D Bergy
Frequent Contributor (1K+ posts)
Member # 9984
posted
Hello all.
Does anyone know all the North American strains of Borellia found in the population? I am looking for the probability ranking of one strain over the rest.
I know Borellia Burgdorferi would likely be the most common. What would second and third most likely be?
Thinking my wife either has more than one strain or may not have the most common strain. Just a hypothesesis I intend to test in the future.
Thank you.
Dan
Posts: 2919 | From Minnesota | Registered: Aug 2006
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Tricky Tickey
Frequent Contributor (1K+ posts)
Member # 26546
posted
In the south, it would be Borrelia lonestari. It mutates, no doubt, and I don't doubt that there are undiscovered spirochetes everywhere.
-------------------- Early Disseminated LD- 2010. Currently doing acupuncture and yoga. Negative Igenex (IND & Pos Bands) ISSUES AFTER: Tendonitis, letter reversal, Low immune system. PREVENTION:SaltC,Iodine,Humaworm, Chiropractic. Posts: 1013 | From In a van down by the river. | Registered: Jun 2010
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Catgirl
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posted
You might try garinii.
-------------------- --Keep an open mind about everything. Also, remember to visit ACTIVISM (we can change things together). Posts: 5418 | From earth | Registered: Mar 2011
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D Bergy
Frequent Contributor (1K+ posts)
Member # 9984
posted
Well, I have been working with frequency treatments for my Crohn's and my wife's Lyme for ten years or so. Both well under control but one thing bothers me about her Lyme.
I often use Char Boehm's a DNA based frequencies for various pathogens. They have proven to be exceptionally reliable with one glaring exception.
The DNA based frequencies for Borellia burgdorferi never worked well. That's unprecedented in my experience.
Also, a very commonly effective Lyme frequency of 432 Hz never helped her.
Not a lot to go on but I have gone off of less. It seems to me the most likely explanation would be I was treating the wrong strain with her frequencies.
I may be able to eliminate it entirely if that is the case. Don't know that for certain but it is worth another try with a frequency set for another strain.
Thanks for giving me some more info to work with.
Dan
(breaking up the post for easier reading for many here)
Bartenderbonnie
Frequent Contributor (1K+ posts)
Member # 49177
posted
I live in western New York. My county did a tick sweep in May. I called the county health department and asked what the results were.
They told me 80% of the ticks collected tested positive for borrelia burgdoferi and borreilia miyamotoi. Yikes !
I kind of know what I m up against. . .
Posts: 2977 | From Florida | Registered: Nov 2016
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D Bergy
Frequent Contributor (1K+ posts)
Member # 9984
posted
Did some have both strains or did they have one or the other?
Dan
Posts: 2919 | From Minnesota | Registered: Aug 2006
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Bartenderbonnie
Frequent Contributor (1K+ posts)
Member # 49177
posted
I m sorry but I can't answer your question.
When I called the health department and asked what species was found, they kept telling me borrelia. I said, I know the genus is borrelia, but what is the species of the borrelia that was found? He put me on hold for 5 minutes and said burgdoferi and miyamotoi.
Clearly, ostrich head in the sand mentality in this area !
Posts: 2977 | From Florida | Registered: Nov 2016
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D Bergy
Frequent Contributor (1K+ posts)
Member # 9984
posted
You had the good sense to get the information from a reliable source. I am just not sure if two different strains can typically exist in one organism. I assume they can but never verified that.
Dan
Posts: 2919 | From Minnesota | Registered: Aug 2006
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me
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Member # 45475
-------------------- Just sharing my experiences, opinions, and what I've read and learned. Not medical advice. Posts: 1431 | From USA | Registered: Mar 2015
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Brussels
Frequent Contributor (5K+ posts)
Member # 13480
The crazy thing is that all of these strains were found in humans (in form of antibodies) ALL OF THEM in about 90% or MORE of their samples!!??
It means, if my brain understood that, that each person has a positive serology for ALL those strains in about 90% of cases!!! ?
Posts: 6199 | From Brussels | Registered: Oct 2007
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Brussels
Frequent Contributor (5K+ posts)
Member # 13480
This article explains more clearly how they divide borrelia genus into species...
---------------------------------------- Lyme borreliosis (LB) is a tick-borne spirochetal infection caused by three Borrelia species: Borrelia afzelii, B. garinii, and B. burgdorferi sensu stricto.
Previous research based on analysis of ospC sequences allowed the definition of 58 groups .
(Brussels: I think that means there are 58 groups of Borrelia known to researchers...)
Therefore, we studied 80 disseminated-form isolates whose ospC sequences were unknown. Of these, 28 (35%) belonged to previously known invasive groups.
Moreover, new invasive groups were identified: six of B. afzelii, seven of B. garinii, and one of B. burgdorferi sensu stricto.
This study confirmed that invasive strains are not distributed among all 69 ospC groups but belong to only 24 groups.
This suggests that OspC may be involved in the invasiveness of B. burgdorferi.
----------------------- Brussels: I don't know what that all means, but certainly there are A LOT of Borrelia groups, and researchers are trying to figure out how to classify these.
Probably, there are many subspecies (like 6 subspecies of B. afzelii, 7 of garinii, and another subspecies of burgdorferi...
Posts: 6199 | From Brussels | Registered: Oct 2007
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Brussels
Frequent Contributor (5K+ posts)
Member # 13480
I don't know if you can see that Figure, but if not, click on Fig 2 on the link above.
UPGMA-based tree of invasive ospC sequences from 100 isolates available in data banks (indicated by their accession numbers) and the 25 ospC sequences determined in this study.
B. b. ss, B. burgdorferi sensu stricto;
B. ga., B. garinii;
B. af., B. afzelii;
B. va., B. valaisiana.
--------------------------- What is ospC: these are sequences of aminoacids (protein) found in the outer surface of borrelia.
It may mean, if I understand well, different strains of Borrelia or sorts of subspecies of Borrelia...
here they explain how they sort of find out /define some new strains / subspecies, if I understood it well...
Posts: 6199 | From Brussels | Registered: Oct 2007
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posted
In this country, I've heard most about B burgdorferi, B miyamotoi, B bissettii and B lonestari.
Posts: 13116 | From San Francisco | Registered: May 2006
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D Bergy
Frequent Contributor (1K+ posts)
Member # 9984
posted
I suppose I just have to work through the list one at a time. I didn't realize how many possibilities there were.
It would have been easier to do this when she was more symptomatic. I guess nothing else is easy with Lyme either.
You people are the best when it comes helping out. Smartest most informed group I have seen concerning this disease.
Many thanks.
Dan
Posts: 2919 | From Minnesota | Registered: Aug 2006
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Tincup
Honored Contributor (10K+ posts)
Member # 5829
posted
Hey Dan,
There are over 300 known strains and the list is growing at a regular pace.
Once in the host a strain can change forms and become something else.
A tick can harbor many strains and pass along none, some or all.
In Minnesota they've recently found a new strain- and have named it after the Hold The Mayo Clinic- of all rotten things to do. It is called Borrelia mayonii.
Most strains, other than B. burgdorferi, can not be picked up on standard tests.
Examples- there are approximately 50 strains of B. afzelii, most commonly detected in European and other countries than the USA. There are approximately 30 known B. garinii strains. Also considered more prominent in other countries.
Here is a list that will give you an idea of the various species/strains. I am pretty sure the list is not complete.
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