I'm a new member here (as of about 10 min ago!). I started babesia treatment 3 weeks ago w/ zithromax. Likely also infected w/ lyme, bart, mycoplasma.
After only two weeks of treatment I got yeast!! I was taking 6-7 PB8 probiotics daily.
My symptoms include bloating, abdominal pain, gas, burning and itching in all nether regions, burning eyes and nose, popping ears, burning mouth, coated tongue, fatigue and neuropathy.
Prior to beginning abx, I actually felt pretty good, having done a lot in the way of diet and supplements.
I stopped my abx and am now on diflucan, to follow up with Nystatin. I use milk thistle and do the lemon/olive oil drink nightly.
I've started the anti-yeast diet, joy! But if it helps, so be it.
I'm really freaking out. How in the world do you stay on abx and control yeast??!!
I'll do plenty of searching here for tips, but I'm in need of any support or ideas anyone is able to offer.
Thank you!
[ 05-10-2009, 08:26 PM: Message edited by: Saskat ]
Posts: 55 | From US | Registered: May 2009
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I *totally* feel your pain. As for the nether regions, in addition to the prescription antifungals, I have been adding some "natural" remedies. This site was the most informative was: https://www.msu.edu/~eisthen/yeast/yourself.html
I'm struggling to get myself on the yeast diet, too. Ick, but better than what we are dealing with currently, I suppose.
-------------------- Wildlife biologist working in tropics since 1997; tick bites in Nicaragua in March 2007, started getting sick May 2007; diagnosed with Lyme based on serological testing in Jan 2009; treatment starting Feb 2009. Wish me luck! Posts: 116 | From Seattle | Registered: Feb 2009
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Keebler
Honored Contributor (25K+ posts)
Member # 12673
posted
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You said: " . . .lemon/olive oil drink nightly."
How much oil are you using with this each night? Too much is not a good thing for your liver or gallbladder to have to process out while you are sleeping. Just a little bit (about a teaspoon), okay, though.
The "recipe" for this varies widely out there. It can be too harsh if used in large amounts.
============
Going gluten-free is suggested for lyme patients. That, alone, also helps tremendously to avoid candida. And, I found that I don't think of this as a diet, but a healthy life style.
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Olive leaf extract was a miracle for me - it totally prevented any candida when I was on abx. Although, I've only done 2 months abx as the longest time. I can't take abx for several reasons.
But, before, even looking at an abx and I'd turn into a huge candida farm. With the olive leaf extract, seriously, nothing. Of course, I still followed a no-sugar, moderate complex carb diet.
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The type my ND recommended that worked so well for me was MYROLEA B. Most naturopathic doctors and acupuncturists know about the Seven Forest formulas.
Myrolea-B (White Tiger) is a simple formulation of highly concentrated extracts from four Chinese herbs and one Western herb.
The Chinese herbs include forsythia and lonicera, two of the key ingredients of Ilex 15 (and the main antiviral ingredients of Yin Qiao Jie Du Pian), thus boosting the dosage of these essential ingredients.
Myrolea-B also contains the antiviral agents scute (huangqin) and terminalia (hezi). The Western herb in this formulation is olive leaf, which is one of the primary anti-viral herbs derived from the European tradition.
SHUANGHUANGLIAN: Potent Anti-Infection Combination of Lonicera, Forsythia, and Scute - by Subhuti Dharmananda, Ph.D., Director, Institute for Traditional Medicine - 2003
Shuanghuanglian (SHL for short) is a modern formula that was devised in the 1960s to treat a variety of infections. It is comprised of the alcohol-water extracts of three herbs: lonicera (shuanghua, often called jinyinhua), scute (huangqin), and forsythia (lianqiao). . . .
. . . One of the early preparations of the SHL was a tablet made of equal proportions of the extracts of each herb. This was used to treat leptospirosis, a disorder caused by a spirochete bacteria, related to the organism that causes Lyme disease.
Leptospirosis causes initial symptoms of fever and chills, headache, and muscle ache (especially in the shoulders); these are consistent with "flu-like" symptoms described for the onset of many acute infections.
In a 1971 report, the formula was described as being made in 500 mg tablets derived from 3.7 grams of the crude herbs, and being administered in doses of 10-15 tablets (thus, equivalent to the extract of 37-55 grams of herbs) every 6 hours (1), a very high dosage.
. . . Recently, Shuanghuanglian has been applied successfully to treatment of Coxsackie B3,
. . . The general indications for SHL . . . are "relieving the exterior syndrome, clearing away heat and toxic material," and its indications are "treatment of fever, cough, and sore throat that arise from wind-heat syndrome."
It is said to have "a good action in treating upper respiratory tract infection, tonsillitis, laryngopharyngitis, pneumonia, acute enteritis, viral dysentery, etc., when caused by virus or bacterial infection."
Betty's suggested POSTING GUIDELINES . many of us have neuro lyme where we can NOT read long solid block text and be able to comprehend and read it as is.
please edit your post by CLICKING PAPER/PENCIL ICON to right of your name. that opens up BOTH subject line and body text.
now please break up your WORDY SENTENCES into one sentence paragraphs. Then hit ENTER KEY ``TWICE`` after each paragraph; we need that space for comprehension.
then go to left hand corner and mark box to receive ALL REPLIES, and click EDIT SEND
we thank you for helping us; otherwise, we will SOB, SCROLL ON BY, since we can't read to help you. If I see posts like this, I SOB them; to hard on me. ------------------------------------------------------
People seeking doctors might be able to get help from their state online information and support group. Nearly 3,400 people belong to state groups. Some of the groups are small but more than 20 of them have 50 or more people and seven have over 100.
The groups are moderated and you have to apply. Most don't allow doctor names, but once on the group, you can ask for doctors in a certain area and ask people to email you privately. *******************************************
This explains the medical politics around lyme WHY you need an ILADS-educated or ILADS-member LLMD (and there are also some ILADS-member LL NDs (naturopathic doctors):
You should also be evaluated for coinfections. Not all tests are great in that regard, either, but a good LLMD can evaluate you and then guide you in testing. One of the top labs is:
"With most infections, your immune system first forms IgM antibodies, then in about 2 to 4 weeks, you see IgG antibodies. In some infections, IgG antibodies may be detectable for years.
Because Borrelia burgdorferi is a chronic persistent infection that may last for decades, you would think patients with chronic symptoms would have positive IgG Western blots.
But actually, more IgM blots are positive in chronic borreliosis than IgG. Every time Borrelia burgdorferi reproduces itself, it may stimulate the immune system to form new IgM antibodies.
Some patients have both IgG and IgM blots positive. But if either the IgG or IgM blot is positive, overall it is a positive result.
Response to antibiotics is the same if either is positive, or both. Some antibodies against the borrelia are given more significance if they are IgG versus IgM, or vice versa.
Since this is a chronic persistent infection, this does not make a lot of sense to me. A newly formed Borrelia burgdorferi should have the same antigen parts as the previous bacteria that produced it.
But anyway, from my clinical experience, these borrelia associated bands usually predict a clinical change in symptoms with antibiotics, regardless of whether they are IgG or IgM." ===========
ILADS The International Lyme and Associated Diseases Society (ILADS) provides a forum for health science professionals to share their wealth of knowledge regarding the management of Lyme and associated diseases.
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randibear
Honored Contributor (10K+ posts)
Member # 11290
posted
diflucan.....
nystatin didn't work for me...
-------------------- do not look back when the only course is forward Posts: 12262 | From texas | Registered: Mar 2007
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I completely freaked out w/ having such complications after only two weeks of abx.
I went gluten and dairy free last summer, and it made a huge difference. Inflammation down, more comfortable, good energy.
I use a tablespoon of oil for the lemon drink. Hm, too much perhaps?
Well, I'll be surfing around here and elsewhere trying to decide what to do for the yeast.
Thanks again!
Posts: 55 | From US | Registered: May 2009
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Abxnomore
Frequent Contributor (5K+ posts)
Member # 18936
posted
The best probiotics are the kind that are in the refrigerated section and contain multiple strains of Acidophilis and bifidus. You might want to
find a better probiotic that contain millions vs. billions.
posted
I figured out the edit feature and made the corrections.
Thanks for the heads up.
Posts: 55 | From US | Registered: May 2009
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gemofnj
Frequent Contributor (1K+ posts)
Member # 15551
posted
Dear S,
The key here is a 'combination' found in Dr. B's guidelines.
Probiotics ALONE will not keep yeast under control, especially if a carb free diet is not maintained. In case you didnt know, sugar FEEDS yeast, big time.
Step 1: DIET (low carb/low sugar/high protein diet
Step 2: Detox to slough off toxins by candida
Step 3: ANTIFUNGALS along with the probiotics can aid in controlling yeast.
Step 4: Oral hygiene-prevents reinfection
Herbal antifungals along with oral hygiene can be very effective if used before yeast gets out of control. Herbals, can be olive leaf, garlic, pau de arc, grapefruit seed extract or oregano, etc.
Personally, fungal defense by garden of life and Oregamax worked great in combination with good refrigerated probiotics and a low car diet. Add a little detox in and it accelerates the results.
Combine that with good oral hygiene, (ie brushing tongue every day, rinsing with a strong antiseptic mouthwash for 30 seconds-UH it burns, oh yea!, and dipping your brush in bleach and rinsing thoroughly after ever use) and you can hopefully keep yeast under control---Yeast actually starts on the tongue.
Detox can be in the form of steam/sauna, warm to hot baths, low impact exercise and/or detox products or methods as tolerated, to get rid of the candida toxins or die off.
There are tons of other additional yeast aid products. To name a few, kolerex, candicyn, candi gone, threelac, cuturelle and candex, etc.
But, with all that being said, some folks need still need prescription antifungals such as nystatin or diflucan in addition to the probiotics, diet and detox.
Posts: 1127 | From atlantic city, nj | Registered: May 2008
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posted
As for controlling the Candida at the start -- i.e., with the oral hygiene -- anyone know if you can use something other than bleach for the toothbrush? Hydrogen peroxide, maybe?
(I'm trying to avoid bleach, an aquatic biologist I know really thinks chlorine is just the worst thing for aquatic ecosystems, so I've tried to eliminate using it in my house.)
-------------------- Wildlife biologist working in tropics since 1997; tick bites in Nicaragua in March 2007, started getting sick May 2007; diagnosed with Lyme based on serological testing in Jan 2009; treatment starting Feb 2009. Wish me luck! Posts: 116 | From Seattle | Registered: Feb 2009
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gemofnj
Frequent Contributor (1K+ posts)
Member # 15551
posted
Hi Kim,
I'm not sure if they kill the same germs, but Clorox has a green line now.
posted
I use Metagenics Ultra Flora -- 60 billion!
Kefir is good.
So is a clove of garlic inserted in the vagina. Leave it in overnight. or more.
Posts: 564 | From Tick Hell | Registered: Oct 2008
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Abxnomore
Frequent Contributor (5K+ posts)
Member # 18936
posted
For oral hygiene put grapefruit seed extract or oil of oregano on your tooth brush with your toothpaste and brush your teeth and tongue and use a tongue scraper. Then rinse with water and a few drops of
grapefruit seed extract or oil of oregano. You can also use a drop or two of tea tree oil in the same manner but be very careful not to swallow it.
When you mouth is completely rinsed, open some capsules of probiotics and let it dissolve on your tongue to replace the good flora.
If you don't change your diet to an anti yeast one it will be a continual problem while on abx.
For vaginal yeast you can insert capsules of acidophilus with some vitamin e to restore the natural flora for a few days.
Posts: 5191 | From Lyme Zone | Registered: Jan 2009
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-------------------- --Lymetutu-- Opinions, not medical advice! Posts: 96223 | From Texas | Registered: Feb 2001
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ukcarry
Frequent Contributor (1K+ posts)
Member # 18147
posted
When you have finished Diflucan, you could get NSI's Candida Yeast Management [www.vitacost.com], which really is effective, even when you're on abx.
I also take probiotics, of course, and follow an anti-candida diet, though not as strictly as I once did.
posted
Thanks so much, everyone! I got some oil of oregano from North America Herb & Spice and some Olive Leaf Extract from Herb Pharm. Both are oil w/ eyedroppers.
Is the only place to buy Theralac on their website?
I've also been running some hydrogen peroxide over my toothbrush (and then giving it a good rinse w/ water) before brushing my teeth, then emptying a PB8 on my tongue. Maybe PB8 can suffice for me in that regard.
Have adopted the anti-candida diet. Not much fun, but some symptoms are improving. I still fail the spit test, but not as dramatically as before.
Posts: 55 | From US | Registered: May 2009
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gemofnj
Frequent Contributor (1K+ posts)
Member # 15551
posted
uk carry,
This looks like a great product. My LLMD also suggested enzymes to aid in yeast contol.
I think I might give this a try in addition to my probiotics.
Thanks!! Posts: 1127 | From atlantic city, nj | Registered: May 2008
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