LymeNet Flash: Canada's Health Care 'Refugees'

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Topic: Canada's Health Care 'Refugees'

gridmonster
LymeNet Contributor
Member # 19280

posted

Canada's Health Care 'Refugees'
by Jessica Peck Corry
10/01/2009

Sometimes, patriotism can be awkward. Especially when it means admitting to an international TV

audience that your nation's broken health care system forced you onto welfare, into adult

diapers, and hobbling with a walker. And all before the age of 30.

Embarrassing perhaps, but for Canadian Lin Gilbert, the time had come to share her story

publicly this week. Especially after her 15-year-old son was recently diagnosed with the

same health condition leading to her suffering. ``As a parent, I will do anything to help him.

I will borrow the money, I will do whatever it takes,'' she said. ``If the Canadian system can't

take care of him, I'll find a way.''

Specifically, Gilbert wants to prevent her son from enduring the agony of government waiting

lists she has known all too well. After first encountering excruciating back pain in 2001, she

was forced to wait six months for an MRI. Nearly three more years passed before she made it to the

top of a waiting list for spinal fusion surgery. Even then, she recalls, one surgeon refused to

operate because she ``hadn't suffered enough.'' Another, however, saw things differently, lobbying

for Gilbert to get the procedure and successfully performing it himself.

At 38, Gilbert is now off public assistance, owns her home, and manages a financial services

business. Life is good, though she still suffers immense guilt from memories of being ``an absent

mother,'' agonized by being unable to play with her kids, and struggling to remain coherent as she

downed morphine to drown the pain.

Fortunately, Gilbert's son faces better prospects.

Enter Rick Baker, a Canadian determined to improve health care in his country. Baker joined

Gilbert Monday at a Vancouver hotel to speak with American reporters as part of a health care

dialogue organized by the Colorado-based Independence Institute, a free market think tank

where I am a public policy analyst.

Baker began by offering a blunt disclosure. ``I make my living sending patients to the U.S.,'' he

said. ``This is medical tourism, but instead of sending someone to Thailand, we're sending them to Delaware.''

Through an innovative partnership with 22 independent American surgery centers and doctors

in 13 states, Baker and his American counterparts transport Canadians to the U.S. for timely care at

cost savings up to 80 percent. The partnership operates largely outside the traditional health

insurance system. And this isn't just about helping Canadians. Baker now also provides a

similar state-to-state service for Americans seeking more affordable or timely care.

Under Canada's controversial federal health legislation, surgeons are prohibited from charging

patients to provide ``medically necessary'' treatment. In addition, they are limited to

performing surgeries to six hours a week. Gilbert recalled one surgeon telling her, ``I spend six

hours in surgery each week, less time than I spend explaining to sick patients why I can't perform theirs.''

Currently, Baker is involved an Ontario lawsuit that could effectively eliminate such limits. ``The

Canada Health Act is responsible for more pain, more suffering, and more death than any other

piece of domestic legislation in history,'' he said. ``Imagine a law that prevents you from

taking care of yourself and preventing your own death.''

The Vancouver gathering came as President Barack Obama continues his push to radically expand the

role of government in administering American health care. But participants weren't just focused

on bashing Canada as a role model. It was also about explaining that America's health care woes

don't come from an absence of government, but rather too much government and not enough consumer choice.

``The Canadian system is a Ponzi scheme is that is just a little further along ours,'' explained Dr.

Keith Smith, an Oklahoma anesthesiologist who partners with Baker and manages his own outpatient

surgery center. Baker believes real change will come only when patients are given the incentive to

help control costs, freed from being forced to blindly abide by the decisions of insurance companies.

To attract patients, Smith lists the costs of all packaged surgery services on his center's Web

site, adding that if the center's costs rise above the figures provided, patients aren't required to

pay more. ``If we are wrong, we eat it.''

Smith hopes the model catches on. ``It's radical. But when people go to our competitor across town

and pay $21,000 [for a procedure], and then find out we could have done it for a fifth of that,

they start to ask a lot of questions, starting with `why didn't my insurance company go there?'''

Smith says insurance companies opt to pay more at hospitals because of a ``cartel'' where both inflate

the total costs of services as a way to increase profit. Smith's approach, meanwhile, also includes a commitment to not accepting any federal funding,

standing in stark contrast to the position espoused by the American Medical Association,

which recently endorsed Obama's plan. Smith was unsympathetic. ``The reason the AMA is endorsing

this plan is that 90 percent of its funding comes from the federal government,'' he said. ``Less than

15 percent of AMA's budget comes from physician dues, so they are seen largely as irrelevant.''

Hospital lobbyists argue that surgery centers like Smith's are given an unfair advantage in that

unlike traditional hospitals, they are not required to take every patient coming to their

door. But Smith rejects this, saying hospitals often exaggerate costs associated with treating

uninsured patients as a way to gain political sympathy and more public funding. ``They love to

see the uninsured person come through the door,'' he said. ``They run a bunch of tests and say it

cost them $80,000. Meanwhile, it probably really cost $1000.'' And while Smith's center is taxed,

his ``not-for-profit'' hospital competitors are not, a distinction Smith says helped net those in

his city net up to $100 million in profit last year.

Despite the intense political opposition they face, Smith and Baker are soldiering on, building

a new system that is transforming lives one at a time. ``I know it sounds a bit naive, but it's

true that reform is as simple as charging less for the delivery of health care,'' Baker said.

Imagine that.

http://www.humanevents.com/article.php?id=33785

Posts: 135 | From Orlando, Florida | Registered: Feb 2009 | IP: Logged |

maps
LymeNet Contributor
Member # 19758

posted

I may not say this very well but I am a Canadian, using the Canadian health care system.

The information in this article is being given by ONE patient with no documented backup as far as her medical situation is concerned.

And anyone reading the statements such as "The Nation's broken health care system" and that "The Canadian system is a Ponzi scheme" and "Canada's controversial federal health legislation" would be left with the impression that our health care is substandard or falling apart.

After reading the rest of the article it is obvious that they are trying to put down the Canadian system in order to scare the American public away from any reform to the American Health Care system. Shame on them.

As a Canadian health care user I am just posting to let people know that there statement are very distorted.

In all mine, my family, my friends doctor visits no one has ever been referred to the US for treatment.

We are well aware that if we have several thousund dollars to spare we can go pay for the medical services we need.

I have been disabled for nine years. I have had dozens of doctor, emergency room, specialist visits along with the same amount of tests and I have not had to pay one dime. I can go to any hospital or any doctor I choose.

If I were living in the US and did not have the money to buy insurance, as I currently don't - where would I be!

My sister lives in LA and had a heart attack, I immediately flew to be with her and was shocked. When I arrived she was lying in a small hospital, after I had been there for an hour she required intabation(sp).

When I asked why she was not receiving any treatment I was told that that particular hospital was not covered under her insurance plan and all they could do was to try to get her stable so that she could be transferred to one that was.

Needless to say once she recovered she immediately changed her insurance coverage.

Our system is by no means perfect. At one time doctors could see as many patients as they wanted too and consequently were earning a resonable salary.

The government looked at these numbers and decided that if the doctors were seing that many patients then they could only be giving patients a maximum of five minutes with the doctor.

Unfortunately although they were trying to look after patient welfare they have now created a situation where doctors are unable to earn a reasonable salary (I say reasonable in context of the amount of years they have spent in schooling and training).

Many doctors have left to practice in the US where thier income is enormous and good for them because now the government has realized that kind of restriction is not helping anyone and hopefully we will get some changes made soon.

I hope I don't offend anyone but it is hard to sit by and watch untruths being accepted as truth.

regards
maps

--------------------
1999 CFS, 2002 CMV Myco pneumonia
1 year antibiotics on and off
2002 EBV, 2009 Positive Igenex Borellia and Babesia, Brain mri severe white matter disease
Monoclonal Gammopathy. On and off antibiotics since sept. March 9 started iv antibiotics

Posts: 328 | From somewhereelse | Registered: Apr 2009 | IP: Logged |

lou
Frequent Contributor (5K+ posts)
Member # 81

posted

Thank you maps. In my opinion there is too much profit built into the system from all areas of medicine in the U.S. This is why there is so much opposition to change.

Insurance driven healthcare leaves patients at their mercy, and the only recourse is a lawsuit. Yes, some states have appeal systems, but lymies don't fare very well. And these systems don't cover everyone. And who can do all this appealing and suing when they are sick?

Was the article posted above published somewhere? There is no source for it.

Posts: 8430 | From Not available | Registered: Oct 2000 | IP: Logged |

maps
LymeNet Contributor
Member # 19758

posted

Lou:

I checked on the website posting this article, the site is called;

"HUMAN EVENTS.COM
HEADQUARTERS OF THE CONSERVATIVE UNDERGROUND" whatever that means.

Hmm sad that they have to lie about other countries to get thier point accross.

Here are some of the comments posted to the article - at least I am not alone in finding it offensive and they have not been edited.

I have to admit that reading through these comments make me really sad regarding the degregation of Canada - Why can't we all just get along!!!

Report Abusive Post
I saw a news story about how someone in Canaduh's government is trying to make it illegal for Canadians to come to America for treatment.

Nice.
Oct 01, 2009 @ 03:53 AMLarry G, Lake Montezuma, Az
Report Abusive Post
Quit your lying. Canada would never adopt a US system. We have a lower infant mortality rate (and a lower abortion rate, even though our Contitution is read to support abortion, like the US did).

We also have a lower national debt. Until the Conservatives came to power, we believed in living within our means. The US hasn't done that since Clinton. We also pay less for health care while covering everyone.

We're your comrades-in-arms in Afghanistan. Canadians sign up for service, unlike John Wayne, Joesph Farah, Rush, etc.
Oct 01, 2009 @ 05:18 AMBrenda, London, Ontario, Canada
Report Abusive Post
The usual right wing extremist KKKonturd paranoia.

Heres a Gallup Poll comparing US, Canada and GB on what people think of health care, from 2003:
http://www.gallup.com/poll/8056/healthcare-system-ratings-us-great-britain-canada.aspx

"44% of Americans are very dissatisfied with the availability of affordable healthcare, and nearly three-fourths (72%) are either somewhat or very dissatisfied. The 44% in the United States who are very dissatisfied with healthcare availability is significantly higher than corresponding figures in either Canada (17%) or Great Britain (25%)."

And what do Canadians think of their Health Care? From July of this year:
http://www.ctv.ca/servlet/ArticleNews/print/CTVNews/20090710/health_care_090710/20090710/?hub=Health&subhub=PrintStory

"The Canadian Press Harris-Decima survey suggests 82 per cent of Canadians believe our system is better than U.S. health care."

Finally, who is Lin Gilbert, the right wing extremist poster child de jour?

"Lin Gilbert suffered from debilitating back pain that she says was untreated in an untimely manner in her native Vancouver. She was also unemployed and on welfare. Eventually she got the surgery she needed and is pain free today. It cost her nothing. She has no debt related to her medical treatment....can't speak to what delayed the treatments in Canada for these women, but surveys show that they are the exceptions."
http://www.newscorpse.com/ncWP/?p=1343

It cost her nothing....It cost a Welfare mom NOTHING.

"An American with the same problem would still be suffering or would have racked up an unmanageable debt that would haunt them and their family for the rest of their life."
ibid.

Or an American on Welfare simply wouldnt be treated according to the KKKonturd.
Oct 01, 2009 @ 05:53 AMIgnacio Izquierdo, Nogales, Mex/az

Report Abusive Post
Gee, and I thought Canada's pride with the military was limited to welcoming our deserters...

www.conservativemusiconline.com
Oct 01, 2009 @ 06:03 AMLance Morrison, CA
Report Abusive Post
Come on lefties: This article is spot on. Socialized systems are notorious for long waiting lists for elective surgery especially. Disagnostic tests are often a long wait as well.
Oct 01, 2009 @ 06:59 AMJohnny, Pewaukee Wi.

Report Abusive Post
My brother-in-law's father broke his hip in Ottawa, where he was being hospiced for dementia. The doctor explained to my b-in-l that pneumonia almost always ensues, and told him his dad had about a 5% chance of survival. Nonetheless, an artificial hip was implanted within a day of my b-in-l's instruction to do so. Sadly, pneumonia set in and the old guy died.

If this had happened here in the States, it would have cost a small fortune for the hip. Would you like to have to deny your Dad that hip, because it might ruin your family's prospects? No bill was sent.

xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx

Gee, Lance, I thought Canada's pride with the military was declaring war on Germany [twice] years before the US could be pried off the comfy couch.

--------------------
1999 CFS, 2002 CMV Myco pneumonia
1 year antibiotics on and off
2002 EBV, 2009 Positive Igenex Borellia and Babesia, Brain mri severe white matter disease
Monoclonal Gammopathy. On and off antibiotics since sept. March 9 started iv antibiotics

Posts: 328 | From somewhereelse | Registered: Apr 2009 | IP: Logged |

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