posted
planning on heading to the cottage for might well be the last time
i want to have a couple drinks how long b4 flagyl is out of my system?
Posts: 61 | From limbo | Registered: Nov 2009
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Keebler
Honored Contributor (25K+ posts)
Member # 12673
posted
- Sorry, it's always hard to tell those new to lyme this . . . however . . .
even without flagyl, no alcohol is allowed during lyme treatment. It will put too much of a strain on a liver that is already tremendously at risk for hepatitis and cirrhosis from the lyme toxins. If hepatitis or cirrhosis develops, it will be much harder to get rid of any infection and fatigue will be life-long.
It also further stress the nerve fibers throughout the body but especially in the brain and in the heart.
And, alcohol will interfere with ALL meds, not just flagyl. Alcohol also feeds candida (systemic yeast) that all lyme patients have to battle.
You might consider something like organic pomegranate juice. Real lemonade or limeade with stevia to sweeten. It's important to avoid sugar and artificial sweeteners but stevia is from plants and will not feed a systemic yeast infection.
Chai Tea - make it condensed and add to cold water.
-------------------- I am not a doctor and this is not medical advice but only my personal experience and opinion. Posts: 2001 | From NJ | Registered: Mar 2005
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Keebler
Honored Contributor (25K+ posts)
Member # 12673
posted
- To put the seriousness of lyme in perspective, Botulism is one of the most toxic infections known to man. Lyme is right up there with that. -----------------
BIOCHEMISTRY OF LYME DISEASE: BORRELIA BURGDORFERI SPIROCHETE / CYST
by Prof. Robert W. Bradford and Henry W. Allen
EXCERPT:
. . . A discovery of great importance relating to a toxin produced by the causative agent of Lyme disease, Borrelia burgdorferi, has been linked to a similar toxin produced by the organism Clostridium botulinum (botulism). . . .
======================
A helpful search: "Hepatic Encephalopathy" and "Lyme Encephalopathy"
and "Fatty Liver Disease" - it can be caused by infection and alcohol makes that much worse, leading to liver damage.
======================
You want treatment to have a chance. Even with the best treatment, not everyone makes it. You don't want your name to land here: --------------
posted
Alcohol and flagyl ... the combo will make you very ill.
-------------------- --Lymetutu-- Opinions, not medical advice! Posts: 96239 | From Texas | Registered: Feb 2001
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TF
Frequent Contributor (5K+ posts)
Member # 14183
posted
For those who don't know:
from page 17 of Burrascano lyme treatment guidelines:
"There are three things that will predict treatment failure regardless of which regimen is chosen: Noncompliance, alcohol use, and sleep deprivation."
Alcohol depresses the immune system. If you ever want to get rid of lyme disease, you have to forget alcohol. Same for smoking.
To get rid of these diseases, we have to do all we can to strengthen the immune system.
Also, people with lyme have a terrible hangover if they drink alcohol. See p. 10 of Burrascano, lyme symptom list:
"Exaggerated symptoms or worse hangover from alcohol"
Of course, if you are also on flagyl, you are really taking a chance drinking alcohol.
My husband's coworker had lyme and drank throughout treatment. He is now in a wheelchair with a personal assistant since he can barely move. Can't feed himself, wears a bag, etc.
His lyme doctor released him once he was cleared of lyme, babs, and bart. That is his final condition, thanks to the alcohol, I imagine.
And, for those of you who have not heard, the LymeMD blog doctor is now sick with an unknown illness. He's not doing well. He uses a computer to dictate his notes as he can't write well. He has limited use of his arms.
He says he doesn't know what is wrong with him. He's been through a number of tests but doesn't seem to have a clear cut diagnosis. He told a patient he doesn't believe it is lyme, which he had in the past. He was considering possible rare autoimmune disease.
Posts: 9931 | From Maryland | Registered: Dec 2007
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BoxerMom
Frequent Contributor (1K+ posts)
Member # 25251
posted
TF - What?!!!
First Dr. M from Under Our Skin, and now LymeMD?!!
Does the universe NOT LIKE US or something?
I wish him the best. And how in the world can he not think it's Lyme?
posted
keebler i respect ur opinon but an not 'new' to lyme like someonee whining they feel funny i knooe flagyl booozr react to form formaldkyhe] but sloeoy cominnnnnnnng termms wiith death i wanttt 1 lsaaat weeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeek off fffffffffffffffffffuuunnn]]]
Posts: 61 | From limbo | Registered: Nov 2009
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lululymemom
Frequent Contributor (1K+ posts)
Member # 26405
posted
tamboski, I've read your previous posts and felt very disheartened that you are wanting to give up. It sounds like you are going through a bit of depression which often comes with Lyme. Don't give up! I have seen someone come back from having very serious symptoms. Life threatening symptoms!
Once you turn that corner, you will forge ahead.. It can happen in a matter of days.. I've seen it happen and you need to keep your fighting spirit alive!
posted
Sorry, I have to disagree. My LLMD says "everything in moderation" and that includes alcohol, and sugar.
I tried alcohol with flagyl, and had no reaction whatsoever. Some do, some don't. Be careful and be prepared to barf the first time if you want to experiment. And don't get wasted.
Fighting this disease is not about denying yourself all of life's pleasures. My fight has not been any more or less successful based on what I deny myself at that time.
Posts: 252 | From NJ USA | Registered: Mar 2004
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BackinStOlaf
Frequent Contributor (1K+ posts)
Member # 23725
posted
OH please- No flagyl with alcohol. Maybe you didn't have a reaction but you may be the exception to the rule.
Don't take the chance!
-------------------- First Symptom 9/09 Multiple docs, negative Labcorp test LLMD: 1/10 Positive Igenex/CDC test Treatment 2/10 2/10-8/10 Amox, ceftin, zith, flagyl Currently: Bicillin, Minocycline, still dealing with severe breathing issues
Posts: 1121 | From New York, New York | Registered: Dec 2009
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mojo
Frequent Contributor (1K+ posts)
Member # 9309
posted
I was on a tincture from my NP and I needed a week of Flagyl for BV. I kept getting serious stomach aches and then I remembered the drops had alcohol in them!
Just that little bit of alchol made me very sick!
To be safe - three days would probably be OK.
Posts: 1761 | From USA | Registered: May 2006
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Keebler
Honored Contributor (25K+ posts)
Member # 12673
posted
- tamboski,
Not trying to deny a good time but trying to save you from this getting worse. Really. Can you allow yourself a good time without alcohol? I'm all about feeling good - a regular hippie in that regard, just with healthful options.
The "everything is moderation" approach can bring some long lasting consequences. One need not deny themselves of delicious and flavorful choices, but alcohol is not a major food group. It's possible to have gourmet food and wonderful drinks that are free of alcohol.
Whatever relaxation or other emotional reactions one wants can be found in a variety of ways. Treat yourself to a massage, good music, etc.
I just don't want others to get as sick I am have been for 20 years (and that is even without alcohol as it always made me very ill, even a little bit).
Every day matters with lyme treatment. Spirochetes don't take the day off for a birthday party or a friend's wedding - or a vacation. They are waiting for us to mess up so they can take a tighter grip on our lives, our futures.
Also to keep in mind: cell damage can happen with just one drink for those who have serious toxic infections. Such cellular damage comes from excess porphyrins due to the liver being overwhelmed.
Excess porphyrins can cause liver damage AND nerve damage in the brain and throughout the body. Some of that may not be reversible. For that which might be, it could day days - or months - for repair from just one drink added to the current toxin load.
Alcohol also changes ALL medicines. They are not the same chemical composition when combined with alcohol. All bets are off then as to if they can address infection adequately but toxicity does increase.
We can still enjoy many things about life while protecting ourselves - and our future. -
Posts: 48021 | From Tree House | Registered: Jul 2007
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"You see, there's almost no data to support the assertion that alcohol and metronidazole combine to create a disulfiram-like reaction. It's crazy, I know. How could this age-old advice be wrong? The reason this is drilled into pharmacy and med students' heads is because the conventional wisdom is old. It got here because "everyone knows" that ethanol + metronidazole = A Bad Time. Even though there's no meaningful evidence to support this conclusion." S/he discusses this in depth.
As far as occasional use of small quantities of alcohol, like an occasional glass of wine, I stand by my LLMD's assertion that it is harmless.
A prescription gel I rub on is alcohol-based. One of my supplements is in an alcohol solution. Yes, one should not be a raging alcoholic, overloading the liver, and expect a Lyme recovery. One should not wash down antibiotics with scotch. But an occasional drink wouldn't harm anyone including a Victorian schoolmarm.
Posts: 252 | From NJ USA | Registered: Mar 2004
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Keebler
Honored Contributor (25K+ posts)
Member # 12673
posted
- Not at all about relaxation that is sorely needed, but to be considered is that many with lyme have some kind of porphyria. Any alcohol can increase the level of toxic porphyrins that kill cells. On occasion, a porphyria attack can become fatal. It's just good to know that as, often, that can be prevented.
That may be one reason why so many with lyme got so ill from even small amounts before being diagnosed. More detail here. -------------------
PORPHYRIA Thread - along with details about KPU/HPU (Mauve factor) -
Posts: 48021 | From Tree House | Registered: Jul 2007
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Marnie
Frequent Contributor (5K+ posts)
Member # 773
posted
Keebler...check out the Fe link.
Bb has a gene for transferrin. If it locks on/binds to that iron transport protein...
See my post about the WFL as I edited it today to include info. about the iron and vitamin D links.
Besides impacting the vit. D receptor on the macrophages, is Bb also starving the macrophages of iron?
Posts: 9481 | From Sunshine State | Registered: Mar 2001
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posted
Many years ago before I was diagnosed with Lyme (which I did have), I went to a conference in a foreign country while feeling ill with the flu/fatigue symptoms. My doctor, who had no idea what I had, but could feel the lumps in my neck, prescribed me antibiotics for 10 days...low dose, not the lyme heavy stuff. I went to the conference, won an award, and at the closing party, danced and drank 1 BEER. I thought...moderation, what could happen? I need to have fun (I was in my 20's at the time).
I ended up waking up in the middle of the night with a burn in my chest soooo bad that I thought I was going to die from a heart attack. I was terrified and in severe pain. I ran down to the recpetion area, but there was no one who could help...nor was there a pharmacy close or open...this was a foreign country. I went back into my room and filled the bathtub and sat there, miserable for the rest of the night. I had gotten severe heartburn from low dose, short term antibiotic and alcohol in moderation. So severe, that over the next 48 hours, I became unable to swallow without severe pain. Ended up in the emergency room....burned esophagus....1 month eating the boxed gerber's baby food very slowly as it hurt to swallow anything.
It wasn't worth it. Keebler is correct in that we need to do all that we can do keep our bodies healthy. Period. Everyday we treat ourselved well we are on the road to better health. It can come tomorrow, in a week...we don't know but our present creates our future. This lyme can come with a fatigue and fog that ina and of itself causes depression. But it CAN and DOES lift. I drink some sangria without the wine in a wine glass sometimes. It ain't the same...but at the same time it feels good to know I am making the right choice for myself.
take care
Posts: 172 | From ohio | Registered: Feb 2010
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lululymemom
Frequent Contributor (1K+ posts)
Member # 26405
posted
Dali: Some antibiotics like Doxy can burn the esophagus if not taken with sufficient fluids or if you lie down directly after taking it. Not sure if that is what happened to you but I have heard of it happening to many others on another website.
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