughts, I do think that I am making progress with these drugs.
How messed up is that?
-------------------- Severe neurological problems. Probably sick for years. Became chronically sick in Aug 2007. Undiagnosed for another 15 months. Started treatment for lyme and bart Sept. 2008. Improving, but very slowly. Posts: 515 | From washington dc | Registered: Aug 2008
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Melanie Reber
Frequent Contributor (5K+ posts)
Member # 3707
posted
SIDE EFFECTS: Diarrhea or nausea may occur. If these effects persist or worsen, notify your doctor promptly.
Report promptly: unusual vaginal discharge/itching. Very unlikely but report promptly: changes in amount or color of urine, stomach pain, persistent sore throat or fever, easy bruising or bleeding, unusual fatigue, seizures.
May cause reddish discoloration of stools. This is harmless. In the unlikely event you have an allergic reaction to this drug, seek immediate medical attention. Symptoms of an allergic reaction include: rash, itching, swelling, dizziness, trouble breathing. If you notice other effects not listed above, contact your doctor or pharmacist.
Do not take antacids that contain aluminum or magnesium, iron supplements, or multivitamins with iron, with a dose of Omnicef. Take these products at least 2 hours before or after a dose of Omnicef to prevent decreased effectiveness of the antibiotic. The Omnicef suspension can be safely administered with iron-fortified infant formula.
What are the possible side effects of Omnicef? If you experience any of the following serious side effects, stop taking Omnicef and seek emergency medical attention or contact your doctor immediately:
an allergic reaction (difficulty breathing; closing of the throat; swelling of the lips, face, or tongue; hives; or a rash); rash, redness, or itching
seizures
severe nausea, vomiting, or diarrhea
mucous or blood in the stool; or unusual bleeding or bruising.
Other, less serious side effects may be more likely to occur. Continue to take Omnicef and talk to your doctor if you experience
mild nausea or diarrhea, or a yeast infection of the mouth or vagina.
Side effects other than those listed here may also occur. Talk to your doctor about any side effect that seems unusual or that is especially bothersome
Diarrhea, nausea, vomiting, or diaper rash in young children may occur. If any of these effects persist or worsen, notify your doctor or pharmacist promptly.
This medication may cause your stools to turn a reddish color, especially if you also take iron products. This is harmless.
Remember that your doctor has prescribed this medication because the benefit to you is greater than the risk of side effects. Many people using this medication do not have serious side effects.
Tell your doctor immediately if any of these unlikely but serious side effects occur:
mental/mood changes.
Tell your doctor immediately if any of these rare but very serious side effects occur:
stomach/abdominal pain, persistent nausea/vomiting, yellowing eyes or skin, dark urine, unusual fatigue, new signs of infection (e.g., persistent sore throat, fever), easy bruising/bleeding, change in the amount of urine.
This medication may rarely cause a severe intestinal condition (pseudomembranous colitis) due to a resistant bacteria.
This condition may occur weeks after treatment has stopped. Do not use anti-diarrhea products or narcotic pain medications if you have the following symptoms because these products may make them worse.
Tell your doctor immediately if you develop: persistent diarrhea, abdominal or stomach pain/cramping, or blood/mucus in your stool.
Use of this medication for prolonged or repeated periods may result in oral thrush or a new vaginal yeast infection (oral or vaginal fungal infection). Contact your doctor if you notice white patches in your mouth, a change in vaginal discharge or other new symptoms.
A very serious allergic reaction to this drug is unlikely, but seek immediate medical attention if it occurs. Symptoms of a serious allergic reaction may include: rash, itching, swelling, severe dizziness, trouble breathing. If you notice other effects not listed above, contact your doctor or pharmacist.
Posts: 7052 | From Colorado | Registered: Mar 2003
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posted
A Herx is your body's response to the neurotoxins released into your body as a result of die-off. Neurotoxins love to mess with the brain especially. You are doing some heavy duty killing off with your present med regime, so more and varied toxins are being released
When I was dark dark dark, I used to crawl up into a ball and rock myself and cry until I felt I could get ahold of myself. My therapist told me that the dark thoughts and anxiety could not kill me, only I could do that. It feels like the thoughts can kill you, but they can't.
Breathe, breathe breathe. Take some Burbur. Tell yourself that this is a biochemical reaction and you CAN get through it because it is TEMPORARY. Make sure you have a few people who will check in on you every day. It is horrible to go through this alone and feel no one understands.
If you can, give yourself a coffee enema each day. This helps the liver detox all those neurotoxins.
All this is well and good, but ultimately I went for the pharmaceuticals to get me over the hump. I have had neuro-psych problems ever since i got bit. Xanax is good.It has short half-life so you clear it quickly so you need to dose your self a couple times a day.
Also there is a supplement that can ease the anxiety. GABA is an amino acid that calms the nerves. When you don't have enough of it (system over load) you feel overwhelmed by everything. You can get it at the health food store or on-line.
Know that you are not alone in your experience. Many many of us have felt suicidal with this disease. Though you may not know it now you will get through this
-------------------- Breathe in. Breathe out. Breathe in... Breathe out... Breathe in............. Breathe out.......... Be still. Posts: 10 | From Sacramento | Registered: Feb 2009
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posted
Melaine - thanks. I saw that too. I may stop the omnicef or at least reduce to 600mg and see what happens.
I thoughts are gone for now. I used ativan, burbur, and now lemon and olive oil.
amjrn - I know that thoughts can't kill ya, but they sure do a number on you.
I am doing a bit better. I just can't decide herx or side effect.
-------------------- Severe neurological problems. Probably sick for years. Became chronically sick in Aug 2007. Undiagnosed for another 15 months. Started treatment for lyme and bart Sept. 2008. Improving, but very slowly. Posts: 515 | From washington dc | Registered: Aug 2008
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MariaA
Frequent Contributor (1K+ posts)
Member # 9128
posted
Biaxin did this to me and it was definitely Biaxin and not a herx. Other people have reported that zith does it to them, a related drug to Biaxin.
posted
The question is how I figure out the difference when I am pulsing. I don't know how to do that. Herx or medicine?
-------------------- Severe neurological problems. Probably sick for years. Became chronically sick in Aug 2007. Undiagnosed for another 15 months. Started treatment for lyme and bart Sept. 2008. Improving, but very slowly. Posts: 515 | From washington dc | Registered: Aug 2008
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posted
The omnicef has done this to me. I think they talk about the "omnicef flare" - which is a flare-up of brain symptoms that happens on omnicef. Do a search for this - here is a thread on it:
So, they deliberately put some patients on omnicef to see f they have the brain flare and this means that they need IV bc there is significant brain involvement.
This last round of omnicef was very hard for me and I could not stop crying. But then I took a break from it and did ceftin for a few weeks. My brain felt great on the ceftin but that makes me a horrible insomniac. So, I recently switched back to omnicef and am not depressed this time.
Go figure!
I hope that you can either start to feel better or maybe switch to ceftin??? Or some people go on antidepressants just to get though the pscyh herx from some of these meds.
Hope this helps and that you feel better soon. Good luck!
Posts: 589 | From Rhode Island | Registered: Jun 2006
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There is no doubt that there is signficant brain involvement. That is cheifly my problem. I don't really have the pain that others talk about.
My doctor tries to cure people with orals.
We shall see if I can handle the omnicef. I am wondering about lowering the dose until I can handle it better.
I am already on antidepressants!
Thanks, Kathy
-------------------- Severe neurological problems. Probably sick for years. Became chronically sick in Aug 2007. Undiagnosed for another 15 months. Started treatment for lyme and bart Sept. 2008. Improving, but very slowly. Posts: 515 | From washington dc | Registered: Aug 2008
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CD57
Frequent Contributor (1K+ posts)
Member # 11749
posted
Kathy, just lending a note of support as having been there myself. My Rifampin combo gave me horrendous neuropsych symptoms, particularly about 6 weeks in. Do anything you need to get thru them.
Posts: 3528 | From US | Registered: Apr 2007
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TF
Frequent Contributor (5K+ posts)
Member # 14183
posted
Kathy, since you said that the thoughts are gone for now, I think you can be pretty certain that this is a herx.
Here is my thinking: in researching these meds, none of my sources mention any mental changes as possible side effects. So, it is pretty unlikely that the meds are causing this. (Not impossible, but pretty unlikely. One of my sources is a physician's medical drug reference book. It doesn't list any CNS side effects caused by these drugs. Same with internet sources.)
Then, I add to that that you reported that the thoughts are gone for now. (Thank God!) And, you are doing a variety of detoxification methods.
Then I add to that the fact that lymies are reporting to you that the drugs did that to them.
So, this so-called "side effect" only seems to happen when lymies take these drugs. Added to that, you report that your lyme symptoms are chiefly brain problems.
This conclusion is reinforced by what luvdogs and amjrn have said.
So sorry you are going through this, but also happy for you that this drug is killing off the lyme in your brain.
I hope you continue to have relief from these terrible thoughts/feelings. But record the dates you have them and see if you see any pattern to them, especially weekly or every 28 days.
I'm not that far from you. Please, please let me know if I can do ANYTHING for you. I'll give you my phone number if you want to talk. Let me know, lady. We don't want anything to happen to you. OK?
Posts: 9931 | From Maryland | Registered: Dec 2007
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