posted
How many people have had luck getting rid of babs without abx. My doc currently has me on amox and zith but need somthing to knock out the babs too. Any Ideas?
-------------------- If you play at the beach, expect to get some sand in your shorts Posts: 223 | From central pa | Registered: May 2010
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janet thomas
Frequent Contributor (1K+ posts)
Member # 7122
Evaluation of selected antiprotozoal drugs in the Babesia microti- hamster model SE Marley, ML Eberhard, FJ Steurer, WL Ellis, PB McGreevy and TK Ruebush 2nd Division of Parasitic Diseases, Centers for Disease Control and prevention, Department of Health and Human Services, Atlanta, Georgia 30341, USA.
The presently used therapy for Babesia microti infections, a combination of quinine and clindamycin, does not always result in parasitologic cures. To identify possible alternative chemotherapeutic agents for such infections, we screened, in the hamster-B. microti system, 12 antiprotozoal drugs that have either recently been released for human use or were in experimental stages of development at the Walter Reed Army Institute of Research for the treatment of malaria and leishmaniasis. Several well-recognized antimalarial drugs, such as mefloquine, halofantrine, artesunate, and artelenic acid, exhibited little or no effect on parasitemia. Two 8-aminoquinolines, WR006026 [8- (6-diethylaminohexylamino)-6-methoxy-4-methylquinoline dihydrochloride] and WR238605 [8-[(4-amino-1-methylbutyl)amino]-2,6-dimethoxy-4-methyl-5 -(3-trifluoromethylphenoxy-7) quinoline succinate], produced clearance of patent parasitemia. Furthermore, blood from infected hamsters treated with WR238605 via an intramuscular injection failed to infect naive hamsters on subpassage, thus producing a parasitologic cure. These two compounds merit further screening in other systems and may prove useful in treating human babesiosis.
WR238605 is now called tafenoquine and the Canadian pharmacies list it as available soon.
-------------------- I am not a doctor and this is not medical advice but only my personal experience and opinion. Posts: 2001 | From NJ | Registered: Mar 2005
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posted
I just looked at a DR B. slide show. Now I don't know the context of the talking point presentation but it looked as though he said to treat bart BEFORE babs. My LLMD says he is pretty sure I have bart. While I do not have the streaks, clinically alot of symptoms point to bart. Of course some may be lyme as it apparently difficult to differentiate. Not sure which way to turn here.......
-------------------- If you play at the beach, expect to get some sand in your shorts Posts: 223 | From central pa | Registered: May 2010
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janet thomas
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Member # 7122
posted
This is from Aug 3rd
Remember to Smile LymeNet Contributor Member # 25481
posted 03 August, 2010 06:38 PM -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Hooray for you & your naturopath! Way to persevere and listen to your intuition!
Ditto posters above. I think you need to seek a better (real) LLMD.
Seems your current practitioner isn't open to learning, and that's REQUIRED in the battle against Lyme & co-infections.
My successful LLMD trained under Dr B in NY and thinks my Babesiosis must be conquered first in order to achieve long-term remission from Lyme & co's. I anticipate taking Mepron & azith (or a substitute) for months.
Good news that your symptoms have lessened for now. Be aware that to get into long-term remission, you should treat for 3 to 4 months after ALL symptoms are gone.
Best wishes,
-------------------- I am not a doctor and this is not medical advice but only my personal experience and opinion. Posts: 2001 | From NJ | Registered: Mar 2005
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The old thinking was to treat bart first as it could supposedly be cured with a 3 month course of Levaquin. Unfortunately there are many strains of bart or BLO and many fail to be cured with the 3 months of Levaquin.
So in my opinion, I would treat whichever infection you think is causing your worst symptoms the hardest and if possible include meds for a 2nd infection as well. It is very hard to find combos of meds which will treat Lyme, babesia and bartonella all at the same time.
So most treat Lyme plus either bart or babs for a minimum of 4 - 6 months and then try to treat the remaining infection for 4 - 6 months. Unfortunately there are people who can't seem to get rid of either bart or babs even after 1 or 2 years of treatment.
Good luck.
Bea Seibert
Posts: 7306 | From Martinsville,VA,USA | Registered: Oct 2004
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-------------------- If you play at the beach, expect to get some sand in your shorts Posts: 223 | From central pa | Registered: May 2010
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posted
Thanks also to you lymetoo you always come through Now I apparently have to decide which is worse; babs or bart. Hmmmm Lymetoo whats your bart recommendations?? Anyone else please feel free also.
-------------------- If you play at the beach, expect to get some sand in your shorts Posts: 223 | From central pa | Registered: May 2010
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lululymemom
Frequent Contributor (1K+ posts)
Member # 26405
posted
I found this on a blog recently that I read quite frequently:
Offering further hope was Dr. S. discussion of clove bud essential oil, which he contends has been effective for ridding bartonella in a handful of his patients (who had tried it on their own). He advocates high doses of 75% diluted clove bud oil with olive, coconut or grape seed oil, although again, did not comment on what constitutes a "high dose."
Dr. S wrote a book on Bartonella and it's treatments. Since taking parasite treatments that contained clove oil, it made perfect sense to me to try this. I take the capsules since the actual oil is very intense and hard to swallow even when diluted.
There are two antibiotics that have been found to be most useful for treating Bartonella/BLO. My choice of these two antibiotics depends on two issues: (1) the extent to which the central nervous system (CNS) is affected and (2) the presence of co-infections other than Bartonella/BLO.
Levofloxacin (Levaquin)
This antibiotic is generally considered to be the antibiotic of choice for the treatment of Bartonella/BLO. Levaquin is a member of the family of antibiotics known as fluoroquinolones, which also includes ciprofloxacin (Cipro). All the fluoroquinolones seem to have activity against Bartonella/BLO, but Levaquin seems to be the most effective. The dosage is 250-500 mg once a day. It is best to take Levaquin on an empty stomach (or with minimal food if you need to eat something due to gastrointestinal side effects). Also, it is important not to take minerals like calcium, zinc, iron, and magnesium within several hours of the dose of Levaquin, because these minerals will bind Levaquin and render it less effective. I advise that patients take levofloxacin early in the morning, or it can be taken late in the evening, but not at bedtime. Except for the tetracycline antibiotic group, the fluoroquinolones are not generally used in combination with other antibiotics. Usually the course of treatment for Bartonella/BLO is one to three months, but occasionally it may take much longer.
Precautions: Levaquin is usually very well tolerated. The major adverse reaction that may occur with use of this medication is tendonitis (inflammation of the tendons). This complication is not common, but when it occurs, the medication must be stopped for a few days to allow symptoms to resolve. It can then be restarted in a few days at a lower dose, but if the tendonitis recurs, the medication should be stopped. The mechanism for tendonitis is not clearly known, but magnesium deficiency may The play a role in some patients. For this reason, I recommend that Bartonella/BLO patients ideally take 600-1,000 mg of magnesium for two weeks before beginning Levaquin therapy. Once Levaquin is begun, the patient should continue the magnesium, being careful to take it three (or more) hours before or after the dose of Levaquin.
Rifampin
Rifampin is a very old antibiotic that for many years has been used for the treatment of chronic infections such as tuberculosis. It is very effective against Bartonella/BLO. In particular, it is very useful for the neurological and psychiatric manifestations of Bartonella/BLO--severe anxiety and mood swings, panic, seizure-like episodes, memory loss, ``spaciness,'' confusion, disorientation episodes, and many other symptoms. Expect a herx-like reaction during the first week or so; then significant progress often occurs during the second or third week on rifampin.
It is best used in combination with certain other antibiotics. Frequently, those combinations include rifampin with doxycycline or rifampin with clarithromycin. The combination of rifampin with doxycycline is especially helpful when a patient with Bartonella/BLO is also infected with either Ehrlichia or Lyme. The dosage of rifampin is 300 mg per day for the first week; increase to 600 mg once a day after the first week. It is advisable to use rifampin in the evening (not at bedtime) on an empty stomach, three hours or more after a meal. It may be used in the morning an hour before breakfast also.
Rifabutin is a medication in the same family as rifampin and is reportedly very effective against Bartonella also. Apparently, it can be combined effectively with azithromycin. I do not have enough experience with its use to recommend it at this time.
Precautions: Rifampin is usually very well tolerated. It will always turn a patient's urine orange. It may cause headaches and sleepiness. Liver function and blood counts should be monitored at regular intervals while using rifampin. The greatest concern about rifampin is the potential for interactions with other medications. Rifampin speeds the metabolism of certain medications, resulting in an increased breakdown of the other medications. Clinically, this drug-interaction issue often becomes a problem when certain pain medications are being used, and often a patient will require higher doses of pain medications while on rifampin.
Babesia
This parasitic organism can live inside the body's red blood cells for four months or more. It usually requires a combination antibiotic treatment for a period of two to four months to effectively control the infection. The following two medications are used in combination with a macrolide for treating Babesia.
Atovaquone (Mepron)
Atovaquone may be used alone as in the product called Mepron or used in combination with proguanil as in the product called Malarone. Both preparations are effective against Babesia. Mepron is the most common form of atovaquone used against Babesia and is typically combined with azithromycin (Zithromax). Mepron is a liquid that looks similar to yellow paint and is taken as one to two teaspoons twice a day. It should always be taken with fatty food (such as nuts, cheese, or similar food), because it is much better absorbed by the body when it is ingested along with a fatty meal. Generally, I cycle Mepron's use as follows: three weeks on the medicine, and one week off. Azithromycin is continued for all four weeks.
Precautions: There are important precautions related to atovaquone. The first is that it can cause temporary liver damage, and for that reason, blood tests for liver function must be followed on a regular basis while using either of these medications. The second precaution concerns the use of supplement doses of coenzyme Q10, alpha lipoic acid, and vitamin E while on atovaquone. These should not be used while taking atovaquone because they are all fat-soluble antioxidants that tend to neutralize the pro-oxidant effects of atovaquone against Babesia.
Bactrim or Septra (trimethoprim/sulfamethoxazole)
Bactrim, Septra, TMP/SMX all refer to the same medication. Like rifampin, it is a very old medication that has been used for many years to treat a host of acute and chronic infections, including parasites. It is very effective, especially when combined with a macrolide such as clarithromycin or azithromycin. The usual dosage is one Bactrim DS twice a day. At times, four or more Bactrim per day may be used, depending on the clinical situation.
Precautions: The vast majority of patients using Bactrim have no problems at all. However, as with most antibiotics, it is important to follow routine blood work (complete blood count and liver function tests) on a regular basis. In addition, Bactrim may rarely cause a severe reaction called ``Stevens-Johnson'' syndrome which can be lethal if not addressed immediately. This serious reaction is usually characterized by fever, flu-like symptoms, mouth sores, and often a skin rash. My patients are instructed to stop Bactrim immediately if any fever or mouth and/or skin sores occur. The condition usually clears in the next 24 to 72 hours. However, if it worsens, the patient needs to seek emergency care.
Ehrlichia/Anaplasma
The key to effective treatment of these organisms is early suspicion and treatment for at least 28 days. The most useful antibiotics for treating Ehrlichia/Anaplasma are doxycycline (100-200 mg twice a day) or rifampin (600 mg once a day). In difficult or resistant cases, I have used a combination of both drugs with very good success.
-------------------- I am not a doctor and this is not medical advice but only my personal experience and opinion. Posts: 2001 | From NJ | Registered: Mar 2005
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posted
Bartonella is probably worse.. fortunately, I did not have that one!
I think Bea has some very good insights there.
-------------------- --Lymetutu-- Opinions, not medical advice! Posts: 96223 | From Texas | Registered: Feb 2001
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seekhelp
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posted
TF beat her Bartonella easily with one month of levaquin. I guess for many it's not that difficult.
Posts: 7545 | From The 5th Dimension - The Twilight Zone | Registered: Mar 2008
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Now I apparently have to decide which is worse; babs or bart. Hmmmm
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