Topic: Lyme diet is going to give me a heart attack!
richedie
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Member # 14689
posted
To make up for all the missing carbs, I am eating tons of nuts, seeds, eggs, chicken, turkey, flax, avocados and so on! I am talking tons of nuts, all types. Again, with all the missing carbs, I am missing a lot of calories in my diet so I am trying fill up on lots of nuts and nut butters. That is hundreds of grams of fat!!!
-------------------- Mepron/Zith/Ceftin Doxy/Biaxin/Flagyl pulse. Artemisinin with Doxy/Biaxin. Period of Levaquin and Ceftin. Then Levaquin, Bactrim and Biaxin. Bactrim/Augmentin/Rifampin. Mepron/Biaxin/Artemisinin/Cat's Claw Rifampin/Bactrim/Alinia Plaquenil/Biaxin Posts: 1949 | From Pennsylvania | Registered: Feb 2008
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glm1111
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When I was on abx and doing the "Lyme diet" I always felt weak. I decided to eat things like oatmeal with cinnamon(antifungal) with some almond milk and sometimes some fruit.
I took a tablespoon of coconut oil (antufungal) before I ate and I started to feel better. I needed my carbs and so does our brain. Hope this gives you some ideas.
P. S.
Sweet potatoes with cinnamon is also another good carb and very good for you.
-------------------- PARASITES/WORMS ARE NOW RECOGNIZED AS THE NUMBER 1 CO-INFECTION IN LYME DISEASE BY ILADS* Posts: 6418 | From philadelphia pa | Registered: Jul 2008
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posted
Stop eating so much fat. Moderation is key.
-------------------- --Lymetutu-- Opinions, not medical advice! Posts: 96220 | From Texas | Registered: Feb 2001
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randibear
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wow, i can't eat any nuts due to diverticulitis and even the raw vegetables either.
i'm so screwed....
-------------------- do not look back when the only course is forward Posts: 12262 | From texas | Registered: Mar 2007
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kidsgotlyme
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If you do some research, I think you will find that the kind of fat that you are eating will not hurt your heart.
It's when you combine all that fat with carbs that you have trouble.
It sounds to me like your body NEEDS some carbs. Some people(me) don't get hungry when they are eating plenty of good fats, but others(like my daughter) cannot get full without some carbs in her diet.
I hope that you can find a happy medium.
-------------------- symptoms since 1993 that I can remember. 9/2018 diagnosed with Borellia, Babesia Duncani, and Bartonella Hensalae thru DNA Connections. Posts: 1470 | From Tennessee | Registered: Dec 2009
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richedie
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posted
I know what you mean but if you go hard core with this diet...you have to cut all grains and potatoes, for example. However, I find I can't survive that way. So, I have started adding back in steel cut gluten free oatmeal, some red skin potatoies and sweet potatoes. I figure as long as they are whole and as close to in tact as possible and I eat enough anti-fungals such as pau d arco, black walnut hulls, ginger, garlic, onion, cloves, cinnamon...I would hope it would balance out! Yikes.
Lymetoo! LOL! You don't understand. 4-6,000 calories is normal for me and even with that I am thin! I am very active and have been lifting weights for years so it takes a lot of calories and carbs to fuel me. When I am asked to cut carbs...I run out of foods to fill the tank. Typically I would never eat THAT much fat nor would I suggest anyone do that. However, when you are on the run and busy...one of the easiest foods to carry is a bag of nuts and seeds.
I typically eat every two hours and we were at a wedding yesterday so I had to have calories on the go. I have been avoiding the amount of fruit I used to eat so that cuts into my calories as well.
Coconut oil is loaded with saturated fat. I avoid it!
Keep in mind the ratio of Omega 3 to Omega 6 is important. I ate almost an entire bad of cashews which are much higher in Omega 6. Not good! When I am on the run and not satisfied from lack of carbs...I make rash decisions and this is what happens.
So I guess pick my poison. Either the infections will kill me or the diet.
-------------------- Mepron/Zith/Ceftin Doxy/Biaxin/Flagyl pulse. Artemisinin with Doxy/Biaxin. Period of Levaquin and Ceftin. Then Levaquin, Bactrim and Biaxin. Bactrim/Augmentin/Rifampin. Mepron/Biaxin/Artemisinin/Cat's Claw Rifampin/Bactrim/Alinia Plaquenil/Biaxin Posts: 1949 | From Pennsylvania | Registered: Feb 2008
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posted
Sounds like a good plan, Rich! Moderation there as well!
-------------------- --Lymetutu-- Opinions, not medical advice! Posts: 96220 | From Texas | Registered: Feb 2001
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D Bergy
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Member # 9984
posted
Trans fats are the bad ones, and rancid fat such as your typical Corn oil, and Canola Oil.
Saturated fat is eaten in huge quantities by several cultures that have less heart disease than our own.
You can overdo anything, but saturated fat is not really the problem it is made out to be. It was not until the introduction of vegetable oils that the incidence of heart disease became common.
Dan
Posts: 2919 | From Minnesota | Registered: Aug 2006
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gwb
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posted
Coconut oil is one of the best fats you could feed your body.
posted
Saturated fat is a big problem for some people, and I'm one of them. My dad was the same way; when I was a child, he turned his health completely around by giving up saturated fats. In my fifties, I had to do the same thing. Some people--like a neighbor who ate spare ribs just about every night of his lift--can tolerate a bad diet. Others can't.
The fats in nuts and avocados won't give you a heart attack. If you want to avoid saturated fats, stick to the white meat of chicken and don't eat the skin, and choose your meats carefully. And if you eat cheese, give it up. (Such welcome advice, I know.)
Posts: 117 | From Pennsylvania | Registered: Jul 2010
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richedie
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WOW, I couldn't disagree more! All the research I have studied and read up on says the opposite concerning saturated fats and also coconut oil. Wow, not sure where you all have gotten your info.
No offense but I have little respect for Weston Price's findings.
My point was that too much of a good thing can be bad...this is true. It has been shown. Anyway, I just had to vent a bit...I'll be fine.
-------------------- Mepron/Zith/Ceftin Doxy/Biaxin/Flagyl pulse. Artemisinin with Doxy/Biaxin. Period of Levaquin and Ceftin. Then Levaquin, Bactrim and Biaxin. Bactrim/Augmentin/Rifampin. Mepron/Biaxin/Artemisinin/Cat's Claw Rifampin/Bactrim/Alinia Plaquenil/Biaxin Posts: 1949 | From Pennsylvania | Registered: Feb 2008
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posted
Im one thats doing the diet to the extreme. I recently cut out almonds because of the carb count. I cant stop at a few nuts so they had to go. Its made such a difference. I still have a long way to go but in having to self treat. I do use real butter. And i love frozen spinach! I hope you can find a happy balance and what works for you!
Posts: 624 | From Oklahoma | Registered: Jun 2010
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gwb
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posted
Changing our way of thinking can be difficult. I know because I almost died last December from lyme disease. Who'd ever thought I'd get better using homeopathic/herbal remedies? Had I stayed on abx I probably be dead by now. Everyone is different and I respect everyone's way of approaching this disease and treating it.
For me, the Weston Price diet played a big role in my health improving. But the biggest role in my improvement came from being treated with natural medicines and therapies. More about that here: http://flash.lymenet.org/ubb/ultimatebb.php/topic/1/89968
As far as coconut oil goes, the evidence is overwhelming in favor of it having many benefits to those of us with Lyme disease (and other chronic diseases as well). Do your own research and come to your own conclusions.
Everyone needs to do what they feel is best for themselves when it comes to treating this disease. I believe there is no one way to tackle this disease. It affects everyone differently and everyone gets better using different approaches. All I can say is what worked (and continues to work) for me.
I don't claim that this is the "only" way, or the "best" way to treat lyme disease, but I can tell you that I didn't get better until I got off abx and went the natural route, including changing my diet. What worked for me may not work for you.
Keebler
Honored Contributor (25K+ posts)
Member # 12673
posted
- About every other week, someone posts that they are trying to go "no carbs" - but feel weak from it. Whether by too strict of a definition or whatever, "no carbs" can be dangerous. Vegetables of all types are carbs.
We NEED carbohydrates to live, brain tissue, especially needs the calories. It's the complex ones, though - not simple.
We also need the fiber that good carbs provide. Without that fiber, we become more toxic. The antioxidants in vegetables are also invaluable to helping control pain and inflammation.
And there are some very good non-gluten whole (complex) grains that have such great mineral and protein content that they can work very well for lyme patients, in the right proportion and with vegetables, proteins and good fats.
Here are some good cookbooks & sites - adaptations can be easily made with these. You might consider growing kitchen herbs so you have fresh rosemary, basil, fennel, etc. at your fingertips. --------------------
CHRISTINA COOKS - Natural health advocate/ chef, Christina Pirello offers her comprehensive guide to living the well life.
Vegan, with a Mediterranean flair. Organic.
She was dx with terminal leukemia in her mid-twenties. Doctors said there was nothing more they could do. Among other things, she learned about complementary medicine and she learned how to cook whole foods. She recovered her health and is now a chef and professor of culinary arts.
She has program on the PBS network "Create" a couple times week. Check your PBS schedule.
To adapt: in the rare dishes where she uses wheat flour, it can just be left out for a fruit medley, etc. Brown Rice Pasta can be substituted (Tinkyada or Trader Joe's). Quinoa and the dark rices can also be used.
But she focuses mostly on very filling vegetable dishes and garden herbs.
Regarding her use of brown rice syrup, just leave it out and add a touch of stevia at the end.
From Nina Simonds, the best-selling authority on Asian cooking, comes a ground-breaking cookbook based on the Asian philosophy of food as health-giving. The 200 delectable recipes she offers you not only taste superb but also have specific healing . . . .
. . . With an emphasis on the health-giving properties of herbs and spices, this book gives the latest scientific research as well as references to their tonic properties according to Traditional Chinese Medicine and Ayurveda, the traditional Indian philosophy of medicine. . . .
THE CURE IS IN THE KITCHEN, by Sherry A. Rogers M.D., is the first book to ever spell out in detail what all those people ate day to day who cleared their incurable diseases . . .
FROM CURRIES TO KEBABS - RECIPES FROM THE INDIAN SPICE TRAIL - by: Jaffrey, Madhur
==========================
Also look for MOOSEWOOD Cookbooks and THE ENCHANTED BROCCOLI FOREST
==========================
MEDITERRANEAN DIET (minus the wheat and the wine) is also good. It's many vegetable based, with delicious herbs in the meat dishes. Quinoa, dark rices - and unsweetened pomegranate juice can be substituted.
Look up Black Forbidden Chinese Rice & the Red Bhutanese Rice. The nutritional content is excellent and these will help fill and fortify you, even in moderation, along with lots of vegetables.
any raw vegan will tell you that it was bad for them when they ate too much fat from nuts and avocados. They emphasise fruit - on an empty stomach and it seems that bananas are popular - one guy saying he eats 70 a day!
I am eating cooked seeds a lot like quinoa and buckwheat. This fills me up and they are good sources of protein. Another good source of protein are chia seeds.
Posts: 148 | From europe | Registered: Apr 2008
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posted
My LLMD told me to eat lots of coconut oil.
It has antibacterial, antiviral, antifungal properties. It is also good for losing weight. I am not sure, but it may be helpful in regulating weight at optimal levels so it might help gain or maintain it if you are thin.
If you really want to know all about the research on fat vs. carbs and how they affect our health, read Good Calories, Bad Calories by Gary Taubes. There is a summary of his main points in this New York Times Magazine article, but the book goes into extensive detail and cites many, many research studies across the decades.
The book is by a science journalist who is interested in how erroneous ideas sometimes become entrenched and accepted. Too bad he hasn't written a book on Lyme. He has written one about physics and cold fusion, which was enthusiastically pursued for a while and then discredited. He doesn't have an agenda of pushing one side or another of the nutritional debate--he just covers the research, history and politics in the same book.
As I understand it, refined carbs are the biggest factor in increasing our risk for heart disease.
Fat per se is not a problem, but the ratio of fats is, and that gets messed up by eating a lot of grain and a lot of grain-fed animals instead of green vegetables and grass-fed or wild meat. Taking omega-3 fish oil helps by improving the ratio of different types of fats. The so-called "good" fats are not inherently superior to saturated fat; they are just the particular components that are most lacking in our diets.
Bison meat is not automatically superior to beef. It has its various health benefits mainly because bison are usually grass-fed and beef cattle are usually not.
I think it's a good idea, if you need to eat carbs, to make them from vegetable sources like potatoes and beans, and if you still need grains, then make them whole gluten-free ones and combine them with fat, protein and fiber. You probably do need lots of carbs, if you are burning them at a ferocious rate. In that case they are not above your body's requirements. Most of us, especially with Lyme, do not burn that much.
Good luck on figuring out the ideal diet for you.
-------------------- Don't forget to laugh! And when you're going through hell, keep going!
Bitten 5/25/2009 in Perry County, Indiana. Diagnosed by LLMD 12/2/2009. Posts: 756 | From Inside the tunnel | Registered: Jan 2010
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bcb1200
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posted
I'm on nystatin and have been "cheating" on my diet more than ususal. I'm suprised to say I've had no averse reactions (yet).
Previously I would cheat 1 day / week and have Pizza and ice cream. But last week I was traveling for work and ended up having some bread a few times and dessert a few times.
No adverse affects yet. Knock on wood!
-------------------- Bite date ? 2/10 symptoms began 5/10 dx'd, after 3 months numerous test and doctors
IgM Igenex +/CDC + + 23/25, 30, 31, 34, 41, 83/93
Currently on:
Currently at around 95% +/- most days. Posts: 3134 | From Massachusetts | Registered: May 2010
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Lauralyme
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I'm with Gary on the benefits of coconut oil. Check out the book The Coconut Miracle.
-------------------- Fall down seven times, get up eight ~Japanese proverb Posts: 1146 | From west coast | Registered: Mar 2008
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posted
You are going by that outdated government BS diet that isn't based on science at all. It is carbohydrates and sugar that cause heart disease, not fats. You don't have to seriously worry about fats at all unless it is something like canola. Any fat that is hydrogenated or transfat, like canola oil is bad for you. It is not suitable for biological consumption. Coconut oil is one of the healthiest fats, as are any animal fats such as tallow, lard or shmaltz.(beef, pork, poultry). Stay away from vegetable oils for cooking. Only eat olive oil raw and do not cook with vegetable oil, unless it is coconut oil. You don't want any oxidized oils, which is what happens when you heat them up, unless it is the right type of fat that can withstand that. You should be eating a diet of mostly meat, with some vegetables as the ideal healthy diet, whether you have lyme disease or not. The food pyramid kills. It is just an evil socialist egalitarian thing to maximize the most food for the most people, it is bad for your health.
Posts: 136 | From arlington, VA | Registered: Jun 2010
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Tammy N.
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Applewine - I use to agree with most of what you said until I started doing a little more research (health and nutrition have been a passion of mine for about 20+ years). If you haven't read it already, you should check out 'The China Study'. Very impressive and informative.
The other concern with eating a lot of meat is that it can throw off the balance of alkaline/acidity, causing a much more acidic environment (in which bacteria, yeast, cancer, etc. can grow).
I think eating right is easy (basically home made foods from whole, organic ingredients....mostly plant based). Eating right with Lyme is another story. So hard to stay ahead of the yeast while on abx. I think small amounts of grains (whole only) are okay.
Posts: 2238 | From East Coast | Registered: Jul 2010
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D Bergy
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Member # 9984
posted
Diet is individual, and my diet that works for me, may not work for the next person.
I eat a lot of high protein, meat filled diet, with some carbs. I do not avoid fats or overindulge in them. I do not eat that way because it is supposed to be what some expert says I should eat. I eat that way because I feel sickly otherwise.
One thing anyone can do is eat real food, not processed. Real fats and natural oils that have traditionally eaten by humans over hundreds of years. Avoid white refined flour and sugar that is not in a food naturally.
Then eat the way that makes you feel well. you can skew your diet one way or another, but eat a variety of foods.
Dan
Posts: 2919 | From Minnesota | Registered: Aug 2006
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Keebler
Honored Contributor (25K+ posts)
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posted
- Grass fed beef does not through off body balance. Free range chicken, free range eggs, etc. How animals are raised and tended makes so much difference. Yes, it costs more but it's not to be the mainstay of any diet.
I was vegetarian for years and I found that really needed to incorporate animal protein, although, it's in moderation. I'd be nowhere without eggs, such a perfect food.
THE REQUIREMENTS OF PROTEIN & AMINO ACID DURING ACUTE & CHRONIC INFECTION . . . - 20 pages
Anura V. Kurpad - Institute of Population Health & Clinical Research, Bangalore, India 129. Indian J Med Res 124, August 2006, pp 129-148.
Excerpt:
" . . . In general, the amount of EXTRA protein that would appear to be needed is of the order of 20-25 per cent of the recommended intake, for most infections. . . ."
- Full article at link (or google the title if it does not go through). -
Posts: 48021 | From Tree House | Registered: Jul 2007
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cottonbrain
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posted
Remember, heart disease isn't the only health condition affected by diet. cancer is also a big killer, and more than 30 percent of cancers can be prevented by adhering to a lowfat, low sugar
diet that includes lots of veggies and fruits. complex carbs are good and help prevent breast and colon cancer, among others.
from caring4cancer.org:
Vegetables and fruit
You need to consume a minimum of 5 servings of vegetables and fruit each day. But remember, this is the MINIMUM. This means that on most days, you
should be consuming MORE than 5 servings of vegetables and fruit. Plant foods, including vegetables and fruit, should make up the majority of your diet.
What is a serving of vegetables?
1 cup, loosely packed raw green leafy vegetables or 1/2 cup cooked greens 1/2 cup chopped of any other vegetable, cooked 6 ounces of 100% vegetable juice (low sodium is a good option) What is a serving of fruit?
1 medium apple, banana, or orange 1 melon wedge (about 1/6 to 1/8 of whole melon, depending upon size of the fruit) 1/4 to 1/2 cup berries or chopped fruit 1 to 2 ounces dried fruit (e.g. raisins, dried cranberries, prunes, etc.) 3/4 cup fruit juice - this is 6 ounces of 100% fruit juice, not fruit drink 4. Complex carbohydrates
The American Institute for Cancer Research recommends that people eat about 20 to 30 ounces of complex carbohydrates every day. This includes foods such as whole grain cereals, legumes (starchy beans), and roots vegetables (sweet potatoes, carrots, beets, parsnips, potatoes, radishes, etc.). That's about 11/4 to nearly 2 pounds of healthy, complex carbohydrates. This works out to be a minimum of seven portions of these foods. One portion is approximately 1/2 to 1 cup for these complex carbohydrates.
Limit or avoid simple sugars and refined (white) bread products. When you purchase a grain product, look at the ingredient list. If you see the word "enriched," then the product is not a whole grain.
Posts: 1173 | From USA | Registered: Nov 2007
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When I was in my 30's, I noticed that my age group could keep up with the 80 year olds, but not the 70 year olds in our group. I asked questions, and here's what I found out:
They had desserts, but most of their food came from their yard--lots of veggies, free range chickens, grass fed beef--nothing with chemicals. They ate fruit, but climbed the trees to pick them. They ate fat, which the body needs. It is the sugar/starch calories that are either burned up right then, or stored as fat. Protein and fat are used in building and reparing the body, so not all the calories count, as far as weight concerns go. Good carbs have a lot of nutrition and fiber, rather than empty calories like processed foods.
So, I try to eat like people did before WW1, when chemicals, and processed "convenience foods" started to make an appearance.
Another thought I've had: maybe the locals in tropical places are healthy because they live on the coconut (free food), while tourists eat in restaurants and get sick from whatever the coconut kills. I use coconut products everyday.
From trial and error, I've found I need to avoid gluten and wheat entirely, and be careful even with the more sugary fruit and starchy veggies--they set up sugar cravings.
Eating this way means I eat until I'm satisfied, and it sticks with me--no more hypoglycemia.
Keebler, I appreciate all the links and put them on my favorites list to go through later.
Posts: 550 | From New Mexico, USA | Registered: May 2007
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richedie
Frequent Contributor (1K+ posts)
Member # 14689
-------------------- Mepron/Zith/Ceftin Doxy/Biaxin/Flagyl pulse. Artemisinin with Doxy/Biaxin. Period of Levaquin and Ceftin. Then Levaquin, Bactrim and Biaxin. Bactrim/Augmentin/Rifampin. Mepron/Biaxin/Artemisinin/Cat's Claw Rifampin/Bactrim/Alinia Plaquenil/Biaxin Posts: 1949 | From Pennsylvania | Registered: Feb 2008
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