quote:

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Originally posted by James1979:
1) If someone bought the device, would they be able to do the complete therapy at home, or do they need the initial starting treatment by a special doctor?

2) Did you happen to see Dr I. W.?

3) Did you see your blood change colors after the ozone treatment?

Thanks!

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James,

1. You could do it all from home. You'd have to get the machine and the borrelia nosodes and have an excellent detox plan, but it certainly would be possible to do it on your own. If you ever get to that point, I'm happy to share the protocol with you so you know exactly what to do.

2. Yup.

3. My blood may have changed colors slightly (it went from normal dark red to a lighter color like a strawberry shake).

But another American was there getting treatment who had major mold issues along with lyme and co's and she had huge changes.

Her blood was black and thicker than mud the first time she got ozone. It was so hard to pull, the machine shook and shook.

By her third treatment, it was flowing like normal and a pretty dark red color.

When she started therapy, she was barely able to walk on her own, focus, even speaking was hard. After the 5th treatment, she walked around town with us, went out for dessert and we had a grand old time. It was amazing! It literally saved her life.
 

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Posted by baileypup (Member # 22824) on :
 
Wow, unbelievable results! So glad you're back, and so happy it went so well.

Can I ask how much it costs to buy the Bionic 880, and where can they be purchased?
 

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Posted by 17hens (Member # 23747) on :
 
They are purchased in Germany and cost 6400 Euros.

[ 01-10-2012, 05:59 PM: Message edited by: 17hens ]
 

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Posted by Maradona (Member # 24552) on :
 
Hope you and your family get cured with this treatment.
How much is the treatment in Eu. or $.
And can you use bionic on children to .
Take care .
 

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Posted by TF (Member # 14183) on :
 
One Euro equals approx 1.4 American dollars.
 

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Posted by 17hens (Member # 23747) on :
 
Yes, you can use the Bionic on children. The machine has 4 strengths - 25%, 50%, 75%, and 100%.

A small child or animal takes 25%.

Dr. W's treatment varies depending on what the patient needs (we're all different), but it cost me about $3500. Slightly more than the cost of some LLMD's first visit.

At first it sounded like a lot. But then I remembered what my family of 4 spent in a year - about $12000. This seemed very reasonable in that light.

Also, there are other doctors in Germany who treat lyme with the Bionic. Very good ones too. I think Dr. W.'s name is known because that's where the first Amerians happened to go and the rest followed.

You can read in Connie Strasheim's book of Dr. W. and another, a woman who sounds excellent. But there is a list with many more names of doctors who treat with the Bionic as well.

The two in Connie's book and the owner of the Bionic spent 8 years creating a protocol to treat lyme disease with the machine. 8 years of experience is worth a lot. And the success rate is over 90%.
 

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Posted by Hambone (Member # 29535) on :
 
This made me cry...seriously.


It made me cry because I'm so happy if is helping you get your life back and you can use it to help your family. Hallelujah!


Then it made me cry because I want it and I'm am way too sick to go to Germany. Boo


I think I will talk to my hubby about investing in one. I need to try something or I will die.


Do you think it would help someone like me who is so far down in the depths? Or just people who can function and just need that extra something to get them over the hump?


How does this compare to Rife?


Thanks for sharing this!!! Much appreciated.
 

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Posted by sixgoofykids (Member # 11141) on :
 
Hambone, rife kills bacteria, photons make your body stronger so it can kill the bacteria (basically).

I didn't have the benefit of ozone treatment when I went. Back when I went, he didn't use it on everyone. I wish he had. I still had LOTS of detox to do when I got back.

The benefits of going to Germany is that you do get the ozone. Also, two of the nosodes he uses there are stronger than you're allowed to use here, in fact, he can't allow those two out of his office even in Germany. So, I would go to Germany if you can. If you can't, I think you can do it here, but it might take longer for the above reasons.

You can't buy a Bionic here, but a PE1 is the same type technology.
 

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Posted by 17hens (Member # 23747) on :
 
First of all, Six, please let me know if I'm posting info that I should be PMing. I'm excited and I want to be honest with people but I want to follow the rules too. Please feel free to edit and correct me so I know for the next time.

Hambone, that was my reaction when I first heard about it. Hugs to you and I'm so sorry for your suffering. For all of our sufferings.

I dont' claim this to be the magic bullet for everyone. I would say this is very strong stuff and you need to be prepared for it. Anyone who starts this on their own needs to have excellent detox support planned out.

Hambone, I don't believe you could be much farther down than the lady who was in Germany with me. It saved her life.

I do believe the bionic and the ozone therapy was crucial for her, but now she's back at home, starting to treat co's with the PE-1 and getting detox from her LLMD. Hopefully that will work for her. I don't know if the PE-1 regulates hormones like the Bionic does. I think that's half the battle.

I don't know much about Rife. Maybe someone else can answer that.

Feel free to PM me, Hambone. Do you live near me at all?
 

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Posted by Haley (Member # 22008) on :
 
So Happy for you! This probably has been posted before, but how much did it cost to do the treatment in Germany (not buying the machine).

I have been wanting to go to Germany for a long time this may be a good excuse to finally go.
 

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Posted by sixgoofykids (Member # 11141) on :
 

quote:

---

Originally posted by 17hens:


Hambone, I don't believe you could be much farther down than the lady who was in Germany with me. It saved her life.

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by 17hens:
Dr. W's treatment varies depending on what the patient needs (we're all different), but it cost me about $3500. Slightly more than the cost of some LLMD's first visit.

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by 17hens:
Hambone, to answer briefly, yes. Maybe someone with a PE-1 could speak up here and offer input?

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quote:

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Originally posted by James1979:

May God bless you abundantly. It is very evident from your writings that you have a good heart which is overflowing with love.

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quote:

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Originally posted by 17hens:
Hambone, the link I have is http://www.photonicenergetics.com/ which I think is directly to the manufacturer (see the bottom of the page)
but yes, it's the same device.

---

Thanks

( You shined a little bit of light on my crappy week. Even if this doesn't pan out for me, I'm so glad it is helping others. )
 

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Posted by Lymetoo (Member # 743) on :
 
This is SOOO wonderful, 17hens!! (minus a few hens)

I hope your healing continues!! and welcome, Got'emall!!
 

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Posted by 17hens (Member # 23747) on :
 
Thank you, my one and only Tutu friend! Hugs to you!

And whatchutalkinbout "minus a few hens?"

Actually this week a hawk is stalking the few I have left. We have very fat hawks around here.
 

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Posted by MichaelTampa (Member # 24868) on :
 
I am considering this for my wife. But I am a big believer in treating the worms/parasites first or at least concurrently. Could anyone talk about how this Germany doc or other similar Bionic-Germany doc deal with parasites/worms. Do they ignore them? Do they treat them, if so what timing and how?
 

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Posted by sixgoofykids (Member # 11141) on :
 

quote:

---

Originally posted by James1979:
Is it difficult to navigate Germany if someone only speaks English?

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quote:

---

Originally posted by 17hens:

Anyone who goes over should take a friend along. You'll need to either drive there or take the bus (45 minutes between guesthaus and dr's office), get groceries, cook, etc. Someone to help is a must.

---

This would be nice. I went with two other Lyme patients. We rented a car together, went to the grocery and doctor together, and did a little siteseeing together.
 

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Posted by Got'emall (Member # 22225) on :
 
Hey Hens!! I think you are ABSOLUTELY right about the environment. When I was talking to my LLMD, he said he may just refer his patients who are not as sick as I was to go stay with Karin when he suspects mold is masking the true illnesses.

Hambone: When I left here, I could barely hold my head up off the pillow. I was told by my LLMD because of the mold toxicity that I had approximately 6-8 wks to live if I didn't get out of the U.S. for treatment. That was four weeks before I left. That being said, the best quote to describe my going to Germany by myself came from a really good friend of mine -- friends since age 12: "She's crazy with a tailwind of brave." LOL

I was fortunate that 17Hens got there shortly after I did. She helped UNBELIEVABLY with translation issues! Of course, we did get a good chuckle when my "sign language" (and not the offensive type) worked really well!!!!

In retrospect, I had NO BUSINESS going there by myself. The airlines were wonderfully accommodating to my disabilities, but at the train station? You're on your own. Trying just to get from the platform to the central portion of the station to meet my ride was almost impossible.

Personally -- and not just because I want 17Hens to get to go to Germany again (!), I would recommend taking her as your traveling companion. She helped me through a pretty nasty seizure one night after treatment. I didn't know it until I woke up -- then I thought I was at the doctor's office because I knew she had an appointment that day -- but she was a LOT of help.

I can't stress enough getting the treatment you need --- whatever that is. I went from being fully wheelchair-bound pre-diagnosis (misdiagnosed for six years while spiraling downward) to partially wheelchair-bound to walking 3 kilometers when I was in Germany.

It is NOT the gait I used to have. It never will be. I have too much permanent neurological damage. I'm a Physical Therapist and I could tell you every MINUTE detail of the differences!!! It is independent walking, though, and it feels GOOD.

I can now play with my almost three year-old granddaughter -- really PLAY -- and we dance together! She is still a little confused that Grammy went away very, very sick and came back able to dance. That one has her perplexed.


I purchased my PE-1 through the folks at Lymehub.com. I thought -- and still think -- they are lovely people. Additionally, I received information from Photoenergetics as well as supportive sites, etc. from them, as well. For my situation, it was the PERFECT purchasing solution. Additionally, I was able to get my PE-1 somewhat quicker through the effort from the folks at Lymehub.

Whatever you choose, I wish you the best. These diseases are NOT for the faint of heart. It took my family a very long time to fully understand how sick I was. They are just now coming to the realization that my life really WAS about to come to a grinding halt. Not that I was doing much "living" for a couple of years, anyway.

Please take care of you.
 

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Posted by 17hens (Member # 23747) on :
 
Gael, I was afraid you were going to say that.

I just started my first Bionic treatment for coinfections yesterday, which will last 3 weeks. As far as I know, I can't treat for parasites during this time.

Is there any other way to get rid of the big red itchy hurty bumps? Please say yes.

Maybe I could make a special facial epsom salt bath and soak my head for 20 minutes at a time?

I'm kinda kidding, kinda not!


Six,

I changed my post to read "Someone to help is a must IMO." Obviously one can do it alone. You did and so did others.

Another thing to consider when making this decision is the landlady of the apartment where we stay.

She is a wonderful woman who gives of herself, too much sometimes. She could easily end up with too much responsibility (and liability) with patients who travel alone.

While I was there, I saw her making dinner for a patient/guest, driving them around when needed, taking them to doctor's appointments when they were too sick to drive, almost admitting one to the hospital then staying up all night with worry that he was alright alone in his room.

Taking someone along would be the best for everyone. Of course, it's not always possible.
 

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Posted by sixgoofykids (Member # 11141) on :
 
You're right, 17 Hens, I didn't mean for it to sound like I was disagreeing .... I think it was easier for us because there were three of us, so none of us were really alone. Fortunately, we weren't all doing badly at the same time. We all helped each other.

Red forehead bumps can also be caused by not enough vitamin B. Even my healthy kids get that and supplementing makes it go away.
 

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Posted by sparkle7 (Member # 10397) on :
 
Great news 17hens!

Brussels - who used to post here, has a message board on Yahoo, I think. I don't have the address. She has alot of experience for people who want to use the PE-1.

I think you could even get by with the LightWorks with this sort of treatment. You have to be the kind of person who likes to experiment on yourself, though.

I would definitely do a parasite cleanse first.

Ozone can also be used for mold remediation in the home.
 

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Posted by James1979 (Member # 31926) on :
 
So it looks like all we would need is the PE-1 and the nosodes? That sounds pretty easy.

It's hard for us Westerners to comprehend how LED lights and a bottle of liquid can help us cure a serious illness. I'm very curious about this.

17hens - your mailbox is full!
 

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Posted by sixgoofykids (Member # 11141) on :
 

quote:

---

Originally posted by James1979:


It's hard for us Westerners to comprehend how LED lights and a bottle of liquid can help us cure a serious illness. I'm very curious about this.

---

Yep. True. But it works well against the bacterial aspect of the illness.
 

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Posted by glm1111 (Member # 16556) on :
 
hens,

Try the B vitamins like six suggested, and also the epsom salt soaks are not a bad idea.

There is also an enzyme spray that you can find under nutrional support at the Lymebusters forum.

This is probably gonna sound crazy, but i have been doing it for several yrs and it helps with the itchies and pain.

READY? Put some Kefir or yogurt in a small bowl (you can add extra probiotics) add some milk (the lactic acid in the milk helps calm things down) and refigerate.

Slap some of the poultice (well I don't really mean slap)on you scalp, cover with paper towels and baseball cap.

It has been an enormous help to me. Takes my headache away also. You can also dab some on your spots on your face.

The other thing you can try is Super Lysine Plus ointment. It does have natural abxs, so don't know if you can use them with your bionic. Hope something can work for you,

Gael
 

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Posted by James1979 (Member # 31926) on :
 
Another remedy for skin problems is "super oxicell" by Apex. It's also a great way to increase your glutathione levels (glutathione is best absorbed through the skin or IV, since it is not absorbed through digestion), which is a big benefit for Lyme & Co.

I use that simply to increase my glutathione, even though I don't have skin problems.
 

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Posted by 17hens (Member # 23747) on :
 
Does anyone know if the PE-1 regulates hormones?

Thanks for all the bugtbegone helpers! I'll start trying them.

Six, do you see any of these suggestions that I couldn't try while in treatment?
 

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Posted by sixgoofykids (Member # 11141) on :
 
17 Hens, in general you're not supposed to use killing herbs while using the photons. I don't know if it's different using anti-parasiticals or not since they're going after different organisms.

I found the key for me was to keep it simple. I did add a lot of detox in. And I do think parasite treatment is necessary. It's also tempting to add more in during the breaks, but the breaks also need to be breaks.

The PE1 has the same hz light, 880 nm. It has different frequencies though. I imagine it does basically the same thing.
 

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Posted by 17hens (Member # 23747) on :
 
Thanks, Six. I was told by Dr. W.'s office to stop the Parastroy when I left home, so a few days before treatment, and I haven't been back on it since.

I am doing my best to "keep it simple." I think that has been the best advice I've ever gotten regarding Bionic treatment and I much appreciate your kind reminders. I need to be reminded for sure!

Of course, preparing my family for Bionic treatment and actually starting them on it, plus whole house mold remediation has left little time to "make things complicated."

Still, I'd love to find a way to get rid of these ugly hurty bumps. I'll start with B vits and some epsom salt facial baths. Maybe that will be enough.
 

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Posted by sparkle7 (Member # 10397) on :
 
Here's Brussels' (Selma's) message board - http://health.groups.yahoo.com/group/bionic880-PE1/

She lives in a country that can't post on Lymenet for some reason.
 

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Posted by sparkle7 (Member # 10397) on :
 
This might be helpful, too -

http://www.lumenergetics.com/Lumenergetics.com/Lumenergetics_home_page.html
 

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Posted by sparkle7 (Member # 10397) on :
 
Also - re: Does anyone know if the PE-1 regulates hormones?

What exactly does the Bionic 880 do to regulate hormones? If it has to do with exposure to infrared light - you would probably get that from the PE-1 or the LightWorks, as well.

You may get that from going out into the sun, too...?

The LightWorks is about half as strong as the Bionic - if I recall correctly. So, you need to use it twice as long. I think the PE-1 is about equal to the Bionic 880.

I may be mistaken - it's been a while since I studied all of this.
 

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Posted by Hambone (Member # 29535) on :
 
Can someone explain to me what nosodes are and how you would use them with the PE-1?

What is the purpose of nosodes?


I got the go-ahead from hubby to buy one, but am doing a lot of reading and more learning first.
 

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Posted by Got'emall (Member # 22225) on :
 
Six is the expert with regard to explaining how the nosodes work. Seriously.

I am using them exactly with the PE-1 as I did with the Bionic. I am simply taping them to my solar plexus during the treatment session.

I HAVE reduced the intensity and the time that I am using the PE-1 vs. the bionic. The reason? After speaking with the folks at PhotoEnergetics, they said that they have documented several studies that show that the PE-1 is 4x more powerful than the bionic. For that reason, I am starting out LOW and SLOW!! I do NOT want a herx rxn like I had in Germany.

With regard to the facial issues, do you know of any other type of poultice to use? Unfortunately, when I put anything on my face that has lactic acid, I have a remarkably bad reaction! Red, "swollen" skin -- as if I had one HUGE hive!! Same if I use any egg poultice. I am not allergic to milk nor eggs -- just soy. I am not lactose intolerant. I simply have a really bad reaction to placing these things on my skin.

Six -- I was surprised that my LLMD wanted me using A-BABS, A-BART and A-L Complex while I was using photon treatment. He said that because I was having such "neurological backsliding" he wanted me to use those in addition. He said that he DID NOT want me on any antibiotics at this point. I liked that!!

With regard to the woman who owns the Gastehaus: Yes, she does sometimes take on far too much. She drove me to my physician's appointments and picked me up, as well. I knew in advance, however, that I would be paying for these. It is a service she offers for guests who she knows cannot take the bus, but she also lets you know in advance the charge to do this. I opted to pay the additional cost because it was more than worth it to me.

The one individual that she drove, she did not charge -- and I told her that I thought she should mention that to them. I went with her to that appointment, because I knew she was going to have to stay for quite some time. It was then that Dr. W. told her that she was going to have to transport him to the hospital -- that he was going to need surgery. Ultimately, however, this person did not -- but the owner of the Gastehaus spent a good three hours at the doctor's office. Well, actually, we also went to the grocery while the person was receiving infusions!

With regard to cooking, she did give me something to eat two times, and did it out of the goodness of her heart. Once was after I had a Grand Mal (actually tonic / clonic) seizure, and once because she wanted me to taste what REAL German food tasted like!

By and large, I cooked for myself. If you are unable to cook for yourself, unable to bathe yourself or even wash your own clothing, you need to be in a hospital setting, or you need to bring either a caretaker or a nurse with you.

I went to Germany with the attitude that I was going to regain my LIFE. While I knew that I was significantly debilitated, I was DETERMINED that I was going to be independent. It was a goal that was realistic, attainable and had potential for immediate results. When I was told that an apartment wasn't available until after the first three days I was in Germany, I told the woman who runs the Gastehaus that it was a perfect situation: I planned on sleeping, regaining my strength and getting my body prepared to fight like a tiger during those days! That is EXACTLY what I did.

Even BEFORE the treatment, I rode with this absolute ANGEL sent to anyone who goes there to the grocery, did my shopping, and put my groceries away, etc.

After I started my treatments, I had a full daily "regimen". I got up, started my strong coffee (as per Dr. W instructions), ran my bath (usually detox) and prepared for my day. If I didn't have an MD appointment, I cleaned my apartment, dug in the dirt, walked -- anything to increase my physical abilities and independence.

None of these things were easy given my disabilities. My LLMD here says that the only reason I am alive is because of my attitude. I think I inherited that from my grandmother who, at 101 years of age was still going strong.

If you are not willing or able to do things independently -- if you are going to need help -- it is only right that you have someone come with you. One particular person really relied on 17Hens and her traveling companion to take care of them. After they left, this person had someone come with them to drive them, etc. The option was given, however, to be driven to and from their appointments by the owner of the Gastehaus. It is, of course, an additional charge -- and well should be.

The landlady of the Gastehaus is more than generous when it comes to letting you ride with her if she is going somewhere. I was fortunate that she would ask me if I needed to go to the grocery when she was going and things of that nature. I tried NOT to take advantage of her generosity, however, and if I didn't need anything, I simply thanked her for the offer but said, "Alles klar"!! I will say, too, that because I spent the amount of time that I did there, she and I definitely developed a friendship. We have been in contact at least twice weekly since I have returned home. I want to go back to Germany just to see HER!!

Hambone: I have the CD that PhotoEnergetics sent me . . . I can copy it and send it to you if you would like. Just send me a PM.

I suppose that's all for tonight! LOL!!
 

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Posted by beths (Member # 18864) on :
 
17hens-

Your mailbox is full. Can you PM me the contact info I need for Dr W, and any other info I need?

I have a friend who speaks German, so they can translate for me-

Thinking seriously about it at this point.

Thanks
 

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Posted by sixgoofykids (Member # 11141) on :
 
Think of it this way, the light strengthens your body, and the nosodes make the bacteria visible to the immune system. In our bodies, as we know, the bacteria hides. So when you use the nosodes, taped on your solar plexus, in your energy field. your immune system recognizes that it's there. Remember, it's an energy treatment, so the energy being in your energy field and not in your body is enough.

Got'em, that's great that he doens't think you need abx!!! YAY!! Based on my experience (I tried herbals when I got back), I would hesistate to use the herbals with the Bionic. The Lyme is the most insidious infection. Once it's gone the other infections don't have nearly the hold they once did. You have to trust the photons to do their job like they did before. Just my opinion based on my experience (basically, when I added herbs, I REALLY backslid).

Your neuro symptoms came back, yes, but you were three weeks without treatment. If they went away before they'll go away again, especially when you're strong enough to use blood.

The benefit of using blood (this is for everyone not just got'em) is that you don't have to know what infections you have. The blood mops up all of them.

The landlady is wonderful. She was making dinner one night when steelbone and I stopped in to say hi. She INSISTED that we try what she was making. I sure hope there was still enough food for their dinner. It was wonderful .... not a full meal, but a nice size sample. Steelbone and I ate out every night. He wasn't going to cook and I wasn't up to it at the beginning. Later, well, it was nice eating out every day ..... and that way we got German food.
 

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Posted by Got'emall (Member # 22225) on :
 
Beths -- your mailbox is full -- can't respond!! LOL
 

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Posted by Got'emall (Member # 22225) on :
 
Hi Six!! Thanks for the heads up about the herbs . . . I DO NOT want to backslide any more than I have! I've ordered the herbal formulas, but my photon treatment is ordered for four weeks right now with the Meyer's Cocktail following and Methylcobalamin injections IM 4x/week.


LOVE that type of B12. I also love the cocktails -- I have malabsorption syndrome, so I feel like a new person (literally) when I'm infused. Ahhhhhh . . . .

Going to hold off on the herbs, I think. The last thing I need is a herx rxn. Ick.

Did you know that you can order a Klinghardt Nosode directly from them without a script? Found that out from TrueSun.com -- where I ordered the PE-1. (Just a little FYI)

Going to finish my "strong cup of coffee" (minus the Bio honey that I REALLY miss -- just the regular stuff here) and get MOVING!! I have muscles that have atrophied for YEARS.

Take care you guys!!
 

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Posted by 17hens (Member # 23747) on :
 
OK, mailbox cleaned up a bit.

beths, will PM you his contact info.
 

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Posted by 17hens (Member # 23747) on :
 
beths, your mailbox is full.
 

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Posted by Hambone (Member # 29535) on :
 

quote:

---

Originally posted by sixgoofykids:
The benefit of using blood (this is for everyone not just got'em) is that you don't have to know what infections you have. The blood mops up all of them.

---

Oh geez, I must've missed something.

What blood? My own blood?


Thank you so much, Six , for explaining this.
 

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Posted by Hambone (Member # 29535) on :
 
Oh...more questions. I hope I'm not driving you guys nuts.


~Where do you get the nosodes? And are these nosodes the real deal or just energized in vials?


~Does the PE-1 address mold?
I don't know if I have it, but suspect I do.


My apologies if I appear ignorant. I am just very sick and trying to function with a couple brain cells. It stinks having to try to learn and figure stuff out when you feel like poop.
You would never guess I passed the national board certification exam for teaching a while back. I feel dumber than a box of rocks sometimes.
 

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Posted by lyme in Putnam (Member # 11561) on :
 
Was any of this insurance coveted? I assume not. Welcome back, god bless.
 

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Posted by 17hens (Member # 23747) on :
 
lyme in Putnam,
No it wasn't. Thank you.

Hambone,
You're not driving me nuts at all! I had the same questions not too long ago. No worries!

Nosodes are little glass vials containing, in this case bacteria, that you use to send a message to your body to attack what is in them. When using the Bionic to treat lyme disease, you tape these nosodes to your solar plexes (below sternum).

Six, that's a great explanation of how the body uses them!

Dr. W. had us buy our own Borrelia nosodes at a pharmacy he uses near his office.

However, he could not supply me with the 2 live nosodes when I left, so I am using blood in place of them.

Even if the few drops of blood I put in the vial is not infected, they carry the message of all the blood in the body, so it will be able to pass this message on to the cells during treatment.

In his treatment guide, he writes,

"The treatment of Lyme disease is a purposeful treatment. By applying the Borrelia nosodes, including Borrelia afzelii and Borrelia burgdorferi, a decisive load of the cybernetic system takes place. The cell is now subject to negative loading, measurable energetic information and defends itself against this influence. By simultaneous treatment with the photon therapy the cell gets the possibility to eliminate the Borrelia agent from within. This leads to a measurable immune reaction. This can be observed and confirmed by the reaction in the LTT- and the serological test (IgG and, occasionally IgM).

Equipment:
1. Bionic 880
2. Borrelia nosodes (1 ml. Borrelia-burgdorferi-nosodes dilutation in the potency stages D5, D6, D8, D10, D12, D15, D30, D60, D100, D200 each)
3. the Borrelia afzelii agent
4. the Borrelia burgdorferi agent

Precondition for treatment success is the application of the Borrelia material (2+3+4) on the solar plexus, or otherwise a purposeful reaction cannot take place.

Please note that each patient has her/his own nosodes/original material, which are delivered to her/him after treatment. Do not use nosodes/original material of other patients for the treatment. If there should be no nosodes/original material on command use autologous blood instead. The use of autologous blood for the treatment of Lyme disease can lead to unexpected reactions, which may require a medical intervention (i.e., always test before use!)."


Note: I know that if the borrelia nosodes can be supplied with the Bionic 880 upon purchase.
 

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Posted by abby-do (Member # 25440) on :
 
Congratulations 17Hens and Gotemall great to read of your success with the 880

Selma is still unable to post on Lymenet but posted this at "[email protected]", I am posting here per her reequest

abby

Selma's post: "Check the thread BIONIC TREATMENT WAS GREAT!

Got'em all is using the PE1. Does he post here?

People keep asking if the PE1 will regulate hormones. As far as I know, the PE1 does very similar to the Bionic and it can be used for such a variety of purposes... Hormones would be just one thing.

The main difference is on some frequencies and the potency, as the PE1 seems to be MUCH stronger than the Bionic. Don't read 'stronger = better'. Stronger is merely, stronger! I can't say better or not as I have not tried the Bionic, since the PE1 worked well!

I used if for burned skin: it is the most efficient thing I ever experienced.

For stopping cramps: it stops a cramp IMMEDIATELY, like magic.

For muscular pains: helps a lot, but treatment takes longer than for cramps.

For getting energy: sometimes it helps a lot too.

For headaches, for toothaches, for back aches, for rheumatism, diarrhea, for helping to move the lymph, for candida in the intestine, skin candida or any type of candida, for most types of viruses (colds or anything else)...

I even used it for metal detox, with very strong reactions sometimes.

For acupuncture: (which can literally regulate most things in a body).

So, whatever people ask about the PE1, it can be used for a variety of things, including the borrelia therapy.

I also, of course, use it to help detoxing with the detox homeopathic liquids.

What is wonderful with photons, is that once you apply to main 'trigger points' or main meridian points, you'll get things flowing inside your body (whatever it is: your own immune system reaches where it didn't reach before, food reaches where it didn't, cleansing reaches where it didn't, remedies reaches where it didn't).

That alone is a wonderful thing in itself!

If someone can post that in lymenet, I would be grateful. Thanks!

Please say CONGRATULATIONS TO 17 HENS!!!! Her experience confirms my thoughts about the Bionic / PE1: it is the FASTEST anti-borrelial treatment ever on the surface of this planet.

I have not heard of anything as fast, from first hand experiences like we keep doing in lymenet or here!

For the ones with hypercoagulation, check on Rechtsregulat, so far the best enzyme therapy I encountered. If you think Rechts is expensive, just think twice: you can redilute it 10 times and get even a stronger effect than undiluted. I bought one bottle for the last 2.5 years, that is still unfinished. I use Rechts everyday, me and my daughter.

Have a nice day, everyone!"
 

---

Posted by abby-do (Member # 25440) on :
 
17 hens, I see you made your own vial using your blood......how much blood are you using and can you tell me where you got your vial.....


Healing prayers, abby
 

---

Posted by James1979 (Member # 31926) on :
 
Here's an interesting question:
Are the wavelengths of the Bionic 880 and the PE-1 present in sunlight? If we expose our bodies to enough sunlight, are we getting the same photons as we would be getting in those machines?

I'm just wondering if the majority of us might have a problem with compromised immune systems because we (Americans in general) don't have as much sun exposure as we should, and those machines are giving us the photons that we should've been getting from sunlight.

It seems far-fetched, and I would guess that this wasn't the case, but I'm curious to hear peoples' responses.

Thanks!
 

---

Posted by Hambone (Member # 29535) on :
 

quote:

---

Originally posted by 17hens:
Please note that each patient has her/his own nosodes/original material, which are delivered to her/him after treatment. Do not use nosodes/original material of other patients for the treatment. If there should be no nosodes/original material on command use autologous blood instead.

---

Ok.

I'm about 75% there with the understanding. The above quote confuses me still.


So, did the doctor in Germany give each of you your OWN nosodes? How did he know what to give you?

I noticed on one of those websites that you can purchase nosode kits. I saw one that had 275 nosodes. Would that be the way to go if I am going to do this myself at home? I have no idea how many infections I have.


Is there a place that explains this that I need to be reading?


I'm going to do it. Just need to be sure I completely understand what I'm doing so i can do it right.

Thanks
 

---

Posted by Hambone (Member # 29535) on :
 

quote:

---

Originally posted by James1979:
Here's an interesting question:
Are the wavelengths of the Bionic 880 and the PE-1 present in sunlight? If we expose our bodies to enough sunlight, are we getting the same photons as we would be getting in those machines?

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by Hambone:
Oh geez, I must've missed something.

What blood? My own blood?


Thank you so much, Six , for explaining this.

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by James1979:


I'm just wondering if the majority of us might have a problem with compromised immune systems because we (Americans in general) don't have as much sun exposure as we should, and those machines are giving us the photons that we should've been getting from sunlight.


Thanks!

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by Hambone:


So, did the doctor in Germany give each of you your OWN nosodes? How did he know what to give you?

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by Hambone:
Because if the sun does the same thing, then PE-1 will not work for me because the sun has not helped me feel better at all.

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by pamoisondelune:
Why are killing herbs not allowed during PE-1 treatment?

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by Got'emall:
Hambone: If you don't mind, can you please tell me where you are located. I would love to see if I am anywhere near your LLMD. Mine would refer me for Ozone infusion in a HEARTBEAT.

As it is, I'm going to go to Connecticut to have my amalgams replaced . . . I'm just a formerly-driving, traveling gal!!

---

Thank you so much!

I am in Florida. I was shocked to see that my LLMD had Ozone Therapy listed as a treatment on his website. He never mentioned it. Wonder why.


Now...

I am about to order the PE-1 in about 5 minutes.


What are the very best nosodes I should get, and where do I get them?


I am certain I have far more issues than Lyme, even though I have tested negative on all co infections. So I want the best and as many as I can get my hands on.
 

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Posted by sk8ter (Member # 8671) on :
 
What is the difference between a rife machine like the GB4000 and the PE-1???
 

---

Posted by jlp38 (Member # 27221) on :
 
This a great thread. Wonderful and encouraging. Glad you are doing so well and Ham, I cant wait to hear how you do.

I went to Spain for treatment last month and also had ozone. My reaction to it was undetectable. I wanted to mention though that one day they couldn't draw my blood so they gave me the ozone thru the rectum. I know, gross, but they said it is nearly as effective as putting it in the blood. I've also heard you can take it orally (I think just by ozonating water and drinking it). You can do this easily at home. You just have to buy the machine. Anyway, I wanted to throw that out there as a possible way to get the ozone that is helping you so much.
 

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Posted by lymie_in_md (Member # 14197) on :
 
Hens, I'm ecstatic that you had learned and experienced so much in Germany -- not to mention feeling soooo much better in the process!

Ozone is just one method for cleaning blood. I suspect the Gerson protocol would do that as well. There is healer I've never seen but I believe as something to offer.

http://drbigelsen.com/drbigelsen2/Dr._Bigelsen.html
 

---

Posted by Tammy N. (Member # 26835) on :
 
My dear friend Hens, this was a pleasure to read!!!! (I had quite a bit of catching up to do!). I cannot tell you how happy I am for you!!! Other than our few, brief emails back and forth, sorry I haven't been able to connect sooner to get the whole story.... I've been very busy on my end (I'll share more another time).... but you are in my prayers every day.

The Bionic treatment has been on my list of considerations for some time now. I'm working on some of the foundational stuff first, and am being treated out of Dr. K's clinic in WA, so I know I'm in good hands. Plus I'm doing AI. I didn't realize the Bionic treated mold as well (which is a new diagnosis for me.... another BIG piece of my puzzle). And now I'm even more interested in the Bionic since it works on that as well. Excellent.

Sending you prayers of continued healing. Thank you so much for sharing your amazing story. xoxo

 

---

Posted by momindeep (Member # 7618) on :
 
Ahhh...this is wunderbarer...okay, cheated and looked up the German translation
 

---

Posted by 17hens (Member # 23747) on :
 
Tammy, giant hugs to you. Yes, we'll talk soon.

Bob, thank you! For the good info too!


Quick question to ALL,
I know of some who have treated in Germany, then come back and treated with PE-1.
But is there anyone here who has treated only with PE-1, all on their own, and is making good headway? (Other than Selma, of course )

I plan to be back tomorrow with the promised info. (explanation as to how the photon works in the body, vs sun rays, regulate hormones, etc.)
 

---

Posted by Got'emall (Member # 22225) on :
 
Tammy N. -- the mold was a HUGE piece of the puzzle for me. We knew that from the outset, though. My mycoplasma antibodies were 1,455 when I was first tested in 2008. A strong positive was 320.

Our house had Stachybotrys Ch., Aspergillis and Penicillium -- we had to leave it and abandon pretty much everything.

We moved into a house that we were doing a "lease to own". The builder was a con man -- and used a sub-standard plumber. We had it sampled by a microbiologist and it had three times the amount that would make a "normal healthy individual" symptomatic. It was Aspergillis and Penicillium.

The apartment we then moved into has black, wet mold. They will only fix a small portion of one beam, even though the pipe from the upstairs unit has been leaking through for evidently a very long time. It was THAT that was putting the final nails in my coffin. Literally.

While I am still "banking" on the PE-1 to take care of the mold, I still want to continue with the ozone infusions. Those made a REMARKABLE difference in the color and consistency of my blood. It actually looks like blood again!

I am glad that you found another piece of the puzzle. I'm sorry that it is mold -- it is kind of a rotten thing to have. (no pun intended!)

Take care of you -- and please keep me updated on how you are doing.
 

---

Posted by ukcarry (Member # 18147) on :
 
Congratulations, 17Hens! I am very happy for you that you have got so much out of your trip to Germany for Bionic 880 treatment and I wish you all the best for your continued treatment at home.

For facial spots/lumps, you could try making a masque using pure bentonite clay,pure/distilled water and [optional] a little of a pure oil like Extra Virgin Olive. Allow it to dry on your face for about 20 minutes before washing off.
 

---

Posted by philly78 (Member # 31069) on :
 
What awesome news! This thread actually brought me to tears. Congrats!
 

---

Posted by lymie_in_md (Member # 14197) on :
 
Not just Selma Hens, you can add my name to the list of successfully using the PE1.
 

---

Posted by Tammy N. (Member # 26835) on :
 
I thought of this thread all night long, dreamed about it, etc....

Got-emall - I'm so happy for your amazing progress. How good does it feel to start getting your life back? Wow. Regarding the mold -- my house showed those same spores in the dust sampling (places you don't dust often, tops of door jambs, duct vents, etc.) but the air sample tests came out clear. We are very confused by this, and it makes it hard to decide what to keep and what to toss. Any thoughts you can share? (so we don't bring this thread off-topic, if you're willing, maybe you can send me a PM with your email address so we can communicate that way? If you'd rather not, no problem. No pressure.

Does anyone know how the bionic helps to correct hormones? With Lyme and Mold, mine are all over the place. Would be nice to understand how the Bionic corrects this.

Very happy about this thread!

Best to all,
Tammy
 

---

Posted by sixgoofykids (Member # 11141) on :
 

quote:

---

Originally posted by sk8ter:
What is the difference between a rife machine like the GB4000 and the PE-1???

---

They're actually not similar at all. Rife kills bacteria. The photons strengthen the body so the body does the work.
 

---

Posted by sixgoofykids (Member # 11141) on :
 
It's interesting so many of us have had mold exposure. I did, too, but it wasn't the dangerous black mold. I had a hard time with it nonetheless. I never addressed it. I treated with the Bionic, did lots of detox, and never addressed the mold.
 

---

Posted by Hambone (Member # 29535) on :
 
I have hit a roadblock.

Can somebody tell me if there is a place that sells PE-1 who will take a credit card?

The ones I find will only take a check or Paypal.


Why why why must everything be soooo difficult?


I am running on fumes. So far today EVERYTHING I have attempted to do has been difficult and won't cooperate. I'm about 2 minutes away from a major meltdown...feel like death and have to deal with obstacle after obstacle .
 

---

Posted by MichaelTampa (Member # 24868) on :
 
Hambone -- Maybe you know this and are just trying to avoid using paypal, but, paypal takes credit cards, so you could use paypal to have it charged to a credit card (if you're willing to go through the process with paypal). Sorry you're struggling, hope you can make it through this!

gotemail or whoever knows -- regarding this type of treatment for mold, would you say the photon therapy gets your body focusing on the mold, and then the ozone help with the detox/binding/removal aspect? What I'm getting at, is, what role does the photon therapy play and what role does the ozone therapy play, for those of us considering trying to do it with just one or the other?
 

---

Posted by Hambone (Member # 29535) on :
 

quote:

---

Originally posted by MichaelTampa:
Hambone -- Maybe you know this and are just trying to avoid using paypal, but, paypal takes credit cards, so you could use paypal to have it charged to a credit card (if you're willing to go through the process with paypal). Sorry you're struggling, hope you can make it through this!

---

Thanks Michael. I didn't know that. My Paypal is set up to my debit card.



I'm just venting and in a tizzy today with snafu after snafu. My heart goes out to people who are so sick and have to figure things out themselves.

This doggone SMOKE from wildfires is making me very grouchy. I'm so sick of smelling smoke. It makes my whole body burn and feel toxic. I am generally laid back and patient, but this smoke is making me feel like a crazy person.
 

---

Posted by 17hens (Member # 23747) on :
 

quote:

---

Originally posted by sk8ter:
What is the difference between a rife machine like the GB4000 and the PE-1???

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by lymie_in_md:
Not just Selma Hens, you can add my name to the list of successfully using the PE1.

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by sixgoofykids:
17 Hens, there wasn't much talk about the Bionic regulating hormones when I went over there. I still have to take 1 grain of Armour thyroid per day. Do you know how to treat that?

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by canefan17:
Any success using the PE-1 for Bartonella?

I'm a fellow rifer and actually find borrelia to be the easiest to eradicate. Bartonella is on another level though.

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by lymie_in_md:
I started with desseret bilogical bacterial nosodes but quickly used my own blood instead then stopped the nosodes altogether and just used the unit itself.

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by Hambone:

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by 17hens:
Six, I would try by using 80Hz or 2.47Hz at 10 points for 3+ treatments and see what happens.
Dr. W. says you can test the fequencies energetically.

Do you have the paper where all 82 ailments and their treatments are listed? If not, I could scan them and email you with an attachment. Just a thought.

---

I have a booklet I got when I bought the Bionic. I'll look there and if I don't have it, I'll get back to you. Thanks.

You don't have 11.77 on your list. Does it mention what that frequency does?
 

---

Posted by sixgoofykids (Member # 11141) on :
 

quote:

---

Originally posted by Hambone:
SixGoofy said she used the Bionic to get rid of her co infections. Can't remember if it was Babs or Bart or both. Hopefully she will chime in again.

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by sixgoofykids:
[QUOTE] You don't have 11.77 on your list. Does it mention what that frequency does?

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by 17hens:
Thanks, I missed it. I added it to the post.

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by baileypup:

I just discovered that there's a doctor (specializing in integrative cancer therapy) that treats with what they call photoluminescence. They said they use your own blood to treat, specifically for bacteria. I wasn't able to find out what machine they used, but from what I could gleen, this is something they call UV light therapy.

Would going to a doctor or practitioner like this be worth consideration, or is it not useful without the expertise in lyme disease and all that is learned in Germany?

this is the website that I located the practitioner and treatment:
http://www.mnwelldir.org/docs/uv_light/uv_light3.htm

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by lymeboy:
why are more people not doing this?

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by sixgoofykids:
Lymeboy, I'm talking about people here. I was raked over the coals when I got back and have been several times since on this board and in the Lyme community in general.

---

Why can't people just be happy for somebody who gets better?


I am well aware this may not work for me. But I'm a big girl and made my own decision to try it. I can't knock anything I don't try myself. And even if it doesn't work for me I won't knock it because obviously it helps some people just like antibiotics help some people.
 

---

Posted by sparkle7 (Member # 10397) on :
 
Six - it's outside of the paradigm, so people are skeptical. It doesn't work for everyone - so, people don't want to risk it. I think it can be beneficial. I didn't know I had parasites, though. I think you have to get rid of the parasites first.

I'm going to go back to it once I handle the parasite issue. I don't think it's a good idea to use infrared light if you have parasites. The same may be true of having mercury or babesia.

It's really a different paradigm of healing & alot of people aren't ready for it. I'm so glad it helped but it was kind of a rough ride going through the debates here.

It really shouldn't be about who can afford it, either. It's unfortunate that it has to be about money. I think you can get pretty far with it by even using the LightWorks.

I had a very severe reaction when I was experimenting with the LightWorks & I didn't know why. In retrospect, I think it was that I had parasites & didn't know it. This may not be everyone's issue but it was significant for me.

This is why I say to do a parasite cleanse for a while *first* if you think it may be an issue. I think Selma agrees with this, too. Infrared light & parasites do not mix well in my experience.
 

---

Posted by daisyrlb (Member # 15686) on :
 
Hens,

I am thrilled for you and thank God that the trip, the treatment, all went very well, and you are in a great place on your healing path!!!

Also, my head is reeling...in a very good way as I learned so much reading this thread. WOW! I look forward to reading more!

It seems I usually end up sharing something totally "off the wall" however it's what really "hit" me...so here goes.

You share, "A very important part of treatment that I think gets missed when people consider treating themselves from home (and I totally get that thinking) is the 3 weeks of wonderful living during treatment

The little village is deep in the black forest,

in a clearing on top of a mountain (think Blue Ridge).

The air was clean and clear.

The sun shined from 4:30am until 10pm.

There were walking and biking trails all around town, thru the woods, from one town to another...But best of all, there was NO stress!

It was wonderful, just wonderful. We cried when we left.

Seriously, I cried just reading about that beautiful healing place. I do believe there is a correlation between healing and our surroundings...more than we can probably even imagine.

Prayers that the good work the Lord started in your life...He will continue. He is the One that said "Let there be photons."

Love and hugs, Hens!


 

---

Posted by 17hens (Member # 23747) on :
 
Dear, dear daisy, now the tears are on my cheeks! Thank you for not just reading my words but for understanding them. God is so good!
 

---

Posted by sixgoofykids (Member # 11141) on :
 
Daisy, I knew it would be the answer for me, just the same as "Let there be light", there was also "Christ is the light" and we know he also healed many. It was significant to me in the religious perspective, though I seldom mention it, but to you, I do.

Sparkle, I did treat parasites for a long time prior to the photon treatment. I also had my amalgams out back in 1991. Got'em did have amalgams in place when she went over for treatment, and it helped her, so I don't think it's a strict rule, but for some, probably, and good point regarding parasites.

Anything new like this and outside the box will spark debate. I went over in 2008, so it's not as "new" of an idea now as it was then. It's had time to sink in, so the debate has calmed down.
 

---

Posted by Got'emall (Member # 22225) on :
 
I cried when 17Hens left, too! It was such an amazing healing experience. Nothing like I have ever experienced before. After she left, the Gastehaus felt very "empty". I really MISSED her.

Hambone: I bought my machine from TrueSun.com -- or Lymehub.com Both sites are owned by the same people. I used my credit card, talked with them over the phone, arranged for it to be delivered to my mother's house vs. our moldy apartment -- it was fast and easy. They are also VERY generous with information regarding treatment and other machines that they have found to be helpful in their family's treatment.

Just a thought . . .
 

---

Posted by Hambone (Member # 29535) on :
 

quote:

---

Originally posted by Got'emall:
Hambone: I bought my machine from TrueSun.com -- or Lymehub.com Both sites are owned by the same people. I used my credit card, talked with them over the phone, arranged for it to be delivered to my mother's house vs. our moldy apartment -- it was fast and easy. They are also VERY generous with information regarding treatment and other machines that they have found to be helpful in their family's treatment.

Just a thought . . .

---

I was about to get it from Lymehub, until I saw they wanted over $400 just for shipping!

$1600 plus $400+ for shipping.


Lumenergetics had it for the same price and $27 shipping.

I faxed my order but never heard anything, though. Still waiting.

If Truesun is owned by the same people as Lymehub, I would guess the price would be the same?? But I will check that out.

Thanks so much G'E.
 

---

Posted by lymie_in_md (Member # 14197) on :
 
2008 the good ol days, ay Six, where you could be bonked to death by some nasty poster followed up by some crony friends. Ah, how much more sedate and cerebral has lymenet gotten. I truly like the new days better!

O2 -- kind of guessed the PE1 would still be in the box. I have hope in time you'll find the LED usefull and really happy to see you posting.

I agree very much with Sparkle, parasites are very important to take care of. And, I now believe it is very important to find a practioner to partner with. One who can help clean your blood as well as using homeopathy to mitigate any autoimmune issues.

Consider the following list:

> parasite cleanse at least 60 days
> lots of enzymes -- this will also help clean the blood if done between meals while doing the parasite cleanse
> kidney cleanse --> 20 days after the parasite cleanse had started
> liver cleanse --> should aid in detoxification
> replace any amalgams with composite material
> pe1 with practioner or bionic and germany
> lymph support

Thought I'd highlight some of the areas to consider when you approach light therapy. It is way of minimizing risk and maximizing gain.

Lastly, most people don't take to this method of treatment because they've made a choice. The choice is ABX and an LLMD, that is the accepted protocol. I hope someday this will be part of an LLMDs bag of tricks. I'm guessing if we find success, you'll see this being done by chiropracters and osteopaths.

[ 06-15-2011, 09:06 AM: Message edited by: lymie_in_md ]
 

---

Posted by 17hens (Member # 23747) on :
 
That's a good list to consider, Bob!

Here's some advice for Bionic treatment...

* Treat 2 days a week, allowing at least 2 days off inbetween, for 3 weeks. Ex. treat mondays and thursdays for 3 weeks

* Turn off wifi and cordless phones while treating and might as well just throw away the microwave.

Cell phones and the like should be in another room with the door closed.

For best results, turn wifi and cordless phones off long term.

The reason being, the waves used by wifi, cordless phones and microwaves mess up the messages sent between cells so the body is getting garbled messages. (Not good during treatment. I prefer crispy, clear messages - KILL THOSE BORRELIA!)

* Stop all abx, medicines 2 weeks before treatment to get everything out of the body.

Stop all killing herbs 2 days before treatment.

This isn't written in my literature but Dr. W. had me stop EVERYTHING 2 days before treatment and it makes sense (of course, I'm sure there always must be a few exceptions).

* Keep a positive mindset during treatment. This is energetic medicine and you'll need positive energy for it to work well. Avoid stress. Focus on the things you love and the things that bring you peace.

* Understand that the Bionic's message to the cells will be remembered by the body for 5 days and there is nothing you can do to stop it. (Not like a bad herx from abx and you can't take it anymore so you stop abx for a few days.)

* Put a serious detox plan in place. Six used coffee enemas, Cowden's Burbur and Pekana. I am using cod liver oil packs, coffee enemas, mini flushes, and Cowden's Burbur.

* Keep it simple (treatment, detox, healing) - wise advice from Sage Six!


Six, Got'em, Hiker, can you think of more?

[ 06-15-2011, 08:59 AM: Message edited by: 17hens ]
 

---

Posted by 17hens (Member # 23747) on :
 
thought of another one...

* blood nosodes must be kept refrigerated and last up to 2 months, so a new one with each 3 week treatment is needed.


oh my goodness! must drag myself to bed!! i think i did my coffee enema too late - my brain is wide awake!
 

---

Posted by Tonglen (Member # 18472) on :
 
For those who have gone to Germany for treatmnet, how many patients had mcs? I have severe mcs and can't tolerate standard hotel rooms, fragrance, cigareete smoke. so wonder how I could survive the trip. Is the Gasthaus fragrance-free...use fragrance free laundry products, no artifical air "fresheners", etc. What bout Dr. W's office? Does the medical staff wear clothing washed in fragranced laundry product? wear pefume?
 

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Posted by oxygenbabe (Member # 5831) on :
 
Lymie, PE1 is in the box because of the way life has gone the last 18 months and how much wilderness camping helped me, how we crisscrossed the country looking at "safe" homes that were crap, and how MCS I discovered I was in hotel rooms and most homes. So I'm building a nontoxic trailer starting this fall. And that is not simple, it took me a good six months to even find the right builder, and then, I will have to test all materials. Makers of "nontoxic" are not necessarily that honest. I just discovered that bonded logic denim insulation changed their source to post-consumer recycled denim which means FULL OF FABRIC SOFTENER. The company didn't advertise this, a fellow MCS person let me know. And once I can settle into a really good place in a truly nontoxic little portable vardo home, maybe a year from now, I can have my doc muscle test me with ergopathics and use the PE1. He already uses lots of homeopathy. And I've found a few really good spots but seem to have settled probably on south Georgia/North Florida--the latter has a great wilderness area that was amazing. And my doc is in Atlanta.

We are all different but healing occurs much faster if you lift the environmental load of toxins. Even on here people are talking about how fantastic the black forest air was etc.
 

---

Posted by sparkle7 (Member # 10397) on :
 
FYI - This company has & makes a bunch of different infrared light arrays -

http://www.elixa.com/light/index.htm

Good luck, O2babe! Hope everything works out for you... and everyone else.
 

---

Posted by Dekrator48 (Member # 18239) on :
 
So happy for you 17hens!

Can you take antibiotics while doing photon treatment?
 

---

Posted by Dekrator48 (Member # 18239) on :
 
Oops...I thought I read your whole thread, but just realized I only read page 1....ok, on to page 2..
 

---

Posted by sixgoofykids (Member # 11141) on :
 

quote:

---

Originally posted by 17hens:
That's a good list to consider, Bob!

Here's some advice for Bionic treatment...

* Treat 2 days a week, allowing at least 2 days off inbetween, for 3 weeks. Ex. treat mondays and thursdays for 3 weeks

* Turn off wifi and cordless phones while treating and might as well just throw away the microwave.

Cell phones and the like should be in another room with the door closed.

For best results, turn wifi and cordless phones off long term.

The reason being, the waves used by wifi, cordless phones and microwaves mess up the waves used by the Bionic - so the body is getting garbled messages. (Not good during treatment. I prefer crispy, clear messages - KILL THOSE BORRELIA!)

* Stop all abx, medicines 2 weeks before treatment to get everything out of the body.

Stop all killing herbs 2 days before treatment.

This isn't written in my literature but Dr. W. had me stop EVERYTHING 2 days before treatment and it makes sense (of course, I'm sure there always must be a few exceptions).

* Keep a positive mindset during treatment. This is energetic medicine and you'll need positive energy for it to work well. Avoid stress. Focus on the things you love and the things that bring you peace.

* Understand that the Bionic's message to the cells will be remembered by the body for 5 days and there is nothing you can do to stop it. (Not like a bad herx from abx and you can't take it anymore so you stop abx for a few days.)

* Put a serious detox plan in place. Six used coffee enemas, Cowden's Burbur and Pekana. I am using cod liver oil packs, coffee enemas, mini flushes, and Cowden's Burbur.

* Keep it simple (treatment, detox, healing) - wise advice from Sage Six!


Six, Got'em, Hiker, can you think of more?

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by hiker53:
For me, I had to kill the bartonella before all of the borrelia could be killed, even though Dr. W proclaimed me energetically free from borrelia. There must have been a few cells left, but once I used the machine and killed bart the borrelia was easier to get rid of.

---

Did you just use the machine to kill the Bartonella? Or did you use blood or nosodes?
 

---

Posted by lymie_in_md (Member # 14197) on :
 
O2 -- really hope you get your environment right to where you can finally open the PE1 box. Why don't you open a MCS topic specific to creating a perfect environment. We could all chime in on what we've learned or take a minute or two to help with research. Logically speaking, 100 eyes are better then two.

In my environment, I've started to switch over from incandesent bulbs to LED (definitely want to avoid CFLs at all cost -- after spending soooo much time getting rid of mercury). However my issues are quite simple compared to the decision process someone with MCS must have. You have to worry whether a material for every material in the house is safe or safe enough to be selected. Which has to be a mountain of minute detail.

I pray for good speed for that sanctuary to help you heal.
 

---

Posted by 17hens (Member # 23747) on :
 

quote:

---

Originally posted by sixgoofykids:

quote:

---

Originally posted by 17hens:
Here's some advice for Bionic treatment...

For best results, turn wifi and cordless phones off long term.

The reason being, the waves used by wifi, cordless phones and microwaves mess up the waves used by the Bionic - so the body is getting garbled messages. (Not good during treatment. I prefer crispy, clear messages - KILL THOSE BORRELIA!)

---

---

quote:

---

Turning off Wifi will allow the body to clearly send and receive messages...

---

Yes, but turning on wifi allows my computer to clearly send and receive messages to webpages!

Okay, I was just kidding. I agree that wifi and cellphones and EMFs are all harmful, but sometimes it's just too difficult to stay away from them.
 

---

Posted by lymie_in_md (Member # 14197) on :
 
From O2

quote:

---

All in good time, LymieinMd. I PM'ed you because I felt annoyed at the judgment in the first post, but this one is nicer, so thanks and don't get too annoyed at my PM.

---

Just want to appologize it is not what I meant, I adjusted the offending post.
 

---

Posted by sixgoofykids (Member # 11141) on :
 
James, the cord coming to my computer works as well or better than wifi.
 

---

Posted by James1979 (Member # 31926) on :
 

quote:

---

Originally posted by sixgoofykids:
James, the cord coming to my computer works as well or better than wifi.

---

Shoot. How do I get one of those cords for my iPhone?
 

---

Posted by sparkle7 (Member # 10397) on :
 
There's controvesy about MMS - re: miracle-mineral-solutions.com

It made me really ill. I think there may be other ways. I don't think it's the cure all that it's touted to be.

Great story, O2babe. You could write a book about your experiences.

EMF sheilding - http://www.lessemf.com/emf-shie.html
 

---

Posted by James1979 (Member # 31926) on :
 
Sparkle, I've been interested in learning about MMS recently, and I'm curious to try it.

Would you say that you are pretty certain that you felt ill from the MMS and not from herxing?
 

---

Posted by Hambone (Member # 29535) on :
 

quote:

---

Originally posted by oxygenbabe:
PS my best advice is, if anyone wants to know how they really could feel...go to a wilderness area and camp for a week, two or three. I don't mean a state campground. I mean a national forest or somewhere that there are a couple hundred thousand acres of forest. They are all over the country.

If you have mold illness you might want to do that in a dry area. If not, you can do it anywhere. We found Osceola National Forest to be great. There are three supposedly beautiful national forests in Florida (where Osceola is).

Just notice the profound difference in how you feel, and you'll understand what modern life does to the body. And DON'T camp in an RV. Those are toxic. You need to camp in a tent and sleep on the blessed earth.

---

I'd be scared to death the whole time of being bitte by more ticks....LOL. I'd be more stressed out than ever!

I hope I lose this fear once I heal. But right now just looking at woods and forests gives me the willies.


I was already sick with Lyme, but went to a national forest in Florida just to get out of my house and get some fresh air. Sat at a picnic table, leaned across the railing of a dock, and never once did I touch any kind of bush or high grass.

Came home and had three ticks embedded in my upper abdomen from where they crawled through my button up shirt when I leaned on the top of the picnic table and when I lean over the dock railing to watch alligators.


I'll stick with the beach, cruises and Vegas for a while.
No more miss wilderness girl here.
 

---

Posted by Hambone (Member # 29535) on :
 

quote:

---

Originally posted by fx:
For the Ozone Therapy I have found something different which increases oxygen level in your body.
http://www.miracle-mineral-solutions.com/

I have not tested it or tried myself, but it is tempting. Did anybody researched it or use it?

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by James1979:

quote:

---

Originally posted by sixgoofykids:
James, the cord coming to my computer works as well or better than wifi.

---

Shoot. How do I get one of those cords for my iPhone?

---

I use 3G with no problem on my iPhone, but as soon as I turn on wifi or bluetooth, I start feeling drained.
 

---

Posted by sparkle7 (Member # 10397) on :
 
That's interesting about the fire ants! You do not want to get attacked by fire ants at all... I accidentally steped on a mound a couple of weeks ago & hundreds were on my feet in minutes.

You have to scrub the bites with providone iodine for a few minutes but they still left a few welts. I used baking soda, too.

I think the heat may make for less ticks in some cases. There is definitely Lyme in SC in any case... FYI - http://www.sc-lyme.com/scticks.html

How does Bounce dryer sheets get rid of ticks?
 

---

Posted by oxygenbabe (Member # 5831) on :
 
I got a few bites from fire ants--but nothing too bad. Prefer it to a fricken tickbite that leaves you with a chronic infection!

In Texas, every morning we were camping I'd sweep away the mounds they'd built in the night. They get very annoyed if you get near what they consider their rightful new home--and they are industrious little creature.

I guess he thought the ticks didn't like the smell. He would actually put a dryer sheet in his pocket. Just about the last thing I could ever do.
 

---

Posted by sparkle7 (Member # 10397) on :
 
Yeah, I hate laundry detergent smell. I actually used iodide drops for the fire ant bites since I didn't have the other iodine - I forget which one it is - Betidine or Provodine. Maybe they are the same?

I think you just have to scrub them to get the poison out. Yes, it's no long term, life threatening thing like ticks...

I don't know, the Bounce dryer sheet seems like magical thinking. I knew someone who felt that way about bad cologne. I couldn't stand to be in the same house as he was in.

Sorry to get so off track with this thread here.
 

---

Posted by pamoisondelune (Member # 11846) on :
 
Dr Bronner's Peppermint soap (liquid, like shampoo) repels ticks. I carry a spray bottle with Dr Bronner's Peppermint soap, diluted w water, to spray on my boots.

Until now. The peppermint is really strong, it gets tracked around, and dissolves the varnish on hardwood floors!

It also contact kills ticks, carpenter ants, slugs, and red lily beetles. I assume it would kill fireants, why not?

----Polly Polygonum
 

---

Posted by lymie_in_md (Member # 14197) on :
 
I got to 15 drops with MMS and thought it was way too much. It kill's pathogens but it doesn't heal the body. I think you need to heal the body as much as what you are trying to kill from the body. So a good plan needs to be in place, to heal the body is also to consider EMF, especially for lyme or anything else. EMF and dirty electricity, maybe some reasons why many people can do have success with all the protocols they put themselves on.
 

---

Posted by hiker53 (Member # 6046) on :
 
I tried MMS and it burned my esophagus and made me puke--it turns into bleach in the body. Very dangerous in my opinion.

HIker53
 

---

Posted by 17hens (Member # 23747) on :
 
Hiker, you said you had to get rid of Bart before you could completely get rid of lyme.

What frequency did you get rid of Bart with? Six said she used 28. did you need the same?
 

---

Posted by sixgoofykids (Member # 11141) on :
 
I used 28 with the Deseret, but that didn't get rid of it. Bart went away over time .... when I was treating with blood monthly with 11.77.
 

---

Posted by lymie_in_md (Member # 14197) on :
 
I don't think MMS is dangerous if done wisely. Just like any treatment we do can be dangerous if it isn't thought out.

MMS is difficult to take if you activate it and can give stomach upsets if you take it too close to meals.

I have never seen any literature which shows mms turning into chlorine in the stomach.

Salt is sodium/chloride mms is sodium/chlorite very similar to salt. Both have chlorine molecules both have sodium. Bleach is molecularly much different, I don't know who decided MMS creates chlorine in the body and if it did does it create any more then salt?

Below more accurately describes the chemical reactions occuring:

quote:

---

Any oxygen that is released when chlorine dioxide oxidizes pathogens has nothing to do with the oxidation of the pathogen. Chlorine dioxide oxidizes because it can accept 5 electrons which it takes from anything it can oxidize.
The term oxidizer merely means something which scavenges electrons and doesn't necessarily mean oxygen is involved

ClO2(chlorine dioxide) becomes ClO2-(chlorite) which then becomes Cl-(chloride)

the 1st reaction involves 1 electron and the second 4 electrons

note chlorine(Cl2) can also oxidize and gains 2 electrons when it does so
no oxygen is involved in this case at all so chlorine dioxide is twice as effective as chlorine without the chlorination problems

This is what Jim Humble says in his book and something he seems to be actually right about, the oxygen here then is not in an oxidation state capable of oxidizing anything and will combine with hydrogen and carbon ions

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by 17hens:
Is this a good borrelia nosode to buy? The one on the top here? If not, where should I look?

http://www.lumenergetics.com/Lumenergetics.com/EM_Signature_Vials.html

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by anemone:

In a thousand years I'll bet most medicine will use some theory like this - wish it was better understood in this day and age.

---

I call it Star Trek medicine. LOL

I hope it works well for you!
 

---

Posted by sixgoofykids (Member # 11141) on :
 
Hambone, I used the Deseret ones. I think that you pretty much have to use the Lyme one because it's too much to use blood at the beginning, but I would switch over to blood from there. Or maybe switch to the bart, then to the blood.
 

---

Posted by oxygenbabe (Member # 5831) on :
 
Does anyone else have any knowledge if homeopathics (deseret) actually work better than energetics (ergopathic). I know "bejoy" here on lymenet used ergopathics.

[ 06-17-2011, 06:26 PM: Message edited by: oxygenbabe ]
 

---

Posted by oxygenbabe (Member # 5831) on :
 


[ 06-17-2011, 06:28 PM: Message edited by: oxygenbabe ]
 

---

Posted by Hambone (Member # 29535) on :
 

quote:

---

Originally posted by sixgoofykids:
Hambone, I used the Deseret ones. I think that you pretty much have to use the Lyme one because it's too much to use blood at the beginning, but I would switch over to blood from there. Or maybe switch to the bart, then to the blood.

---

Thanks!


So.....it would be bad to tape both ( Lyme and Bart ) to my solar plexus at the same time, I'm assuming.

One at a time?


When I had energetic testing done, it showed that Bart was a bigger issue than Lyme was. Should I still start with Lyme?


About the homeopathic vs. energetic nosodes question...

all I know is with the energized ones, you have to be very careful about keeping them away from cell phones, wifi, electrical outlets and sources, radios, etc. or these will interfere with / mess them up and make them less effective.

If you order them, you have no idea how many of these things they were exposed to in transit before they get to you.
 

---

Posted by oxygenbabe (Member # 5831) on :
 


[ 06-17-2011, 06:28 PM: Message edited by: oxygenbabe ]
 

---

Posted by hiker53 (Member # 6046) on :
 
I would use the homeopathic ones, given the option.

I personally would treat bart first, but that is just my opinion.

Hiker53
 

---

Posted by sparkle7 (Member # 10397) on :
 
I would think the homeopatic ones would be stronger but who knows in the world of energetic medicine. It might work if you just write the name of the pathogen on a piece of paper & attach it to your solar plexis... I'm not being sarcastic, either.

Talk about "spooky action at a distance"....

[ 06-17-2011, 09:01 PM: Message edited by: sparkle7 ]
 

---

Posted by sixgoofykids (Member # 11141) on :
 
Hambone, I'd start with the Lyme. I thought babesia was my strongest infection, and I still think it was, but I still had to start with Lyme. Once Lyme loses its hold over you, the bart won't feel so bad. That's how Dr. W does it, anyway. (LOL, hiker, sorry, we'll have to agree to disagree. Hambone, maybe muscle test to see which is better for you).

[ 06-18-2011, 12:53 PM: Message edited by: sixgoofykids ]
 

---

Posted by hiker53 (Member # 6046) on :
 
Sixgoofy--seems like you and I have given Hambone different opinions. I do know Dr. W started with lyme with me, too, but he does not treat co-infections or at least he didn't two years ago.

I don't know if the bart went away easier, becuse the lyme load was lower, but I do know I did not get all of the borrelia killed until after all the bartonella was gone.

I think each person is different and it really doesn't matter which you start with, because you can always go back and retreat with the bionic--that's the nice thing about it. You are not locked into a antibiotic regimen.

Hiker53
 

---

Posted by oxygenbabe (Member # 5831) on :
 
Thanks for the heads up on homeopathics vs ergopathics. Really appreciate it.
 

---

Posted by pamoisondelune (Member # 11846) on :
 
Here's Selma's post on radionics vs homeopathics (radionics are the machine-made ones that are sold at www.lumenenergetics.com):

[bionic880-PE1] Homeopathics versus Energetics (Radionics)...
From: Selma
To: [email protected]

I am convinced radionics do work, because of my own experiences using my radionics machine for the last year.

But I'm still not convinced of 2 points:
- that they are exactly as strong as homeopathics
- that they last as long as homeopathics (specially the ones in sugar pellets).

My homeopathic stuff I bought years ago and protected them with aluminium foil, passed through Xrays etc, they are still very good today (most are in water solution).

I now need about 3-4 years of storing radionics to have the same confidence as I have with homeopathics.

I know that Hahnemann's sugar pellets were still active 100 years AFTER by some literature I read. This is pretty much what anyone could expect right?

Selma
------------------------------
---------------------------------------------
Selma is here, reading this thread! She just can't post, because the moderators had to block all posts coming from Asia and Australia, because of heavy spam streams.

----Polly Polygonum
 

---

Posted by jlp38 (Member # 27221) on :
 
Sparkle, what an interesting experiment that would be to try with a piece of paper. Have you read Hidden Messages in Water?
 

---

Posted by hiker53 (Member # 6046) on :
 
Hambone,

Yes you tape the borrelia only to your solar plexus for treatment. Then when you treat bart you only tape the bart nosodes to your solar plexus.

If you have thyroid troubles keep the machine away from your thyroid gland!

Hiker53
 

---

Posted by sixgoofykids (Member # 11141) on :
 

quote:

---

Originally posted by hiker53:


If you have thyroid troubles keep the machine away from your thyroid gland!

Hiker53

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by sixgoofykids:
I was unable to take the 3 week break, I had to keep treating for several more weeks.

Dr. W had someone in my group treating back pain outside of Lyme treatment with the photons minus the nosodes.

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by lymeboy:
I am REALLY starting to consider this as treatment after another year of antibiotics.

---

If you're going to try it, I would try it now. Abx are hard on your body, you'll just have that much more damage to fix after another year of Lyme.
 

---

Posted by 17hens (Member # 23747) on :
 
Yes, that's true lymeboy. Dr. W. said the ones who've been on abx are harder to treat.

Lulu, I got back mid May. Is that what you mean?

Boy, yesterday and today I'm feeling yuck (comparatively speaking), as in toxic.

I did my third treatment on Friday (that's the one that got me in Germany too) and I'm a few days before my period...great timing.

I'm tired and my fingers and ankles are stiff.

I'm feeling a coffee enema coming on! WooHoo!!!

But on the bright side, I went to church yesterday - 1st time in 1.5 years! Nothing bothered me, not the noise, lights, commotion - it was great!!

After that we went out to lunch, then ran around to get gifts for our dads (we're last minute around here) then went to the movies, great day!

So I guess I had a great day even though I was feeling yuck. That's what I mean about "comparatively speaking."

[ 06-20-2011, 12:18 PM: Message edited by: 17hens ]
 

---

Posted by lymeboy (Member # 24769) on :
 
the antibiotics have been working for me. I just don't think they will get me to 100%
 

---

Posted by lymie_in_md (Member # 14197) on :
 
Hens there is one more group who might be difficult to treat. Those who had been overloaded with bad metals and were no longer chelating effectively. The two are interwoven in the chronic disease problem, especially those in the autistic community. I think someday we'll find the bionic or PE1 is just as important in that community.

I'm curious how your detoxification works out in you fingers and ankles. I was an avid racquetball player prior to getting ill in the middle of 2006. I had severe tendonitis in my left elbox. I couldn't play any racquet sports until 2009. I no longer have tendonitis, my elbow is as strong as it was when I was teenager now. I asked a PCP recently if it was possible to get rid of tendonitis. He said NO (a little surprised)! not in his eperience anyways. I guess I have tendonitis without symptoms for the 2 1/2 years. Well, just played tennis with my 23 year old son to a draw this past weekend (we both have 100 mile an hour plus serves. A sure sign of your elbow not being a problem is playing 3 sets of tennis and it doesn't hurt.

I used to use the PE1 on my elbow, while also using some essential oils, Lavendar, tea tree oil and either cedar or pine. I'd use a carrier oil, I think avocado -- good source of magnesium and then use the PE1 for about 10 minutes on the joint.

I guess my point, don't forget about the use of herbals topically with the bionic or PE1. There are many different options to try.
 

---

Posted by 17hens (Member # 23747) on :
 
Bob, normally stiff fingers and ankles are not one of my symptoms, and actually, today they aren't stiff anymore.

The fatigue is still here but not as bad as yesterday. I expect it to be gone the minute I get my period.

Hey, you could try that too for your tendonitis!

But seriously, the topical herbal info is great and I'll make a note of it.
 

---

Posted by lymie_in_md (Member # 14197) on :
 
I never made a nosode with live ticks, thought about it though. I'll provide some thoughts if someone wants to be adventurous. And who might want to work with a homeopath to do it.

If you sweep into brush dragging white felt cloth, then peruse for ticks on the cloth, get about 20 or 30. Gut them and take the internal material out. Then follow the recipe in the link (cheap nosode) work with a homeopath to make sure of what you are creating, instead of ingesting suggest you put drops on the outside of the body where you would put vials like the bionic:

http://www.ehow.com/how_5782695_make-homeopathic-nosodes.html

By using 20 to 30 ticks, statistically you should have covered almost every infection you could possibly get.

Not only are you removing the ticks from the environment, a plus. You'll also have a better idea of the tick population within your area.

Just an idea.
 

---

Posted by sixgoofykids (Member # 11141) on :
 

quote:

---

Originally posted by 17hens:

quote:

---

Originally posted by sixgoofykids:

---

How did you know you needed to keep treating for several more weeks?

You're much more of a "follow your gut" kind of gal and I'm a "follow the rules" kind. I want to learn how to become the other.

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by lymeboy:
the antibiotics have been working for me. I just don't think they will get me to 100%

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by 17hens:
Any PE-1 users know anything about that? If so, I'd like to know how to do it! Sounds interesting!!

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by sixgoofykids:
I used Deseret chemtox and metox with the Bionic for heavy metals and chemicals (pharmaceuticl chemicals).

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by hiker53:
I also treated Bart twice a week for three weeks, only I found the nosodes worked better than the blood. I think it depends on where the bart is hiding. You may see have it in the blood or it may be in deeper tissue.

Hiker53

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by 17hens:
When this lady told me what the Lumenergetics lady said about killing parasites, I got to thinking...

I've had on and off pelvic inflammation for years. It went away completely while I was taking Parastroy but when I stopped it to go to Germany, the pain came back.

It's not all the time and it's not as bad as it used to be but now I think it's due to parasites, soooooo....

At the end of my 4th Bionic treatment today, I put the handle over my bladder area where the pain is.

Since then I've urinated at least 3 times and each time, at least 10+ of the little critters I've seen before were in the toilette!

So I gathered one on a Q-tip and put it in some distilled water in one of the jars I got to make nosodes with. I'm going to kill them all!!!

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by Hambone:
When you decide to use blood... how much blood do you use?


Do you use fresh blood each time?

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by Maradona:
Every antibiotic under the sun it does something but not cure me . Do you people there that had good results think Bionic will help me ore something ellese.

---

Maradona, do I think the Bionic could help you, even cure you?

From my own experience, yes, I think you'd have at least as good a chance with it than with antibiotics, maybe even better. (Actually, I think a much better chance but I'm trying not to show my bias.)
 

---

Posted by hiker53 (Member # 6046) on :
 
17Hens,

I used new blood each time for the bionic in addition to an older vial. You never know what might be in the new blood that wasn't in the older blood.

After two years I have found my borrelia nosodes from Germany are less than half full. I have them in a black bag in a cabinet, so they are not exposed to heat or sun, but I think if I still had borrelia I might need some new nosodes.

I did buy some nosode soluton from England that was at a higher dilution and used them as well.

Hiker53
 

---

Posted by sparkle7 (Member # 10397) on :
 
It's hard for me to say about the parasites, hiker. I did a different protocol than you guys have done. I used the LightWorks. I just know I started detoxing something & it was not fun.

I may have had a bad parasite problem but I don't know exactly which parasite it was. I just know that stuff was coming out... If it was a healing crisis - it was too strong. I had no idea of parasites back then.

I think it's better to use the herbs first.

Bob - you are brave dealing with live ticks & gutting them!!! That's a bit too hardcore for me.
 

---

Posted by aMomWithHope (Member # 19255) on :
 
How long of a waitlist is there for the md in Germany? Does the doc have a website with treatment and cost info? Can someone pm that to me?

The treatment there is 3 weeks, right?

How easy is it to learn how to use the Bionic or PE1?

Does one need to know how to energy/muscle test to use these machines?

Thank you!
 

---

Posted by canefan17 (Member # 22149) on :
 
So blood and nosodes are 2 different treatment methods.

I wish someone would do a YouTube video on photon therapy.

Something where us newbs could make sense of all the nosode and blood talk.
 

---

Posted by sixgoofykids (Member # 11141) on :
 
No, they're really the same. You use the Lyme nosodes when you first treat so you're only treating Lyme. Once the Lyme is treated, you use blood to treat all the rest.

I've also used it with homeopathics .... whatever homeopathic I feel I want to take, I can use with it. ie, I used Chemtox and Metox with it. I also used a bug bite remedy.
 

---

Posted by sixgoofykids (Member # 11141) on :
 
AMomWithHope, I think you can get in quickly. You don't have to muscle test. I didn't actually learn until later, but it is easy to learn and helpful.

By the time you leave, you know how to use the bionic. It's easy.
 

---

Posted by sparkle7 (Member # 10397) on :
 
I tried doing the Desseret mycoplasma remedy series with the LightWorks. I think it was helpful but I'm not sure if my Asyra reading was accurate that I really needed it.

I think you can do all the same things with the LightWorks as you do with the more expensive devices. It might be different timings, though. It's good if you can dowse it or use a bobber/biotensor.

I haven't messed around with it much after finding out about the parasites. I'm still going through getting rid of them first. It would be worthwhile to try the LightWorks with this technique if you can't afford the other devices. You have to be willing to experiment.

Some people feel that the LightWorks isn't strong enough but I don't think it matters. You just have to adjust the amount of time that you expose your points to the light. The Nogier frequencies are alittle different than the Bionic ones.

You can dowse it to see which ones you should use. That's what I did. It may actually be safer than the PE1 or Bionic... It's not hard to overdo it & then you are fried. Some people have gotten ill from overuse.
 

---

Posted by pamoisondelune (Member # 11846) on :
 
Here's a post from Selma:
-----------------------------------


--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
From: Selma
To: [email protected]
Sent: Tue, June 21, 2011 4:27:58 AM
Subject: [bionic880-PE1] Chelation with PE1 and thougths about Allergie Immun


As will all chelation methods, each method reach points that others don't. At least, that is how I feel.

The PE1 is no different. I keep trying new chelation methods everytime I can, some I react a lot, some less, but I feel most are beneficial if you know how to drag the toxins out of the body (with whatever binders you have).

I do feel the infrared reaches areas that only ingestion of substances don't. That is why I could still chelate with the PE1 even years after being on different chelators and binders. There was still heavy metals flushing out, even after so many years...

That could be the downside though for very toxic people. IF you kill too much plus chelate at the same time, it could be hell on earth.

But if you had done chelation before for at least 6 months or 12 months, I guess it's okay to start with the massive killing that the nosodes and infrared do.

As for the Allergie Immun drops, they also cause 'chelation' and I wonder what would be the interaction when we use Dr. W's protocol altogether...

It could be also overwhelming?

My husband is on AI for some time, but had the WORST allergic reaction now. He doesn't really take binders. While I feel the number of allergies he got diminished, I do feel that lack of binders could cause some trouble, as he could redistribute these toxins...

He didn't go into anaphylatic shock, but had I not treated him with autonosodes from his saliva and the food that caused such allergic 'shock', I wonder....

His neck was doubled, his eyelid close, his mouth got so big his upper lips were almost touching his nose, his breathing started to be compromised etc...

My daughter is also on AI, but she complains of burning mouth with certain foods. Her insect bite allergy is MUCH better though.

Anyway, just some thoughts. Has anyone here been on AI too to share some thoughts??

Thank you.

Selma
 

---

Posted by hiker53 (Member # 6046) on :
 
I own both the lightworks and the bionic and in my opinion will say the bionic is much stronger and works better on bartnella and borrelia than lightworks.

That being said, I do use my lightworks machine quite a bit--for muscle problems, tendonitis, when I had toe surgery so I did not have to use antibiotic cream etc.
 

---

Posted by hiker53 (Member # 6046) on :
 
Selma,

I did AI before the bionic and inbetween my rounds of using the bionic and then did some more AI. I totally regret it. I wish I had not done AI or had waited until the borrelia was totally killed. I feel the borrelia is gone now.

I believe my mistake was thinking the salt/C protocol and Dr. Natura cleanse had killed all of the parasites and that I would not have much to chelate out of the body. I have been releasing metals for a full year after I stopped the bionic---very tiring.

Now I am going after the parasites, but cannot do a massive kill-off or my tired body will not be able to handle the toxin/fungi/viral/bacteria release.

Hiker53
 

---

Posted by sixgoofykids (Member # 11141) on :
 
Hiker, interesting about the AI. I did three rounds pretty much back-to-back, but have not felt ready for the fourth round even a month later. I do feel like my body is going through changes and don't feel that I'm ready for it yet. I believe I'm working through fungi that I haven't been able to let go of until now.

So, I am in agreement with you about AI. Go very slowly. I do think it does something. But, I don't want to get caught up in having my body releasing too much at once. If you know anything about iridology, my eyes show I am still holding toxins, but it's improved substantially with AI. Until I feel the fungi release has stopped, I won't do the next round. One thing at a time.
 

---

Posted by hiker53 (Member # 6046) on :
 
I think you are being wise, Six! Especially since AI is supposed to continue working in the body even after it is stopped. Most people in Europe do only 3-5 rounds.

Hiker53
 

---

Posted by sixgoofykids (Member # 11141) on :
 
I can see why. I know these toxins need to come out, but slowly. It's a lot of work for the body .... makes you tired.
 

---

Posted by Atta (Member # 30786) on :
 
"So blood and nosodes are 2 different treatment methods.

I wish someone would do a YouTube video on photon therapy.

Something where us newbs could make sense of all the nosode and blood talk."


I too would like something more to help make sense of this. My brain is really foggy and I feel like I'm jumping in on a post with a lot of history. Where could I go for beginning information?

Thanks
 

---

Posted by James1979 (Member # 31926) on :
 
Yes, a video would be pretty awesome! I'm surprised nobody has ever made one yet.

If anyone finds a link, please post it here.

It's just impossible to visualize because of all the strange concepts.
 

---

Posted by 17hens (Member # 23747) on :
 
I'm going to put something on YouTube today so stay tuned. I'll add the link as soon as it's on.

I'm just going to show Borrelia nosodes and blood nosodes and how I put them on my son when he treats, so you can get an idea.

I didn't understand it either until I saw/did it myself, so I totally understand the confusion.

I'm a visual learner so "show me" and poof, I've got it!

I am pretty proud of myself though! Me, not being a coffee drinker, just got a french press to make coffee for coffee enemas. No one was around to show me how to use the french press, so I actually FOLLOWED THE DIRECTIONS on the paper and did it myself (Hand shake!! Back slap!!)

-- edited to make clear "no one was around to show me how to use the" french press, NOT the coffee enema!!! I figured the enema out on my own too but HADN'T been wishing for a demonstration.

[ 06-23-2011, 02:05 PM: Message edited by: 17hens ]
 

---

Posted by 17hens (Member # 23747) on :
 
Bob, I have some questions for you! (or anyone else who never went to Germany for treatment and has only used the PE-1 to self-treat.)

Friends of mine are trying to decide between getting the PE-1 and the Bionic and have asked me a million questions which I'm trying to find answers for. How you don't mind.

1. Did you start treating Borrelia and then moved on to coinfections or did you do it another way?

2. Did you use Borrelia nosodes at all? If so, which ones did you use and was it necessary to use blood (or other) with them?

I'm asking this question because Dr. W. told me that even though I had borrelia nosodes from the pharmacy, that I would need to use either live borrelia nosodes with them (but he couldn't tell me how to get them) or make blood nosodes to use with them.

So I'm wondering if someone buys borrelia nosodes over here to use, like from Deseret, will they work alone or does a blood nosode need to be used with it?

3. What frequencies does the PE-1 have and which is used to treat lyme?

4. When you buy the PE-1, do you get a paper or something that explains what the various frequencies are used for?

5. Do you get a list of things the machine will treat and instructions how to treat each one (like I did with the Bionic)?

I know there's a link online of videos that explain how to use the PE-1 but these people are older (non technical) and have been sick a long time. They don't think they can sit and watch a video and understand what to do. I have encouraged them to try it but I don't think they will.

6. I know this varies for everyone but can you tell me how long it took you to feel a marked improvement?

This man just lost his practice (psychiatrist) and is heartbroken. I feel well enough to work since I've been back from Germany, but he's wondering how long it might take to get to that place if he would treat himself. He's not well enough to take a trip to Germany.

Thank you very much, Bob, (or whomever)!!!
 

---

Posted by Atta (Member # 30786) on :
 
Thanks Hens. I'm a visual leaner too. I look forward to seeing how it works.

High five to you for the coffee enemas. I did garlic colonics, talk about a good burn. But then developed an allergy to garlic because of leaky gut. Oh well.

Thanks for all the info in this post.
 

---

Posted by sixgoofykids (Member # 11141) on :
 
Since they're very similar lights, except that the PE1 has more wavelengths, I would say the treatment is the same. I don't know what time or strength to use, but you would still use nosodes.

I would probably try using the Lyme nosodes alone at first to see what the reaction is before adding the blood nosode. With Dr. W we had the benefit of the detox iv's.

If he decides on a Bionic, I know someone trying to sell one (not me).
 

---

Posted by 17hens (Member # 23747) on :
 
Six, could you PM or email me the seller's contact info? I know enough people with their antennas up right now... do you know what the asking price is too?
 

---

Posted by ladyjenie (Member # 21098) on :
 
I am interested in how the appointment to see the doctor is made and what happens next after the appt. is made (airline and hotel reservations, etc.).

Is the amount quoted, I think it was $3500 for treatment, paid in US dollars or EUROS? Are the doctor's fees paid by credit card?

Could someone PM me with the doctor's name and the city he practices in? I have a cousin who is stationed in Germany that might help me out if she's anywhere near the doc's office.

Prayers to help us get well!
 

---

Posted by hiker53 (Member # 6046) on :
 
ladyjenie--Sent you a pm with name and phone numbers of doctor and guest house. You need to stay in a place while being treated that does not have wireless and most places do, but this guesthouse does not. And the owner of the guest house is wonderful. You have to cook for yourself or you can eat at the rehab center just down the street for a meal or two a day. I usualy ate one meal there at a very reasonable price.

You may use a credit card to pay the doctor--his fee varies depening on the number of treatments, whether you need ozone or not etc. My treatment was around 2,000 euros for 8 photon treatments, three of them included ozone (I stayed longer than most people) and several lengthy conferences with the doctor.

Hiker53
 

---

Posted by lymie_in_md (Member # 14197) on :
 
Hens -- I'm a little busy at work, but I'll get back to you over the weekend.
 

---

Posted by sixgoofykids (Member # 11141) on :
 
17 Hens, I sent her a message on Facebook asking her for either her email address or her screen name here. I'll get back to you. I know NY John was wanting to sell his, too, since he's better. I don't know the price for either.
 

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Posted by sparkle7 (Member # 10397) on :
 
FYI - this may be a bit oblique but some may be interested...

The Smallest Mind
Scientists use light to make worms start, stop and lay eggs

http://www.scientificamerican.com/article.cfm?id=the-smallest-mind
 

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Posted by 17hens (Member # 23747) on :
 
Sparkle, I am afraid to read this! I want to use the light to KILL the worms, not to encourage them to start laying eggs!!! Will it never end??!!! (Cough,Choke,Gurgle,Gasp!)
 

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Posted by sparkle7 (Member # 10397) on :
 
Yes - this is why I say that the infrared light is no good if you haven't gotten the parasites out. I think the herbs & diatomaceous earth are better for treating parasites. Also, babesia is a parasite... just to keep in mind.

Everyone may have different experiences but I know I had a hard time with this even though I used the LightWorks - not the stronger devices.
 

---

Posted by 17hens (Member # 23747) on :
 

quote:

---

Originally posted by sparkle7:
Yes - this is why I say that the infrared light is no good if you haven't gotten the parasites out.

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by 17hens:
I'm going to put something on YouTube today so stay tuned. I'll add the link as soon as it's on.

I'm just going to show Borrelia nosodes and blood nosodes and how I put them on my son when he treats, so you can get an idea.

---

Sorry, a little late... hey, it takes time to make professional film footage!!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C7-jb7caogI&feature=youtube_gdata_player
 

---

Posted by James1979 (Member # 31926) on :
 
17hens - awesome!! Thanks a lot!! A 10-star video!

The bionic looks like such a small machine... I'm surprised its so expensive! I wonder if they're just making a ton of money off of those machines.

It's very difficult for me to comprehend that taping those bottles to the sternum makes such a big difference. I'm not doubting the procedure, it just seems so foreign and exotic.

Thanks again! God bless.
 

---

Posted by pamoisondelune (Member # 11846) on :
 
Selma did use saliva nosode to treat her husband's anaphylactic shock (see her most recent post above).

I've asked Selma what she did with the saliva to make it into a nosode--- just straight, or dilute and succuss? No reply yet.

So you use the blood neat, not diluted and succussed?

17Hens, thanks for the info that we really need!

---Polly Polygonum
 

---

Posted by oxygenbabe (Member # 5831) on :
 
17hens, you tape all the nosodes on? You don't muscle test for which strengths are needed?
 

---

Posted by 17hens (Member # 23747) on :
 
James,

I asked about the cost of the machine and was told the following which made sense to me.

(excuse my imperfect German translation...)


1. Science costs money. And quality does too.

2. The Bionic has an 8 year development of lyme treatment which cost much money. It shows the success of the treatment and for so many other illnesses too.

3. The Bionic 880 is approved as a medical system in Germany (equivalent to our FDA approval). This approval cost EUR 60,000.

4. The Bionic regulates hormones and that is very important for lyme treatment.

5. The Bionic treatment of LD has a success rate of over 90%.



For me, getting the German quality, the proven research and the treatment plans for 82 illnesses are worth the price.

And yet it's still cheaper then the last year of LD treatment for my family has cost us.

For me, it was like buying the Mercedes of photon light machines.

But living here, in PA (the hotspot of LD!), I will get my money's worth from this Mercedes in no time!
 

---

Posted by 17hens (Member # 23747) on :
 

quote:

---

Originally posted by pamoisondelune:
So you use the blood neat, not diluted and succussed?

---

Polly, Dr. W. never mentioned diluting or anything to me. He just said 3-4 drops of blood in a vial will work. I'm a newbie at this too so I'm just following directions!

quote:

---

Originally posted by oxygenbabe:
17hens, you tape all the nosodes on? You don't muscle test for which strengths are needed?

---

oxygenbabe,
I do not yet trust myself at muscle testing. I'll get there.

I'm doing it just like they did it at Dr. W's office, taping them all on.

Dr. W. had these boxes of nosodes waiting at the pharmacy for me to treat my family with. I'm just following his directions, getting my feet wet, and it seems to be working fine.
 

---

Posted by marine2783 (Member # 24982) on :
 
Does anyone have contact information for this machine and the doctors who use it?? I have access to a doctor with a photon machine but we have no idea how to use it for lyme...
 

---

Posted by 17hens (Member # 23747) on :
 
I PMed you, marine.
 

---

Posted by sparkle7 (Member # 10397) on :
 
Wow - great youtube video! I'm sure it will help alot of people.

In general, auto nosodes can be made from other body fluids. I believe they are succussed. It seems easier to use the blood nosode straight. I think the succussing creates a medicine with a different energetic purpose.

If Dr. W uses it straight - seems like a good thing. I guess you pay for the research & development of the Bionic. Other devices can be used from what I could tell.

I heard about someone who prevented getting their foot amputated because of diabetes by using a red laser pointer from Staples & colloidal silver...
 

---

Posted by sixgoofykids (Member # 11141) on :
 
To give an idea of pricing, my avian vet has a similar light that he paid $14,000 for. He uses it for all kinds of things and considers it to be miraculous in what it does. He has friends who come over to use it for various ailments, but he didn't realize it could be used for immunity, too. I explained how. Funny how vets are opent to this stuff.

Anyway, it is a medical device, and expensive. The vet has two or three lights, and one of his he found worth paying even more for than the Bionic.

BTW, I tried using saliva for viruses (like the flu, etc.). Dr. W also said you could use a dirty tissue for treating a cold/flu/bronchitis. But for these bacterial infections, you need the blood.
 

---

Posted by Hambone (Member # 29535) on :
 

quote:

---

Originally posted by 17hens:

quote:

---

Originally posted by 17hens:
I'm going to put something on YouTube today so stay tuned. I'll add the link as soon as it's on.

I'm just going to show Borrelia nosodes and blood nosodes and how I put them on my son when he treats, so you can get an idea.

---

Sorry, a little late... hey, it takes time to make professional film footage!!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C7-jb7caogI&feature=youtube_gdata_player

---

Thank you so much for this, Hens. VERY HELPFUL!

Answered a ton of my questions.


But I still have another one.

Did you start out at 5 minutes for each point your very first time? Or do you start out lower and build up?


Mine should be here at the end of next week.
 

---

Posted by Hambone (Member # 29535) on :
 

quote:

---

Originally posted by 17hens:

quote:

---

Originally posted by 17hens:
I'm going to put something on YouTube today so stay tuned. I'll add the link as soon as it's on.

I'm just going to show Borrelia nosodes and blood nosodes and how I put them on my son when he treats, so you can get an idea.

---

Sorry, a little late... hey, it takes time to make professional film footage!!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C7-jb7caogI&feature=youtube_gdata_player

---

Thank you so much for this, Hens. VERY HELPFUL!

Answered a ton of my questions.


But I still have another one.

Did you start out at 5 minutes for each point your very first time? Or do you start out lower and build up?


Mine should be here at the end of next week.
 

---

Posted by sixgoofykids (Member # 11141) on :
 
We started out at 100% power and 5 min each point. However, when I talked to Dr. W about treating my daughter at home without the detox iv's, he said to start at 25% power, but for the same time, then work up.

Same when starting to treat with blood, start at 25% power and work up.
 

---

Posted by Hambone (Member # 29535) on :
 

quote:

---

Originally posted by sixgoofykids:
We started out at 100% power and 5 min each point. However, when I talked to Dr. W about treating my daughter at home without the detox iv's, he said to start at 25% power, but for the same time, then work up.

Same when starting to treat with blood, start at 25% power and work up.

---

Thanks. That's what I will do ( 25% power ).
 

---

Posted by sixgoofykids (Member # 11141) on :
 
Good idea. Better safe than sorry.
 

---

Posted by aMomWithHope (Member # 19255) on :
 
6GK--is your daughter getting the same great results as you did without going to Germany and without the IV detox/ozone therapy?

What are you using with her for detox?

I would be using this with my dd so am most curious about the use with children/teenagers.

While I would love to go to Germany--money is very tight, and we will need to spend the next year saving up (which means another year of her possibly being in pain)--so if this can in fact be done here at home sooner versus waiting to save up $$$, that would be ideal.
 

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Posted by sixgoofykids (Member # 11141) on :
 
My daughter treated a couple years ago. She was in remission at the time. She had to be careful to get enough sleep and eat right or her symptoms would return, but she was off meds and on herbs only.

The Bionic made it so her remission was more solid. Now she doesn't have symptoms return at all.

We used parsley, burbur, lemon water for detox. I also used coffee enemas.

I didn't take her to Germany because she was in remission so I figured she could wait to be treated. If I were you, I certainly wouldn't want to wait a year. I would want to try it at home.

BTW, I did not have ozone therapy in Germany.
 

---

Posted by 17hens (Member # 23747) on :
 
aMomWithHope,

I'm treating my 15 year old daughter with the Bionic right now. She's doing castor oil liver packs, mini flushes, bile duct flushes, coffee enemas as detox. She's not had any problems so far.

The most expensive part of this detox is the organic lemons for the flushes!

I will say that my daughter and I treated 4 times with blood nosodes made from blood from our fingers and one time (yesterday) with blood nosodes made from our menstrual blood.

After the finger blood treatments, neither of us felt anything really. We kept up our detox so I'm sure that helped.

Then yesterday we did the menstrual blood nosode - phew, what a difference!

After her Bionic treatment she did a coffee enema and a mini flush and she feels fine.

I have done only Burbur (no time for coffee enema yet) and I feel like a truck hit me.

I think I'll put a pot of coffee on...
 

---

Posted by dan67 (Member # 20344) on :
 
17,

Are you saying the burbur hit you hard?

Also, how do I do castor oil packs over the liver? What materials / procedure? Thanks.
 

---

Posted by sixgoofykids (Member # 11141) on :
 
No, she's saying that the menstrual blood nosode hit her. I think there's more information in that blood than from a finger prick.
 

---

Posted by sparkle7 (Member # 10397) on :
 
There are stem cells in menstrual blood.
 

---

Posted by hiker53 (Member # 6046) on :
 
Pekana makes good products for detox that I used at home with the bionic--iteres, renelix, a-hepat--these are for the lymph, kidney, and liver. Natural Healing House is where I get them--just google pekana and natural healing house.

I also used two products made by Heel--Hepar Compositum and Lymphomyosot, but they are pretty expensive compared to the Pekana products.

Dr. W had me take extra magnesium as well, so I did that when using the bionic at home, too.

Hiker53
 

---

Posted by Hambone (Member # 29535) on :
 

quote:

---

Originally posted by sparkle7:
There are stem cells in menstrual blood.

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by hiker53:
I also used two products made by Heel--Hepar Compositum and Lymphomyosot, but they are pretty expensive compared to the Pekana products.

---

Whew! I just used the Lymphomyosot the other day and it knocked me for a loop.

When my ND gave it to me, he told me to use it to massage into the skin on sore areas. But I saw on the bottle that you can take it orally and it gave directions on how much to take.

Holy shmoly!

I can hear my doctor now. "I said use it on your skin dummy!"
 

---

Posted by 17hens (Member # 23747) on :
 

quote:

---

Originally posted by dan67:
17,

Are you saying the burbur hit you hard?

Also, how do I do castor oil packs over the liver? What materials / procedure? Thanks.

---

Dan, Six was right. I meant treating with nosodes hit me hard.

Don't get me wrong, it didn't put me on the couch or anything. I'm still doing laundry, making dinner, running kids around, running to the store. Nothing like before treatment.

I guess the trucks that hit me are getting much smaller but I forget how big they were before.

Burbur takes the edge off. It helps get rid of the toxins.

For castor oil pack info, you can read my thread -
http://flash.lymenet.org/scripts/ultimatebb.cgi?ubb=get_topic;f=1;t=106075;p=0

If you have questions that I don't answer on that thread, feel free to PM me.
 

---

Posted by MichaelTampa (Member # 24868) on :
 
What is the purpose of the ozone therapy in all of this? And would it need to be done immediately following the photon treatment to make sense?
 

---

Posted by sixgoofykids (Member # 11141) on :
 
I didn't have ozone therapy, but those who did had it right after photon therapy, but no, it doesn't have to be. The detox iv does.

Ozone is a heavy detox. My friend needed it for mold detox. My roommate over in Germany got it for viruses. I guess there are various uses of it. Dr. W didn't think I needed it.
 

---

Posted by 17hens (Member # 23747) on :
 
I'm not really sure I needed ozone therapy - I wasnt' sooo sick, not nearly like the other two people there with me.

But I did like the results - was running laps around my traveling friend.

Another purpose? It was not cheap (if you get my drift).
 

---

Posted by sixgoofykids (Member # 11141) on :
 
I kind of wish I had had the ozone. I had mold exposure that I discovered a few weeks before leaving. I think it would have helped with that detox. As it was, I was happy with my progress, but am only now addressing the prior mold exposure .... I had been leaving well-enough alone.
 

---

Posted by 17hens (Member # 23747) on :
 
Yes, we're finishing mold remediation in our home right now. Hubby's replacing a bathroom floor (shower leaked) as I type.

We had 4 different types of bad mold test way high, mostly in the basement.

Maybe the ozone took care of my detoxing it? Guess I'll find out.

Don't know if you noticed it, Six, but there is a link on this thread (page 1 oe 2) that lists ozone therapists (put in your zip). So, apparently you could still get it if you wanted it without going to Germany.

What are you doing to address the exposure?
 

---

Posted by dan67 (Member # 20344) on :
 
You can do ozone easily for not much money in the USA, so I don't think missing it in Germany means its out of bounds now.
 

---

Posted by sparkle7 (Member # 10397) on :
 
re: quote:
Originally posted by sparkle7:
There are stem cells in menstrual blood.
And toxins, from what I have heard.

---

What kind of toxins?
 

---

Posted by sixgoofykids (Member # 11141) on :
 
17 Hens, I took oregano oil and am now taking vitamin C. I feel that the oregano caused a big release in fungi based on symptoms. I felt horrible for a few days after taking it for two weeks, feel fine today.
 

---

Posted by sixgoofykids (Member # 11141) on :
 
17 Hens, your mailbox is full
 

---

Posted by 17hens (Member # 23747) on :
 
Urgh. Cleaning it now.
 

---

Posted by Fuel1212 (Member # 29312) on :
 
Wow, I made it through the whole post... It was like a great book I could not put it down.

Hen was one of the first people on this forum that comforted me in a time of need, I am so happy for you!! God is good!!

As for mold remediation has anyone looked into Austin Air? Austin Air My naturopath highly recommends them.

So, if I was to come across some money from a money tree and bought one of these.

Do you think detoxing in my infrared sauna would be sufficient enough? Or, would I need to look into other avenues?

I keep hearing about coffee enemas, but have no clue how they work It is not a video I would want to watch either...

Thanks in advance!!
 

---

Posted by sixgoofykids (Member # 11141) on :
 
Congrats on making it through the thread!!!

I do have an air cleaner in my bedroom, but the thing with mold is, you have to remove the source .... and it can be even more complicated than that.

A sauna and coffee enemas are good, and I've done both (I have a sauna, and I used coffee enemas all through treatment). Neither will get rid of the mold in the body, but are good for other toxins.
 

---

Posted by sparkle7 (Member # 10397) on :
 
Ozone is supposed to get rid of mold. Bejoy used it to remediate her house after she sealed off the mold. You could probably use it internally to get rid of mold in the body, too.

Just a thought. I never tried it.

There are connections between cancer & fungus. People use baking soda for that. One doctor also injects baking soda solution into tumors & it's supposed to be successful.
 

---

Posted by scorpiogirl (Member # 31907) on :
 
Hi,

I am interested in learning more but I just can't wrap my brain around to understand WHAT is it and how it helped you all.

Those who have gone to Germany could you please PM me, I want to hear the good, the bad and the ugly. I must explore all options! So thank you in advance you all!
 

---

Posted by Fuel1212 (Member # 29312) on :
 
I would like to learn more also, did some searching last night and did not find a whole lot?

I would love to understand the specifics of the technology. I know light is used to work with the good healthy cells in your body.

Pricing including a good base for nosodes would be wonderful too.

Hen's video was helpful and getting a picture of how things worked. I don't understand how taping those tubes around your chest works though? If there is nothing inputted into your system how does any information or messages get received? Does the light ever pass through the tubes?

Sorry if those are dumb questions.. I actually have a computer sci degree, so I am technical but don't understand everything

Fuel
 

---

Posted by sixgoofykids (Member # 11141) on :
 
There is not a whole lot out there. I have been asked to turn my blog into a book, but honestly, I don't want to spend that much time going over what I went through, I'm past it.

Anyway, if you go to Oct 2008 of my blog and start at the last post and read forward, I explain in detail what the photon treatment is. All you need to read is October to read about the Germany trip, though I have documented everything I've done since returning.
 

---

Posted by 17hens (Member # 23747) on :
 
Bionic 880
http://www.biophoton.de/english.html

PE-1
http://www.photonicenergetics.com/

Nosodes
http://www.desbio.com/series-therapy.html

Sorry, guys, I don't have more time to write (crazy at our house right now) but the answers to all of your questions are on this thread. Read and reread?
 

---

Posted by lymie_in_md (Member # 14197) on :
 
Come on Six write a book! You could do it like a whodunit. As you used deductive reason to snare the evil Moriarty, ooooops borrelia.
 

---

Posted by scorpiogirl (Member # 31907) on :
 
I have only found like 3 other people who have gone through it on the internet and not much RECENT info. But I can't find much info on the impact long term?

Money aside, the prospect of getting better after a few sessions is very tempting. What I was hoping to find was more success stories considering how effective this treatment is, and I'm surprised I have only found 3!! Now I don't know what to think!
 

---

Posted by Lymic (Member # 19335) on :
 
Dear All,

Using the PE1, can I put some homeopathic drops in a vial and tape them to my solar plexus to have the same or even more powerful effect as ingesting the drops? For example, I've got a Lyme disease homeopathic formula that has some other co-infections included within. Can I photoon myself with it taped to my solar plexus instead of taking it under my tongue? How effective would that be?

Thank you!
 

---

Posted by hiker53 (Member # 6046) on :
 
Better to tape it to the solar plexus than ingest it. I would never ingest a homeopathic solution of borrelia, bartonella, toxic metal etc.
 

---

Posted by sixgoofykids (Member # 11141) on :
 

quote:

---

Originally posted by lymie_in_md:
Come on Six write a book! You could do it like a whodunit. As you used deductive reason to snare the evil Moriarty, ooooops borrelia.

---

I'm too busy to write a book. If the publisher still wants it, I might have a friend write it.
 

---

Posted by sixgoofykids (Member # 11141) on :
 

quote:

---

Originally posted by Lymic:
Dear All,

Using the PE1, can I put some homeopathic drops in a vial and tape them to my solar plexus to have the same or even more powerful effect as ingesting the drops? For example, I've got a Lyme disease homeopathic formula that has some other co-infections included within. Can I photoon myself with it taped to my solar plexus instead of taking it under my tongue? How effective would that be?

Thank you!

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by scorpiogirl:
I have only found like 3 other people who have gone through it on the internet and not much RECENT info. But I can't find much info on the impact long term?

Money aside, the prospect of getting better after a few sessions is very tempting. What I was hoping to find was more success stories considering how effective this treatment is, and I'm surprised I have only found 3!! Now I don't know what to think!

---

There just haven't been that many people from here who have gone. I know the owner of the guesthouse talked about a lady who came back every year to get retested and has stayed in remission. It's all heresay like that.
 

---

Posted by dan67 (Member # 20344) on :
 
Six, you say you don't want to write a book because you are "over it." Apparently you aren't over it - you hang out here to help us :-)

A book would be awesome, I bet you'd spent less time not more time helping people, because you wouldn't be answering the same questions over and over. Think about it!
 

---

Posted by sixgoofykids (Member # 11141) on :
 
Yeah, Dan, I thought of that. But it's different helping you guys. It's not rehashing all I went through, and I can come here when I have time, and not when I don't .... like I've stopped in here a few times today, in between all the other stuff I did (taught five hours of pilates classes off and on all day, went to the pool with my daughter, etc.).

I didn't say "over" .... I said "past".
 

---

Posted by Tammy N. (Member # 26835) on :
 
Wow, Hens, your thread has made it to page 5!! And counting. Woohoo! This is a great thread. Such great info. Very inspiring.

I'm definitely interested in this treatment at some point. I finished 3 rounds of AI (I'm going slowly with it.) And now I'm dealing with my dental issues (jawbone infection, ugh, having surgery Thurs. 6.30) Once I get this behind me, I'd like to give the Bionic some more serious consideration. Thanks again for this really great thread.

I hope that day by day, in every way, you keep getting better and better.

God bless,
Tammy
 

---

Posted by Lymic (Member # 19335) on :
 
Hi Hiker and Six,

I was referring to the use of a homeopathic remedy for Lyme and coinfections, which is intended for oral use. Would it be more effective to use the PE1 with it taped to the solar plexus than to ingest it?

Thank you again.
 

---

Posted by sixgoofykids (Member # 11141) on :
 
Do you have a link to the homeopathic?

I found things were stronger taped, but I always tested them first orally.
 

---

Posted by 17hens (Member # 23747) on :
 
Hi Lymic,

I'm just looking around on your blogspot and wondering if you know that Herr Buschkuehl, the owner of the Bionic 880, will be in Toronto this October at the ILADS conference?!

If you have any questions for him, I'm sure he'd be glad to talk. He's very kind.

Hens
 

---

Posted by 17hens (Member # 23747) on :
 
Tammy,

You are too sweet.

I'll be praying for you on Thursday, my friend.

,
Hens
 

---

Posted by pamoisondelune (Member # 11846) on :
 
Scorpio and Fuel,
You can find extensive descriptions of this treatment if you search, here on Lymenet, the archived posts of Selma, aka "Brussels" or "hardynaka".

You can also search her more recent posts on the yahoo group at

[email protected]

She was completely cured using PE-1 plus homeopathic nosodes.

-----Polly Polygonum
 

---

Posted by 17hens (Member # 23747) on :
 
In case it interests anyone, I just found out the nosodes used in Germany are radionic.
 

---

Posted by Hambone (Member # 29535) on :
 
All of a sudden, I'm scared.

I have my glass vials for blood, clear tape, just got my two boxes of Borrelia ( 10 vials ) and Bartonella ( 10 vials ) and my PE-1 is supposed to be here today via Fed-Ex.


I was soooo excited, and now I feel scared.


I don't know if I'm scared about the reaction I may get, or more scared that nothing at all will happen and I am all out of options.


I think I feel like this is my last chance.. do or die.

I think when the Fed-Ex guy gets here, I'm going to f.r.e.a.k.

OMG, were y'all nervous when you went to Germany and were about to do this?
 

---

Posted by 17hens (Member # 23747) on :
 
Yes, nervous and excited and scared, just like you.

You will be OK. Really. I believe this can and will help you. We are here for questions, the PE-1 guy, Selma. You're covered.

Just treat one thing at a time, go slowly. Start out with low strength, start killing one pathogen.
Get your ducks in a row for detoxing.
Remember to turn off the wifi and put the cordless phone in another room.
Drink lots of water (1-2 quarts while treating).
Don't cross your legs or arms (crosses meridian points or something like that).

When I treated in Germany, I was in a room by myself treating with the Bionic. I was on a comfortable sofa and I had an hour and a half to think... so I pictured my kids and my husband (warm thoughts) and I visualized a battle going on inside me. Borrelia with swords on one side and white blood cells with swords on the other. The white blood cells won every time!

You can do this!!!!
 

---

Posted by Hambone (Member # 29535) on :
 

quote:

---

Originally posted by 17hens:
Yes, nervous and excited and scared, just like you.

You will be OK. Really. I believe this can and will help you. We are here for questions, the PE-1 guy, Selma. You're covered.

Just treat one thing at a time, go slowly. Start out with low strength, start killing one pathogen.
Get your ducks in a row for detoxing.
Remember to turn off the wifi and put the cordless phone in another room.
Drink lots of water (1-2 quarts while treating).
Don't cross your legs or arms (crosses meridian points or something like that).

When I treated in Germany, I was in a room by myself treating with the Bionic. I was on a comfortable sofa and I had an hour and a half to think... so I pictured my kids and my husband (warm thoughts) and I visualized a battle going on inside me. Borrelia with swords on one side and white blood cells with swords on the other. The white blood cells won every time!

You can do this!!!!

---

I needed to hear that.


Questions:
My box of Borrelia is 10 vials. Do I tape all 10 vials to me, or one at a time?

I think I saw you taped more than 1 in your video, but you have been doing this longer.


and....


Can I still take my vitamin supplement?
 

---

Posted by sixgoofykids (Member # 11141) on :
 

quote:

---

Originally posted by 17hens:
In case it interests anyone, I just found out the nosodes used in Germany are radionic.

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by 17hens:
I was on a comfortable sofa

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by Hambone:
[Questions:
My box of Borrelia is 10 vials. Do I tape all 10 vials to me, or one at a time?

Can I still take my vitamin supplement? [/QB]

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by sixgoofykids:

quote:

---

Originally posted by 17hens:
In case it interests anyone, I just found out the nosodes used in Germany are radionic.

---

What does this mean?

---

It means that they are easier to manufacture and hold the message easily. Other than that, I have no idea.
 

---

Posted by 17hens (Member # 23747) on :
 

quote:

---

Originally posted by sixgoofykids:

quote:

---

Originally posted by 17hens:
I was on a comfortable sofa

---

Seriously? Wow. That's not how it was when I was there ..... I had a desk chair.

---

Yup, those were the good ole days. I guess you had to walk five miles uphill in the snow to get there too, huh?
 

---

Posted by sixgoofykids (Member # 11141) on :
 
Yeah, you know it!!
 

---

Posted by Tonglen (Member # 18472) on :
 
If you use ozone to kill mold in the home, you're instructed to remove people, plants, pets, etc. Curious, does anyone know why ozone ivs don't kill the good cells as well as the bad stuff? Thx!
 

---

Posted by James1979 (Member # 31926) on :
 
I think the ozone doesn't kill the good cells because the good cells are all aerobic and they like the extra oxygen, whereas the bad cells are usually anaerobic and oxygen kills them.
 

---

Posted by sixgoofykids (Member # 11141) on :
 
I have heard that ozone IV's are safe and good, so is ozone used in the ears, but that for some reason it is harmful to the lungs. I don't know anything beyond that about the treatment since it's one I never did.
 

---

Posted by James1979 (Member # 31926) on :
 
Only high levels of ozone are harmful for the lungs. Lower levels are natural and healthy. For example, the fresh smell during rain is due to increased ozone.

There is a lot of negative propaganda put out by the FDA against ozone generators, and that's why most people think they're dangerous. I'm breathing ozonated air right now as I'm writing this, and I think its wonderful! It has many health benefits.

Because the FDA hates the ozone generators so much, this should be a clue for you that they are healthy.
 

---

Posted by sixgoofykids (Member # 11141) on :
 
James, I have an ozone air purifier too.
 

---

Posted by 17hens (Member # 23747) on :
 

quote:

---

Originally posted by James1979:
Only high levels of ozone are harmful for the lungs. Lower levels are natural and healthy. For example, the fresh smell during rain is due to increased ozone.

There is a lot of negative propaganda put out by the FDA against ozone generators, and that's why most people think they're dangerous. I'm breathing ozonated air right now as I'm writing this, and I think its wonderful! It has many health benefits.

Because the FDA hates the ozone generators so much, this should be a clue for you that they are healthy.

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by 17hens:
Hambone, how are you faring?

---

Getting ready to do it right now. I came to watch your video one more time before I start.

I'm so nervous.


I cannot even begin to describe how sick I am and I'm trying not to get my hopes up too high. But even 25-50% better will be well worth it to me.


Wish me luck.
 

---

Posted by 17hens (Member # 23747) on :
 
Hambone,

Wow, you're like "Insta-Answer Woman!" Caught me off guard!

I hope all is going fine. If you're so sick, maybe start at 25% and don't go past 50% power this time (3 week treatment). Oh, well those are Bionic increments but you get the picture.

Better not to push it when we're on our own, I think. Just go slow and easy and you'll be fine.

Keep us posted!
 

---

Posted by Hambone (Member # 29535) on :
 

quote:

---

Originally posted by 17hens:
Keep us posted!

---

Whoa!

I did it yesterday and didn't think anything would happen. But as the day has gone on today, I am FAR more woozier and .

I did it for about 30 seconds on each point on 40%.

I swear it feels like my brain has gas.

Don't laugh.
 

---

Posted by 17hens (Member # 23747) on :
 
I would say wait 3-5 days before doing it again, use 20% next time or even less, and detox like a mad woman starting now.

What say you hiker, six, bob???
 

---

Posted by 17hens (Member # 23747) on :
 
Reading thru Bionic notes and found this, thought it might be useful...

Side effects and contra-indications

� There are NO side effects in photon therapy

� There are healing reactions though

� Diseases with a tendency of bleeding eg. Colitis are a contra-indication

� Pacemaker,epilepsy, pregnancy are conditions, that are contra-indicated, because of lack of study results


Remember:

� Instead of treating longer with more intensity, treat more often! Repeat treatment until result is stable.

� Always give toxin binding agents, since toxins are being loosened.

� Always give nutritional support.

� Always correct attitude, focus on healing thought, hygiene, sleep patterns.


(Reminder: when it says "treat more often" I believe it means continue treatments until you see results. Treatment should never be more than 3 times a week, for Borrelia it is 2 times a week.)
 

---

Posted by Hambone (Member # 29535) on :
 
I can report that I used this thing on my very painful heels, and the pain has gone down about 75% since yesterday. I can walk today without wincing.

Still feel like crap, but this is impressive
 

---

Posted by Hambone (Member # 29535) on :
 

quote:

---

Originally posted by 17hens:
(Reminder: when it says "treat more often" I believe it means continue treatments until you see results. Treatment should never be more than 3 times a week, for Borrelia it is 2 times a week.)

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by aMomWithHope:
Hambone,

You're using the PE1 right? Does it come with instructions?

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by aMomWithHope:
Are you using both the Borrelia and Bart nosodes or just the Borrelia? Or just the PE1 without nosodes?

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by 17hens:
From the beginning, Dr. W. had us at 10 points for 325 seconds (5 minutes 25 seconds) each point. The only thing that varied was the power (25%, 50%, 75%, 100%).

Now that I'm treating coinfections, the Hz varies but not the points and the time at each point.

---

Thanks. I turned the frequency down yesterday to 30% and used it for a minute on each point.

But I did get wild and turned it up to 70% when I put it on my heels.


Then I just laid in bed and zoned out and kept repeating "Health" and imagining my body healing everything.
 

---

Posted by anemone (Member # 19995) on :
 
17Hens-
Will you PM me Dr. W's contact info in Germany? I'm trying to figure out if I could afford the trip and doc fees.

Six-
Can you PM me the names of the people you know that have the Bionic 880's for sale here in the US, if they are still available?

Dr. K in Seattle is not taking on any new patients this year, bummer.
 

---

Posted by 17hens (Member # 23747) on :
 
Sure thing.
 

---

Posted by Maradona (Member # 24552) on :
 
Do you need to take antibiotics anymore after treatment in Germany with Bionic photon therapy and ozone.
 

---

Posted by sixgoofykids (Member # 11141) on :
 
I did not take any antibiotics after treatment with the Bionic. I have not taken any herbs for killing bacteria, either, though I have taken herbs for detox, mold, and parasites.
 

---

Posted by 17hens (Member # 23747) on :
 
Maradona,

Dr. W's protocol is 3 weeks of Bionic treatment, 4 weeks off to heal and detox, and repeat as many times as necessary until all infections are gone.

During the treatment weeks, 2 treatments a week are permitted, so this means 5-6 treatments with him if you stay for 3 weeks.

Dr. W. will treats 5 times and then tests you to see if you are clear of borrelia or if you need a sixth treatment. If you need more than 6 treatment to clear borrelia, you'd have to wait another month to treat again with the Bionic.

I believe Six needed more, but Get'em and I tested clear of Borrelia after 5 treatments. I'm not sure about Hiker.

Some people go back to Dr. W. a few months later for more treatment. I knew I had more infections than just borrelia and so I bought the Bionic to continue my treatment at home for the other infections. (Plus I am treating my family.)

So if you received treatment from Dr. W. for 3 weeks and then came home, you would likely still have your other infections.

The way I feel now, I could see treating the other infections with herbs rather than abx as a possibility.

Does that answer your question?
 

---

Posted by sixgoofykids (Member # 11141) on :
 
Right, I didn't test as clear, but had the weakest memory of borrelia still showing, so Dr. Woitzel had me do THREE more treatments for a total of 8 treatments over a period of four weeks. He did not have me wait to do those follow up treatment.

I ended up treating for several more weeks, twice per week before I took a break. NEVER more than twice per week.

The rest time is as important as the treatment time and it's important to NOT use any killing medium as it's supposed to be REST from treatment.
 

---

Posted by Haley (Member # 22008) on :
 
I have not read all of the posts on this thread so sorry if this is a repeat question.

If I feel that Borrelia is probably the least of my problems at this stage in treatment does that mean that the Bionic would not be recommended?
 

---

Posted by Hambone (Member # 29535) on :
 
I did a longer treatment yesterday ( 15 minutes ) and am really feeling it today.

Amazing how a light can do this.


Question for anybody who used the PE-1....

I've been using frequency F ( only because that's what the tutorial video at Lumenergetics said to use ).

I just saw that frequency J is the one that rotates through each frequency every 7 seconds so you can receive all of the healing benefits of each frequency.

Did any of you use this frequency? Which one(s) did you find most helpful?
 

---

Posted by sixgoofykids (Member # 11141) on :
 
I'm not familiar with the PE1 frequencies, but I would use the one between 9-12 if there is one. That is the closest to the earth's frequency, which Dr. W thinks should be used.
 

---

Posted by Hambone (Member # 29535) on :
 

quote:

---

Originally posted by Haley:
If I feel that Borrelia is probably the least of my problems at this stage in treatment does that mean that the Bionic would not be recommended?

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by sixgoofykids:
I'm not familiar with the PE1 frequencies, but I would use the one between 9-12 if there is one. That is the closest to the earth's frequency, which Dr. W thinks should be used.

---

Nah. There's only letters A through J.


It says F is the universal frequency, whatever that means. And that's the one the tutorial at Lumenergetics said to use, so I have stuck with that one.


I was just curious since J rotates through all of them every 7 seconds, if that one would be better.
 

---

Posted by sixgoofykids (Member # 11141) on :
 
I would stick with the universal frequency (whatever that means). Maybe get fancy later. I don't know if that's the right answer, but I know we used one frequency with the Bionic.

Haley, I did not have the most symptoms from the borrelia, babesia seemed much more prominent, but borrelia is still the place to start. Dr. W says to treat it first, then the other infections.

Whether it would be a help for you depends on what other problems you think are in the forefront. If it's parasites, I'd treat those first. Metals, I'd treat those first. The Bionic is for the infections.
 

---

Posted by 17hens (Member # 23747) on :
 
Haley, before I went to Dr. W., I wondered if I even had borrelia. Bart symptoms were in my face, Babesia were very slight, and lyme didn't seem to be an issue.

It had been an issue in the first 4 months after my bite but after taking 3 months of doxy, those symptoms had all gone away.

Then Dr. W. tested me. Shocker! Borrelia read as highest, with Babesia being right behind it.

As I look back on the last 15 years now (which is approx. how long I've had borrelia according to Dr. W.'s test), I do see that lyme & babesia have been with me a very long time.

So I thought Bart was my big infection. But since borrelia was removed from the equation, bart and babesia symptoms have seemed much less obvious. Much more controlled. Almost just annoyances.

And soon, they too will be gone - HAH! ( to all my other infections!)
 

---

Posted by Maradona (Member # 24552) on :
 
17hens
Is Bionic helping the same to other family members.
And can you use in kids age 3 -8 years old.
 

---

Posted by 17hens (Member # 23747) on :
 

quote:

---

Originally posted by Maradona:
17hens
Is Bionic helping the same to other family members.
And can you use in kids age 3 -8 years old.

---

Hmmm, good questions.

First...
Is the Bionic as helpful to my kids as it is to me?

I might not be the best one to answer this as I've only been home less than 8 weeks. I think people tend to look at this treatment as "insta-cure" but it's not. Treating with the Bionic requires consistancy, patience, and lots of detox.

There's no reason for me to doubt the machine will help my family as much as it's helped me, it's just that their recovery won't be as obvious as mine.

My daughter has had lyme since she was 7 (she's 15 now). She's had stomach acid (been on 80mg protonix for 2+ years), the "grumpies" and bartonella streaks almost that long.

She treated with abx for 8 months of Bart treatment and stopped this past December due to major brain fog (couldn't attend school for 6 weeks), physical fatigue, and sleep issues (needs meds to go to sleep).

She's been doing liver packs and flushes since January. Since cleaning her liver, the brain fog is much improved, physical fatigue is better, the "grumpies" are even improved and stomach acid has gotten better but not gone (down to 20mg protonix daily). She still needs meds to get to sleep. Since April she has been having hair loss as well (which tells me thyroid or adrenals are off).

She did 3 weeks of bionic treatment (4 treatments with borrelia nosodes and 2 adding a blood nosode)and is on week 2 of her 4 week break.

The biggest improvement I've seen is that her physical fatigue has lessened but is not totally back to normal (she spent 7 hours at Hershey Park one day recently (in 98 degree weather too!) and has started working out at the gym), her "grumpies" are a bit better, and she's been off all meds for stomach acid for 3 weeks now with two exceptions. (That's the one that really excites me!!)

So you see, it's NOT a quick fix, treat it and you're healed kind of thing. It is a slow and steady process peeling back the layers of this disease.

It IS a treatment that strengthens your body, guiding it to do the bacteria killing and healing on it's own (the best part of it I think is treatment without drugs).

Second...
Yes, you can use it on a person of any age.

What it does essentially is the light gives the cells the strength they need to communicate like healthy cells do. The infections weaken the cells and prohibit communication (talking on a cellular level here). The weak cells (not the healthy ones) take their strength from the light and are able to work like healthy cells, in the case of borrelia treatment, to kill borrelia bacteria.

There is nothing about light giving energy to cells that is harmful. Anyone can do it, any age. The only situations that are contraindicated are pregnancy (not tested), pace makers, and bleeding.

I think you asked 2 short questions and I gave you 2 long answers. Sorry if it is too much info. Hope this helps.
 

---

Posted by Fuel1212 (Member # 29312) on :
 
Kind of off topic.. not really. I would love to see a CD57 test before and after bionic treatments..
 

---

Posted by 17hens (Member # 23747) on :
 
You know, when I heard about CD57, I was so impressed, like it was the test I had been looking for, an answer to my problems (had tested negative 3 different times on WB & coinfections).

Then I got one, my family got them, my friends got them, I read threads here of various posters' results, and it didn't impress me anymore. Too confusing, not congruent, not giving answers to many.

To me, how I feel is what matters.

But if I ever get another one, I'll let you know.
 

---

Posted by Fuel1212 (Member # 29312) on :
 
I totally agree about how you feel is what really matters.

I feel a lot better most of the time and my CD57 is at 19..

Anyways I do not want to change topic on this awesome thread... keep it coming all.

Hambone hope you are doing well!
 

---

Posted by jlp38 (Member # 27221) on :
 
I just want to say thanks to all of you for posting your experiences. It is all sooooo very helpful. Antibiotics have never felt like the answer to me and rife seems too complicated for my Lyme brain. It's taken me the last year to just get back up over 100 lbs and get strong enough to do any treatment. So I'm working on my metals now and then I hope to try the PE. The thing that excites me is that I could treat my kids. They're not sick but I know my tick bite was before I had kids. I would love to treat them before they get sick, just in case they are carrying anything.
 

---

Posted by 17hens (Member # 23747) on :
 
Fuel, I didn't mean to squelch the CD57 idea. Sorry about that.

Before Germany, I asked Six a few times how she knew she was better, had test results changed? I wanted "proof."

The thing is, I think, that since no LLMD in the states (that I know of) knows much about photon machines, by the time we get to this kind of treatment, we don't have an LLMD anymore. At least I don't. We are on our own, which for one thing means no lab testing.

There is one exception I can think of. Got'emall (page 2 of this thread) is still with her LLMD. Maybe she'd consider sharing/comparing lab results like CD57s, after she's treated with her photon machine for awhile. Just a thought.


jlp38, that's what got my attention too. My kids.
 

---

Posted by sixgoofykids (Member # 11141) on :
 
My LLMD doesn't use the CD 57 anyway. Plus, he believes the Western Blot only shows exposure, that you go by symptoms to know whether you're well or not no matter what treatment you are on.

I no longer have Lyme symptoms, babesia symptoms, or bartonella symptoms. That's all I have to go on.
 

---

Posted by 17hens (Member # 23747) on :
 
Since I put this research info in another thread, I thought I'd stick it here too, so it can all be kept together...



photon light therapy for horses
http://www.thoroughbredtimes.com/horse-health/2006/september/11/soothing-touch.aspx

photon light therapy for animals
http://www.furrykids.net/lumen.php

photon light therapy - NASA
from year 2000
http://www.msfc.nasa.gov/news/news/releases/2000/00-336.html

from year 2011
http://www.nasa.gov/topics/nasalife/features/heals_photos_prt.htm

http://www.warp-heals.com/
 

---

Posted by Hambone (Member # 29535) on :
 
I had such a much better day yesterday, I decided to up the intensity to 50% and used it for 20 minutes instead of 15.


I was prepared to feel it the next day because I had the last two times....

but omg!!!!!!!


Y'all, this thing is p.o.w.e.r.f.u.l.


You were not kidding. I am a hurting puppy today.
It is definitely changing something in my body. I even get the same weird sensation in my teeth I get when I take Bactrim DS.


Off to go detox and make it an "in bed day".


Lesson learned.
 

---

Posted by sixgoofykids (Member # 11141) on :
 
Keep up with the detox, Hambone!! I know everyone can't go to Germany, but this is why I think it's best when it's possible. Hang in there!! And detox, detox, detox!!!
 

---

Posted by Hambone (Member # 29535) on :
 

quote:

---

Originally posted by sixgoofykids:
Keep up with the detox, Hambone!! I know everyone can't go to Germany, but this is why I think it's best when it's possible. Hang in there!! And detox, detox, detox!!!

---

I'm hurting, but it's a MUCH better feeling knowing that the antibiotics have been taken out of the equation. No more wondering, "Is it a Herx or a medication reaction?"


I'll be ok. I've been worse.


Just so amazed that a light can do this.
 

---

Posted by 17hens (Member # 23747) on :
 
What's even better, IMHO, is that this means the body is fighting back against the infection itself (because of the light). It's being given the resources to fight and to heal. Restoring health, slow and steady, now that's good!

Glad to hear you're OK, Hambone.
 

---

Posted by dan67 (Member # 20344) on :
 
Has anyone had the problem wwhere photons help and cause herxes initially but then the effect wears off?
 

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Posted by Leonardjio (Member # 32906) on :
 

quote:

---

17hens:

I visualized a battle going on inside me. Borrelia with swords on one side and white blood cells with swords on the other. The white blood cells won every time!

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by dan67:
Has anyone had the problem wwhere photons help and cause herxes initially but then the effect wears off?

---

I wouldn't really call what happens with photons herxes. It's not the same as with abx. You feel your body fighting, but it's definitely different.

I just continued to get better and better.
 

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Posted by dan67 (Member # 20344) on :
 
six: When I used my PE-1 a few months ago, it did amazing things for me but didn't seem to last. Perhaps I need different nosodes as time goes on, or to photon blood. Also, since then I've needed treatment for other things too, like KPU, so perhaps my body wasn't ready to fight the infections yet. I recently completed a course of Rifampin which helped a lot, and am doing other things too, so I'll be back at the photons soon... hopefully a less burdened body will respond better.
 

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Posted by sixgoofykids (Member # 11141) on :
 
Dan, I had to use the Bionic for months on end, taking breaks, of course. But I also had to do various detoxes. It wasn't just getting rid of the infections, it was healing the body.

I, too, needed KPU. I also needed parasite cleansing and major detoxing. I had to rebuild the gut.

BUT, having the Bionic to treat the infections made it simpler for me.

It would not have lasted for me either had I not continued treating with the Bionic while also working on those other issues. Also, I definitely think the blood nosode was a key to getting well. I stopped using the Lyme nosodes and switched over relatively early on.

I hope the next time around works better for you. If you needed Rifampin, perhaps the bartonella acted up once the Lyme was treated by the photons???
 

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Posted by dan67 (Member # 20344) on :
 
Yes, I know the bartonella surfaced after I dealt with babesia and some borrelia, and yes, I think the bionic helped with that. I consider the bionic to be among the best options currently available and I will definitely use it more in the future, but judging by how much die off I had from rifampin and how much improvement it gave me in such a short amount of time, I feel like I have yet to benefit from some of the regular treatments, so I'm going to run the gamut through them a little while longer until they don't work anymore. I'm also just starting to use a machine similar to an ondamed but cheaper, and it seems to really be doing something.
 

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Posted by canefan17 (Member # 22149) on :
 
I missed the video of someone demonstrating the PE-1

can someone link me
 

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Posted by jlp38 (Member # 27221) on :
 
17hens did one using the bionic. Is that what you're looking for? The link is on page 4 of this thread.
 

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Posted by canefan17 (Member # 22149) on :
 
Thanks
 

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Posted by canefan17 (Member # 22149) on :
 
So how does the body recognize the nosodes once you place the nosodes over the solar plexus?

And what is the purpose of the red light?
 

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Posted by sixgoofykids (Member # 11141) on :
 
The energy of the pathogen is in the body's energy field.

The light is to add energy to the body.
 

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Posted by 17hens (Member # 23747) on :
 
OK, I was trying to find the answer to canefan's question (since I didn't know it myself) and I found a really good explanation of the way the whole "energy medicine" works.

This is all very foreign to me, but try reading these links in this order and see if you understand it better...

http://www.inphases.com/blog/energetic-healing-and-balancing-understanding-the-process/

http://www.inphases.com/blog/what-are-chakras-and-how-they-function-in-the-physical-body/

http://www.inphases.com/blog/how-the-chakras-affect-our-personality/
 

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Posted by 17hens (Member # 23747) on :
 
If anyone is interested in finding out more about the Hamburg doctor, read this

http://www.lyme-borreliose-hamburg.de/downloads/borr-buch-connie.pdf

I am so excited!! I just stumbled upon this, the entire chapter in Connie's book!

There is lots of info in it about hormonal problems, fixing adrenals, thyroid, etc. Very, very interesting!!
 

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Posted by 17hens (Member # 23747) on :
 
Does anyone know of any other blogs about Bionic treatment, other than these 4?

http://betterhealthguy.blogspot.com/2008/10/2-days-before-it-all-begins.html

http://sixgoofykids.blogspot.com/2008/10/leaving-tomorrow_10.html

http://bionicsurfbabe.blogspot.com/2009_01_01_archive.html

http://zombiemum.blogspot.com/


Oh, of course, Connie's. I'll have to find that link. Any others?
 

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Posted by Hambone (Member # 29535) on :
 
Thank you for posting these links Hens


I was reading one of them ( can't remember which ), and it said Dr. W thinks the photons change the frequency of the borrelia so that it stops making you sick ( I don't quite understand how that would stop making someone sick. )

If that is true, then why do some people Herx? The second and third treatment I did, I felt like I was beaten with a club the next day. Wouldn't that be from die-off and toxins? Why does Dr. W insist you have strong detox tools if the photons aren't causing die-off?


I did my 4th treatment today and (so far ) I do feel a little better than I have. Not great, but after the treatment my mind seems clearer and my feet stopped hurting. My brain feels less inflammed.

It's the day after that has kicked my butt, though.
 

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Posted by sixgoofykids (Member # 11141) on :
 
The way he explained it to me is that the borrelia ceases being a bad bacteria. I don't know why it makes you feel bad. Maybe some of the bacteria dies off and what's left is no longer harmful? I don't think we really know for sure. Dr. W. said that it was his theory that the borrelia stops making us sick, but that it wasn't a sure thing, it's just his opinion.
 

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Posted by 17hens (Member # 23747) on :
 
Never heard any of that before.
 

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Posted by Hambone (Member # 29535) on :
 

quote:

---

Originally posted by sixgoofykids:
The way he explained it to me is that the borrelia ceases being a bad bacteria. I don't know why it makes you feel bad. Maybe some of the bacteria dies off and what's left is no longer harmful? I don't think we really know for sure. Dr. W. said that it was his theory that the borrelia stops making us sick, but that it wasn't a sure thing, it's just his opinion.

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by 17hens:
Never heard any of that before.

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by canefan17:
So those of you who've used photon therapy...

Do you herx like you would from anything else?
Say you do a session on Monday... do you get whacked on Tuesday, Wed, Thurs, etc?

Or do you just get better?

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by dan67:
The problem is that the bionic treatment's results seem to be short lived for me

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by canefan17:
So sixgoofy,

If you're using photon therapy (and nosodes) you're only able to go after a few infections, right? (borrelia, bart, babs, myco)


So I guess you didn't need to attend to other infections in the gut?

I guess my worry with photon therapy would be allowing other bacteria and viruses to take over while you deal strictly with Lyme and Cos

---

quote:

---

dan67:
I am certainly open to this, but when I've done this with almost any treatment in the past, I plateau after a month or so and the rest of the time nothing happens at all. I've even tried treatments for months past the plateau, just to see, but still nothing. I feel stuck rotating everything more often due to this.

---

Hi Dan, It probably would be interesting for you to have your seleniumstatus checked, for if it is low, any treatment will possibly fail because the body's immune function will simply be too low to continue improving.

Check for background info: Selenium and Lyme
Good luck for you.
 

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Posted by kimmie (Member # 25547) on :
 
http://old.spiritualityhealth.com/spirit/archives/healing-light

In doing my research, this article was sent to me and explains a lot about the potential healing effects of light therapy.

Sounds promising.
 

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Posted by canefan17 (Member # 22149) on :
 
Sixgoofy (others too),

Would it not make sense to address KPU before using Photon Therapy?

If the idea of light therapy is to re-train the immune system to attack the infections... wouldn't it make sense to first get your immune system back?

Dr K says White Blood Cells without Zinc are like an army with no bullets.


Well Photon Therapy with minimal immune system activity sounds like potential for minimal results.
 

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Posted by 17hens (Member # 23747) on :
 
I am way out of my league here. Just not to this level of health knowledge yet, so I'll shut up and listen after saying...

Interesting line of thought here. Maybe if you lack zinc, that's a problem. Aren't white spots on your fingernails a marker of needing more zinc? None of my family has those.

What's the saying about staying quiet and people will believe you're highly intellegent? Too late for me.
 

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Posted by Marnie (Member # 773) on :
 
Try topical ionic MgCl for the itchy red bumps. Not all over - just apply a little to a forearm/leg.

Liquimins...Amazon...Blue bottle. Goes a long way. 4 eyedroppers full = approximately the RDA for Mg/400mg. Personally, I'd only start with 2 eyedroppers full. It might burn a little for a very short time.

Trace Minerals Research Liquimins Mega - Mag Liquid Magnesium, Low Sodium, 4-Ounce (Pack of 3)


I would also use sublingual B6 25mg(Source Naturals)- Amazon. Dissolves fast under the tongue and doesn't taste bad. B6 has more functions than any other vitamin.

Source Naturals Coenzymated B-6, 25mg , 120 Tablets (Pack of 2)

Both not horribly expensive.

Might as well let your fingers do the walking.

KEEP UP WITH PROBIOTICS!

My personal fav. is Essential Formulas. Take 1 with a full glass of water before a meal.
 

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Posted by Fuel1212 (Member # 29312) on :
 
My Naturopath also says that the white spots on your nails are an indication of adrenal issues?
 

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Posted by sixgoofykids (Member # 11141) on :
 
I got a lot of benefit from the bionic pre-KPU, but KPU definitely was a HUGE piece of the puzzle as well. I don't know that my immune system would have ever kicked in and gotten rid of the "other" issues without it.

I believe zinc was in the IV's Dr. W gave us, so that could have been a part of the help we got over there .... not to be taken as the Bionic didn't do anything, it did TONS, and I had great results from it at home prior to doing KPU.
 

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Posted by Marnie (Member # 773) on :
 
White spots sometimes caused by zinc deficiency.

Bb uses zinc.

Be careful. Must be in balance with copper. Don't overdo.

This might be a better choice:

CuZnSOD

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Zinc_deficiency Highly recommend scanning info. there.

Rebalancing the nutrients is tricky. Go slow and less maybe safer.

See my other post too (above).
 

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Posted by 17hens (Member # 23747) on :
 
Look who is going as an exhibitor!!

http://www.ilads.org/lyme_programs/lyme_events_exhibit.html

[ 10-21-2011, 10:36 AM: Message edited by: 17hens ]
 

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Posted by Hambone (Member # 29535) on :
 
Some things on my mind....


1) I got a cold sore on my lip. I haven't had one in YEARS, and got one after my 4th photon treatment. Coincidence? Healing reaction?
Photons waking up dormant viruses?


2) Does anybody have any thoughts about using saliva as a nosode?


3) Do you think it would be safe or ok to use the photons daily WITHOUT NOSODES on my frozen shoulder to help it heal faster and give pain relief?


4) I get pretty immediate pain relief on my heels on treatment days. But when the relief wears off after a day or so, the heel pain is getting stronger and stronger. Could this be Bartonella rearing it's ugly head since the Lyme is being beaten down ( hopefully ), or do you think it's toxins settling in my feet?


You don't have to answer every question. If you know the answers to any or have a theory, please share.

Thanks
 

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Posted by sixgoofykids (Member # 11141) on :
 

quote:

---

1) I got a cold sore on my lip. I haven't had one in YEARS, and got one after my 4th photon treatment. Coincidence? Healing reaction?
Photons waking up dormant viruses?

---

quote:

---

2) Does anybody have any thoughts about using saliva as a nosode?

---

quote:

---

3) Do you think it would be safe or ok to use the photons daily WITHOUT NOSODES on my frozen shoulder to help it heal faster and give pain relief?

---

quote:

---

4) I get pretty immediate pain relief on my heels on treatment days. But when the relief wears off after a day or so, the heel pain is getting stronger and stronger. Could this be Bartonella rearing it's ugly head since the Lyme is being beaten down ( hopefully ), or do you think it's toxins settling in my feet?

---

Could be either. I'd move around daily to try to keep the lymph flowing.
 

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Posted by Hambone (Member # 29535) on :
 
Thanks SixGK

Appreciate it!
 

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Posted by Hambone (Member # 29535) on :
 
Did anybody else get constant low grade fevers from photon treatment?


Is this a good thing?
 

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Posted by sixgoofykids (Member # 11141) on :
 
I did not.

I did at some point later on get constant viruses .... that was when I added in KPU.

Fevers are a sign the immune system is working. I don't know that it's good, but I don't know that it's bad either.
 

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Posted by canefan17 (Member # 22149) on :
 
I long for the days where can actually run a fever lol

Then I'll know I'm truly on my way
 

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Posted by Hambone (Member # 29535) on :
 

quote:

---

Originally posted by canefan17:
I long for the days where can actually run a fever lol

Then I'll know I'm truly on my way

---

You are welcomed to come try this thing if you ever want to. Just let me know.
 

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Posted by canefan17 (Member # 22149) on :
 
You're in Florida area?
 

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Posted by MichaelTampa (Member # 24868) on :
 
Has anyone gotten better with this biophoton type treatment (either in Germany or in US, either machine), and seen their CD57 improve from "bad" levels to what is considered non-relapse levels?

I am not doubting it could happen, but as I am struggling with the CD57 and relapse, and considering this therapy, it would be great to hear if someone has seen this happen for them.
 

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Posted by sixgoofykids (Member # 11141) on :
 
I never had the CD 57 test, but I have been well from Lyme for two years.
 

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Posted by anemone (Member # 19995) on :
 
Michael = My CD57 was very high while I was on Una De Gato/Cat's Claw. I've heard it acts to increase CD57 numbers, but can't remember all the specifics. Maybe that would help you. I was also on Artemesinin and some other chinese herbs at the time.
 

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Posted by canefan17 (Member # 22149) on :
 
There's a doctor who believes that taking the Deseret Nosodes orally may be just as effective (or close) to using the PE-1 with the nosodes.

Any thoughts on this?
 

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Posted by sixgoofykids (Member # 11141) on :
 
I have used homeopathics orally then with the Bionic. NO COMPARISON!!

I bought chemtox and metox from Deseret. I used them orally for a few days, and not much happened, so I used them with the Bionic. I was so high from the chemtox releasing the pharmaceutical drugs I had taken (Lyrica, Lunesta, Ambien, Norco, Vicodin), that my daughter's boyfriend still talks about it.

There was no comparison between taking them orally and using the light.

I think taking them orally is good, too, but not as effective. Plus, you have to keep buying them to take more orally.
 

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Posted by blownelk (Member # 27078) on :
 
I'm thinking of buying a PE-1 (wish I could afford to go to Germany and come back with a Bionic, but that's not happening!).

The only place I've found so far is www.lymehub.com, has anyone used this site? Are there other places to purchase one?

Also, are there any doctors in the US that are experienced with these machines? I've read this whole thread and have only noticed overseas.

Thank you!
 

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Posted by aMomWithHope (Member # 19255) on :
 
17Hens,

Any updates regarding how you're feeling now that you've been back for awhile--I hope you are still doing well and even better than before!

Have you started treating your dd? How is she doing? (I'll be using this for my dd so am curious how she is responding.)

Feel free to pm me!

Questions for all Bionic/Pe1 users:

1) If the LED treatment is specifically to treat Lyme (at least initially), and one has to be off abx before doing Bionic, how does one tolerate any co-infection symptoms that come up while going after the Lyme?

DD's symptoms are more Bart, I think, than Lyme. She has managed to stay off Lyme-specific abx for 2 months without any real relapse, yet her Bart symptoms remain and have increased (anxiety, etc).

If she had to stop Bart abx as well for LED treatment, I wonder how she would do with Bionics--how did you all handle this dilemma?

2) Once you return from Germany, how much longer did you have to treat with the LED to be in remission and/or symptom free? (Does Dr. W tell you before leaving how much longer to treat? Is there any followup?)

3) Can you use the LEDs with braces/orthodontic?

4) Can the PE1 be used in the same manner as the Bionic? It seems they both have the 880 hz and offer the same frequencies 11.77 and power--maybe the delivery is different?

just trying to figure out how to perhaps go to Germany for the treatment but buy the PE1 instead of the Bionic and save some $$$, though it seems the PE1 might be more complicated to use? --not sure though--still researching.

I hope you don't mind me posting these questions here, 17Hens. I just figured it would be great to keep all the Bionic info together in one place. If you'd like me to edit and start a new thread, please let me know--no problem.

Thanks for all your help--I really am trying to figure out how to make this work for my dd.
 

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Posted by sixgoofykids (Member # 11141) on :
 
1) My primary symptoms were babesia, but once I treated the Lyme, the babesia symptoms weren't that bad. I did end up drinking tonic water, which has a little quinine, to help with the symptoms. I crashed when I got off meds to go to Germany .... just something I had to tolerate to do the treatment.

2) 9 months. I got better all the time, so it wasn't like abx treatment where I was full of herxing.

3) I have a wire retainer that was no problem

4) I've never seen a PE1, but it's used similarly. The thing that makes the Germany treatment stronger initially are the vials that Dr. W uses that we can't get. Eventually when blood is used, I think this is made up for, but from what I've seen it goes slower in the beginning without those vials.
 

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Posted by 17hens (Member # 23747) on :
 
It's a good idea to keep the info here, I think.

When I went over, most of my symptoms were Bart, but when Dr. W. tested me, I tested very high for Lyme and Babesia and less with Bart.

Since I've been back my symptoms have been mainly Babesia. I don't even know if Bart is still around anymore or just backstage.

I did my 2nd treatment today of my 2nd three week treatment. This time I used only a blood nosode.

After the 1st treatment, 3 days ago, I PMed Six asking what was going on. I was slammed with Babesia (?) for about 24 hours. Not nice - hadn't felt that strongly for months now.

But I did a coffee enema and everything calmed down. Felt pretty good today before and after the treatment. Pretty good meaning, we just finished painting some rooms in our house and I spent the day cleaning up 3 tornadoed rooms. Got 'em done too No resting, just feeling fine to get the work done.

DD will start her 1st treatment of the 2nd three week round in a few days. She's doing pretty well. We're trying to determine if she is well enough to play field hockey this year. I don't think her stamina is there for school AND a sport.

Her hair loss has decreased. She's having a hard time resetting her clock - to sleep around 2am, and woken up around 10:30. Not good for school!

Her symptoms right now are hormone related only (sleep, hair). Her stomach acid is all but gone.

To answer your questions...

1. Just handled it, I guess. I was OK, when I went over. Maybe adrenalin kicked in? When I went over, I had been off abx for 4 months and had only to stop killing herbs. I managed.

2. I don't think there is a standard answer to this. It depends entirely on the patient as to how long one needs to treat.

3. That would be a question for Buschkuehl (Bionic 880 owner) and/or for Dr. W. Someone else who got treatment same time as I did, had a mouth full of fillings, so I got the idea metal wasn't an issue.

4. I don't know much about the PE-1 but I understand one difference between the two machines is this.

With the Bionic, no matter what frequency you use, the length of the light rays stays the same. (The rays travel 3 inches under the skin at 880 nm at any frequency.)

With the PE-1, the length of the rays is 3 inches at lower frequencies but the rays shorten the higher you go with the frequencies. So, in other words, the rays aren't reaching as far into the body when treating at the 9.88 or 11.77 (both used for the lyme protocal I got while in Germany).

Maybe you want to verify this on the PE-1 thread?

Another consideration, Buschkuehl will be in Toronto in October at the ILADS conference as an exhibitor. He is able to bring a few machines with nosodes with him to sell.

A friend of mine is buying one of the machines and will travel to Toronto to meet him (she is excited to get her questions answered) and asked me to go with her. Just making you aware in case I can help in any way.
 

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Posted by jlp38 (Member # 27221) on :
 
Six, how did you know how long to treat when you got home? Did you just base it on symptoms? I wonder if anyone has worked with an ART doc while doing this. It seems like it would be nice to get the feedback on which infections have been eliminated.

Has anyone treated myco with this? I think that is one of my bad ones. I guess the blood nosode would take care of it along with everything else.
 

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Posted by Hambone (Member # 29535) on :
 

quote:

---

Originally posted by blownelk:
The only place I've found so far is www.lymehub.com, has anyone used this site? Are there other places to purchase one?

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by jlp38:
Six, how did you know how long to treat when you got home? Did you just base it on symptoms? I wonder if anyone has worked with an ART doc while doing this. It seems like it would be nice to get the feedback on which infections have been eliminated.

Has anyone treated myco with this? I think that is one of my bad ones. I guess the blood nosode would take care of it along with everything else.

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by 17hens:
Michael Tampa,

My husband was communicating with a person a few months ago who had lyme and treated herself with the Bionic.

I thought I had read in their email communication that she mentioned her CD57.

It took me awhile but I found the email I was looking for - she says, "It did bring up my CD57 from 30 to 171."

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by aMomWithHope:
I had hoped to attend the ILADS conference in Toronto, but I went to the website, and it says the conference is for those in the medical profession. Plus, the cost to attend is quite expensive and more than I had thought it would be.

Between travel and hotel costs, plus the conference fees--I'm not sure we can swing it. It would have been great though to speak directly to the Bionic creator and get the nosodes, etc. I suppose I'll just save the money to use for the Germany trip and get everything there when we go.

I did notice on the Bionic website that they are coming out with a non-medical practitioner's device similar to the Bionic 880. I hope that doesn't mean that they've been hassled and now the original Bionic won't be available to purchase by non-professionals. If we go to Germany, I want to get the device that is tried and true. Anyone know anything about this other Bionic device?

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by gmb:
We have been treating my Lyme and Co's with cold laser therapy, which I think is simliar to the Bionic 880 and PE-1 technologies.
gmb

---

How are you treating with cold laser therapy? Both the Bionic and PE1 are LEDs. I'm curious how you're doing it with a laser.

What color is the laser? I have a green laser, but it's much different. Do you also use nosodes?
 

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Posted by gmb (Member # 23562) on :
 
six,


Sorry if this gets long winded....

The Dr has an Erchonia PL 5000 series cold laser devise. The laser beam is red in the 630 to 660 range and is like a bar code scanner with the light beam dithering across a straight line. Lasers are suppose to be better than LEDs for deep tissue photon therapy. Google Lasers vs LED light therapy for some good reading.

The machine is programmable to a wide range of frequencies listed for many health conditions similar to Rife. There are much more frequnecies than the 10 or so settings used by a PE-1 and other LED devices.

He purchaced the cold laser as a soft tissue injury healing device and later learned it could be used to treat Lyme from a Dr in CT. I initially met with him this past February for Detox support and alternative medical treatment to support my ABX protocols. He didn't present his therapy as a cure to Lyme, but to help build up my body and immune system to help fight it.

The Dr first used the devise as a diagnostic tool during muscle testing. He does have a series of nosodes he uses. He did use a Borelia nosode, but had none for Babs or Bart. He would program in different frequecies and target the laser on a trigger point on my neck and measure muscle weakness against that condition. He initally picked up Lyme, Bart, and heavy metals (mostly Nickle).

On following weekly sessions he would start off with some back adjustmets to free up meridian flow needed to help detox, and do additional muscle testing to determine my condition on that day. Then he would go thru the Primary, Secondary and Tertiary Lyme Frequencies until he got a few hits from muscle testing.

Those Frequencies were programmed into the Laser and I would be moved into another room for an Ionic footbath and his aid would do a 20 minute laser scan of the Frequecies selcted for that session. The laser would be scanned across my chest, upper and lower abs, and sometime my head.

Some sessions we would add a frequecy for either Immune support, Lymphatic drainage, inflamation, and pain management.

In May my LLMD started me on Mepron and after 3 or 4 weeks I was more of a mess. By then we had run thru all the Lyme Freqs with no muscle weakness detected. He was picking up Babs in all my joints and spleen and he moved to Babs frequencies and detox support.

Just starting to turn the corner and show improvements. Weather its the Mepron or his detox therapy... I don't know but will stick to it.

gmb
 

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Posted by sixgoofykids (Member # 11141) on :
 
Thanks for the description gmb. It's very interesting, I'm glad to hear it's working.

I've read about the difference between laser and LED. The LED is scattered light and I've read that it more easily spreads to where it needs to be, but laser can be directed better .... or something like that .... it's been a while.

At any rate, it's interesting that light works.
 

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Posted by Brussels (Member # 13480) on :
 
Testing to see if I can repost as I was banned from lymenet...
 

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Posted by Brussels (Member # 13480) on :
 
Hey, I can!! Nice to be able to post after so long!
I haven't read most posts, but I will when I have time!

Just a comment: ingested nosodes have NOTHING to do with photooned nosodes. The effect of ingested nosodes are good but they are about 50 times or weaker than when they are photoonedin my feeling.

The reason, in my opinion, is that the sick body can't transmit well the ingested homeopathic message.

With photons, you get a boost on the TRANSMISSION of the homeopathic message. What heals you are the nosodes, but what transmits the message to ALL corners of your body and to your ligth body is the infrared!

Many people got very good results with INGESTED bartonella nosodes though. I suspect that bartonella does not react as well to photons as borrelia does.

So when you CANNOT photoon cetain nosodes, why not ingesting them? But when you can photoon them, photooning is FAR superior than anything I ever tried.

I've been a frequent user of homeopathy for about 15 years or more, so I can compare. I had been treated with ingested borrelia nosodes since the beginning of my lyme disease. It did help but it didn't put borrelia dormant, far from it. What put my borrelia dormant was DEFINITIVELY photooning nosodes of borrelia. It's no comparison.

I'm lyme free for more than 2 whole years, without any treatment! But I have just got a recent bite again yesterday (not infected, I suspect), not in treatment, but, let's see.
-------------

Congratulations for all who have been doing photons successfully!!!!
 

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Posted by sixgoofykids (Member # 11141) on :
 
Welcome back, Brussels!!

(I wonder what changed, are you still in Korea or wherever you were that doesn't allow posting?)
 

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Posted by Brussels (Member # 13480) on :
 
Another comment on laser. If it is green laser and something similar to the Laser detox with nosodes or homeopathics flashed on your body, nope, it is NOT similar to infrared and nosodes.

I had been using my own green laser I bought at dr. K's institute with the appliance to flash homeopathics on my body. I don't feel laser is a VERY good transmitter of homeopathic message.

It is a good tool for some things, I feel, but the laser itself is far too strong with its own 'message' / treatment and weaker to transmit the homeopathic message, when compared to infrared.

I don't know how to explain that, but as I told before, I have enough experience with ingested homeopathics to compare with any other method that uses homeopathics.

Laser transmitting the message (if it is the green laser used in Laser Detox at least...), nope, it is not the same as infrared and not even CLOSE to be as potent as infrared to transmit the homeopathic message. I haven't though tried to put the nosodes on my solar plexus while lasering them though...

As I'm not sick anymore, nor my daughter, I can't test things like to compare, but my feeling is that infrared is far stronger for borrelia treatment. For detox, I don't know, we need to compare treatment by treatment.
-----------

HAMBONE, congrats on your PE1!!!! I hope you don't have parasites in your GI tract, they go partying with too much infra red!!!

I love mine too, and I do still use it for many many other things than lyme disease! For skin burn, for muscle cramps, it works SOOO fast, it is unbelievable! And arthritic pains, I do for other people, sometimes it does help too!

Go slow with your treatment, but don't stop if it is creating good results! You still have a long way to go until getting totally symptom free and TREATMENT free! But congrats, anyway!!!!

---------
And 17hens: congrats for your Bionic treatment! Improvement is amazingly fast, isn't it? I ahve been following your thread here and then, but I was banned while in Asia. Now I'm back to Europe, so I can post again. Congratulations!!

As for the PE1, I do suspect it is stronger than the Bionic. If stronger is best for this type of treatment, I don't know, but as far as I remember while trying to compare both, the PE1 was stronger in a few ways.

I was the first person who bought a PE1 and used with the Bionic protocol, that is why I'm telling this, as I had to choose and decide what to buy to start such treatment at home. The Bionic was far too expensive for my pocket.

Well, the PE1 LEDS are of different wavelenghts (5 different lenghts, if my memory is good), it's got more than the Bionic, plus all Nogier frequencies that you can choose, plus radio frequencies added for deeper penetration. You can ask the manufacturer.

It does not have the earth frequency like the Bionic, but it has other frequencies. And the infrared LEDS penetrate very deep (about one inch or more, if my memory is good).

And also, because the intensity is bigger, we only need about FEW seconds on each trigger point, so a nosode session never lasts more than 5 minutes (at least for me and my daughter, we couldn't stand more than 1, 2 seconds per acupuncture point, so strong it was).

So both machines are different. While you can do almost an hour every Bionic session with nosodes, we do only 3-5 minutes, 5 minutes being too much in my own experience.

So they are very different indeed, and if I was not healed with my PE1 trial, I would CERTAINLY have tried to get to dr. W.

I canceled my appointment with him just because I got healed before on my own!

I have easy access to his office (less than 2 hours drive), and to many Bionic machines around in Switzerland. So the only reason I didn't use the Bionic was that my PE1 worked!

But of course, only few people have used the PE1 + nosodes, so if anyone is looking for certainty and experience, go for the Bionic as it is a more sure path.

If you have 1,600 dollars and wish to take a risk, you can buy a PE1 and try though.

I hope I'm not stealing your Bionic thread! If you want, I can do another thread!!
 

---

Posted by Brussels (Member # 13480) on :
 
Thank you, Six!! Nice to be able to talk to you all again. I have though never stopped totally to read lymenet, but not as often as before.

I'm back to Europe, that is why I can post again. I was in Asia for the last 2 years. All Asian countries are banned from lymenet.

I haven't seen a tick during all the time there, too dry for ticks.

I just came back and yesterday, got my first tick bite!! Unbelievable! I'm on a special treatment to avoid contaminated ticks with borrelia, though, so I hope I will be fine. I refuse to go on putting repellents 8 times a day.

It was so nice to be in the forests and mountains without being worried about ticks for 2 whole years! I had forgotten about the tick tension back here!

Anyway, I see you are still doing very well, congratuls too!!! I also did pilates while in Asia, I loved it!

Cheers!
 

---

Posted by James1979 (Member # 31926) on :
 
Why are Asian countries banned from Lymenet?
 

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Posted by Hambone (Member # 29535) on :
 
Hi Brussels,

Thanks for sharing all that.


Do you mind if I ask a few things?


~ How long did it take for you to heal from Lyme with your PE1?


~ How long did you leave the nosodes on your solar plexus? Just long enough during a treatment, or did you leave them on longer?


~ I am using Frequency F. Is this ok, or should I be using different ones?


Thanks so much


( I've been using a few parasite treatments since April. )
 

---

Posted by Brussels (Member # 13480) on :
 
HI Hambone,

- Healing: from January to May 2009 (4 months)
But I had done many things before. I used the PE1 mainly as antiinfective, but I had done most of Dr. K.'s detox protocols at that time, i was starting teh KPU when I finished the PE1 treatment. I had done lots of dental work, scars, I was eating allergy free, had protection against EMRs during the night, had done heavy metal chelation for years, had a strict diet for years, had done MFT and PK for years, etc before having started with photons +nosodes.

I consider photons + nosodes basically as anti infective, but the treatment for the disease has to come in a more holistic way. I do believe only certain people develop the disease, not all infected people, as I see around me people being bitten all the time. Few fall as sick as me and my daughter.

my daughter got to wheel chair in Jan 2009, and she started walking and sitting on her knee about 1 week (or less) from start of the PE1 treatment. That is what made me believe. You can see our whole story in the PE1 and Bionic treatment thread from 2009. She got also to remission in May 2009, so again, 4 months.

She though relapsed in Jan 2010, but symptoms lasted about 3 days if not less (arthritis). She got re-treated, same protocol, and in about 3 weeks, we stopped treatment. Until today, symptom free /treatment free. She's on AI treatement now, to correct disregulations (she's born with a tendency to be allergic).

- Nosodes: only enough for the treatment (so about 3 minutes or so?). And I only used it once every week or once every 2 weeks or more. I never retreated (that I remember) twice a week. I concentrated on CLEANSING in between nosode treatment.

I had MUCH more trouble cleansing than using killers, even before photons. My daughter the same. We used nosodes minimally, but worked hard to find good cleansers (that kept changing all the time).

Sometimes, for cleansers, I used other entrances (trigger points) like the chest (Mediastinum). I don't know why, but they tested energetically so. TOday, I feel it could be because my solar plexus was still full of the nosode information...

I never though photooned different treatments fast, I waited few days at least, so that my body didn't get too many diffeernt information and got confused on what to do.

- Frequency F: what do you mean, for nosodes? I used NO FREQUENCY, jsut direct mode, that is why it was TOO strong. As far as I know, other people did the same, and they all tested independently. Direct mode tested better but it is EXTREMELY strong, so never use it more than a couple of seconds per point.

Frequency F is high frequency, so it could be similar to DIRECT mode, I suppose...

I use Frequency F for symptom relief, but not for photooning homeopathics (as far as I remember). Certainly not for borrelia nosodes.

I could use some of the Nogier frequencies for other homeopathic products, but not for nosodes. It's all documented in the PE1 and the Bionic therapy thread of 2009, all details are there. Use energetic tests to discover! Once your body knows the machine and their frequencies, it can tell you what to use, how long, what intensity etc.

When I used direct mode, I rarely used it higher than potency 6, if my memory is good. 6 was already too much. Sheryl used higher though, and she is a good 'tester'. I guess each person would require different settings. But she also used direct mode for nosodes!

You're welcome! And good luck!
 

---

Posted by 17hens (Member # 23747) on :
 
Hi Brussels! Hugs to you! So good to see you back!

No, no, it's fine to keep it all here - it makes sense this way. We're all just trying to help each other.

Thanks for dropping in here and sharing. I love your posts, so full of details!
 

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Posted by kimmie (Member # 25547) on :
 
Hi Brussels welcome back.

Your timing is perfect as I have been following the yahoo bionic PE-1 group and reading all your post both there and here.

I have ordered my PE-1 from Sheryl and just received my desbio nosodes. Planning to start soon. I will have to go VERY slow however because of my strong history of c diff.

Petra at Dr W's office said they do not have "this big c diff problem with photons". I hope she is right.

Welcome back and thank you to you, SixGK, 17hens etc for coming back to support and encourage those of us still fighting. You all are the reason we continue to fight. I am so happy you remain well.
 

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Posted by sixgoofykids (Member # 11141) on :
 

quote:

---

Originally posted by James1979:
Why are Asian countries banned from Lymenet?

---

Because that's where most of our SPAM comes from. The SPAM was overwhelming there for a while.
 

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Posted by sixgoofykids (Member # 11141) on :
 
Brussels, YAY!! I'm glad you're back in Europe so you can post!!

Sorry about the tick bite. Fortunately, for me, I'm not outdoorsy, so I can easily stay out of the woods/grass and it really doesn't affect me much. I hope this one is nothing .... if it is infected, at least you have the tools to take care of it.

I'm glad to hear you are doing so well, still!!
 

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Posted by groovy2 (Member # 6304) on :
 
Hi All--

I have not been here in a while and I have been Feeling Perty Great except for Breaking my foot
Sky Diving off a ladder --
6 weeks in bed - OucH --

I have read some about the Rife and had a idea about it and wanted to see what you all thought -

Please tell me if this Idea wont work and the reasons why- ect -

The Rife machines are perty expensive for one person to buy and from what I know about the
machine it is sitting around Idle Most of the time because the person can only do treatments a couple of times a week-

So what I was thinking was a group of people on LN that had some extra cash could pitch in together and buy one or 2 rife machines and
Lend them out to people to use--

I think we would have to first start out lending to Groups of people that live close together
so that the machines could get Maximum use -

There would have to be some kind of deposit and a small fee for maintenance of the machines if
something like that is required --

There would also have to be some kind of contract
for use so that people that pitched in money to buy these machines are not held responsible
for there use and results ect --

There are several ways that something like this could be worked out -

I am willing to pitch in some money to get the ball rolling if a Good plan and the details
can be worked out --

So think about this and see if you can come up with a plan that will make something like this possible --Jay--
 

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Posted by sixgoofykids (Member # 11141) on :
 
I do hear about Bionics for sale (not many), so feel free to ask me if you want one. I don't make any money off connecting you with someone selling theirs.

Jay, you might try posting in the rife thread, it's different than the light we're talking about. Or even make a new post so even more people read it.
 

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Posted by 17hens (Member # 23747) on :
 
Brussels,
Have you (or someone you know) treated Babesia with only LED and gotten rid of it? Maybe you told me this already, but I can't remember.
Thanks!
Hens
 

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Posted by aMomWithHope (Member # 19255) on :
 
Brussels--

WELCOME BACK!!! I've thought of you often these past couple of years.

You've been missed here on LN, and your added knowledge to this thread will be most beneficial.


 

---

Posted by Hambone (Member # 29535) on :
 

quote:

---

Originally posted by 17hens:
Brussels,
Have you (or someone you know) treated Babesia with only LED and gotten rid of it? Maybe you told me this already, but I can't remember.
Thanks!
Hens

---

Ahhh she beat me to it. I was about to ask the same thing
 

---

Posted by sixgoofykids (Member # 11141) on :
 

quote:

---

Originally posted by 17hens:
Brussels,
Have you (or someone you know) treated Babesia with only LED and gotten rid of it? Maybe you told me this already, but I can't remember.
Thanks!
Hens

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by sixgoofykids:

quote:

---

Originally posted by 17hens:
Brussels,
Have you (or someone you know) treated Babesia with only LED and gotten rid of it? Maybe you told me this already, but I can't remember.
Thanks!
Hens

---

My babesia is gone. Aside from drinking tonic water for symptom relief, all I did for it was use the photons.

*note- I had used antimalarials prior to using photons, but always relapsed within days after stopping them..

---

You think the blood nosodes did the trick?

Isn't babs in the blood? Does it get into nooks and crannies like Borellia?
 

---

Posted by 17hens (Member # 23747) on :
 
Well, well, well...

Today I did the bionic and then a coffee enema and I found some interesting things in the toilette with the coffee...

Do not continue if you have a queasy stomach!

Anyone want to guess what these are? I looked on lymephotos and took some guesses but I'd love to hear yours!

PS. I have not been on antiparastics since the beginning of April.



alien #1
http://i1098.photobucket.com/albums/g361/survivinglyme/IMG_20110804_171914.jpg

http://i1098.photobucket.com/albums/g361/survivinglyme/IMG_20110804_171900.jpg

alien #2
http://i1098.photobucket.com/albums/g361/survivinglyme/IMG_20110804_172003.jpg

http://i1098.photobucket.com/albums/g361/survivinglyme/IMG_20110804_171944.jpg

http://i1098.photobucket.com/albums/g361/survivinglyme/IMG_20110804_171930.jpg

alien #3
http://i1098.photobucket.com/albums/g361/survivinglyme/IMG_20110804_172328-1.jpg

http://i1098.photobucket.com/albums/g361/survivinglyme/IMG_20110804_172109.jpg

http://i1098.photobucket.com/albums/g361/survivinglyme/IMG_20110804_172411.jpg
 

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Posted by sixgoofykids (Member # 11141) on :
 
Yes, I think that over time either the nosodes or my own immune system as it got stronger got rid of the babesia.

17 Hens, I've seen stuff like that. Anytime I do Dr. Natura, I see stuff like that. I didn't realize things like that were parasites. The ones I identified as parasites were more like worms .... but I'm interested in hearing what you think these are.
 

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Posted by 17hens (Member # 23747) on :
 
Yes, I thought you probably had... but have you ever seen them so clearly? I'm just amazed when I see them!! (Amazed at hubby's steady camera hand while trying not to vomit! )

I thought the 3 in the bottom left corner looked like alien #1 http://www.lymephotos.com/bb/index.html

alien #2,3, I thought I had found but I looked again and now I don't think so.

I hope Gael sees these! Maybe she knows!

I guess the really surprising thing to me is that the aliens seem to be dying even without antiparasitics. (Actually, I've seen these guys for a while now, just today decided to take a closer look.)

The first time I did the Bionic since getting home from Germany, this came out in my urine - often. http://i1098.photobucket.com/albums/g361/survivinglyme/A%20parasite/IMG_20110620_220959.jpg
I thought it looked like Star Shaped Larva http://www.lymephotos.com/starshapedlarva/index.html
 

---

Posted by sixgoofykids (Member # 11141) on :
 
I never fished them out, LOL!!! I just said, "Ew," and flushed.

Dr. Natura is good for this stuff. You'll have to try it sometime.
 

---

Posted by 17hens (Member # 23747) on :
 
That's cuz you're a lady!!
 

---

Posted by Lymetoo (Member # 743) on :
 
Pretty interesting stuff!! Brave man, your husband!
 

---

Posted by Hambone (Member # 29535) on :
 
I have those sesame seed looking things all the time. I don't get the white globby stuff with it, though. Just the seed looking things.

What the heck are those?

Eggs? Tapeworm? pinworm?
 

---

Posted by sixgoofykids (Member # 11141) on :
 
If you have a tapeworm, you will know it, trust me. They are enormous.
 

---

Posted by 17hens (Member # 23747) on :
 
Hambone, what are you doing to detox? What is working for you?
 

---

Posted by Hambone (Member # 29535) on :
 

quote:

---

Originally posted by 17hens:
Hambone, what are you doing to detox? What is working for you?

---

I don't know that it's working, but I am doing Epsom salt baths, skin brushing, Chlorella, burbur, and parsley. I have a FIR sauna, but it just kills me, so I avoid it like the plague.


I need to check out Pekana. Keep forgetting.

What are some other things I can do? What do you do?

I feel like I need to get better about this.
 

---

Posted by 17hens (Member # 23747) on :
 
Wow, impressive! Much better than me!

I'm doing coffee enemas on my treatment days and any other day that I'm feeling yucko (3-4 times per wk).

Skin brushing daily and epsom baths on yucko days.

And burbur if I feel toxicity building. Some days, like yesterday, I did nothing cause I felt fine and I was busy. No, I did do burbur 2x before bed.

It's working pretty well. Coffee enemas are the best though.

I'm thinking (still) of getting a cheapo infrared sauna off ebay. No way hubby will do an enema and he'll need some kind of powerful detox when he starts treatment.

My daughter's doing regular liver packs, bile flushes, and coffee enemas here and there and that seems to be working for her.

Wow, what did we do to keep busy before detox? Take drugs, I guess!
 

---

Posted by James1979 (Member # 31926) on :
 
Hens - why won't your hubby do coffee enemas? Does he think he's too cool for them?

You give him my number, and I'll set him straight.
 

---

Posted by 17hens (Member # 23747) on :
 
HaHa, James! I bet you would too!

Just to clarify, I've done 4 treatments now in this 2nd 3 week round. The only days I felt yucko were the two days immediately after the 1st treatment, so last week for 2 days. Since then, I've been feeling better and better.

Living the normal life is such a wonderful blessing, that I hope I don't ever again take for granted!!! Thank you, Lord Jesus!!
 

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Posted by thehause (Member # 21237) on :
 
I know six has gotten rid of her Neuro issues with the Bionic / PE1 treatment.

Has anyone else improved neurologically with this strategy? The thing I'm mostly trying to get after is the speed and depth of thought which is no longer present.
 

---

Posted by 17hens (Member # 23747) on :
 
I would say my neuro issues have much improved since treatment began in April. Some is still around though, but so are babesia symptoms. It's all a process that I'm still working on.
 

---

Posted by thehause (Member # 21237) on :
 
17hens, did you have the lack of depth of thought / memory / speed of thought?
 

---

Posted by JenInMa (Member # 31544) on :
 
Hi. Could someone PM me with the information you need to get an appointment in Germany?
I would like to know how long you need to be there for the treatment to be effective. I have two sick children that I would bring during a school vacation. Any help at all would be appreciated.
 

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Posted by 17hens (Member # 23747) on :
 
thehause - oh, yeah, still get that slightly when i'm feeling toxic but thankfully it's happening less and less often.

jeninma - i'll send you a pm.
 

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Posted by Brussels (Member # 13480) on :
 
HI everyone, sorry for my delay in writing. I was travelling and getting bitten again by ticks... Anyway, so far no contamintation... I've been searching for mushrooms and doing gardening, hikes... Best way to get bitten, anyway!

17Hens: thanks for letting me post here again!!
As for babesia, I don't think photons will deal DIRECTLY with it. What happens, in my feeling, is:

1) once borrelia gets to the background, your immune system works better and can get rid of things better.

2) dr. K. thinks borrelia is a sort of master-mind of tickborn coinfections. Without borrelia, other coinfections have little power on their own. They work synergistically to help each other. But once they lose their master-mind, they can even go dormant by themselves.

when my daughter got a relapse, and I got a relapse, I can test all coinfections coming slowly, from dormant to being VERY VERY ACTIVE.

It's EXACTLY like I have been bitten again and reinjected with all coinfections. This happened clearly to my daughter in Jan 2009, middle of the winter. One infection appear, then all other tick coinfections appeared and caused symptoms. We haven't been bitten in January, it was a real relapse.

We didn't treat babesia since then, I think (you got to refer to the old thread to be sure), but if I had had real trouble with babesia, I would have memory of it. I had very very TOUGH battles with babesia before I used my PE1. I hate babesia, that was my ugliest infection before photons. I'm alsmot sure my daughter got babesia active again in Jan 09, but I don't think I treated it directly.

I think dr. W. has experience enough to say that many infections go dormant after. I believe him from my own experience!

I guess great part of parasites being seen in urine and stools are part of this process of the immune system getting stronger and doing the job it was supposed to do, but it couldn't because of borrelia or lyme.
-----------------------

Kimmie: I guess if you have no intestinal parasites, you won't see your situation going downwards (except for some herxes, but temporarily, if you take binders). If you have parasites that react with photons, you gotta watch out and treat parasitism first before attacking borrelia.

---------------
Jay: good luck on your Rife proposal!!

Joey is selling his Bionic, but not a Rife machine.
------------

Hambone, I have better experiences with Heel products than Pekana. The only Pekana I swear about is Mucan, that helps eliminating fungi or candida die off. It really helps in a gentle way.

For the rest, my body prefers Heel (Lymphomyosot, Hepar compositum, Solidago Compositum)... The ones dr. W. uses, I suppose.

When they stop working, you got to look into either herbs or tinctures (like Bear garlic, that is wonderful for kidneys, chlorella, MSM, apple pectin, milk thistle, ...). But still the best to correct the problem are specific homeopathics for each person.

Sometimes, foot reflex massage helps, or tapping the 9 MFT points help (very often).


------------
Mom with Hope: thank you !!!

-------
the Hause: I guess most of us who had chronic lyme as main problem got rid of most (or all) neuro issues after treatment. I suppose I don't have any neuro issues anymore.

Most of the neuro issues though (or a lot of them) comes from excess of toxins, in my opinion. They aren't really caused by infection ONLY. Lots of brain fog can go only taking binders, but it has to be the good binders and you got to keep changing them accordingly (to your disease evolution).

--------
JenInMa: I hope someone will PM you with the info. I only got the old address of dr. W!!
 

---

Posted by Hambone (Member # 29535) on :
 
How in the heck do you guys distinguish which infection is your main issue?

Energy testing? Or just the way you feel?

For the life of me, I cannot tell one from the other. When I look at symptoms lists, they all overlap.
 

---

Posted by thehause (Member # 21237) on :
 
Brussels - what binders do you use? I used ALA and a ton of anti-oxidants. My diet isn't perfect, but I do a lot.
 

---

Posted by Haley (Member # 22008) on :
 
17hens please PM me the same information as you are sending jenin MA

Thanks
 

---

Posted by Brussels (Member # 13480) on :
 
Hambone: energetic tests. Dr. W. also uses energetic tests to see how to treat patients individually, with or without ozone, which potencies of nosodes, etc. The follow up of treatment is also done with energy tests.

Before lyme, I would NEVER try energy tests because they sounded like voodoo or similar.

BECAUSE of lyme, I had no choice and went to dr. K's practioners, who ALL use energy tests. Since I started to feel better (I followed ALL their recomendations), and I felt my arm losing force and gaining force with their tests dozens of times in a session, I started to believe.

Now I believe it was one of the best things I learned in my life. It's not 100% accurate, but it is about 50 times better than guessing. It is about 80% accurate according to dr. K. I believe that too, if done by someone with experience.

You can know which infection is active (but not the dormant ones), which is causing which symptom, or if symptom is caused by toxins, what treatment to do for EACH infection, for each symptom, for each toxin building up, the amount of things to be ingested, how often you need and even if the treatment is reaching the area that is mostly affected!!! If not, what to do for the treatment to reach (tapping usually).

As I told above, even if energetic tests done by a good person is about 80% accurate, it is MUUUCH better than simple guess.

Before energetic tests, I could only guess. I guessed I had babesia because of symptoms and because I tood RIamet and got well so fast (then relapsed later though). I could guess my brain fog was mainly from toxins because when I took chlorella I felt better. Etc etc. With energy tests, you do a much better guess. What made me believe was clear improvement.

With energy tests, you can TUNE your treatment even daily. Believe me, you need different things almost on a daily base!!! Not everything changes, but as the ecossystem changes, new critters get attacked, then you need different binders or different minerals, for example.

I was not that bad as I could feel many substances before I did energy tests. But with energy tests, the accuracy got much better!

Candida symptoms overlap with borrelia, bartonella, parasitism... Impossible to know, I agree with you. When you start doing energy tests, you don't care much anymore on your symptoms as they do disappear or change very fast. You focus on eliminating disease as a whole, and with well being as a whole...

If your symptoms stay the same, it means, in my opinion, no improvement. Everytime you are on the right track, symptoms keep changing, like peeling the onion.

With photons though, you sometimes get symptoms ONLY disappearing, and not new ones appearing. Sometimes, at least.

But with any conventional treatments, you'll get changes of symptoms on and on, almost no stop, until you reach remission. At least, it happened to me a couple of times before my final remission of May 09.
------

The Hause: binders I USED, as I'm no longer treating.

Mostly chlorella, MSM when in great need, bear garlic tincture (done by myself or bought), milk thistle, cardamon in powder, and all homeopathics I wrote above, mainly from Heel. I don't remember all, sorry, you got to refer to the old thread to get more details.

Each problem needs to be addressed differently, and binders change almost daily (at least the amount changes daily). Even teas like green tea can serve as cleanser.

ALA is not a good binder for starting detox, but one of the latest ones, when one is already clean as it can move metals into unwanted places. I also used it, but not for very long, and certainly, not at starting point. Dr. K. talks about microsilica...

Diet: the most important is to energetically test yourself for all major allergens. BRain fog and energy improve almost immediately after that. If you eat and feel tired, for example, it may mean allergy. When you eat, you GOT to feel good after, not slow, not tired, not needing to nap, no bloating etc.

You can't track all your allergies or intolerance by clear symptoms. Some food caused my mouth to burn, others caused me loose stools, others bloating, others made me tired, but I didn't know the culprit were certain foods.

I learned that cutting allergens is a very important first step to healing lyme. And beware as the list of allergens increase with toxin build up and I suspect every chronic lyme sufferer has multiple allergies, but they don't know.

-------------------------
Another tip to deal with fatigue (after solving the food allergy problem), that helped me immensely, was Coenzyme compositum from Heel.

Since I started ingesting it (I rediluted it once, I can tell how to do that, so that your vials last much longer), I never needed to buy any expensive Co10 supplement. I needed that on and off with lyme, while lyme was active.

Once I learned to use photons, I took it through photons and then never bought it anymore as I keep using the same vial (until TODAY, I can use the same old vial, after a flu or deep in winter, after any health problem).
 

---

Posted by 17hens (Member # 23747) on :
 

quote:

---

Originally posted by Haley:
17hens please PM me the same information as you are sending jenin MA, Thanks

---

PM sent.
 

---

Posted by 17hens (Member # 23747) on :
 
Hey, I've got one for ya'll!

One of my main complaints these days is that my teeth hurt like I've been grinding them all night. Not even grinding, just clenching them. All day they feel sensitive, sore, like they took a beating.

Any ideas what would cause this, what I could do about or how I could use the Bionic to help with this?
 

---

Posted by canefan17 (Member # 22149) on :
 
What do you guys do for Mold?
Nosodes for that?
 

---

Posted by glm1111 (Member # 16556) on :
 
Hey, Hens,

I mentioned in your pm to me that I thought Alien #1 was the same one as seen on lymephotos, but don't know what it is. I have seen it posted on curezone many times, so it must be more common than realized.

Since there are over 1,000 different parasites, it's more difficult to identify where they all come from.

(I might be inclined not to eat any octopus though) I think the coffee enemas are helping to kill them, possibly because of the acid.

I have seen others mention they had parasites exit after doing coffee enemas. Just to add the teeth clenching feeling and grinding is on the symptom list for parasites.

PLEASE continue on the antiparasitics when you can because you do not want these things to hatch again.

Really glad to hear of the progress you have made on the Bionic! Send more pretty pictures when you have a chance.

Gael
 

---

Posted by tricia386 (Member # 29623) on :
 
Hens can you pm me the info please
 

---

Posted by 17hens (Member # 23747) on :
 
Sending PM.
 

---

Posted by kimmie (Member # 25547) on :
 
Thread: Bionic treatment was great!

I'm again banned from LN, so I can't post again. Whatever reasons, I don't
know.... I know another French person who has been banned too, so it may be that
all Europeans are banned?

Well, so I won't be able to answer questions here anymore, nor PMs. Sorry!!!

Please write in the Yahoo forum called Bionic 880/ PE1 Discussion group.

------------
To 17 Hens: teeth problem will go on until you get to remission and even after.

Gum and teeth are very affected by lyme and many infections, coinfections and
toxins. Specially root canaled teeth and the places where there were wisdom
teeth which were extracted (or still in the mouth) and places that once had
amalgams and got toxic.

If you got no amalgams or metals, you can use photons there to help. The best
though is to find out whether you got cavitations through energetic tests and
treat them. You can use ozone injections with procaine to treat them at least
temporarily and gain time, it is VERY INEXPENSIVE and fast. Or you can extract
the problematic teeth and clean the jaw from cavitation.

The most important is to find out what is the problem. Either infection or
toxins, usually. You got to treat each tooth like if it is an organ. They have
to test good, each of them. To do that test, you got to touch both the tooth and
the gum while asking questions, so that you get both problems (from teeth, gum
and jaw).

never ignore teeth problems as each of them can affect an organ or organs from
your body. Besides, when infection stays there, it is not good.

Either your body is developing infections there as part of 'peeling the onion'
process, or toxins are coming out (it is PAINFUL when toxins come out, at least
for me). Whatever it is, you got to help your teeth and gums to heal. Infrared
can help but it can also move heavy metals , so use with care and get your
binders ready!

In my feeling, both GI tract and teeth are vital for being healthy. When both
are in good health, you are a healthy person. When one is in trouble or both are
in trouble (even if you are symptomless aparently), there's is no health
possible.

First step is to discover what is the problem, tooth by tooth. When you get the
problem, treat it seriously, as though you are treating an organ in trouble.

All practioners following dr. K know about how important it is to treat the
mouth. I once heard him saying something like: "I usually ask the patient to
open his/her mouth. Just by looking at their mouth, I know how are their chances
to get better, if it will take long or if it will be fast!"

---------------
To CANEFAN, abut candida:

I fought candida for MUCH longer than I fougth borrelia and lyme. For me, the
best treatment was:

- constant chelation with whatever method you think fits, but that has to go on
for years without interruption, and always changing substances and methods (KPU,
infrared, cholorella, cardamon powder in hot water, psychokinesiology,
chemicals, rubbed oils on skin, rubbed tinctures etc).

- diet (low carb, NO sugar, high protein diet, fewer fruits; allergen free; add
Rechtsregulat daily that are wonderful enzymes)

- Killers: mostly homeopathic from Sanum, like Albicansan then Sanukehl Candida;
or Pefrakehl then San. Cand; or Mucokehl then sometimes San Myc or San Cand;
Mucedokehl.

You can help killing by adding infrared in the GI area, with pulsed mode
(without nosodes). Always have something to bind toxins as they are VERY toxic
(more than borrelia, in my feeling).

Mucan, from Pekana helps with brain fog coming from candida or fungal die off.
But one needs LOADS of chlorella and other binders too.

Using plants or chemicals to kill like grapefruit seed extract, oregano oil,
salt in high amounts, vinager, pharma chemicals, whatever you choose, will NEVER
be as efficient as Sanum nosodes (or other candida nosodes). I can tell that by
experience. They help, but never get rid of CHRONIC candida or chronic fungal
infections.

If one does not chelate, it WILL come back. Think about lowering symptoms in the
first 6 months or so, then think about getting rid of the infection in a matter
of a couple of years, if on constant chelation. It's not something you can do in
a few weeks, if you see what I mean. You can though lower symptoms quite fast
and live an almost a normal life, while still on treatment.

Once symptoms disappear, I would continue chelation, and candida will ALWAYS
appear again while while on chelation. But this type of infection is milder and
easier to treat.

I don't know of any other treatment, in case you suffer from very chronic (long
term) candida. Certainly, stop ALL antibiotics as they bring only catastrophe.

All candidas and fungal infections start at the GI tract, no matter if you have
them on the skin or in you ear, or on the tongue and you think your GI works
wonderfully well. The source of infection is in the GI tract. It took me more
than 15 years to believe this theory, now I'm convinced!

Just killing will not get rid of chronic candida. Just diet won't either. Just
chelation, won't work as lots of heavy metals are hidden inside the body of
fungi and candida, so you need them dead to bind their heavy metals.

After 20 years of suffering, I think I got candida into control. It can still
come back sometimes in winter, but it is muuch weaker and easy to deal with (few
days on Sanum, light diet, it goes dormant).

I got more trouble to eliminate candida than borrelia. It was more stubborn for
me.

A new treatment that could also work is the Allergie-Immun treatment. But we're
still not well versed in that to know (at home). We're still testing it. I would
use it VERY slow and with care as I think it may take time to see good results
with it and there can be a sort of reverse effect in the beginning (like
allergies getting worse initially, or too many toxins building up too fast).

Whatever treatment is good for candida, is also good for lyme. That is my
general feeling. The same milieu where candida thrives is the milieu that
borrelia thrives.


Tue Aug 9, 2011 11:47 am


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Posted by kimmie (Member # 25547) on :
 
THE ABOVE POST IS FROM BRUSSELS. She is not able to post on here again. You have always been such a big help here!
 

---

Posted by 17hens (Member # 23747) on :
 

quote:

---

Originally posted by glm1111:
Just to add the teeth clenching feeling and grinding is on the symptom list for parasites.

PLEASE continue on the antiparasitics when you can because you do not want these things to hatch again. Gael

---

Gael, I just want to thank you for posting here. I appreciate your parasite wisdom for sure! And I will treat for them as soon as I possibly can. I think they might be causing more trouble for me right now than the babesia.

"I will get you, my pretty!! (Evil laughing!)"

And I look forward to sharing more award winning photos with everyone - shows off my true talents!
 

---

Posted by dan67 (Member # 20344) on :
 
Why can't Brussels / Selma, the most helpful person I've ever read, post here?
 

---

Posted by Fuel1212 (Member # 29312) on :
 
Can we come up with a US proxy server that will allow them to gain access?
 

---

Posted by James1979 (Member # 31926) on :
 
I really liked Brussel's post.

Concerning the banning: I wish LymeNet would just get better forum software. Everything here seems so archaic, like it's a forum from the 1990's. The newer programs have so many protections against spamming that you wouldn't even need to block out entire countries. That's just my opinion.
 

---

Posted by kimmie (Member # 25547) on :
 
Reposted for Brussels...

Could you just add in that thread for CANEFAN that for Aspergilus niger, Sanum
has also a product called
Nigersan, that is recommended by dr. K. in most of his seminars. I never had to
fight Aspergilus for very long, so I didn't use it long term. Dr. K. swears by
it, but really long term.

I don't really follow the whole Sanum recomendations, nor dr. K, but I do think
many of their products are really the best to fight certain infections or the
left-over from infections. For chronic infections,I do find they are the best I
ever tried!

For Aspergilus sufferers, I suppose you got to combine with Mucokehl to get
totally rid of the infection (energetic tests can show that or just follow Sanum
recomendations to stop the cycle of Aspergilus- Mucor, in case you have no
access to energetic tests).

Another unknown group of products from Sanum that helped me very deeply, but
used short term, were the Polysans, that are not marketed as remedies. Sanum
can't market them as remedies. But I learned how to use them from a Sanum
'specialist', and can tell you guys how to use them, without any danger. Only
rubbed.

Thank you again.
 

---

Posted by Brussels (Member # 13480) on :
 
Hi again everybody!!

Thanks to Lou and to Six, I'm back again!
I thank you moderators for solving the problem!

I know it's a huge work (and unpaid) to keep LN running, so I do appreciate your efforts!

Thanks for the support from all!
 

---

Posted by sixgoofykids (Member # 11141) on :
 
Yay! I'm glad you're back ... again!
 

---

Posted by Hambone (Member # 29535) on :
 
Ok guys and gals....

Fever. Why am I running a higher fever since starting photon treatment?

It pretty much stays between 99.5 and 99.8.


Before photons, I'd get a fever here and there. Now it's pretty steady.

I think I may have done too much

I'm on my month off and haven't treated in almost 2 weeks, but the fever is never ending. The blood nosode, I feel, really hit something.


Is this normal?
 

---

Posted by jlp38 (Member # 27221) on :
 
I would think getting a fever would mean your immune system is starting to work. When I was first sick I always had a low grade fever like that. As I got more sick, the fevers went away. Hopefully once you've killed off all your infections the fever will go away.
 

---

Posted by Hambone (Member # 29535) on :
 

quote:

---

Originally posted by jlp38:
I would think getting a fever would mean your immune system is starting to work. When I was first sick I always had a low grade fever like that. As I got more sick, the fevers went away. Hopefully once you've killed off all your infections the fever will go away.

---

That's how it was for me, too. Fevers in the beginning, then nothing, now fevers again.

I just wish I knew exactly what the heck is going on in this old body.
 

---

Posted by Fuel1212 (Member # 29312) on :
 
I would think this is a good sign?

I never get fevers when I am sick... My immune system doesn't know what to do. Fever is a natural way for the immune system to fight off enemies
 

---

Posted by jlp38 (Member # 27221) on :
 
I saw a doc in Spain who wanted me to do hyperthermia - basically inducing a fever to stimulate my immune system. They have a way over there to raise your core body temp. Of course you cant do it here. I've been trying to do it with the sauna but can't seem to get it high enough.
 

---

Posted by kimmie (Member # 25547) on :
 
Hambone,

Sounds like a strong immune response to me. I have heard it is possible to overdue the photons. I think you should wait to treat again until this clears. That is just my thoughts.

You may want to take some oral antioxidants like vitamin E, A & C for a couple days or drink some green tea if the response is too strong.

The antioxidants should help to clean up the oxidation caused by reactive oxygen species produced from the mitochondria. They really help with the inflammatory response.

Maybe Six or Brussels will give their thoughts.
 

---

Posted by kimmie (Member # 25547) on :
 
Oh, I just wanted to add that I do not think antioxidants should be taken all the time with this treatment, only on an as needed basis when the immune response and inflammation is too high. They should help.
 

---

Posted by 17hens (Member # 23747) on :
 
If anyone who is reading here has called the Guesthause in Germany recently and is named Julie, please PM me.

Karin called me today and is worried she misunderstood your phone call. She asked me to try to find Julie and help her to understand the details of the call.

Or if you don't want to do that, please contact Karin again but by email next time. It is much easier for her to use her google translate on an email than understand an American (with all our many accents and slangs) over the phone.

Thank you!
 

---

Posted by aMomWithHope (Member # 19255) on :
 
I was just on the Bionic website, and there is a notice stating that the company and Dr. W will NO LONGER be collaborating!?

What does this mean for those going to Germany to treat or for those wanting to buy the Bionic?

Feeling like I should be freaking out a bit but am controlling myself until I learn more......

17Hens/Six--any news regarding this development?

Feel free to PM me if you'd rather not go into details here.
 

---

Posted by 17hens (Member # 23747) on :
 
PMing you.
 

---

Posted by Brussels (Member # 13480) on :
 
HAMBONE:

Fever: I guess you are the lucky guy? I never ran fever while with lyme...

Lyme bacteria hate higher temperatures.
----
But if you feel crap for long, I guess it could be the next peeling the onion infection showing up?

I had once tuberculosis in my joints, and I may had had fever (I was in such a bad condition that I don't know if I measured my temperature).

It was part of the cleaning (peeling the onion), like getting all dormant infections alive again. I needed to address to it (even took days of antibiotics).

I hope it's nothing too serious. Stop killing for a while and concentrate on cleaning, antioxidants, resting, out of EMRs etc. Crossing fingers for you. If you're really bad, send me a PM!
-------
Mom with Hope:

Even if they are not collaborating, I suppose the company will STILL want to sell the Bionic to you!!! Just contact them directly, without the intevention of dr. W (?)

It would be crazy if they don't want to sell you!!
 

---

Posted by Fuel1212 (Member # 29312) on :
 
With so many people following this thread, I would think this information could be shared with us all?

I know a lot of people that are saving and putting their hopes in Photon, specifically the Bionic.

Please do share at least in its generalty.
 

---

Posted by jlp38 (Member # 27221) on :
 
I agree with Fuel. I'd like to know too.
 

---

Posted by 17hens (Member # 23747) on :
 
Sure, I agree. Here's what I PMed aMomWithHope.

"Dear...

No, don't freak out. It all works out fine, it's just a bit awkward, that's all.

How do I answer this without making some party look bad? They parted ways.

Dr. W. has built his own photon machine and is using it, rather than the Bionic that he's treated patients with for 9 years, to treat current patients. He claims it's stronger.

Dr. W. did not mention another machine to me before I went over for treatment. I thought I was getting Bionic treatment, so it was rather awkward when I found myself hooked up to another photon machine. But in the end, it seems his machine worked fine.

I'm glad I bought the Bionic since this was the machine he successfully treated lyme with for many years.

In the book, "Insights into Lyme Disease Treatment," a German holistic practitioner named K. treats with the Bionic and has had good success. Dr. W. is also highlighted in the book with the successes he has had using the bionic.

If you notice on the Bionic website, it offers a list of other German doctors who treat lyme with the Bionic.

All I can tell you is that I got treated by Dr. W. with his photon machine and I've been using the Bionic since I've been home and it is working.

From what I can gather from others who were treated by Dr. W., he might sell his machine or he might not, but if he does it'll likely cost more than the Bionic.

Dr. W. never mentioned to me the availability of his machine since he knew I purchased the Bionic before starting his treatments.

Hope this helps. Let me know if you have any other questions."
 

---

Posted by Brussels (Member # 13480) on :
 
Hey guys, why you don't try buying the CHEAPEST sota Lightworks model (about 300 dollars, if my memory is good) just to test?

http://www.amazon.com/Sota-LightWorks-Infrared-Healthy-Light/dp/B00152VGZK

A few people treated with LW with good results. The PE1 was just 10 times stronger than LW, they swore. But if you want to see how it works and don't want to spend the money, why not trying 300 dollars on this cheaper model?

People that have both LW and the PE1 swear that they work similarly, but that the PE1 is about 10 times stronger. If you want to use the LW, you just need to treat 10 times longer than with the PE1!!!

Just an idea. Don't freak out!

Do a search in the old threads with the words Sota and Lightworks, you may find the old threads to decide!
--
What I mean is that there are OTHER devices than the Bionic that seem to work. You don't have to freak out!!
 

---

Posted by Fuel1212 (Member # 29312) on :
 
Many thanks Hens!

This does not seem like a big deal at all. In fact this could lower prices with the availability of other options in the future?
 

---

Posted by 17hens (Member # 23747) on :
 
Fuel,

It could! Plus with the info Brussels is passing on, there could be a lot more options. I just know that I went with the treatment that has had a good amount of success and the results I am experiencing means it is working...and that is a great thing! If people can do it cheaper, that is even better...
 

---

Posted by dan67 (Member # 20344) on :
 
I believe the Bionic isn't "special." The PE-1 and even light works do the same thing. The reason the Bionic is so expensive is because it is certified, manufactured according to medical standards, etc. for Europe. But 880NM LED lights are not magical; they are simple. They all do the same thing. It's not a magic box, its just a bunch of 880NM LED lights. Just my opinion.
 

---

Posted by sixgoofykids (Member # 11141) on :
 
Lights with frequencies, Dan. The frequency part is important.

To give an example, when I would use 28 hz frequency, my husband would have to leave the room. If I used other frequencies, he wouldn't. So the frequencies do something.
 

---

Posted by aMomWithHope (Member # 19255) on :
 
Thanks so much for alleviating my concerns.

I didn't mean to cause any ruckus, just was very upset when I read that and was thinking that it might mean the end of that option--

Very relieved to hear that it is a non-issue!

Again, my apologies if I caused a stir--wasn't my intention.
 

---

Posted by Brussels (Member # 13480) on :
 
Dan, in the PE1, we have more than 880nm LED lights. There are 875nm, 940nm, 680 nm and 655 nm besides the 880nm. So penetration is different through different depths. The Bionic uses only 880nm if my memory is good.

Then as for frequencies, there are what is called Nogier frequencies, so the same LEDs above are 'blinking' in different optional frequencies, depending on the way you set your PE1.

4.5 Hz, 9 Hz, 18 Hz, 36 Hz, 73 Hz, 146 Hz, 293 Hz, 586 Hz, 1172 Hz, 4688 Hz

MOst are Nogier frequencies, known to influence different parts or tissues of your body (they are really different, if you try these, as Six says). The same 880nm Bionic infrared light, if pulsed in different ways, cause VERY different results.

Just use these machines for about 2-3 monhts, and you get convinced of how simply changing these 'flashing'/blinking frequecies makes the whole difference.

Of course, the Bionic has long term records of success, so it would be the safest. But Dr. W. is an excellent energetic tester (otherwise, he would never have come up with such magical borrelia protocol!!), so I'm sure that if he is using other machines, they would be as efficient, if not better.

I wonder if, in the end, the PE1 is not even more efficient than the Bionic. Really. Because the time of treatment is SO SMALLER compared with the Bionic (about 1/10 of the time Bionic users use), and it can create similar results... I really wonder. We need more people to use this to get more input.

And yes, the Bionic is used for dozens of other REASONS. That is why it is also expensive, as it has so many possible settings!
 

---

Posted by Brussels (Member # 13480) on :
 
Joey is selling his Bionic (if not sold) in the PE1 forum. If anyone is interested. And possibly with the old price (I am not sure though, please, check by yourselves)

Yahoo forum called Bionic880/PE1.
 

---

Posted by pepperspeck (Member # 18837) on :
 
Brussels,

If one was to treat with the LW, is the procedure the same, using the nosodes and such? I am seeking an alternative method of treatment for a family member but the person is rather fragile. I am thinking that the LW, if it is not as powerful, might be a better choice to begin with at least. It might take a longer time to treat, but the treatment would not be as harsh. Any thoughts would be appreciated.

Also, thank you so much for sharing your knowledge with us. I know for me, I am very grateful.
 

---

Posted by sixgoofykids (Member # 11141) on :
 
Or if you want to contact Joey, PM me your email address and I'll get him in touch with you.
 

---

Posted by Brussels (Member # 13480) on :
 
Pepperspeck,

I don'w own a LW, but I bought the PE1 based on LW users' experiences that they shared here in LN.

I just found out the PE1 offered more choices and it looked stronger. And the maker is such a wonderful informed person, that I decided on the PE1.

I 'll try to get the thread up again. I suppose the method is the same. Atleast two people used it, sheryl and bob, that I remember.

I feel it could be a good starting point, as it is weaker and cheaper. With not much money, you can start your explorations on the homeopathy + ifrared combination.

For what they shared with me, LW was pretty much the same as the PE1, but just much weaker. Both wanted faster results and invested on the PE1 later, but if you want to experiment, why not?

They used the same protocol, as far as I know.
 

---

Posted by pepperspeck (Member # 18837) on :
 
Thank you for bumping the threads up Brussels. I tried a search but must have done it wrong. There is a lot of helpful information in them. Thank you!

I am liking the fact that it is weaker, since the person to use it is so fragile right now. I know detox is important with treatment and her body can not be overwhelmed.

I will post an update if anyone is interested in her progress which whichever machine I finally choose.
 

---

Posted by pamoisondelune (Member # 11846) on :
 
Selma says Candida HATES infrared!

That seemed to work for me.

Always before i avoided the abdomen, because people warn that it could awaken parasites and Babesia.

I was doing a PE-1 session, on Direct/ Intensity 10,
and i got brave and put it 1 minute on L front abdomen and 1 min on R front abdomen.

It didn't bring out parasites or Babesia and it knocked down the Candida. That was on Monday, this is Wednesday.

Thanks, Selma!

Polly Polygonum
 

---

Posted by 17hens (Member # 23747) on :
 
Actually one of Dr. W/s points of treatment in his Lyme Protocol is just above the belly button. I do it everytime.


A thought (Six, Brussels, anyone?)... if Bartonella is so easily passed around a family, (sharing a fork, a glass, a kiss) then what do you think about making a nosode from spit. Might that capture it?
 

---

Posted by sixgoofykids (Member # 11141) on :
 
No idea, 17 Hens. My bartonella is gone .... I'm not sure what got rid of it. My hunch is that it was my immune system being stronger after the Lyme was gone.
 

---

Posted by 17hens (Member # 23747) on :
 
I think mine is gone too. But my son has it and the blood nosode from a few drops from the finger doesn't seem to do a thing. Doesn't hurt to try it, I guess.
 

---

Posted by sixgoofykids (Member # 11141) on :
 
Mine took MONTHS to go away. Give it time.
 

---

Posted by m0joey (Member # 13494) on :
 
Deseret Biologicals carries Bart nosodes. However, you must transfer it from the brown vials to clear vials. In several of our experiences, there's something about the brown vials that blocks the treatment
 

---

Posted by Brussels (Member # 13480) on :
 
Peppersp, you're welcome!

----------
Polly Pol, good you feel candida got better. It is not a solo treatment (infrared for candida) but they don't like it.

I was never brave to use it without pulsing though! I pulsed around my whole waist (without nosodes), and never on 10, but lower (max 7 or so?). It was divine!!

Good luck!
----------
17 hens, I use it laterally too, I find it helps. The back part (from back) is less efficient, but I do flash there too. Belly button part is though the strongest, I agree!

----------
Bart: it reacts to nosodes. Sheryl sells them or go to Deseret Biologicals (real homeopathy).

I would CERTAINLY give a try on their bart series if my bart came back.

I fought bart a lot BEFORE I used photons. When my borrelia got dormant, bart got too. But before, I swear bart was a damm hard infection to get under control.

I would try ingested (bart nosodes) or through photons ONLY in case my borrelia nosodes treatment would be finished. No parallel treatment with borrelia and photons (I wouldn't attempt that!!).

Bart nosodes react well even when only ingested, and even for people that NEVER used infrared. So it could be a big hit.

Saliva nosodes, one can always do, as well as urine nosodes. If you react to them, it means, they did something, right? Whatever you catch on saliva and urine, is the right individualized treatment for you!!�

You just have to find out which dilutions (as I'm not familiarized with undiluted stuff, like undiluted blood like dr.W uses...)
-------------
Hi Joe!! Long time no see you! Could you sell your Bionic?

I just saw somethign about CFS in betterhealthguy (A deep Look Beyong Lyme, conference 2011):

�Viruses in the nervous system are likely not the cause of CFS. They are certainly often present, but when treated, the patient may only get a little better.

The two main causes are parasites (mainly lungworm) and chronic nasal staph infection. These nasal infections enter the hypothalamus which then leads to suppression of MSH. One's level of fatigue and level of MSH are directly related. MSH is depressed by bacteria and mycotoxins.

If you are interested, take a look at the whole article in better healthguy as he speaks how to dea with these nasal infections (with sanum usually) or candia /parasites.
 

---

Posted by Brussels (Member # 13480) on :
 
Joey is right, brown vials work only minimally compared to transparent vials!
 

---

Posted by thehause (Member # 21237) on :
 
m0joey,

Youre inbox if full.

I have heard you have xmrv, which i do as well. Have you gotten any recovery from your neurological symptoms?

I have been in treatment for a few years now for Lyme and really haven't gotten too far. I still have Lyme Encephalopathy, which I believe is causing major neuro, attention, and personality issues.

Hause.
 

---

Posted by Hambone (Member # 29535) on :
 
I resumed treatment yesterday after an almost 4 week break.

I used a blood nosode again.

And oh my lord, it has hit on something huge!


Why am I feeling like I take a beating now when I do a treatment, vs how some people say they feel better after a treatment?

Only one time did I feel slightly better after a treatment (the first time with a blood nosode, I think ).

The treatment I did yesterday has been the hardest one yet. It think it's my 8th in all, and first one after a break.

I even used a lower intensity starting it again, and for a lesser amount of time on each point. The only difference was I used a fresh blood nosode with a little more blood than I used before.


I was tested for the MTHFR defect this past Monday but don't have the results yet. Could this be an issue even with photoning?

I'm almost positive I have the defect.

I am sooooooo sore all over

This detoxing stuff I use just isn't cutting it. I guess I'll go try a coffee enema. Uggggg
 

---

Posted by sixgoofykids (Member # 11141) on :
 
I had more of a reaction when I used more blood, too.

I did use coffee enemas almost daily when treating, also whey protein powder shakes.
 

---

Posted by Hambone (Member # 29535) on :
 

quote:

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Originally posted by sixgoofykids:
I had more of a reaction when I used more blood, too.

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Originally posted by sixgoofykids:

I didn't feel horrible like when treating with abx, but I did feel my body was working hard when I used photons.

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Well at least I don't have that poisoned feeling I had with abx's. I just feel like I had the snot beat out of me.
 

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Posted by sixgoofykids (Member # 11141) on :
 
Your body is working hard. Let it rest for a few days for the photons to work. It's an intense treatment.

Have some coffee ..... it's an amazing help ....
 

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Posted by Brussels (Member # 13480) on :
 
To Hambone,

Binders, binders!! And homeopathic cleansing products may help. But you got to test these, to be sure or it's like shooting in the dark!

That is why I keep telling you all: the killing part is the easiest in a protocol, even with photons. Just one treatment, easy explanation, one or few substances do the killing job well.

In all protocols, killing is the easiest. That is not where people should concentrate their attention (or desperation! )

What is hard is what comes after, the cleansing part. That shall occupy 80% of your time in finding out what you need exactly, 80% of your treatment budget, and 80% of overal treating time in a day and energy (as cleansers keep changing as your organs keep needing help in different times, and different substances).

If you cleanse well, your life goes like you are not sick, nor treating anything. It goes very smooth.

If you don't cleanse, you can go one or more steps backwards on improvement instead of goig forwards, and killing will slowly stop by itself.

And you can get to the point of having to go to emergency for whatever problems it may appear.

With photons, you can't stop your body killing, so it's the dangerous point, in my feeling.

Go slow!!!!!! Slowly wins the race!!
 

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Posted by Brussels (Member # 13480) on :
 
As for the poisoning feeling, I know exactly what you mean. You can be sure that the herxes you feel are not chemical poisoning, but merely herxes (also poisoning, but from bacteria die off and inflammation).

I hope you feel better soon! Keep trying new binders, teas and try the 9MFT point tapping constantly!
 

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Posted by dan67 (Member # 20344) on :
 
Brussels,

Which binders do you recommend? I use Apple Pectin.
 

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Posted by Brussels (Member # 13480) on :
 
According to dr. W, after photons, cells dump toxins out plus the die off toxins, it makes a poisonous cocktail...

DAn, I don't know what to say, there were so many different things I used. The secret is energy test.

Are you doing the photon treatment and taking only apple pectin?

You can do guesses on what binders you need (my guess would be MAINLY chlorella, bear garlic, cardamon and all homeopathics used by dr. W like Hepar comp, lymphomyosot, solidago comp), or you can test energetically and find out exactly what is missing or what you don't need from the list above.

And believe me, it will be changing every day. Either in amount, in the combination, you have to add things and take off others. But you feel almost perfect, so its worth to keep looking to find what you need.

Magnesium is a must (dr. W. also puts in his cocktail), away from EMFs, no killer whatsoever. Dr. W. even doesn't recommend supplements, but he gives his cleasers through IV plus ozone... We treating solo have no choice than ingest.

Last year, I learned about breathing (a technique derived from the Pranayama from yogha), in the course Art of Living. It was a profound experience of detox for me (and I had no lyme already for more than a year when I did the course). They call it Sudarshan Kriya.

I had an intense physical detox experience and my head was in the clouds like smoking smocking herb for 3 weeks, non stop.

Today, when I feel anxious, I feel any toxins showing up (because of whatever reasons, KPU or just common colds), I mainly only breathe.

The logic on the breathing detox effect might have to do with oxygenation. I just remember that because I was reading again Connie's chapter on dr. W and he talks about ozone, and he says it works to clean the blood by oxygenation. I suppose breathing does similar, in case you have no access to ozone.

So, not moving, just sit upright or stand up, and let your body breathe deeply, start slowly, from nose or mouth, as you wish (I use only nose), you can vary the speed in 3 or 4 speeds.

The fastest must be VERY fast to the point you feel the oxygen in your brain clearly. Keep on for at least one minute, then change to slowest rhythm, and so on. If you do that for 5-10 minutes, whatever variation your body feels necessary, you can already feel some results (relaxing, for me).

The slowest is about one full breath (in and out) a second or so.

Just an idea, but I think it can be very powerful for helping detox and relax.
 

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Posted by 17hens (Member # 23747) on :
 
I think this was the thread that talked about Bionic waking up parasites but not killing them.

I'm not so sure about that anymore.

(Forgive me if it was another thread, I can't think very well today. I've got my first real full blown cold and my head's in a cloud. I just don't have the energy to read back thru to make sure this is the thread or if it was another.)

I have seen more "aliens" in the toilet since starting Bionic treatment then I ever did when I took 4 months of Parastroy.

The last 3 weeks, I've been treating with the Bionic w/ blood nosode at 10 points.

I am taking a few supps (multi, thyroid support) and probiotic. I am drinking tonic water and every few days am adding some grapefruit seed extract. And every day or every other day I am doing a coffee enema.

I don't know if it's the Bionic or the tonic or the enema, but something has them falling out of me. And I'm feeling less parasite symptoms.

My husband did the bionic 2 days ago, and for the first time EVER, he called me in the bathroom to show me aliens.

I'm not convinced the bionic does not kill parasites. I'm believe it wakes them up, but I'm starting to think it kills them too.
 

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Posted by Mo (Member # 2863) on :
 
thsank you 17 hens and everyone who has contributed to so many chronicles of bionic/photon treatment.

you help many, many people!!!!
 

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Posted by dan67 (Member # 20344) on :
 
When I was herxing from photoning bactrim, I thought I had awakened parasites but it turned out to be a big herx and all the symptoms died down and improved greatly.
 

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Posted by Brussels (Member # 13480) on :
 
Great news, 17hens!!�

There are so many parasites, I am glad to hear you got the good ones that are killed by light!!!

I know that bacteria is a bit the same, some HATE photons and die, some don't die.

As for viruses, so far, most hate infrared. And same as yeast.

I'll keep your experiences in my head!!! Thanks for sharing. If you know which are the nasty critters, please share with us!
 

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Posted by glm1111 (Member # 16556) on :
 
hens, I am not sure about the bionic killing parasites, but I have seen several people post that they saw parasites after doing a coffee enema.

I always say, "whatever works" If eating chocolate chip cookies kills them, well then just eat more chocolate chip cookies.

P. S. I eat ice cream because it keeps them in the G.I. track, and I eat the antiparasitic herbs and it kills them while they eat the ice cream.

Gael
 

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Posted by Brussels (Member # 13480) on :
 
Another point: when borrelia goes, I swear that your immune system gets better in GENERAL.

Because of long term borrelia infection, I am a firm believer that parasites grow as they want, in our GI tract, in great amounts.

In other conditions, with a strong immune system, parasites won't have as good chance as with long term borrelia or long term candida.

Borrelia is EXTREMELY immunesupressive. And it also could be that some of your parasites are dying because your body's immune system is finally waking up and doing what it is supposed to do now.

But as for your husband, that would be TOO fast to be true. So it could be the light that really kills!!!
 

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Posted by 17hens (Member # 23747) on :
 
Brussels - liver fluke (many after most every coffee enema) and 6"flat worm (w/out coffee enemas). I've gotten more than that after enemas, (I think photo links are on this thread and maybe others) but the flat worms did not follow enema.

My husband did not do coffee enema, ONLY bionic. His were flat worms too, I think. Other people's aliens are so much more disgusting (mine were pretty cute)! JK!!!

It is interesting, you're right, that I get my first cold just days after alien appearance.

Gael - Choc. chips and ice cream? No wonder I like you!!! Come over and we'll have a party!! You're welcome to come too, Selma! Bring some Lindt choco with you, will you please?
 

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