Topic: how is obama's health plan going to effect us?
randibear
Honored Contributor (10K+ posts)
Member # 11290
posted
i've heard that obama says he's going to pay for this healthcare by reducing the payments to laboratories, doctors, and hospitals and pharmacies.
well, this means the insurance won't pay as much and we'll have to pay more for our care.
course my llmd doesn't take insurance but we do take meds.
i'm not sure this is a good thing. from all i'm reading, i will pay more and the insurance companies will decide what to pay for and what not.
oh great, like we needed this.
-------------------- do not look back when the only course is forward Posts: 12262 | From texas | Registered: Mar 2007
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posted
No, he is paying for this healthcare and everything else included under the 700 Billion Dollars of debt is with our own money.
They have already raised auto registrations here along with raising the fee to get an new title. We are also having to now pay for a license for shoreline fishing, which we never had to pay for before.
The price of our water is going up.
They have allowed insurance companies to raise their rates.
Soon, we will be a Socialist Country. Sure, we will all have insurance, but we will wait for it in line for hours and if they don't think anything is wrong with us, they will send us away.
And I say they because the doctors will all be working for the government making about $18/per hour and they will have so many restrictions placed on them until they finally don't even care to be a doctor anymore because they know they don't have the power to help people anymore.
Shalome
Posts: 893 | From Florida | Registered: Dec 2008
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twoangie
Frequent Contributor (1K+ posts)
Member # 1636
posted
While there are quite a few very good doctors who deserve a high salary, I've met even more who deserve no more than the average worker. I worked for one who bragged about making $1,000 a day. He always showed up for work on time and saw his patients as he was supposed to but he scoffed, did not believe them and blew them off if they had something he hadn't been trained in. He didn't keep current past the barest minimum. He was too busy out playing on the lake to keep up with current research. He went to college, he learned everything there, right? Right...
-------------------- I surf to serve! Posts: 1993 | From Charlotte, NC, US | Registered: Sep 2001
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posted
we just got recent AARP newspaper. in it, it state for 2010, there were be NO COST OF LIVING, COLA, PAYMENTS to anyone.
it's frozen; $90.64..i can't remember exact no. will remain the same for medicare monthly payments.
off topic...ended up watching 2 hrs. of cspan after i got off here in wee am hours on chrysler & gm bankrupties.
they had 4-5 car dealerships there from 5 different states. boy, their touching testimonies were something.
dingle, sp, really nailed the CEOs good; had no questions written down and kept throwing them out before they were finished & cut them down to yes/no answers.
few others like dingle there including iowa's young house rep.
mediacom recently changed things and they gave up cspan2 to add 5-8 MORE SPORTS CHANNELS! i'm so upset.
well, i'm going to have to be more vocal calling their main HQ wherever they are located.
now back to obama's health care plan.
when i had joined obama's change.org site & giving them health comments galore on lyme, they send me regular emails of things they want to see addressed and asking us to contact our house reps/senators.
are any of you getting them too? most i delete unless it's a cause i believe in strongly.
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posted
Yes Betty. I do get those regular emails and really enjoy getting them. It helps me to keep in touch with what Obama is doing. i appreciate that he is open to input from the country. I reply to ones that I think are important and delete the rest.
I know there is a lot of controversy regarding his health plan, but will only add that our system is broken the way it's now and something must be done. Regardless of what side you are on, it's broken and it will not be able to go on the way it is.
It comes down to simple mathematics and something has to give. It simply is not affordable for anyone(workers, employers etc...) It's bankrupting our country. We must do something to make it more affordable.
I have not heard any other real suggestions from the other side other than complaints. Even the head Republicans say, something must change. I pray that something good will come of this.
My brother is healthy and has never been ill and they charge him 1000k per month for private coverage. That is luanacy. There is nothing "affordable" about that.
Under the new proposed plan you can keep the health plan you have now and if you are not happy with your existing plan you can try the new one. I don't see this as socialist, yet rather fair competition. If you have more choices, that means more competitive prices. This is business 101.
I also think a huge problem is that the insurance agencies are constantly allowed to pick and choose the prices and what is covered and what is not at will. No wonder the government is forced to step in and do something. Many people become ill and all of a sudden the insurance agencies cut ppl off and leave them stranded. Many of us have had that happen.
The insurance agencies are already dictating many of our treatments. Many of us have not been able to receive what our doctors have wanted to administer anyway and or do not cover it even though we pay good money for our premiums. If it was not for their greed we would not be in this position.
Bottom line is change was coming long before Obama took office. It has been broke for many years now, just swept under the carpet.
-------------------- aka: Lyme Warrior
In order to do "real" science, you have to have a "real" conversation with nature.
Well Behaved Women Rarely Make History!
"Just Demand your Rights" Posts: 869 | From nor - cal | Registered: Apr 2008
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kam
Honored Contributor (10K+ posts)
Member # 3410
posted
I haven't been able to read what others have written.
But, did here a person on CNN say that we can not speculate on this yet as the plan is still in the works.
So, I am waiting until I hear what the plan is before deciding one way or the other.
As lyme patients, we have seen first hand how ineffective our current health care system is.
I had my primary doctor refuse to give me a thyroid test the other day and the primary doctor before him and the one before her.
Our system needs improvement. I don't have the answers at this time and have not had the answers for quite some time.
When I first started on this road to regaining my health, I felt that once I was well....I would put a side funds for health needs to pay out of pocket but also pay the monthly fee for insurance.
This would mean about $2,000 a month would go towards health care needs. Not a good thing or answer but the only answer I could see at that time.
At that time, I thought I would be well in 6 months or less and back to work.
I worked for the state of CA at the time and it would have been a $1,000 a month coming out of my check for a PPO.
The HMO was about $800 a month but I learned the hard way that an HMO was not for me.
Posts: 15927 | From Became too sick to work or do household chores in 2001. | Registered: Dec 2002
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kam
Honored Contributor (10K+ posts)
Member # 3410
posted
I had both an HMO and a PPO when I first came down sick.
An HMO at first which was of no help. The PPO later was more helpful but still had a very limited tool box.
I think with lyme and company education of the medical field, guidelines that support helping the sick get well and better testing and treatment are still our goals no matter which way things go.
Posts: 15927 | From Became too sick to work or do household chores in 2001. | Registered: Dec 2002
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randibear
Honored Contributor (10K+ posts)
Member # 11290
posted
well what's going to kill me is he's wanting to tax the portion of health benefits that the government provides.
my retirement has already gone down several hundred dollars. i can't afford more taxes.
-------------------- do not look back when the only course is forward Posts: 12262 | From texas | Registered: Mar 2007
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Keebler
Honored Contributor (25K+ posts)
Member # 12673
Thanks for posting this. I just started watching this and what strikes me is that you can have good, quality, "Affordable" health care.
Some of it seems like common sense to me. This is a very interesting program. I only watched part of it, but want to watch the whole thing.
Thank you.
-------------------- aka: Lyme Warrior
In order to do "real" science, you have to have a "real" conversation with nature.
Well Behaved Women Rarely Make History!
"Just Demand your Rights" Posts: 869 | From nor - cal | Registered: Apr 2008
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Keebler
Honored Contributor (25K+ posts)
Member # 12673
posted
-
IMO, as long as there are insurance companies, I think the care will be inadequate. It's the insurance companies that have become like Bernie Madoff in this area, scheming to get rich, not caring about who gets hurt.
I would like to see the insurance companies all disbanded. I'll pay the doctor, or the lab but why should there be a broker in the middle of my relationship with my doctor?
From the Frontline program above, (if I recall correctly) one of the Scandanavian countries seemed to have the best system - and maybe also Japan.
I have been arguing for years now, that it is mainly because there is a middle man(namely the insurance companies) that we are in this situation.
They are nothing more than a money making machine and when you think of it are in essence nothing more than a "Bookie" in the process, collecting money, and then setting up a transaction between patient and doctor.
Why on earth would anyone in this country want someone like a bookie interfering in their relationship with their doctor. The bookie never, ever, ever cares about the patient. The bookie only cares about themselves and their bottom line.
I believe you are right regarding the fact that some of the Scandanavian and yes Japan has the best programs. Perhaps we could structure ours something like theirs. They don't allow people to go broke over their health.
When the overall health of a society is good, the whole society benefits. The economic stability of a country that has healthy people has shown time and time again historically to have a marked increase economically over country's that don't.
We have been sliding economically with the mess that we are in. Both employers and employees are spending far too much of their budgets on their health with little to show for it.
Chronic illness is spreading in our country, thus effecting our workforce, thus costing us huge money.(money we could all be putting in our pockets.)
The only ones making money in the process are the insurance agencys and the drug company's.
If they can keep us ill and on meds forever, then of course this is what they like. It keeps money rolling in for them. They don't like when there are long-term fixes for our health problems. It is one huge money making machine that needs to be fixed.
-------------------- aka: Lyme Warrior
In order to do "real" science, you have to have a "real" conversation with nature.
Well Behaved Women Rarely Make History!
"Just Demand your Rights" Posts: 869 | From nor - cal | Registered: Apr 2008
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randibear
Honored Contributor (10K+ posts)
Member # 11290
posted
i'm concerned that the government will say there is no lyme and when we go for treatment can't get any at all, prescriptions, etc.,
they had one guy and i can't remember who on the radio, and they said that the plan is to approve patient care.
i don't want somebody telling my doctor how he can treat me or for what.
but time will tell...
-------------------- do not look back when the only course is forward Posts: 12262 | From texas | Registered: Mar 2007
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I share your concern regarding the possiblity of the government saying that there is no Lyme.
I mean why wouldn't this be a concern? After all we already have the IDSA which is the bible for mainstream doctors and the insurance agency's. They have already teamed up with the insurance agency's to dictate our disease and how it should be tested for, handled and that Chronic Lyme does not exist.
My only hope is that Obama will truly see how this disease and other chronic illnesses are affecting our overall economic condition as a country and will want to get to the bottom of it.
It does our country no good having people with chronic illness. As I have said before the only ones who benefit are the inusrance agency's and the drug industry.
I guess I don't see how it can get any worse than what we have now.
Currently we are living in a country where the CDC is still using antiquated methods for tracking a disease. We allow the IDSA to tell us that Chronic Lyme does not exist and we allow the Insurance agency's to dictate how and what we can use for treatment.
We have leaders in the IDSA saying that Lyme is over diagnosed etc....IMHO I can only see it getting better, not worse.
And, we have not even discussed all of the people that don't even have health care which is a whole other subject.
I agree with you in that time will tell and can only pray for good changes to come.
-------------------- aka: Lyme Warrior
In order to do "real" science, you have to have a "real" conversation with nature.
Well Behaved Women Rarely Make History!
"Just Demand your Rights" Posts: 869 | From nor - cal | Registered: Apr 2008
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bettyg
Unregistered
posted
i'm sure you are talking about NORWAY ... free there; we have 6 or so members from there.
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kelmo
Frequent Contributor (1K+ posts)
Member # 8797
posted
I talked to my LLMD about this today, and he launched into a rant. His office partner used to be a doctor in Canada and left because it was so bad.
Obama says we will have a choice to stay with our employer sponsored healthcare, or take the government health care.
Well, you can guess what the employers will do, cut you off and send you to be on the government, taxpayer supported heatlh care.
At that point, the government will have all the control to decide what healthcare you get for what ailment.
If you are 75 and older, you might as well make funeral plans because there will be no hip replacements or heart surgeries for you.
It's bad, bad, bad.
Posts: 2903 | From AZ | Registered: Feb 2006
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I personally do not think it will be that easy to "Cut you off".
Let me explain. As soon as there is a little competition out there, the pre-existing insurance premiums will go down. Competition is a good thing and currently there is none.
The insurance company's have a huge monopoly right now. The existing plans have no one to compete with. They call all the shots. It's about supply and "Demand". When demand goes down, they will get more reasonable.
Even if employers try to do this, believe you me the current insurance agency's do not want to go under and you can bet your bottom dollar that they will restructure and come down out of their ivory towers and lower their prices to a more reasonable level.
Why do you think the insurance agencys are spending so much money to try to stop Obama?
They are spending millions of dollars to stop him because they know their days are limited being able to suffocate us with their absurd charges.
The minute they start losing customers by the threat of Obamas plan, they will be forced to be more reasonable in their costs. As it stands now, there is no reason for them to be reasonable.
Also, if the employers were to cut us off, whose fault would that be? You can't blame the government for that. If employers get greedy and do something like that, than that is the employers who are being greedy. We need to hold our employers responsible too.
We can't get angry if the government is trying to offer an affordable option for people who don't currently have one now.
Oh, and the reason most doctors come here to practice is to make more money. That is more money that you and I are paying. That is another part of the problem. i/e I received a tylenol for a headache when I was in the hospital once and they charged me $12 for one pill.
They charged me over 10K for a normal labor and delivery and I was only in the hospital for a little over 24hrs. Now if that is not insane then I don't know what is.
There may not be a perfect solution(nothing in life is), but this country absolutely can't continue on the path it is on. Both sides agree that there must be reform and change. It was inevitable.
I am hoping for a good change that we all can live with.
-------------------- aka: Lyme Warrior
In order to do "real" science, you have to have a "real" conversation with nature.
Well Behaved Women Rarely Make History!
"Just Demand your Rights" Posts: 869 | From nor - cal | Registered: Apr 2008
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posted
The doctors and hosptitals charge so much because of what insurance actually pays them, which is sometimes crap. I had a recent surgery, minor, it is called radio-frequency. It was to help my allergies calm down and hopefully make me feel somewhat better.
Yes, the charges were $980.00. Yes, that is a lot; however, insurance paid them $240.00. Some may think that is a lot, but there was a MD in there with me, along with 2 surgery nurses to monitor me, along with the space I was taking up. So, when I think about it that way, that is not alot of money.
And, still someone has to pay the light bills and electric bills, along with someone to keep the place clean and sterile.
Also, like with Quest, they will draw my blood, and the test they run may cost $35.00. The insurance sends them $8.00. $8.00!!! So, they pay those people who draw our blood next to nothing.
Where I get REALLY upset is when I see a medicine that costs $4,000 a month. That is crazy. Yes, insurance is part of the problem, but to me the biggest problem lies with the Drug Companies.
How to fix all those things of course bring different responses. BUT, I think that our Government should protect us from Terrorist. Period. I think they have no business in the Home Insurance Business, nor the health care business.
Shalome
Posts: 893 | From Florida | Registered: Dec 2008
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randibear
Honored Contributor (10K+ posts)
Member # 11290
posted
i have a friend in england who has breast cancer. yes, she's terminal.
but when she went for treatment, she told me their attitude was "well you're dying anyway, sorry...."
wow....that's terrible.
all i'm saying is that if the government says there's no such thing as lyme, they tell the program, the program tells the doctor don't treat, then where are we?
we're ____out of luck that's where....
-------------------- do not look back when the only course is forward Posts: 12262 | From texas | Registered: Mar 2007
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you are correct and that is a big part of my point. Right now the insurance agency's and the drug company's for that matter pick and choose what they will and won't pay and they get away with it.
I am sure when I was billed 10k for a normal labor and delivery that my insurance only paid lets say $1000.00 which is not much at all. Now, if you don't have good coverage or insurance at all, you would be stuck paying the whole $10k. There is no balance for those that have insurance and those that don't.
If the doctors know that someone is paying with cash or their credit card the amount s/b what the insurance agency would pay.
I will give you another example. I paid out of pocket for an MRI once and was given a cash discount of $1500. The normal charge for this procedure was 3k. I thought wow, this a good discount.(sounded good as I was getting a 50% break, right?)
Now, come to find out that I had another MRI that I submitted to insurance and it was performed at the same place and same exact procedure and my insurance only paid $250 of the 3k charge. My jaw dropped wide open when I saw that on my itemized bill and insurance stmt.
Keep in mind that the insurance agency is already collecting a premium from the employer and the employee and yet they still get the biggest break from the place that I had the MRI performed.
Basically, we are shoving off the cost to the little man that has no insurance or bad coverage. That is criminal in my opinion.
Why should the insurance agency get the big break when they are already collecting huge money each month through our premiums?
Maybe I am stuck in the mud, but no one will ever convince me that a normal labor and delivery should cost 10k for a 24 hr visit with no surgery or complications. Why should someone with bad insurance or none for that matter be charged that amount of money and have to pay the full amount?
I know another family that had a serious medical issue just two weeks ago and had to spend a weekend in the hospital with multiple tests being run and by the time the weekend was over they incurred over 38k in medical bills. This is unacceptable and is ruining peoples whole lives.
I totally agree with you that 4k per month for a medicine is lunacy. That needs to be overhauled too. They were trying to charge me $98 for 12 little zithromax pills that is only a 6 day supply that I am supposed to take daily for my Lyme.
My zith alone would cost me $500 per month and that is only one of my meds. This is insane. Meanwhile I am still paying my insurance premium and the employer is paying their part too and what am I getting for it???
The whole picture is broken and no one is budging, so the government is left to interfere.
And, this is nothing new. The government has been involved for many, many years now. They are involved in social security and medi-care.
If it were not for those two programs alone, many would not have a pot to pee in or any medical coverage for that matter.
The government is not just for protection from terrorist. Of course that is an important role, but is not their sole role.
This country gives millions if not billions of dollars annually to other country's to help them with humanitarian aide, infrastructure aide etc... If we can do that than IMHO we'd better be involved w/ helping our own people with health care and other issues.
-------------------- aka: Lyme Warrior
In order to do "real" science, you have to have a "real" conversation with nature.
Well Behaved Women Rarely Make History!
"Just Demand your Rights" Posts: 869 | From nor - cal | Registered: Apr 2008
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kelmo
Frequent Contributor (1K+ posts)
Member # 8797
posted
Socialized medicine and universal health care is not the way to go.
I think more competition would be created if we each had a personal policy. The money the employers spend on his could be put directly into our hands. Then WE could shop.
That way, insurance companies will be forced to become competitive to get our business.
The problem with my suggestion is that people will not budget for health care when the money is put in their hands to do so, and they will then scream for the government to provide it for them.
In that instance, we have the IDIOT quotient. No matter WHAT system of health care is chosen, there will be an unhappy group.
But, for the Lyme patients...universal and socialist based healthcare will screw us even more than what we have now.
It's not that I'm anti-Obama (I know you think that's where I'm going). I didn't like any proposal from any candidate during the election.
But, of all of them, the one he proposed is the one I liked the least.
Posts: 2903 | From AZ | Registered: Feb 2006
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bettyg
Unregistered
posted
my left hip replacement surgery 2 years ago was $50,000 !! i paid max of $800 for family plan out of pocket; rest was paid for and medicare/bcbs reduced their costs as well.
i feel for those WITHOUT INSURANCE who have to pay the FULL AMOUNTS vs. what the insurance woudl HAVE paid had they had it.
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posted
Well first off, anyone paying cash to a doctor should always ask for a cash discount. There are times when I run out of chiro visits (because I am only allowed so many) and I have to pay out of pocket.
The chiro charges me less than what they get from the insurance. Why, because every penny they get from the insurance company, they have to fight for it. First, they wait 30 days and send a letter asking why this visit is relevant to our condition, then when that is answered the insurance company will deny the charge, and then you can appeal it. By then, it is 4-6 months later when the doctor gets paid.
Doctors have to pay people just to fight with the insurance companies. And it isn't just healthcare, but auto insurance too.
One time, it took my doctor 2 years to get paid for surgery to remove the cysts on my ovaries.
I would like a fix to these things: insurance, medicine, and doctors. But, I do not think that the Obama way is the way to go. He is from the "Socialist" mindset, and ole Hillary is from the Communist mindset. Why?? That is where all their money for campaigning came from.
Do you know that our Senators and Representatives will draw their same salaries (150-300K) even after they are removed from office, so that is until they die???? Soooo, talk about the government spending money needlessly. So, life always goes back to what we call the "Good Ole Buddy" way of life. Money begets money, and money begets the souls of our goverment. AND, please note that I am not saying that everyone of them is corrupt, but I would say more are corrupt than are not.
Yes, the government is in Medicare/Medicaid/Disability but none of those programs work either. Yes, something needs to be done, and I wholeheartedly agree, but Government managing anything doesn't work.
I even worked for a Navy contractor, do you know how slow the wheels turn there?? You have to have 50 signatures to buy a role of toilet paper. So, how much of that time is wasted?
In the end, I just want lyme to be noticed, paid by insurance companies (or the governement) so people can get better. But, our government is about money, just like the doctors, the insurance, and the drug companies. Who ever pays them the most is the way they vote.
That is why we as lymies have a hard time getting noticed, we don't have any money to give to anyone, and we are considered throw aways - because it is all in our head. And, we are too tired to fight.
That was way more than I wanted to write...sorry.
Shalome
Posts: 893 | From Florida | Registered: Dec 2008
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Geneal
Frequent Contributor (5K+ posts)
Member # 10375
posted
There will still be health insurance.
I would think especially for companies.
It's by taxing our benefits (insurance and stuff)
That Obama hopes to fund his Universal Health plan.
So....those of us with insurance will be paying taxes on it
For those who don't have any.
Hugs,
Geneal
Posts: 6250 | From Louisiana | Registered: Oct 2006
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posted
In my above scenario that I described, I did ask for a cash discount and I still paid over 6x's what my insurance company paid. wrong, wrong, wrong!
I would beg to differ about medicare etc not working. It may be far from perfect, but for many it is far, far better than nothing, So from that point of view, I would say it works pretty well.
I have known numerous people who without medicare/medicaid/disability would have had "complete" financial ruin(we are tallking out on the streets). If you asked someone who has it whether they would be better off without it at all, I could pretty much gaurantee you they would say no.
And as far as social security, it too is far from perfect, but for many senior citizens on fixed incomes, it pays their monthly bills.
Both my grandmother and grandfather and my dad get their SS checks monthly(They paid into the system for years) and all three have told me that if it were not for that automatic savings plan, they would not be able to survive with what other money they were able to save up.
All three of them were responsible and also were able to put away a little money, but there is no way that would have been enough.
I do agree that those of us with Lyme need to be noticed along with all the other chronic illnesses out there. I can only hope and pray that ppl will sit up and realize that chronic illness will only hold us all back as a nation.
I wish the government did not need to be involved, but the minute you allow the private sector to be the sole care-taker, that is when the greed starts i/e insurance, drug companys etc(I mean they are a business like any other business that wants to make money).
I don't think it's alright to profit off of peoples health.
As much as I hate it, someone has to be the gate-keeper and the private sector blew it along time ago. If they hadn't we would not be in the position we are in right now.
Lets hope for the best =)
-------------------- aka: Lyme Warrior
In order to do "real" science, you have to have a "real" conversation with nature.
Well Behaved Women Rarely Make History!
"Just Demand your Rights" Posts: 869 | From nor - cal | Registered: Apr 2008
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posted
Some things i've tought about recently are how bad it is that pharmacies can charge all over the place for the same medication in price, and yet the insurance will pay a company that charges $1,000 for a months prescription that full amount when a pharmacy down the street charges $500 a month. As people using the insurance we don't care because we still pay the same co-pay. The insurance should pay the $1,000 pharmacy $500 and not require the patient to pick up the difference.
Another problem is that you can get a months worth of a medicine you never toke before, then not be able to tolerate it or have it not help you and then have paid for a expensive prescription that is now worthless to you. You never fill a partial prescription with insurance since there is no incentive to take less finacally with co-pays. You'd end up paying two co-pays in order to get a small amount first to test it out.
Posts: 526 | From NJ | Registered: May 2007
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Obama: "Part of what I think government can do effectively is to be an honest broker in assessing and evaluating treatment options."
Translation: Government bureaucrats will step in and call the shots. Both you and your doctor will be shut out from determining appropriate treatment.
If that doesn't worry you, the President elaborated further:
"The chronically ill and those toward the end of their lives are accounting for potentially 80 percent of the total health care bill..."
"There is going to have to be a conversation that is guided by doctors, scientists, ethicists. And then there is going to have to be a very difficult democratic conversation that takes place."
Just what do you think Obama's talking about here? Trust me, these are scary times if you're chronically ill or over the age of 55.
If you have diabetes or high blood pressure or multiple sclerosis - or are diagnosed with heart disease or cancer - your future doesn't look very bright based on the President's comments above.
If the feds determine you're costing more than you're worth, well, it's been nice knowing you.
Even Obama's top health advisers have emphasized that America should value the lives of young, healthy people more than those of old, sick individuals.
One such adviser is Dr. Ezekiel Emanuel, brother of Obama's pit-bull chief-of-staff Rahm Emanuel.
Kevin Williamson of National Review Online describes Dr. Emanuel's views:
"He wrote in The Lancet in 2008: 'Unlike allocation by sex or race, allocation by age is not invidious discrimination.' We all were young once, the argument goes, and so denying the elderly and weak in order to care for the young and fit is just."
Does that sound "just" to you?
And, Obama claims that his health plan won't involve rationing or reduced care. But that's ridiculous, because all government-run health systems suffer from those drawbacks.
In fact, government-run health care supporters in Congress have already made a down payment on rationed care.
Specifically, 1.1 billion has already been appropriated as part of the disastrous "stimulus bill" for so-called "comparative effectiveness research."
What is "comparative effectiveness research?"
Congressman David Obey, Chairman of the House Appropriations Committee, explained it in his committee's report:
"...those items, procedures, and interventions... that are found to be less effective and in some cases, more expensive, will no longer be prescribed."
What happened to America being a Republic that promises to safeguard the God-given rights of "life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness?"
Private System vs. Government-Run System...
We are the first to admit that America's health care system is not perfect. Costs are out of control; access to care is a real issue for some.
Yes, some reform is needed, but "reform" modeled after state-run European and Canadian models is the wrong approach.
After all, despite its flaws, the current health care system in the United States is second-to-none in the world.
Dr. David Gratzer, a Canadian-trained physician who practices in the United States, makes that very point in his book The Cure. Here are just a few examples he cites:
U.S. breast cancer patients are four times as likely to be diagnosed before the tumor has spread... and thus much more likely to survive; U.S. cancer patients generally have much higher survival rates than their European counterparts; American heath care dramatically outperforms the "universal care" systems with heart disease and stroke; and, American researchers in a private enterprise system are responsible for roughly 80% of the world's major medical advances.
Here's how Dr. Gratzer describes his own revelation about Canada's state-run system:
"On [my way to medical school class]... I cut through a hospital emergency room and came upon dozens of people on stretchers - waiting, moaning, begging for treatment. Some elderly patients had waited up to five days in corridors before being admitted to beds. They smelled of urine and sweat. As I navigated past the bodies, I began to question everything I thought I knew about health care - not only in Canada, but also in the United States. ... I had begun a journey into the heart of one of the great policy disasters of modern times."
Painful and interminable waits for care are policy disasters Obama "forgot" to mention.
The time is now to tell Congress that you don't want government bureaucrats making life-and-death decisions for you and your family. The time is now to defeat government-run health care in the United States.
Shalome
Posts: 893 | From Florida | Registered: Dec 2008
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Government health care will be a disaster. The question is, what can we do to stop this??
-------------------- Wishing You Showers Of Blessings! Lyme since Fall 1983 = Diagnosed Summer 2008 IV Rocephin 7 weeks Stopped due to drug fever Now doxycycline "For I know the plans I have for you...plans to give you hope and a future." Jeremiah 29:11 Posts: 430 | From Sunny South | Registered: Jul 2008
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kelmo
Frequent Contributor (1K+ posts)
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posted
Translation: Government bureaucrats will step in and call the shots. Both you and your doctor will be shut out from determining appropriate treatment.
THIS IS THE IMPORTANT ISSUE!
The government just intervened with Chrysler and several long standing family-owned businesses in my city (major city) HAD to close. Their sales were still good! It was rediculous.
They have new cars on their lot they are not allowed to sell. And Chrysler can't buy them back. So, these owners are screwed.
The more government has it's hand in the pot, the more contaminated it's going to get.
There is no way to stop it. There are no checks and balances in the government right now. Only three people are running it. Obama, Nancy, and Harry.
Posts: 2903 | From AZ | Registered: Feb 2006
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Let me get this straight, we are blaming "Everthing" on Nancy, Obama and Reid????
That's really interesting since George Bush Jr. was in office for the past 8 years.
What amazes me, is that people don't remember that.
Anyway, I think I have said enough on this issue and on this particular thread. I am proud to be a liberal and am proud to be someone who is willing to help those who are less fortunate.
I am proud that Obama is trying to make a change(a change that was inevitable).
It will not be a perfect plan, that I am sure of, but it will at least be an attempt to be better than what we now have. The last administration had eight years to do something and chose to do absolutely nothing on this issue.
The people voted for Change and change is what they will get.
I am sorry if you disagree with me and am saddened that you think trying to offer "affordable" care is not an option or is not an important option. That of course is your choice.
I will still continue to pray to God for the right solution.
Ps as someone else mentioned in a similar thread here. We are not talking about a car, we are talking about basic human rights(the right to basic "affordable" health care)
Call me strange, but I can't for the life of me equate the two.
-------------------- aka: Lyme Warrior
In order to do "real" science, you have to have a "real" conversation with nature.
Well Behaved Women Rarely Make History!
"Just Demand your Rights" Posts: 869 | From nor - cal | Registered: Apr 2008
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No, computers are here to stay. They will never get away with that one.
If they tried that one, they will get voted out as quickly as they were voted in. Might take eight or so years, but people would not stand for it and eventually the tide would change.
The beauty of this country is that when the balance shifts, then things always change.
The balance shifted for this cycle and if the majority are not happy with Obama and friends, then they will be ousted.
If enough people are happy, then he or the like will stay.
And as far as the Chinese, I agree totally with you in that I think it's very sad about all the jobs that we have given away by importing cheap plastic crud from China.
We have lost millions of good manufacturing jobs and so many Americans can't find decent wage jobs. Very sad indeed.
We have such a trade in balance. We buy so much more from them with our dollars and the safest thing is they buy treasury bills.(T-bills).
The reality is the T-Bills are debt that is promised to be paid back in the future therefore holding us hostage to the debt we owe.
Anyway, I agree about the Chinese owning us. We have to stop importing their garbage. (America supports stores like Walmart, therefore are dollars go over there and that gives them the dollars to buy us)
Ultimately the problem is our willingness to buy cheap stuff from China instead of paying a little more, having a little less and having it be American made.
So, I guess we agree on the Chinese issue at least.
-------------------- aka: Lyme Warrior
In order to do "real" science, you have to have a "real" conversation with nature.
Well Behaved Women Rarely Make History!
"Just Demand your Rights" Posts: 869 | From nor - cal | Registered: Apr 2008
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kelmo
Frequent Contributor (1K+ posts)
Member # 8797
posted
I'm not blaming the American ills on Obama, Nancy and Henry. What I said was they were in charge with little opposition.
No country is healthy without check and balance, Democrat majority, or Republican.
I love our country. America is magnificent. I highly encourage people to see the HBO series John Adams and see the sacrifice it took to create this nation. The men were wise. They looked to God for wisdom.
Our peaceful change of power is to be admired.
We can't be beholden to a communist country.
People need to get mad and hungry.
When we think we are financial in the dirt, just look around you at all the cellphones people have. Look at all the ipods. I see people on foodstamps, but have iphones.
My husband gets up at 3:30am to take the bus to work, 27 miles one way. He used to drive, but we wanted to save the extra $150 in gas to pay for my daughter's medication. He is not a young man, this is a sacrifice. There are only six people on the bus coming and going. I am guessing people can afford nearly $3/gal.
Just walk into any Applebee's and you'll find people who are overfed.
We can't keep blaming whoever is in charge of this country when we aren't willing to do something on a personal level.
The government can't just dole out money. I believe if we take responsibility for helping each other, it will go a long way to take care of needs AND make us better people. Which will make for a better country.
We all love our country and I am proud to be an American too. I pray to God daily and hope he guides each and everyone of us to make good decisions.
I also totally agree with you that we need to take responsibility on many different levels.
These problems are very complex.
I agree that ppl are overfed and make bad choices. I can't believe how people are angry over wanting to tax cigarettes higher. Lung cancer is a huge cost to all or our health care insurance costs. Lung cancer is one of the number one killers in this country.
Obesity is a major problem.
You are right that we need to do something on a personal level. That is why I also commented on China and Walmart etc....
We each need to take some responsibility. I have done the same as your husband in the last couple years with my driving habits. I will bring a book when carting the kids around and instead of dropping off and going back home, I will many times just stay and read a book. I ride my bike whenever I can and recently purchased a scooter to save on the gas and the environment.
There are so many things that each of us can try to do.
Recycle, turn off electricity, buy local, buy American, stop buying stuff you don't really need, help your neighbors out when you can.
Bottom line is, that I think you and I are probably more alike then different.
-------------------- aka: Lyme Warrior
In order to do "real" science, you have to have a "real" conversation with nature.
Well Behaved Women Rarely Make History!
"Just Demand your Rights" Posts: 869 | From nor - cal | Registered: Apr 2008
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kelmo
Frequent Contributor (1K+ posts)
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I think so, too, Lies.
Posts: 2903 | From AZ | Registered: Feb 2006
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METALLlC BLUE
Frequent Contributor (1K+ posts)
Member # 6628
posted
Medicare and Medicaid cover all my treatments for Chronic Lyme Disease, Babesia, Bartonella/Mycoplasma, mold, Igenex testing, Quest testing, Doctor Data, Genova, Labcorp, and prior IV Vancomycin etc.
Just an FYI. If the government is saying "no," to paying for my care because they think Chronic Lyme doesn't exist -- then the mailman must be delivering my bills to the wrong house it's not showing up in my mailbox.
Medical care which is limited to those who can afford it is a matter of descrimination. The basic principle of our Constitution states in simple terms. The right to "life," liberty and the pursuit of happiness.
One can not "live" if an insurance company -- which is designed to make money -- is stamping approved or denied on the claim submitted by a doctor on a patients behalf. When an insurance company -- as we've all seen with Chronic Lyme Disease -- denies claims based on vested interests rather than the physicians best judgment, indirectly they are playing a role in the suffering and potential death of the patient.
That is how our present system is designed. Someone sitting in a corner office on the 50th floor is crunching numbers and stamping approve or deny on insurance claims based on bottom-lines, not human lives.
Here is my experience with private insurance carriers:
Unum insurance denied I was disabled when I had to leave work on short term (eventually long term) disability. I filed all the appropriate paperwork from all of my physicians. It was clear I was disabled and they pulled my coverage. I tried to appeal, they denied me. I tried to appeal again, they denied me. They wrote me a termination letter explaining why they denied further coverage. In the letter they twisted all of the evidence I gave them instead something that didn't even resemble my personal history. Basically it ended with them saying "We suggest the patient go back to work and see a psychiatrist for his ongoing complaints."
I had paid into that policy for years through my employer. When I needed it, it wasn't there. Tufts Insurance also gave me a hard time when I needed surgical intervention and medications. They billed me for a $10,000 procedure. I spent months fighting it. The co-payments were incredibly expensive and they kept raising them. $10, then $20, then $40, then $50. It was unreasonable.
When I hired a lawyer to try to go after Unum, they began stalking me. They told me if I took them to court they'd "make things unpleasant." My lawyer told me it wasn't in my best interest. He told me I should file social security disability instead. So I did. It took about two years, but I did finally get support.
-------------------- I am not a physician, so do your own research to confirm any ideas given and then speak with a health care provider you trust.
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