posted
My teenage daughter's doc wants to put her on Levaquin for new assumption that Bartonella is in the way of her lyme treatment. He asked her a bunch of questions and makes his decision based on this:
5 months of clarithromycin/hydroxychloroquine combo and she still feels the same, fatigue, lead suit, headaches, tummy aches, joint pain, brain fog, memory loss. No improvement.
When asked about foot pain she said sometimes when I walk barefoot on rocks! That could be any of us. As her mom I know that she has never complained of foot pain to me and she can complain with the best of them. So I don't think it is the right kind of foot pain after reading through old posts here re bart.
He noticed some faint striae, stretch marks on her back and hips and tummy, but they were white not red. She seems quite moody to me, but with a teen girl, that is normal.
Insurance won't cover Levaquin, so we are trying to get Cipro covered. She has stopped the other abx. He also started her on Magnesium and Ginko, and HH.
Does this sound reasonable? He has not tested for Bartonella specifically. She has a weak WB in April and again this month, little changed. +41,IND 31,IND 83-93 IGM. Then only +41 on the IGG Igenex. Symptoms began 9/08, diagnosis 4/10.
Thanks for your input.
Posts: 42 | From Northeastern US | Registered: May 2010
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17hens
Frequent Contributor (1K+ posts)
Member # 23747
posted
My daughter and son both have Bart with stretch marks and streaks. The marks vary from red to purplish to skin colored.
Neither of them have any foot discomfort.
If your daughter has Bart, you LLMD knows she will not improve until it's treated (then treat lyme).
I believe Burrascano says Levaquin is for 18 plus. Especially if your daughter is still growing.
Is he willing to try her on Rifampin? That made a huge difference for me.
-------------------- "My flesh and my heart may fail, but God is the strength of my heart and my portion forever." Psalms 73:26
bit 4/09, diagnosed 1/10 Posts: 3043 | From PA | Registered: Dec 2009
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nefferdun
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Member # 20157
posted
I have bart with no foot pain. My physical symptoms include headache, muscle twitching, urge to urinate frequently and shin pain and burning. I have recently begun to lose my voice.
Some of the skin conditions listed in Dr. S' book (and I have many of them) are stretch marks, pea size brown spots, crusty moles, spots of loss of pigmentation, spider veins, broken veins, swelling in various areas of the body that look like edema but do not leave a dent when pressed, lumps along the shin bone, indentations in the skin, nodules you do not notice until you find them - like a marble and hurt when pressed, papules, streaks of red or purple, bruising . . . .
Bart can cause anxiety and irritation. It also causes depersonalization - feeling disconnected. You lose motivation. It is hard to feel happiness. You have problems with memory and word recall, especially nouns.
Dr Burrascano says when neurological symptoms (mood, mental clarity nerves) are greatly out of proportion to physical symptoms (pain etc) suspect bartonella. As the drugs for lyme have not affected her mind, then it is a good idea to suspect bartonella especially if she has any of the other symptoms listed.
Levaquin is a good drug for bartonella if you can tolerate it. It can be dangerous causing tendonitis and tendon rupture in some people (I was one). It can also cause mental illness - see side effects.
Rifampin is a good drug to use. Also Bactrim DS with a macrolide like biaxen or zithromax.
-------------------- old joke: idiopathic means the patient is pathological and the the doctor is an idiot Posts: 4676 | From western Montana | Registered: Apr 2009
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posted
I think it depends on the STRAIN of bartonella that she has.
Bartonella quintana and bartonella henselae cause similar symptoms, but while b. hensalae causes streaks and things, I think it's b. quintana that causes the foot pain. So it depends on what type of bartonella she has, whether or not there will be foot pain.
In other words, yes you can have bartonella without that particular symptom.
There are dozens of strains out there, and while similar, they don't all cause the exact same symptoms.
In my very UNprofessional opinion, shouldn't your LLMD be switching between different types of antibiotics to address the different forms of Lyme? Look for cycles in her symptoms; if she gets a severe headache and/or moodiness every 5-7 days, that could be indicative of bartonella.
Like nef mentioned, Dr. Burrascano says to suspect bartonella when there are few other symptoms such as joint pain, and an OVER abundance of neurological signs such as muscle twitches, encephalopathic symptoms such as headache and anxiety, irritability, moodswings, and seizure-like activity, including depersonalization or the feeling that "nothing is real."
Posts: 512 | From USA | Registered: Sep 2010
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D Bergy
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posted
Bart symptoms in my wife's case, involved only swelling of the feet, no other symptoms.
Dan
Posts: 2924 | From Minnesota | Registered: Aug 2006
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sixgoofykids
Honored Contributor (10K+ posts)
Member # 11141
posted
I had bart with no foot pain.
-------------------- sixgoofykids.blogspot.com Posts: 13449 | From Ohio | Registered: Feb 2007
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posted
It's also possible that she will develop foot pain with Bart treatment. For me, more Bart symptoms manifested when I began to treat, such as more foot pain and scratch-like rashes.
-------------------- Bart and Babesia seropositive Current tx: Rifampin, Biaxin, Bactrim DS, Artemisinin, Resveratrol (japanese knotweed), Red Root, Boneset Posts: 168 | From PA | Registered: Feb 2010
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posted
I agree with Ian. Foot pain developed when I went on Bart treatment. Lasted about a month, then disappeared.
Posts: 671 | From Fort Myers, Florida | Registered: Jun 2009
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bcb1200
Frequent Contributor (1K+ posts)
Member # 25745
posted
I have no foot pain or bart streaks. I tested borderline positive. My symptoms are mainly calf muscle twiching. I also had Gastritis / Gerd and anxiety / depression.
-------------------- Bite date ? 2/10 symptoms began 5/10 dx'd, after 3 months numerous test and doctors
IgM Igenex +/CDC + + 23/25, 30, 31, 34, 41, 83/93
Currently on:
Currently at around 95% +/- most days. Posts: 3139 | From Massachusetts | Registered: May 2010
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posted
Nefferdun, when you responded with this a Light bulb went off for me:
Bart can cause anxiety and irritation. It also causes depersonalization - feeling disconnected. You lose motivation. It is hard to feel happiness. You have problems with memory and word recall, especially nouns.
YES, She switches nouns all the time, "sheep" for "pig" and such. She has been losing motivation lately, getting depressed and I keep telling her not to give up on herself. She is trying her best to stay in school, Junior year of HS and only makes it in 2-3 times a week, sometimes not the full day. This yucky feeling all the time for 2 years is tough for a usually motivated student. The depersonalization could also be happening. She will see a psychologist in 2 weeks for therapy session(s).
She was also diagnosed with ADHD last month and taking adderall XR. Helping the processing and staying "with" the lesson or homework, but memory is still bad and word recall too. Headaches are the worst symptom of them all and I guess that falls into the neurological side of things? We are just using Advil and excedrin type meds for these, any other suggestions?
Your responses have helped me so much, thanks everyone. In her words she feels misunderstood, but here on these boards you have helped me to understand what she is going through much better. Hashing this around helps me see that bartonella is a very likely suspect. Will ask doc about the Rifampin next.
Posts: 42 | From Northeastern US | Registered: May 2010
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mojo
Frequent Contributor (1K+ posts)
Member # 9309
posted
I've had Lyme&Co for most of my life and have been treating it since early 2006.
I just got my foot pain within the last two months! Figured out I had Bart a couple years ago but just got this "classic" symptom.
Posts: 1761 | From USA | Registered: May 2006
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