posted
I hear on here much about Jaw pain coming from babs.
Have any of you ruled out plain old TMJ?
The reason why I ask is.... I've spend too much money on TMJ treatment and wondering if one of those nasty co-infections is the main culprit.
According to CAT scans I have a bilateral disk dislocation, which basically means my disks are flat as pancakes, nowhere to be found.
Question... Babs can't cause this can it?? I've had jaw pain for 20 years!
Thanks
-------------------- Bart Henslea 1976 Fibro/CFS/arthritis 2004 Lyme diagnosed 2007 3 1/2 years treatment with oral combos, Cowden, IV roc. BW herbs. Off all abx in 12/10. Feeling good. Posts: 647 | From NY | Registered: Dec 2007
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posted
I have babs, bart, and Lyme. I also have TMJ with damage to the bone.
I went through wearing a splint 24/7 for months to move my jaw, then wore braces to move my teeth to the right place to hold my jaw there.
$10,000 worth of dental work 100% covered under MEDICAL insurance because it was work on a joint!!!
I have absolutely no jaw pain whatsoever now. My pain went away with TMJ treatment before I was even diagnosed with Lyme Disease, though I was really ill at the time.
Don't know if my experience gives the information you were looking for.
-------------------- sixgoofykids.blogspot.com Posts: 13449 | From Ohio | Registered: Feb 2007
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posted
I had TMJ surgery total joint replacement 15 yrs ago. I just recently got dx with Lyme and I know for fact that my jaw was due to Lyme.
Was it a co-infection? I don't know if it was Babs. I do have babs though.
The treatment is expensive, thats true. I tried everything to avoid surgery.
My discs were trashed as well. They took some of my inner ear cartlidge and created new discs, rather than giving me some foreign object for a disc. Which has saved me in the long run. My pain was such that I could not talk, so I felt it was justified.
I am very fortunate today that I had a good surgeon. It is all still working excellent and doing well, which is NOT common for that surgery.
BUT I still have other snovial type issues in other parts of my body. Do you? This I've heard is Lyme.
I didn't know I had Lyme at the time, but looking back I had way too many Lyme related surgeries.
I do get jaw flare ups now that I'm on Lyme treatment, but its nothing compared to what it was before.
I've also heard that you can "biopsy" snovial fluid, ie: tmj issue fluid and look for the buggers?? not sure if its really feasibly though.
I hope you find the answers you are looking for.
Posts: 19 | From woods | Registered: Jan 2007
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posted
Hi Six Oh how I wish my tmj was covered. I've spent over 5 grand now on treatment. TMJ is taboo in our insurance provider. Nothing labeled tmj is covered. All treatment is "experimental"
Lymetoo, I read your other post about this Bio Cranial. I've had ostopathic treatment very much like you describe. It does help and I get my splint checked with this method to determine if my bite is correct. I have also done cranial/sacral which was nice and relaxing but did little for me.
What helps the most for pain is Prolotherapy.
Gypsygirl, I am glad you did well with tmj surgery, most do not. Yes I heard of buggers in the synovial fluid. I should ask my osteopath to biopsy some just to see. And yes I have lots of back pain. Particularly in the neck and sacrum, hips, knees, wrists, fingers, ankles.
-------------------- Bart Henslea 1976 Fibro/CFS/arthritis 2004 Lyme diagnosed 2007 3 1/2 years treatment with oral combos, Cowden, IV roc. BW herbs. Off all abx in 12/10. Feeling good. Posts: 647 | From NY | Registered: Dec 2007
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CaliforniaLyme
Frequent Contributor (5K+ posts)
Member # 7136
posted
My TMJ went completely away with Babs treatment!! Had been affected greatly & lessened by IV Rocephin but when I went on Babs tx it dissappeared!!!!!!!!
Haven't had it for 7 years now and it was chornic for years and HORRIBLE & agonizing-
-------------------- There is no wealth but life. -John Ruskin
All truth goes through 3 stages: first it is ridiculed: then it is violently opposed: finally it is accepted as self evident. - Schopenhauer Posts: 5639 | From Aptos CA USA | Registered: Apr 2005
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tailz
Unregistered
posted
I have Microwave Sickness/Electromagnetic Hypersensitivities. My jaw pain and tension has not budged even with treatment. Mine is essentially from radiation poisoning, especially given the proliferation of cell phones and wireless internet in recent years.
Lyme Disease is just the tip of the iceberg. I highly doubt that any antibiotic or surgery will give you any lasting improvement.
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posted
Re TMJ history for me, developed it 3 1/2 years after being bitten. Had a splint made and no more pain. I have Lyme with no co's.
[ 20. December 2007, 03:28 AM: Message edited by: Robin123 ]
Posts: 13116 | From San Francisco | Registered: May 2006
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Tracy9
Frequent Contributor (1K+ posts)
Member # 7521
posted
wOW, interesting. I have had TMJ for over 25 years. My dentist said it was the worst case he'd ever seen. I travelled to Boston to see a world renowned surgeon, and had bilateral jaw surgery in 2000. It was horrific; I was so unprepared for how sick it was going to make me.
It took a good year to slowly recuperate, but my jaw now is no where near what it was then. It does flare up now but clearly with lyme symptoms.
I didn't know Babs was related. I have been on mepron and zith for a few weeks. I just opened and closed my jaw a few times and the creaking and cracking isn't there.
WOW, so this Mepron and Zith might actually cure my jaw problems too???? As I said it's much better but instead of taking 2400 mg of ibuprophen a day, it might be 400 mg twice a week now.
My LLMD is sure my TMJ onset was Lyme related. He thinks I was initally infected in my late teens, as I had a slew of medical issues then that he feels really add up...TMJ, pericarditis, horrible hip, shoulder pain for many years...meningitis...he thinks it was all Lyme. He says it's just too many factors for it not to be, for a woman in her early 20's.
13 years Lyme & Co.; Small Fiber Neuropathy; Myasthenia Gravis, Adrenal Insufficiency. On chemo for 2 1/2 years as experimental treatment for MG. Posts: 4480 | From Northeastern Connecticut | Registered: Jun 2005
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pamoisondelune
Frequent Contributor (1K+ posts)
Member # 11846
posted
Yes, the soreness in the corners of my jawbones stopped after i started Artemisia annua a couple of months ago, and the creaking and crunching on one side continues to diminish. The other side got a bit out of alignment but then the creakiness stopped well before i started Artemisia annua.
Posts: 1226 | From USA | Registered: May 2007
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posted
TMJ was one of my very first symptoms of lyme, although I didn't recognize it at the time. The right side of my jaw hurt so bad it brought tears to my eyes when I would chew anything.
When I was finally dx'd with lyme a month later I was started on Biaxin. The TMJ was one of the first sx's to go away. That was 6 months ago, and just now am I getting the creaking/squeaking in my jaw occassionally, but no more pain.
I have tested negative for any co's, and haven't been treated for any.
Posts: 69 | From So Cal | Registered: Jun 2007
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Tincup
Honored Contributor (10K+ posts)
Member # 5829
posted
They have FINALLY linked TMJ to spirochetes in a number of cases.
Antibiotics may be needed to kill the keets.
Craniomaxillofac Surg. 2007 Nov 16 [Epub ahead of print] Links
Borrelia burgdorferi - A potentially aetiological factor in TMJ disorders? Preliminary report.
Wanyura H, Wagner T, Samolczyk-Wanyura D. Department of Cranio-Maxillofacial Surgery and Centre of TMJ Arthroscopy (Head: Prof. Hubert Wanyura), Medical University of Warsaw, Poland.
INTRODUCTION: The available literature does not report on infectious factors potentially triggering intra-articular pathology or dysfunction manifest as temporomandibular (TMJ) disorders.
AIM OF THE STUDY: To establish the presence of Borrelia burgdorferi spirochaetes in the histopathological material obtained from the intra-articular space by arthroscopy from patients with advanced TMJ disorders.
SUBJECTS AND METHODS: The histopathological material was obtained intra-articularly from 31 patients by means of arthroscopy; apart from routine H+E staining, the material was additionally examined for the presence of micro-organisms (spirochaetes) by the Warthin-Starry method.
RESULTS: Seven out of 31 patients presenting with manifesting TMJ dysfunction had spirochaetes detected in the histopathological material; their shape and size resembling B. burgdorferi bacteria.
CONCLUSION: This paper is the first to indicate that in borreliosis the infective agent may localize itself to the temporomandibular joint.
This observation cannot be ignored when analyzing the pathogenesis of TMJ degeneration especially that tick-borne infections with spirochaetes are definitely more common than it is generally believed.
PMID: 18023198 [PubMed - as supplied by publisher]
posted
I was diagonosed last year. I had painful headaches and a stiff neck. I started on minocin and after a week they stopped. I just started up with the same symptoms 2 weeks ago and they will not let up. I called my LD and he told me to stop taking the antibiotics for about 4 days until this cycle that I am stuck in lets up. Then start up at a lower dose for a few weeks until I see Him again. I hope this is working. Right now I tylenol since, excedrin and percocet to help the sysmptons let go of their grip. I'll see what happens in the next 4 days.
Posts: 19 | From New Jersey | Registered: Dec 2007
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Maybe there is hope. Maybe I won't get that other prolotherapy injection and wait till I start treatment and see if the "crunchies" and pain improve.
I'd love to get a sample of my synovial fluid to see what critters there are in there.
-------------------- Bart Henslea 1976 Fibro/CFS/arthritis 2004 Lyme diagnosed 2007 3 1/2 years treatment with oral combos, Cowden, IV roc. BW herbs. Off all abx in 12/10. Feeling good. Posts: 647 | From NY | Registered: Dec 2007
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