I did the google search, I searched old posts here, and have calls into 2 docs to have this explained but I'm not clear on it and I'm stewing in worry.
All I know for sure is that my new LLMD wants me to get 3 vaccines because of it: meningitis, pnemococcal (pneumovax), and HIB=haemophilus influenza.
Anything you can share about this is greatly appreciated.
Posts: 702 | From North Eastern USA | Registered: Dec 2009
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Keebler
Honored Contributor (25K+ posts)
Member # 12673
posted
- I have no idea of what your tests mean. And various methods of immuno-therapy may (or may not) have benefit under certain circumstances if done safely.
But be aware that many with lyme react adversely to vaccines. It could be the introduction of the live (or dead) germ and the actual immune reactions for someone with an already dysfunctional and exhausted immune system - &/or the additives.
Is your LLMD ILADS-educated or an ILADS-member?
Dont' "stew in worry" - ever. However, I'd give this a lot of research - and get second, third and fourth opinions. Read professional literature from those who really know about vaccine considerations.
If you go ahead, be sure to get vaccines WITHOUT MERCURY (thimerosal) or other adjuvants (additives, etc.). You will have to make special arrangements.
I can't find the exact link for a very good video (I think it was Dr. Russell Blaylock) as to why CFS patients should not get vaccines. That detail would extend to lyme patients as many with CFS have undiagnosed chronic infections.
Now, all this said (or read) . . . there still may be good reasons for your doctor's advice. I sure would want to know a lot more.
And - why not just keep a bottle of the best allicin in your pocket, so to speak. At the first sign of trouble, allicin can cover a lot of bases. -
[ 03-05-2010, 03:54 PM: Message edited by: Keebler ]
Posts: 48021 | From Tree House | Registered: Jul 2007
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Pocono Lyme
Frequent Contributor (1K+ posts)
Member # 5939
posted
My subclasses have been low for years. I was very worried also when I saw this.
3 out of 4 of mine were low in addition to my total being way low.
I found a chart that explained which subclass deficiency could indicate, but of course my babesia brain didn't save it.
If, and that's a big IF, I remember correctly, subclass 1 could be due to atypical bacteria, such as Bartonella.
One of them could indicate viral.
I believe it was subclass 4 that could indicate a parasitic infection such as Babesia.
I'm going to be getting mine checked again in a couple of weeks, but the last ones had improved. Now only deficient in 2 subclasses and my total is finally improving significantly, though still low.
My immunologist had me get 2 vaccines to check my response by my immune system to see if IVIG would be beneficial. I had no adverse reactions.
Try not to worry. They're probably low due to longstanding infection and will improve with treatment.
Wish I saved that chart
-------------------- 2 Corinthians 12:9-11
9 But he said to me, �My grace is sufficient for you, for my power is made perfect in weakness.� Therefore I will boast all the more gladly about my weaknesses, so that Christ�s power may rest on me. Posts: 1445 | From Poconos, PA | Registered: Jul 2004
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Keebler
Honored Contributor (25K+ posts)
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posted
- There are some methods of homeopathy regarding immuno-therapy that might be considered - and homeopathy has virtually zero risk factor. But you'd need a well educated ND (naturopathic doctor) who has the additional training in homeopathy.
There may be a few with doctorate degrees in homeopathy but, most often, it is an additional course of study that a ND would pursue, along with their naturopathic studies. But not all NDs are trained in this or have enough training for immunity protocols.
One who would be lyme literate would be nice, too. -
Posts: 48021 | From Tree House | Registered: Jul 2007
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seekhelp
Frequent Contributor (5K+ posts)
Member # 15067
posted
IVIG therapy is the main way it's tackled based on my readings. I had a mildly low Subclass 1 IgG deficiency. Doc didn't care.
Posts: 7545 | From The 5th Dimension - The Twilight Zone | Registered: Mar 2008
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Keebler
Honored Contributor (25K+ posts)
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- Just how are are vaccines supposed to help? Sounds like this is more to change the immune system than to offer protection for certain infections for which the patient may be more at risk?
Is there a basic article on this approach? Is it just for those consider IVIG treatments?
Various vaccines nearly killed me in the past. One put me in a near coma for one full year. I did not make the connection until one later (tetanus) that sent me to the E.R. with convulsions - and I'm not the only one. So, this is perplexing to me and has me very curious about this method. It's all new to me. -
Posts: 48021 | From Tree House | Registered: Jul 2007
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posted
For me the worry stems from concern about the safety of vaccines for lyme patients--I'm in that pro/con pickle where I'm not sure what to do and can find conflicting arguments.
My own experience: I had a flu shot at the end of this past summer prior to diagnosis by an LLMD--I got the flu from it! And tetanus, a couple of years ago, made me stiff and sore for a while; maybe even damaged my hip.
Keebler, I just switched to a new LLMD. Both the new one and the old one have both been presidents of ILADS so no worries there. However, now I have a difference of opinion between the two. Got the call today from the nurse at the first LLMD's office--they don't recommend vacinations for for IgG deficiencies. I have a call in to the new LLMD ( who recommended getting the vaccines) so that I can get more info.
I know IVIG is very expensive and I recall reading here of people having trouble with it. My inclination is to skip these treatments and see if the deficiencies correct themselves with lyme treatment--I'm only five months in and it has NOT been a smooth ride, especially as far as drug tolerance goes.
By some miracle I haven't gotten any colds or flus since starting treatment in a timeframe in which I normally would've been hit at least twice. I take allicillin and lots of vit c AND hardly ever leave the house, so that all must help.
Does anyone know if IgG subclass deficiency has it's own diagnostic code and if it is a distinct illness/syndrome, as opposed to a symptom/sign?
Posts: 702 | From North Eastern USA | Registered: Dec 2009
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-------------------- Suspected Lyme 07 Test neg One band migrating in IgG region unable to identify.Igenex Jan.09IFA titer 1:40 IND IgM neg pos 31 +++ 34 IND 39 IND 41 IND 83-93 + DX:Neuroborreliosis Posts: 5850 | From Kentucky | Registered: Dec 2008
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Siciliano
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posted
Hi, sickpuppy, I never try to tell others what medical choices to make. But, this might be the first time......
I think I would move on to another LLMD because I don't think you need those vaccines.
If it were me, I would NEVER consider taking the vaccines. I really hope you think about this.....really hard.
I'm concerned about you--you are such a nice person and I don't want anything to happen to you.
-------------------- I'm sorry but I am no longer accepting any private messages due to my own battle with lyme. Posts: 3897 | From New Hampshire | Registered: Jun 2008
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karenl
Frequent Contributor (1K+ posts)
Member # 17753
posted
My subclass is also low - since long time. It gets better when I take the IGG 2000 powder. Only start with 1/4 of teaspoon.
Keebler, the tetanus is a horrible vaccination,it made me so sick. But it is also horrible for children, they get fever and pain.
Posts: 1834 | From US | Registered: Oct 2008
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posted
Thanks for your comments--they bolster my own feeling that getting the vaccines would not be a good choice.
Sicilano, as far as going to yet a third LLMD (well actually 4th as I went to one and eliminated him from the running immediately), I think I should stay put for now. I'm sure I can talk to this current LLMD about my concerns. Considering his expertise and high standing in the lyme community, he must have valid reasons behind making this suggestion. But my plan is NOT to get them. Anyway, I need to be able to have faith in SOME LLMD and family friend's, who are his patients, feel strongly that he will fix me up.
I need to read more about this whole IgG situation, like in a medical textbook. Right now I'm in the midst of getting heart and lung tests so... very busy here in Sickland. Maybe I can just procrastinate it away!! Ha ha. (Funny to me because I'm a ducks in a row, plan ahead type!).
Why does lyme have to be SO, everlastingly complicated!?
Posts: 702 | From North Eastern USA | Registered: Dec 2009
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posted
I have low IGG subclasses as well. They did the vaccine test on me to see if I would have an immune response. My immune system strongly reacted to it so therefore the LLMD just thinks that is could be depressed because of infection but not bad enough to need IVIG.
Posts: 458 | From Miss | Registered: Mar 2009
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posted
A vaccine test? My doc said vaccine, not vaccine test. He never mentioned IVIG. I learned about that from the good old internet.
Posts: 702 | From North Eastern USA | Registered: Dec 2009
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posted
^
Posts: 702 | From North Eastern USA | Registered: Dec 2009
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Pinelady
Frequent Contributor (5K+ posts)
Member # 18524
posted
I think you are talking about a titer test?
Docs dont like to talk about titers for some reason.
-------------------- Suspected Lyme 07 Test neg One band migrating in IgG region unable to identify.Igenex Jan.09IFA titer 1:40 IND IgM neg pos 31 +++ 34 IND 39 IND 41 IND 83-93 + DX:Neuroborreliosis Posts: 5850 | From Kentucky | Registered: Dec 2008
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posted
Ok so the LLMD recommended an Immunologist. Hopefully that means he'll be able to get his head around the lyme as a major associated issue.
Posts: 702 | From North Eastern USA | Registered: Dec 2009
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sutherngrl
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posted
I am wondering if the IGG subclass thingy is even of that much importance, since many Lyme docs don't seem to test for this. Maybe it is just a common thing seen in Lymies and goes away with the lyme.
How did you find out you had this? Are there certain symptoms associated with this? I guess I am just trying to figure out what prompts a doctor to test for this, yet many don't.
Posts: 4035 | From Mississippi | Registered: Jul 2008
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posted
I was muddling around trying to find a new llmd. In the process more labs were done including a general IgG test. Since that was low, then my old LLMD had the subclasses tested. It's significant in so far as it puts you at greater risk for nasty killer stuff like pneumonia, meningitis etc--so I've read.
The symptom is getting/being sick a lot. So people can be unaware of it. I remember hearing in the news once about a school principal who died of H1N1, they said he was immunodeficient or suppressed. So anyway, I'm gonna play it safe, as I said, by going to the immunologist. See if I can get more information.
Hard to know what's significant and what's not and the docs have different opinions--eeeek.
Posts: 702 | From North Eastern USA | Registered: Dec 2009
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sickpuppy, I never try to tell others what medical choices to make. But, this might be the first time......
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