posted
Realize, she is the one that diagnosed me w/Lyme after 16 years of misdiagnosed as "chronic fatigue/fibro" by another doc.
Knows none of the treatments have worked (abx pills/IV for 6 months/rife/etc.... Said back then she'll do whatever she can to just get me by until further treatment/cure is known.
Good doc. Wait, what?
Now I have to sign a pain contract that basically is written by a lawyer. Says I have to take as directed, won't over do it, won't sell it. Ok, never would.
My problem? Contract says, I have to be prepared for random drug tests, psychological or psychiatric treatment or in-patient rehab if she so deems it necessary -- and I lose all rights to fight it.
Also, I cannot cancel or reschedule appt's.
Now, am I wrong here? Is this not an invasion of my US rights? Am I supposed to drop-trough at her whim, or be at a designated drug test within 24 hours of order?
Hey, I don't drive, so I can't just be anywhere you want anytime you want it. I don't abuse pain med (15mg oxy 3x day) and SHE's the one who rx'd this pain med to me to "help my late stage lyme' and to just get me to be able to get out of bed in the morning.
I don't care about the testing....I'd pass. But I am NOT about to sign a document that basically gives up my personal freedom. Civil liberties anyone?
Feel like I'm being treated as a criminal .....and oh no, not for taking drugs. Just not what she rx'd.
So, do I have to worry the oxy does or doesn't show up in my system or that it does?
She actually suggested Marinol and wrote me an RX in hope it might help. I couldn't fill it b/c it was too expensive. She then told me....ask a relative or neighbor for real thing......
SO, if I did and this shows up? What? Are the police coming to my door? Does this give her the power to put me away for 30 days? Geeze!!!
I do not want to be ordered to pee in front of a nurse....I do not want someone to tell me if I'm not there at 2pm today I will be in breach (can't assume person who takes me to appointment will be available) and final thing is....?
SHE CAN QUIT ME AS PATIENT AS UNRELIABLE DRUG USER/dealer? AT HER DISCRETION! WHICH MEANS, IF I TRY TO REPLACE HER AS MY GP, IT'S ON MY PERMANENT RECORD for docs/medicare/anyone to see?
14th Amendment anyone...illegal search and seizure?
IS THERE A LAWYER IN THE HOUSE WHO WANTS TO REPRESENT ME AS A CHRONIC LYME PATIENT THIS DOC WANTS TO LOSE OR JUST GO AWAY B/C OF DEA PAIN MED RESTRICTIONS HER LAWYERS ARE TELLING HER ABOUT?
Trust me friends, I will NOT be signing it....unless she says her practice will pay for the tests, the commitment, the lawsuit I will file for lack of care and failure to stand by the oath she took to do no harm.
No, she's decided I am a liability.....forget harm, she doesn't want trouble.
Woe is us babies....woe is us. And America just keeps letting it happen.
Can you tell I'm mad and I'm sad? I am sick, but I am not stupid and refuse this...which means, I know, I will be in MORE pain every day or give into a system that treats me like an abuser or a criminal. Sigh.................
Oh and please, don't say doc is required to adhere to....if that's so, we are in WW2 Germany and it won't be long until....
Giving up. So mad/so sad/so ready to give it up. But I'll go with my dignity intact. G-Damn them.
[ 03-09-2013, 07:28 PM: Message edited by: healthywealthywise ]
Posts: 867 | From PA | Registered: Jan 2006
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posted
Sorry if I sound angry, but I still am...and so let down.
No wonder people go underground........lyme is the killer of souls nobody speaks of. I should know this by now.
I actually thought when "UNDER OUR SKIN" came out, people would know. Guess what? Nobody but us even saw it.
Says a lot. We are alone and lost.
I just pray some of us make it through but wow, my anger at all of this totally taxed me. so, no more comments, treatment etc for me.
Just going to lay in bed like I do every day and get through another 24/7.
Good luck to all of you.
Posts: 867 | From PA | Registered: Jan 2006
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Keebler
Honored Contributor (25K+ posts)
Member # 12673
posted
- [thought that when] ""UNDER OUR SKIN" came out, people would know. Guess what? Nobody but us even saw it." (end quote)
That is because PBS local affiliates folded to local and regional IDSA pressure (and funding from medical centers and doctors). -
Posts: 48021 | From Tree House | Registered: Jul 2007
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Keebler
Honored Contributor (25K+ posts)
Member # 12673
posted
- Now, to the matter at hand. Under no circumstances would I sign that - or return to this doctor.
I know you are in pain and I wish I could make that better. However, IMO, you simply cannot afford to be registered in this "system" that could probably "mark" you in some way with computerized speed.
Yes, indeed, I think this is illegal in so many ways but my energy does not allow me to expand.
Probably her malpractice insurance and the state medical board are requring this of all patients on pain meds, my guess is that you are not the only one being required if you want the medicine.
My guess is that the law does not afford a person medical treatment - it's not in the constitution in anyway I can figure. So, no civil rights are likely being denied.
If this is the best plan she has to relieve pain, I'd not be hiring her again. She's not helping and I am astounded at her offer.
However, someone from another state just posted of a similar ocurrance so I wonder if this is the medical establishment's doing and not hers alone. Regardless, I would run and
see about a better plan to address the cause with a LLMD &/or LL ND and complementary methods.
You say that "none of the treatments (for lyme) have helped"
Find a better doctor. Get a rife. There are better doctors and other ways to approach this. TF posted that when she finally got a good LLMD, in just one year, she was into remission.
(edit jump here, sorry)
I jump right to that as, really, after seeing a lecture on Book-TV last week about how drug trials are done, I would never take anything that is not absolutely required to stop infection or save my life.
We don't have all the detail about what many Rx can do to us. Neither do the doctors - and some detail is hidden on purpose. It's shocking.
That said, I know that sometimes, a heavy hitter drug that can block pain signals is needed as the cause can just take so long to get under control.
Too tired to intelligently wrap this but but, just, Oy, Vey! and a big sigh. -
Posts: 48021 | From Tree House | Registered: Jul 2007
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Keebler
Honored Contributor (25K+ posts)
Member # 12673
posted
- Even though lyme can cause so much pain, some of that is because the liver can be so damaged by lyme and the stress of treatment. Liver support can help ease pain.
A gluten-free & dairy-free diet also really help reduce pain for me, to a reasonable degree.
Lately, though BERBERINE has been my best pain reducer. It's really helped. When I'm off of it, pain is nearly a ten. Back on after a few days, back to a 3 or so.
posted
Yes, this is now the "norm" in the medical community now. Most of the drs are writing similar contracts. I've had to sign one, not for pain medication, but for treatments (this well before we started treating for lyme). It's going to get worse with ObamaCare also!
The drs are protecting themselves, and you are agreeing to follow their directions. You probably wouldn't be called into the office to be drug tested, it would be done during a scheduled visit - and this would usually apply to people that abuse pain meds - believe me, there are alot of them out there. If you don't follow the drs advice/prescription you are harming yourself and by signing releiving the dr of responsibility.
Again, Most drs are doing this now days. It is for their safety due to so many drug abusers, especially the ones that dr hop.
Posts: 250 | From East Coast | Registered: Jan 2013
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poppy
Frequent Contributor (1K+ posts)
Member # 5355
posted
If this is a doc who treats lyme, it would not be surprising that protection for the doc was wanted. What is surprising is that a lyme doc would even consider pain meds, wouldn't send you to a pain doc instead for that part of treatment.
It is just very risky for any doctor to treat pain these days, and lyme docs do not need any additional risk.
Too many addicts and pill mills out there for the drug enforcers to deal with, so they clamp down on everyone who treats pain, legit or not. What that means is that it is hard to get treated for major pain issues.
Posts: 2888 | From USA | Registered: Mar 2004
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lax mom
Frequent Contributor (1K+ posts)
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posted
What on Earth??? Is she trying to be your medical guardian?
"I have to be prepared for random drug tests, psychological or psychiatric treatment or in-patient rehab if she so deems it necessary -- and I lose all rights to fight it."
Ok, so I get the need to be prepared for random drug tests, but the rest is a bit much. I would never sign that.
posted
I wouldn't sign it - you could be abused by it -
I also was very careful with pain med through the years - it was for me, never overdid it, never sold it -
Even though I don't like the idea of signing anything re medical rights, I could have lived with signing just re the meds - take as directed, don't overdo, don't sell.
The abuse could come with the psychological part - here we are, in pain, and we're being abused by being considered psychological cases? I told any psychologist I saw that I was physically hurting. They could turn your pain into something psychological, when it's got a physical cause.
When I found out what was actually wrong, ie, Lyme disease, I went back and had all my medical records updated, including psychological ones, to include the new report about the infection.
If such is the case, I think a CLASS ACTION lawsuit ought to be started on this - it's wrong to judge people who are in physical pain as being psych cases.
I suggest you start researching the organizations near you who take civil rights cases. You can call the state bar association, you could call local law schools, to get started on the search. And keep us posted.
Posts: 13116 | From San Francisco | Registered: May 2006
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glm1111
Frequent Contributor (5K+ posts)
Member # 16556
posted
She should have referred you to a pain clinic/doctor. This is what my PCP did and what is standard practice now.
BTW, If you have not considered treating parasites it might be a good idea to look into that option.
Parasites/worms are now considered the number one co-infection of Lyme by ILADS. Parasites cause excrucuating pain. Google parasite symptoms and see if you can relate.
Gael
-------------------- PARASITES/WORMS ARE NOW RECOGNIZED AS THE NUMBER 1 CO-INFECTION IN LYME DISEASE BY ILADS* Posts: 6418 | From philadelphia pa | Registered: Jul 2008
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poppy
Frequent Contributor (1K+ posts)
Member # 5355
posted
I don't think legal action is what is appropriate here. This is going to get you branded, and you may not get pain treatment anywhere after this.
What you were given sounds like boilerplate language, probably suggested to medical people by a lawyer for their protection.
You really need to put this into a bigger picture, of what is happening with pain treatment in this country.
Posts: 2888 | From USA | Registered: Mar 2004
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surprise
Frequent Contributor (1K+ posts)
Member # 34987
posted
My thoughts when I read your post is that it is related to the drug itself: Oxy.
Some kind of crackdown on any Dr. that is going to be prescribing it.
Awful. I'm so sorry you are having this layer of stress on top of everything else.
-------------------- Lyme positive PCR blood, and positive Bartonella henselae Igenex, 2011. low positive Fry biofilm test, 2012. Update 7/16- After extensive treatments, doing okay! Posts: 2518 | From USA | Registered: Nov 2011
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Rumigirl
Frequent Contributor (1K+ posts)
Member # 15091
posted
As others have said, it sounds like you do NOT have a Lyme dr, just a dr who doesn't know that much about Lyme, and was treating you. (Forgive me, if I'm wrong, but it certainly sounds that way).
You need the best Lyme dr that you can see.
And, it sounds like you need to find out if a Pain Management dr would have you sign the same thing---I don't think so. But with the new federal crack-down on hydrocodone, maybe everyone is. Sad.
Find a dr who doesn't have such a horrible contract to help you with pain meds.
But you need really good treatment, so, hopefully, you won't always need the strong pain meds.
And most importantly, PLEASE, get help every which way, so you don't end up doing the permanent solution to a "temporary" problem. I realize it isn't very temporary, but you know what I mean. There is a Suicide Hotline number at the top of the Medical Questions section.
I don't know if you were serious about that, and many of us have been there lots with that feeling/wish, but acting on it is a terrible choice, tempting as it is sometimes.
Posts: 3771 | From around | Registered: Mar 2008
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posted
Thanks for your feedback folks. I will look into the Berberine and links supplied.
And don't worry, I will find a new doc and WILL NOT be signing the form. Just doesn't fit in my wheelhouse as an American Citizen.
Never considering the Permanent Solution. Against my faith and could never hurt my family in that way. When I said ready to give it up, I meant the pain med and the doc!! Not my life or personal freedoms.
Just be aware to all of our members that this is happening - where medical + lawyers = the new patient experience.
It's not just this doc.....I went to see on other pain forums and people are crying out about it elsewhere too.
Maybe I'll insist she sign something I draft up holding her fully responsible for rx'ing it in the first place and for a lack of a real treatment plan and failure as a physician? ;-)
Yeah, I still have some spice and vinegar left in this old carcass. :-)
Posts: 867 | From PA | Registered: Jan 2006
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posted
Keebler, may I ask how much berberine you take? Can you recommend a brand as well? Of course, I'd like to take the purest one out there and it seems you've done your research.
Oh and on the subject of Pain Contracts, if anyone cares, here is an article stating they are NOT LEGALLY BIINDING.
BUT, not signing it could lead to doc putting it on record so that next doc would automatically assume I was guilty of something.
Damned if I do, damned if I don't.
My plan is to go in on Tuesday and if they ask for the signed form, just tell them I'm having my lawyer review it first...just as I do with any contracts! ;-)
Never mind w/berberine info....I found your post from earlier. Thanks anyway!
Posts: 867 | From PA | Registered: Jan 2006
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sammy
Frequent Contributor (5K+ posts)
Member # 13952
posted
These kinds of contracts are very common with doctors who prescribe pain medicines.
Most of it is an agreement that you will follow the rules and take the medicine as prescribed.
If the doctor feels that there may have been a breach in contract, they could have you get a random drug test or even discharge you as a patient.
They may refer you to psych if they feel that is impacting your pain.
The thing with these contracts is that they end/ restart when you transfer to another doctor.
I was pretty freaked out when I read my first contract but the nurse was nice enough to sit down and explain how it really worked for that office.
I was worried, what if I got hurt and ended up in the ER where they gave me pain meds? This would not be by choice but I was scared that something like this might get me kicked out. The nurse assured me no, that all I had to do was call if I ended up in hospital and was given other pain meds.
So all that talking for me to tell you that you will probably run into these contracts everywhere, even your PCPs office if they prescribe pain meds. Just ask to talk with someone there that can help you understand it better and feel more comfortable before signing.
Posts: 5237 | From here | Registered: Nov 2007
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randibear
Honored Contributor (10K+ posts)
Member # 11290
posted
i would never, ever sign this. it gives the physician the right to even commit you if they feel it's necessary.
a long time ago a doctor wanted me to sign something like that. he got furious when i wouldn't and i left.
later i learned he went out of practice.
the medical profession is getting out of hand. protect your privacy at all costs.
-------------------- do not look back when the only course is forward Posts: 12262 | From texas | Registered: Mar 2007
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poppy
Frequent Contributor (1K+ posts)
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posted
So if these contracts are common and you refuse to sign, then you may not get pain meds. Be prepared for the consequences.
Posts: 2888 | From USA | Registered: Mar 2004
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posted
I just did a quick Internet search and found two doctors' sites with lengthy agreements similar to the one you mention.
I had to sign a similar form five years ago when I was getting pain meds and epidurals for my back. Knew the doc, and he said he was required to do it by the groups he had affiliations with due to length, type, and strength of the meds he could prescribe.
Oh, I also just found one that would really get most of us nervous. It stated that you knew that medical malpractice suits and frivolous lawsuits drive up costs, so you signed agreeing not to bring a case against that doctor. Hmmm. Wonder if that is a thriving medical practice?
-------------------- 'Hope' is a thing with feathers, that perches in the soul-- Emily Dickinson Posts: 160 | From Indiana | Registered: Nov 2012
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Carol in PA
Frequent Contributor (5K+ posts)
Member # 5338
posted
I was able to reduce alot of pain and constant severe headache with supplements that reduce inflammation: Systemic enzymes, Magnesium, Fish oil with high EPA.
Systemic enzymes and fish oil also reduce fibrin and help the blood to flow easier, improving the oxygen and nutrients to all the cells of the body. When your cells are "happy," you have less pain.
LED light therapy provides more energy to the ATP in the mitochondria in the cells, so that they work better as the powerhouses of the cells. Injuries to the cells heal many times faster than usual when you treat with LED's with specific wavelengths.
You can buy a home model for LED light therapy, such as the SOTA LightWorks which uses LED lights with wavelengths of 660 and 880. http://www.sota.com/lightworks.html Reduce the price to $292 by googling for a 10% discount code.
Pulsed electromagnetic fields improve the function of the cells by inducing electrical changes around and within the cell. Minerals necessary for enzyme processes pass through cell walls, oxygen and nutrients go in, waste products go out.
I found that the Mag Pulser worked more quickly to reduce pain in body and joints than the LightWorks. There is a video on YouTube that shows the unit in action.
[ 03-19-2013, 11:12 PM: Message edited by: Carol in PA ]
Posts: 6947 | From Lancaster, PA | Registered: Feb 2004
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posted
Limeaid, I think it's one thing for medical offices to want to regulate pain med substances, and another thing to say pain patients are psychological cases.
That's wrong. We hurt, from a real physical entity. That's what made me angriest, during my many years undiagnosed, how many wanted to discount the real pain I was in.
That's why I say people should not sign, since the second part of it is abusive to us.
What would be your opinion on the psych part of this?
Posts: 13116 | From San Francisco | Registered: May 2006
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posted
Thx, Limeaid - looks like you understand the complications.
I could see signing a pain med contract, but not one that consigns us to mental care, because we are dealing with physical pain.
It was so easy for people to suggest to me during the undiagnosed years that I must then be dealing with a mental creation. I knew I wasn't, but I had no explanation for them,
so off I would go to the psychologists and tell them I was physically hurting. It didn't matter how many life issues we looked at, it didn't change the pain level.
That's why I think that if this stands as is, people will be abused. My opinion is that a class action lawsuit is needed to stop the psychologizing of people who are hurting physically from a physical entity.
................................................
Second, this is my opinion about pain meds: since it's easy to develop tolerance to them, I think it's best to rotate them so as not to develop tolerance to any too quickly,
and that if tolerance occurs and people have to start taking high doses to cover pain, then to drop that med out for awhile until people can start it at a lower dose.
To me, it's a no-brainer to do it this way, and the best way to do it, and I'm really sorry there's any fuss at all about prescribing pain meds, because there shouldn't be, if people need them.
As a nurse (or if anyone knows?), do you know why they're being so hard on the use of narcotics? What's the big deal? To me, it's another tool in the management of pain, and a necessary one, for sanity, for sleeping, etc.
Posts: 13116 | From San Francisco | Registered: May 2006
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posted
To me, this is similar to anytime disabled people are made to pay the price for what others are doing.
Just because others are dying from overdose or misuse doesn't mean that we would do the same or that we don't have need.
People in pain have need for pain med and should not be denied it.
It is our responsibility to be responsible with pain med and to work carefully with doctors prescribing it. I and others I know have been very careful with usage.
Posts: 13116 | From San Francisco | Registered: May 2006
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randibear
Honored Contributor (10K+ posts)
Member # 11290
posted
the one i wouldn't sign actually said that the doctor could have me committed for observation and treatment if HE felt i was a threat to family or community.
now that's invasive and no way in heck would i ever ever sign my life over to somebody else.
-------------------- do not look back when the only course is forward Posts: 12262 | From texas | Registered: Mar 2007
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poppy
Frequent Contributor (1K+ posts)
Member # 5355
posted
Here is the national context for this issue:
lax mom
Frequent Contributor (1K+ posts)
Member # 38743
posted
I can't believe how patients are being treated like drug addicts now.
My husband and I moved a year ago. We are having the worst time finding a PCP for him because all the Drs freak out and refuse to accept him as a pt because he's on AMBIEN!
Not pain killers, just ambien.
These Drs put you on the meds and the treat you like an addict when you need to continue them.
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