posted
Denny, welcome to our 24/7 educational/support board.
I was going to copy/paste my newbie links for you, but my wordprocessor is acting up right nw.
Go to the top of MEDICAL, page 1, look for TREEPATROL'S NEWBIE LINKS. Print this off...it will help you later on. Mark off as you read site. Many months of reading there.
Print off Dr. B's 05 guidelines treatment too, about 40 pages.
The western blot numbers are discussed in detail on tree's site.
Good luck; enjoy the site. Use the search also for medicl or general stuf. Show a SPECIFIC subject you are after on your posts/searches; you should have a lot of finding thins.
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BostonLyme2005
Unregistered
posted
Hi,
Not sure what to tell you, but maybe by bumping this up someone else with more experience will read it and help you.
posted
Below is the breakdown of the Western Blot bands: 9 cross-reactive for Borrellia 12 specific for Bb 18 unknown 20 cross-reactive for Borrellia 21 unknown 22 specific for Bb, probably really the 23/25 band 23-25 outer surface protein C (OspC), specific for Bb 28 unknown 30 unknown; probably an outer surface protein; common in European and one California strain 31 outer surface protein A (OspA), specific for Bb 34 outer surface protein B (OspB); specific for Bb 35 specific for Bb 37 specific for Bb 38 cross-reactive for Bb 39 is a major protein of Bb flagellin; specific for Bb 41 flagellin protein of all spirochetes; this is usually the first to appear after a Bb infection and is specific for all Borrellia 45 cross-reactive for all Borellia (sometimes people with Lyme who have this band positive also have the co-infection Ehrlichiosis) 50 cross-reactive for all Borrellia 55 cross-reactive for all Borrellia 57 cross-reactive for all Borrellia 58 unknown but may be a heat-shock Bb protein 60 cross reactive for all Borrellia 66 cross-reactive for all Borrelia, common in all bacteria 83 specific antigen for the Lyme bacterium, probably a cytoplasmic membrane 93 unknown, probably the same protein in band 83, just migrates differently in some patients
No Lyme test is completely reliable and results can vary by lab. Lyme reputable labs often have more sensitive testing and test a greater number of bands. Tests should be used to aid in diagnosis not determine diagnosis. Although the CDC requires a large number of bands to show for the test to be considered positive, many people who have Lyme do not have this many bands show. Often, Lyme doctors focus on which bands show, some are specific for Lyme disease.
-------------------- I'm gonna get that lyme !!! Posts: 61 | From Erie, PA | Registered: Dec 2005
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bettyg
Unregistered
posted
Denny, as I stated above, go to TREEPATROL'S NEWBIE LINKS shown below. The western blot numbers & meanings are in there...just read them ok! Print off Treepatrol's newbie link pages, 10+ of them for your future reference; you'll use them often.
Here's what I was unable to get to last night on some newbie links.
Welcome to this 24/7 LYME support group board!
Here's TREEPATROL's and Tincup's combination newbie links.
Print off the links then check them off as you read as you could spend several months reading all of this.
print & read Dr. Barrascono's 2005 info first; you will come back to this often.
Extensive info in Treepatrol's newbie links about the meaning of WESTERN BLOT IGM/IGG test results from Igenex! Be sure to read or print this info IF Igenex tested you ok!
Also, see Cheryl's extensive web sites on: LD DIAGNOSIS, SYMPTOMS, & TREATMENT ... wonderful! Read the area on CO-INFECTIONS! You could have from 1-12 other illnesses that tick is carrying...lyme, malaria, etc.
If you are showing symptoms of co-infections, I would like to suggest being tested for co-infections when you have LYME western blots done. It isn't cheap!! But if you are positive, you can treat the co-infections first, and then work on LYME symptoms.
EYE SENSITIVIES & NOIR, no infrared sunglasses info., 2-28-06 updated
YES, I have what you have! Are you on doxy too? That made my extreme eyes 200% MORE sensitive than they we were earlier. I learned a lot about eye sensitivity/lighting on www.marshallprotocol.com board. Look for AUSSIE BARB'S EAST FINDER and then eyes/sunglasses, etc. Wealth of info there.
You will need 2% amber and 10% amber ... Style no. 901 and 910. 1-800-521-9746 TOLL- FREE
mention you have lyme and marshall protocol, they will give you 20% off! Also they have been kind enough to replace the SCRATCHED LENSES & BROKEN BOWS! How's that for service?
I don't drive often at night, but I can wear NOIR's 901 lenses at night while driving; it creates soft candle lights coming at me...tolerable. NOT to wear in town with all the action of people crossing where they shouldn't be, etc.
from LOU to Betty on LONG web links and Thank You Lou!: "If you hit the return key in the middle of a link, I don't think it will be clickable anymore. An alternative that maybe Betty should be telling people about is the tiny url website. I have it on my tool bar at the top of the page and use it for those incredablylongwebsiteaddresses.
All you have to do is ask tiny url to produce a short version, which it will do with a unique address, which you then use instead in your post. Works just the same when clicked! Here is the website, spread the word!
3-1-06, fyi, I tried dragging tinyurl to my toolbar without success, so that's why I currently have LONG addresses vs. short tiny ones! I'll keep trying.
bpeck
Frequent Contributor (1K+ posts)
Member # 3235
posted
Oms D, which is band 28 is specific for Lyme. (This protein is usually called Osp D)
It's much more common in the european species. Present in the northamericam species only 24% of the time.
No question you have Lyme.
REFERENCE 1 J Bacteriol. 1994 Aug;176(15):4572-82 Analysis of the distribution and molecular heterogeneity of the ospD gene among the Lyme disease spirochetes: evidence for lateral gene exchange.
Marconi RT, Samuels DS, Landry RK, Garon CF.
Laboratory of Vectors and Pathogens, Rocky Mountain Laboratories, National Institute of Allergy and Infectious Diseases, Hamilton, Montana 59840.
Analysis of the ospD gene has revealed that this gene is not universal among Lyme disease spirochete isolates. The gene was found to be carried by 90, 50, and 24% of the Borrelia garinii, B. afzelii, and B. burgdorferi isolates tested. Size variability in the ospD-encoding plasmid was also observed. Sequence analysis has demonstrated the presence of various numbers of a 17-bp repeated sequence in the upstream control (promoter) region of the gene. In addition, a region within the coding sequence where various insertions, deletions, and direct repeats occur was identified. ospD gene sequences from 31 different isolates were determined and utilized in pairwise sequence comparisons and construction of a gene tree. These analyses suggest that the ospD gene was the target of several recombinational events and that the gene was recently acquired by Lyme disease spirochetes and laterally transferred between species.
PMID: 7913928 [PubMed -
REFERENCE 2 Infect Immun. 2004 Nov;72(11):6279-86. Extracellular secretion of the Borrelia burgdorferi Oms28 porin and Bgp, a glycosaminoglycan binding protein.
Cluss RG, Silverman DA, Stafford TR.
Department of Chemistry and Biochemistry, Middlebury College, VT 05753, USA.
-------------------- Barb Peck (Elder LymeNet user). Lyme since 1975 Transfusion Posts: 1882 | From VT | Registered: Oct 2002
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bpeck
Frequent Contributor (1K+ posts)
Member # 3235
posted
I meant to add this paper - it might be of interest when choosing the right antibiotic- since Osp D is a penicillin binding protein- You might want to talk to your Doc about using high dose Amoxycillin since you're expressing antibodies to 28 kDa.
Barb
Microb Pathog. 1995 Oct;19(4):257-72. Chemiluminescent analysis of Borrelia burgdorferi penicillin-binding proteins using ampicillin conjugated to digoxigenin.
Norgard MV, Baker SI, Radolf JD.
Department of Microbiology, University of Texas Southwestern Medical Center, Dallas 75235, USA.
Knowledge of the penicillin-binding proteins (PBPs) of Borrelia burgdorferi is important for understanding both the targets of beta-lactams used therapeutically for Lyme borreliosis and the complex membrane biology of the distinctive spirochetal pathogen which causes Lyme disease.
In this study, the PBPs of a number of B. burgdorferi strains and variants were examined using a rapid and sensitive chemiluminescent assay which employs ampicillin conjugated to digoxigenin (dig-amp). The minimum inhibitory concentration of dig-amp for B. burgdorferi high-passage strain B31 (0.012 micrograms/ml) was essentially no different from that of free ampicillin (0.025 micrograms/ml). Dig-amp bound specifically to B. burgdorferi B31 PBPs with molecular masses of 92, 80, 65, 46, 40, 34, 31, 29, 22, 20 and 13 kDa; the 31 kDa and 34 kDa PBPs were proven to be OspA and OspB, respectively. All of the borrelial PBPs were present in the cytoplasmic membrane fraction of B. burgdorferi, findings consistent with their activities as PBPs but inconsistent with OspA and OspB as surface-exposed outer membrane lipoproteins. Furthermore, among the PBP profiles of other high- and low-passage variants of B. burgdorferi strains Sh-2-82, HB19, and N40, which differed somewhat from one another,
OspD (28 kDa) but not OspC (22-25 kDa) also was strongly implicated as a PBP;
however, OspC possessed a gel mobility easily misconstrued as that of a 26 kDa PBP often expressed reciprocally with OspB. The ramifications of classifying OspA, OspB, and OspD as PBPs are discussed. While the current inability to genetically manipulate B. burgdorferi hinders determining which of the borrelial PBPs are essential for spirochetal viability (i.e., are the lethal targets of beta-lactams), a priori knowledge of the borrelial PBPs will facilitate the production and purification of recombinant derivatives whose activities can be assessed further in vitro.
PMID: 8825913 [PubMed - indexed for MEDLINE]
-------------------- Barb Peck (Elder LymeNet user). Lyme since 1975 Transfusion Posts: 1882 | From VT | Registered: Oct 2002
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posted
Wow, Barb, this is fascinating. I had no idea such research had been done. Gives another reason why it is important to report the WB on all bands. And it looks like Radolf did do some good research in the past, even though he seems to have gone over to the other side since he got in trouble.
Wouldn't it be nice if a western blot test could tell us which abx to use? Of course, if your immune system has conked out and not producing antibodies to lyme antigens, won't be much help. And those seem to be the sickest people.
Posts: 8430 | From Not available | Registered: Oct 2000
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denny edwards
Unregistered
posted
yup, very interesting everyone, thanks, esp. to bpeck.
here's another question. i've also read that epstein-barr virus (which lab tests show i have the 'reactivated' form of) could be cross-reacting to the lyme bands. Igenex's own page states: "Patients with other spirochetal disease and/or who test positive for rheumatoid factor or Epstein Barr virus may have cross-reacting antibodies." i've done some pubmed searching but can't find out WHICH bands would show the crossreactivity. is it all of them, or just certain bands, that can cross react and give you a false positive?
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posted
I RECENTLY TALKED TO DR STEVEN HARRIS REF POSITIVE RHEUMATOID FACTOR ( i HAVE ONE ) AND LYME TESTS. HE SAID THAT TYPICALY IT WILL NOT GIVE A POSITIVE LYME TEST. HE DID NOT SAY WHICH BANDS BUT SAID THE TWO ANTI BODIES ARE ENTIRELY SEPERATE. I STILL WONDER WHY THEY MENTION IT THOUGH ON THEIR SITE
Posts: 408 | From NY | Registered: Jan 2006
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posted
Try google for this search.
Posts: 8430 | From Not available | Registered: Oct 2000
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bpeck
Frequent Contributor (1K+ posts)
Member # 3235
posted
That statement (of cross-reacitivity with EBV) is in respect to IFA and ELISA IgM assays, NOT for Western Blots.
It's folded into one of ILADS position papers- and you can read it on their website.
Here is the paper they reference for that statement:
Journal of Infectious Disease 56 (1987): 183-188.
"Cross-reactivity in serological tests for Lyme disease and other spirochetal infections."
Magnarelli, LA, Anderson, JF, and RC Johnson.
Serum specimens from 163 persons with Lyme disease, tick-borne or louse-borne relapsing fever, yaws, syphilis, leptospirosis, or Rocky Mountain spotted fever were analyzed to assess the specificity of indirect fluorescent antibody (IFA) tests, an enzyme-linked immunosorbent assay (ELISA), and microscopic agglutination (MA) procedures. Strong cross-reactivity occurred when sera from individuals with Lyme disease, tick-borne relapsing fever, and louse-borne relapsing fever were tested against heterologous Borrelia antigens. Antibodies to Borrelia burgdorferi bound to Treponema pallidum in immunofluorescence tests for syphilis. Sera from subjects with syphilis cross-reacted in IFA tests and the ELISA for Lyme disease. Immunoglobulin antibodies to Borrelia or Treponema spirochetes, however, did not react with serovars of Leptospira interrogans in MA or IFA tests, and the prevalence of false-positive results in the reciprocal analyses was negligible.
PMID: 3298452 [PubMed - indexed for MEDLINE]
-------------------- Barb Peck (Elder LymeNet user). Lyme since 1975 Transfusion Posts: 1882 | From VT | Registered: Oct 2002
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bpeck
Frequent Contributor (1K+ posts)
Member # 3235
posted
Denny:
And here's a paper by Alan B before he went over to the Dark Side showing that OspD's expression is a virulence factor. (and the meaning of virluence is the capacity of a microorganism to cause disease).
So, while the conventional Drs. may question your blot as to whether it's negative or positive for Lyme - by research standards, you are positive.
Now you have entered the Twilight Zone between Research and Convention and will have to decide what you beleive.
Infect Immun. 1992 Nov;60(11):4662-72. Low-passage-associated proteins of Borrelia burgdorferi B31: characterization and molecular cloning of OspD, a surface-exposed, plasmid-encoded lipoprotein.
Norris SJ, Carter CJ, Howell JK, Barbour AG.
Department of Pathology and Laboratory Medicine, University of Texas Medical School, Houston 77225.
Borrelia burgdorferi, the causative agent of Lyme disease, loses its ability to infect and cause disease in mammalian hosts after repeated in vitro passage.
To identify proteins preferentially expressed by the low-passage strain and thus representing potential virulence factors, the polypeptide profiles of virulent, low-passage
and nonvirulent, high-passage forms of B. burgdorferi B31 were compared by nonequilibrium pH gradient two-dimensional gel electrophoresis.
Four low-passage-associated proteins with relative molecular masses (M(r)s) of 35,000, 28,000, 24,000, and 20,000 were identified. Of these, the 28- and 35-kDa polypeptides were not expressed in detectable quantities in the high-passage B31 strain, whereas the 24- and 20-kDa proteins were present in reduced quantities. All four of these proteins were lipoproteins, as determined by labelling with [3H]palmitate.
The abundant 28-kDa component, called outer surface protein D (OspD), is surface exposed on the basis of its proteolysis during treatment of intact organisms with proteinase K. The ospD gene is located on a 38-kb linear plasmid present in seven of nine low-passage strains of B. burgdorferi examined but absent in most high-passage, nonvirulent strains tested.
Molecular cloning and sequence analysis of the ospD gene locus revealed an open reading frame encoding a 28,436-Da polypeptide with a putative signal peptidase II leader sequence. An unusual feature of the region upstream of the gene was the presence of seven contiguous, direct repeats of a 17-bp sequence that includes consensus -35 and -10 transcription initiation signals; however, only one transcription initiation site was active as determined by primer extension analysis. Further study of these and other polypeptides associated with low-passage strains may lead to identification of B. burgdorferi gene products required for infection and pathogenesis in mammalian hosts.
PMID: 1398980 [PubMed - indexed for MEDLINE]
-------------------- Barb Peck (Elder LymeNet user). Lyme since 1975 Transfusion Posts: 1882 | From VT | Registered: Oct 2002
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bpeck
Frequent Contributor (1K+ posts)
Member # 3235
posted
Denny: I also meant to add- that when you really read about how easily borrelia can adapt the host (us ) to THEM - and how many differernt protein's they express under different conditions, then it's pretty easy to see how it's very difficult to meet CD criteria and have 5 bands positive on the same blood draw.
Usually- if a person has just one of the highly specific bands then it's a slam dunk you have Lyme (But the conventional Docs won't necessarily think that way.)
Barb
-------------------- Barb Peck (Elder LymeNet user). Lyme since 1975 Transfusion Posts: 1882 | From VT | Registered: Oct 2002
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