posted
*I've deleted the text of my post because there were complaints that it was indiscreet and too explicit. I apologize if I offended anyone. I was simply seeking support, compassion, and guidance. Thank you to all who responded.**
[ 03-18-2012, 01:41 PM: Message edited by: axseptants ]
Posts: 52 | From Central VA | Registered: Jun 2011
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posted
First off, that is very, very cool of you to be open about it. I don't have herpes, but I have friends who do and most don't reveal it to their new partners.
My fiance bolted when she learned I had lyme. It crushed me at the time. I have now learned she has since tested positive.
It's absolutely sexually transmittable. Anyone who says it's not, doesn't know. I do think it's easier from guy to girl than vice versa.
I also dealt with it the same way, with booze. It's really the worse thing for you. It appears you know that.
My advice would be to start treating lyme, once in remission..I highly doubt it's transmittable.
If you are still feeling ok, maybe it's not disseminated throughout your whole body and you may be able to recover within a year or less but you have to change those habits.
I know it sucks so bad, but one thing at a time. I think once you recover from lyme, you will realize genital herpes isn't so bad.
I read something like 1 in 5 adults have it. Doesn't surprise me.
You can get through this.
Posts: 109 | From PA | Registered: Feb 2012
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'Kete-tracker
Frequent Contributor (1K+ posts)
Member # 17189
posted
Dr. R, from NYC (famous/ in U.O.S.), didn't seem to think much of the transmission-by-sex thing. He said, "eh... just go & have fun!" or something to that effect, during the questioning period following the film's showing up here a few years back.
Your right, the CDC's current position is that Borrelia Burdorferi is not an STD. (Or is it "a STD"?) But many out there, & on the Boards here, think Lyme *is* sexually tramnsmitted, including some LLMDs! (??) ---- Although this doesn't involve sex, I recall reading of a couple interesting studys that both showed identical results: A group test animals (rabbits, I think), who were purposely infected w/ Lyme, were used to see if un-infected ticks could pick up the B.B. after being placed on & taking a "blood meal" from these animals. Most ticks did, but after putting the test animals on a few months of hi-level abx, a repeat of the same "tick test" showed ZERO... None of the un-infected ticks picked up ANY Lyme, even after a multi-day feed.
The belief was that the abx got the Lyme critters totally out of the bloodstream, & as a result, the spirochetes couldn't "find" the new ticks to infect, breaking the [vector] cycle of the disease.
So *I'm* wondering if you're on, or have been on, seveal months of high-level abx... that That small chance of passing the disease on to your partner might be eliminated, or atleast seriously diminished.
I know the mechanics are quite different, but it seems to me it would've gotten the B.B. out of your blood & bodily "secretions"... so you wouldn't be able to infect anyone during intimate contact. Just a theory of mine. Posts: 1233 | From Dover, NH | Registered: Sep 2008
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posted
I know I'm speaking as a mom of a young daughter, but please remember, you can still get HIV from unprotected sex, and that can kill you.
He may have spared you from something worse in the long run...especially since he didn't care enough to want to make sure you wouldn't get AIDS.
You do not deserve any of this!!!!
My family is going through a constant locust plague with all these health problems in our 30's. Even so, we are good people who did not ask for, nor deserve a second of this suffering. That goes for you as well.
The very fact that you were honest and sincere with him shows that you have a good heart.
There's a reason why you are on this Earth. You have to believe that there is something better on the other side of this.
Herpes, Lyme, Leprosy, Ebola, whatever, you still deserve to be adored...you don't have to lower your standards because of any health condition...be honest about it, yes, but lower your standards and expect anything less than adoration and respect, no.
Thankfully, you now know that he was not capable of meeting your needs.
Tell yourself that, "I deserve to be adored"
-------------------- aperture Posts: 551 | From Louisville, KY | Registered: Nov 2011
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randibear
Honored Contributor (10K+ posts)
Member # 11290
posted
my niece, who is a beautiful girl, has herpes. she got it from somebody who did not tell her he had it.
she finally met what she thought was a very nice guy. she felt she had to be honest so she told him.
not only did he curse her out, he beat her so badly that she lost vision in one eye.
so consider yourself lucky. enjoy your singleness. you have plenty of time. you have to live with yourself first before you can live with anyone else.
-------------------- do not look back when the only course is forward Posts: 12262 | From texas | Registered: Mar 2007
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lululymemom
Frequent Contributor (1K+ posts)
Member # 26405
posted
I want to see the scientific studies on humans that proves that this is sexually transmitted.
Until those studies come out, we have absolutely no obligation to warn our partners about anything!
I have been in 2 long term relationships and neither man has contracted it.
Lyme is an epidemic. If the person we're with has it, it could be he/she got it before or during our relations with them. I have read a study recently that states it can be transmitted by mosquitos. Now how common do you think that would be???
-------------------- PARASITES/WORMS ARE NOW RECOGNIZED AS THE NUMBER 1 CO-INFECTION IN LYME DISEASE BY ILADS* Posts: 6418 | From philadelphia pa | Registered: Jul 2008
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merrygirl
Frequent Contributor (1K+ posts)
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posted
I dont think its sexually transmitted. Just my opinion.
Posts: 3905 | From USA | Registered: May 2007
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posted
we can only go on what we know and have experienced.
in my situation, there was 2 athletic, healthy people living in different cities. one of them (me) got bit and infected with lyme(not treated correctly, inititially)
after 1 1/2 years of continuous sexual contact. my ex got sick and and tested IGENEX +, never having been bit.
we were never living in the same house even. i never wanted to believe it or admit it. but it's clear to both of us, i gave it to her.
maybe it's not as easily transmitted as an STD, and maybe it's easier from male to female.
not trying to convince anyone that they should disclose it to a partner, it's just my experience.
lululymemom
Frequent Contributor (1K+ posts)
Member # 26405
posted
Claiming this is an STD (Sexually Transmitted Disease) will further increase the stigma attached to people with Lyme disease. We have to be very careful about unproven labels!
Bartonella henselae 1:100 Posts: 2027 | From British Columbia | Registered: Jun 2010
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lpkayak
Honored Contributor (10K+ posts)
Member # 5230
posted
lymenow-i wrote you a pm but now i feel i have to say this out inpublic
1-many excellent llmds i have spoken to (one of them being the same one kete referenced-and the others up on his level) have all said we dont know if they can be transmitted
2-yes they can be in sperm but that doesnt mean they can be transmitted
3-they are also in the placenta blood but if a pregnant woman take abx they are not viable in the blood so do not make the baby sick
4-every other man she has been with (before you) could have given it to her too(and they wouldnt have told her cuz they wouldnt be dx by most docs)...she could also have been infected by fleas or mosquitoes or a spider or blackflies...they are finding it everywhere
5-also there is no way to know you have not been bit if you got bit by a nyph the size of a pencil point
it bugs me to see you beat yourself up about it. its hard enough to live with it and fight it...and with thousands -maybe more- running around infected but thinking they are not cuz thats what there pcps say or worse taking steroids for ms and other supposed diseases that lower their immune system and mke them sicker...
-------------------- Lyme? Its complicated. Educate yourself. Posts: 13712 | From new england | Registered: Feb 2004
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lpkayak
Honored Contributor (10K+ posts)
Member # 5230
posted
again...i write the facts as i know it and it is lost on here...
but lymenow it really bugs me to see you beat yourself up over this cuz it makes no sense for so many reasons
i cant type them again but any of you can call me if you want to hear why....
posted
That is so awful that he split like that. You are being so responsible and amazing for being up front about this! That is so brave and rare nowadays. I think that you should follow your heart about what you disclose or not.
I think it is possible that some people can get lyme from sex, and others cant. "lyme" is really so many different versions of spirochetes, so many different coinfections. I doubt any of us on this site even have the exact same bacterial infections, so of course there will be differences in our patterns of how we got them in the first place, and whether we could possibly pass it on.
My husband and i both have lyme. We feel that we both contracted it congenitally from our mothers, due to their similar health issues and chronic issues present before each of us were born. We think that it just got really bad when we lived together in an area where we both got tons of tick bites.
But who knows really?
Anyhow, follow your heart. There is no one right answer to this, I think. Using protection is always a good idea though, IMO. Many people have various STDS and dont even know about it themselves, and you need to protect your own health too!
Keeping my fingers crossed for you to cross paths with an awesome person who will treat you with the love, respect and compassion you deserve.
-------------------- IgM ++41, IND 31, 34, 39, 83-93 IgG IND 41
"To the world you may be one person, but to one person you may be the world." - unknown Posts: 72 | From NC | Registered: Sep 2011
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im just saying that i think its irresponsible to say its not transmittable on the basis of "ive had sex with others, and they are fine".
i had a different experience, and i wish others that have would speak up. i hope i am, but i know im not the only one.
Posts: 109 | From PA | Registered: Feb 2012
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posted
Okay, drinking and anti-anxiety meds.?! Not a good combo. Please think about what you are doing. If you need a drink, fine. But, don't do both.
I think that you did the right thing by telling him. It should be his choice if he wants to take the chance. You will find the right guy for you at some point. This one was not that guy.
Btw, my ex-husband and current boyfriend have no signs of lyme.
Posts: 418 | From NJ | Registered: Sep 2007
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lpkayak
Honored Contributor (10K+ posts)
Member # 5230
posted
"ive had sex with others, and they are fine".
just for the record this is not my argument at all...my argument is based on the science as we know it...i know i'm messed up and cant communicate well but i know what im talking about and its the same opinion many top llmds have
-------------------- Lyme? Its complicated. Educate yourself. Posts: 13712 | From new england | Registered: Feb 2004
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posted
kayak, i wasn't at all implying you said that. just seems to be the sentiment of the argument for why its not..i understand that it's not proven either way. its just such a horrible thing to have.
if my case was isolated, so be it.
Posts: 109 | From PA | Registered: Feb 2012
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posted
I agree with lymenow...."it's just such a horrible thing to have" Amen to that.
-------------------- aperture Posts: 551 | From Louisville, KY | Registered: Nov 2011
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Tricky Tickey
Frequent Contributor (1K+ posts)
Member # 26546
posted
I was upfront with my spouse from the beginning. He chose to continue intimacy knowing there may be a chance it could be contracted that way. He has also had 2 tick bites since then (within the last 2 years). He hasn't developed the symptoms but is well aware of the risk.
So whose to say it can or cannot transmit through bodily fluids.....I say anything is possible.
-------------------- Early Disseminated LD- 2010. Currently doing acupuncture and yoga. Negative Igenex (IND & Pos Bands) ISSUES AFTER: Tendonitis, letter reversal, Low immune system. PREVENTION:SaltC,Iodine,Humaworm, Chiropractic. Posts: 1013 | From In a van down by the river. | Registered: Jun 2010
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posted
All - I have not been on line in a few days. I just want to say how grateful I am for your input and dialogue on this issue in response to my post. What's clear to me is that the answer is unclear. I think a lot of my problem is that I already have a fears of and issues with rejection and abandonment and inadequacy. Having Herpes AND Lyme have just made these existing fears and issues exponentially magnified. I know that is my problem and no one else's. I need to come to terms once and for all that I may be alone forever because there may be only a minority of people willing to accept that I have these two diseases. I think that is the hardest part. I've always wanted to find a life long partner. I'm 40 and it hasn't happened yet and it's time I really had a coming to terms with myself that it likely won't, given my situation. Thank you all SO much for even caring enough to respond. I am grateful for this site and for all of you.
Posts: 52 | From Central VA | Registered: Jun 2011
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You are not a leper. You do not have to settle and live a life alone, if that's not what you want, just because you have 2 illneses...that you did not choose.
Just let people get to know you for you, before letting them know what's going on medically. Then, when it comes time for intimacy, let them know. By then, he/she will already love you for you.
I could have said the same thing. I had undiagnosed Lyme and friends (diagnosed as PTSD, anxiety and depression...ie.crazy).
I was divorced at 30 with a 5 yr old daughter. If I had told my now husband at our 1st meeting, "hey, I have mental health issues", he would have run away...not that he's superficial, he's the sweetest guy ever. But, that's alot to take in when you just meet someonoe.
I let him get to know the true me and when I finally told him (he says I opened Pandora's box, after he already loved me ) he wasn't willing to let me go just because I have some problems.
Just please don't settle, you deserve better.
-------------------- aperture Posts: 551 | From Louisville, KY | Registered: Nov 2011
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'Kete-tracker
Frequent Contributor (1K+ posts)
Member # 17189
posted
Yes 'glm', spirochetes have been seen in sperm on many an occasion, but those "donors" hadn't been thru several months of high-level abx in any study I've read about. Also, Dr R (NYC) feels sexual transmission a VERY low probability when I spoke w/ him in 2007.
The idea is the 'conduit of infection' (vaginal environment) is too hostile to the Lyme spirochetes to allow them to use this method of entry; too much oxygen, too much bacterial defense activity, etc. The injection method by the tick, using it's saliva to knock our local immune response out, is Quite effective... unfortunately.
I'm not saying sexual transmission can't happen, but the "parallel theory" of infection (the husband or wife having a similar exposure history to the surrounding environment) is still the popular hypothesis for spousal infection among many LD docs & researchers.
And no, lulu, there are no real good studys on this... & probably never will be. Many of the people who would be asked to participate would likeley respond negatively to the 'full disclosure' of the risks involved. (i.e: any Potential disease being possibly difficult to treat)
Posts: 1233 | From Dover, NH | Registered: Sep 2008
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That is right... we all deserve to be adored. I think if there is one definitive thing Lyme can teach a person is to love oneself ... as just a being... When you are confronted with your own mortality, a lot goes out the window. I don't know if I have always been good at loving myself... actually I know I have been horrible at it -- this illness has taught me how to live.
I sure didn't choose it and I sure want to beat it... but I was not living before... And now, I am beginning to and really just want the chance.
Hang in there... Your right person is out there.... In the interim, love yourself and those around you...
One thing my mom taught me before she passed away... is to never regret giving something your all... because eventually, it will be the right thing. She was an amazing woman...
She also said after going through a really rough road with Amyloidosis- a cancer of the blood (basically)-- Life is a thrill a minute if you are really paying attention...
Hang in there... The BEST is yet to come!~
Posts: 859 | From Southeast | Registered: Mar 2011
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Keebler
Honored Contributor (25K+ posts)
Member # 12673
posted
- I never read many the original post due my eyes spasming with tight spacing (so don't know what all has been said) but each time I seen this "headline" it calls to me.
First of all, no one rejects us.
They walk away, sure but if they are not fully committed, it's their decision to do so and we just have to let them go.
If we see it as rejection, we become the victim. We cannot afford that.
They simply may not understand all the issues and may not be ABLE to do so. Maybe they just don't want to and we are better off knowing that, as much as it hurts.
Still, the deep emotional loss is undeniable and demands some tender nurturing as we process our feelings and turn ourselves around to face the sun again.
Later will know that it was a good thing to happen now, rather than later - or to go on with a half-hearted relationship.
Remember: no one rejects us unless we give them the power to do so. It may help to reframe this to their simply deciding this was not the right relationship for the two of you.
They just saw it first, even if certain news triggered that, they were already out the door but just had not yet moved body to make it official. Believe me.
By being generous in that kind of spirit view of letting go, not taking it (totally) personally, you can start to heal.
Life is all about a dance, anyway. We come and go. Others come and go. We hope those we love (in various ways) will stay but it's a complex chain of events, for sure, this business of relationships.
As I try to frame it all around truth and what is real, looking back at relationship losses, I see that they were never REAL, to begin with.
I really lost only my illusion and had my hopes bruised. And, yes, that still hurts but it's freeing to recognize that I had not been seeing with clear eyes.
May you always have good and true friends and, yes, real love exits. I believe that it will blossom at the right time, regardless of circumstances beyond our control. -
Posts: 48021 | From Tree House | Registered: Jul 2007
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randibear
Honored Contributor (10K+ posts)
Member # 11290
posted
hey hon, don't apologize. heck, look at me. ya'll know how very little support i get. i've told ya'll stuff about the verbal abuse and all.
just like my niece you don't deserve this. we all have made mistakes, look at me!!
now if you had gone into detail about your sex life, that's one thing!!
but this didn't bother me at all.
listen to wise old keebler. great post.
remember, you can't make somebody stay if they don't want to. and if they don't want to be around you, then you really don't want them!!
keep on posting...
-------------------- do not look back when the only course is forward Posts: 12262 | From texas | Registered: Mar 2007
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posted
Wow Keebler... Thanks for this... You are a very wise woman... You know, I think I miss that most about my mom... with age comes wisdom and my mom had a lot of that...
I needed to read what you posted tonight... thank you... and Axseptants -- have you read the Invitation by Oriah Mtn. Dreamer? This always spoke to me... http://www.oriahmountaindreamer.com/ Posts: 859 | From Southeast | Registered: Mar 2011
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posted
Hello, The original post was deleted yet i "get" the gist of this conversation.
Keebler, your response is beautiful (as are other responses as well!)
There is a lot of wisdom in what Keebler says, and i can't emphasize this enough. Nothing is personal, really. It can feel personal, but in the long run, when someone chooses not to be in the relationship, it is a gift. We just can't see it until later ~
One thing that i want to say is that i've known many people in my life, as friends, as partners, as clients, students, etc......and i have never met a person who doesn't have some sort of "disability".
Some disabilities are obvious, such as not being able to get out of bed or not being able to see or hear, etc.
Yet the hardest disabilities for me to handle in relationships had to do with unconsciousness. We are all unconscious on some level, yet heartlessness, lack of listening and communication skills, alcoholism, avoidance.....these to me are much harder to live with than a physical situation.
Sometimes i see the illness i live with as a "test" of sorts as to who i relate to, who comes into my life. If someone just sees me as someone with an illness, i wouldn't want them close anyway.
We all want to be with someone who sees the essence of who we are. We are most likely to attract this in a mate or close friend if we can feel this essence while we are with ourselves.
An interesting note to "willbeatthis" is that Oriah who wrote the above has chronic fatigue syndrom. A beautiful and wonderful soul.
May we all know who we really are, no matter what our bodies can or cannot do.
There are many ways to be intimate "axceptants"....when we begin with ourself, this energy expands and others can't help but want to be with us.
May you be kind and gentle with You ~
Posts: 164 | From North America | Registered: Mar 2009
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kam
Honored Contributor (10K+ posts)
Member # 3410
posted
Not able to read what others wrote. But, I can't imagine having a boyfriend with this illness.
I know we are all at different levels.
I also have seen how being rejected due to health from a boyfriend really hurts more and makes our health worse.
I have felt so sorry for those who have tried.
When I first came down sick I was still interested in finding a companion to enjoy life with.
But, after years of living with this, I find it difficult to live with myself much less be around others.
it takes all I have just to make sure I eat 3 meals a day and usually don't accomplish that.
I was a person who would see someone needing help and help them before lyme.
I still try and do this but am getting better at stopping myself because they are actually able to do much more than I am and I am putting myself in harms way health wise by trying to help.
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