posted
I know I've said I was going to do this for a long time. But I am scared/was scared. I'm tired of being sick. I literally feel like my brain is infested with bb....and God knows what else.
My plan is to order some abx online, hopefully cheap ones. If anyone knows of a place, please PM me. You guys (and ladies) are more knowledgeable than my doctors BY FAR and you don't "look" at me like I'm from Mars.
So here are my questions: I need a cheap abx that really doesn't need to be combined with anything else. I am on a SHORT budget. To be honest, my rent is late this month. Like, I'm $500 short, but that's actually due to fraud (someone got my banking info and it's taking forever to clean up that mess), but I need an abx. Can someone tell me the most powerful one I can get and one that will work alone, and one that is kinda cheap.
2nd question, I know there's been Salt/C discussions but I never really considered it, but I would like kindergarten explanations on how to start and how to ramp up. It' doesn't have to be a lengthy post, just a simple guideline. I'm fed up and I have to try something. I know some people will say that it's dangerous but I've also heard of people have somewhat of a success with it. Is sea salt the same as kosher salt? I cook with that, not table salt, sea salt, I think it says Kosher salt on the box, it's blue, if that's not it, please be kind enough to tell me where to go. How much vit C? I bought some, but I'm too lazy to go look.
3rd question: I want to do a parasite cleanse. I need to know the most effective cheap cleanse.
If there is ANYTHING I'm missing, please tell me. Oh yeah, what about anything for yeast? Do I still need that? Any supplements I need for this?
I'm thinking about standing in front of Walmart, different stores that have a lot of business, degrading myself, making a poster about Lyme, how I...and many people have it, the dangers of it (not just how to prevent it because that sure didn't work for me....living in FL, I didn't even know it existed here), are there any brocures (sp) that I can hand out with ILADS info, does anyone have any of those.
I'm sooooooo sick and tired of not having any options and if I die doing this, I will keep a video diary of my story, my protocol, and maybe people will pay more attention to the Lyme cause.
Also, are there any magnetic ribbons that I can buy to put on my car (when it starts working) or on my door that says anything about Lyme. I am ready to make this as known as possible.
I am not going to be a sitting duck any more, just feeling like this nasty stuff is just multiplying inside my body destroying it. I WANT MY LIFE BACK. I don't have money, but I can beg for a few things, or spare a couple bucks for a few things. Please give me a list of what to do as far as starting Salt/C, parasite cleanses, things to protect my body to the things that I'm about to do to it, I mean everything I need to prepare myself for this journey. I will do anything to have an informative list to protect myself while I *try* to fight this off and be a success story. I'm sick of it all.
Thanks for listening to me. Any replies would be wonderful and I will be eternally grateful. Also, where can I get Armour Thyroid? I can't get it off the internet can I? No doc will rx it to me, they laugh at it. I don't know why. I have Hashimotos also.
My alimony ends in March. Something decent has to happen before then because I have NO CLUE what I'm going to do after that. I'm barely (not even) making it as it is. I have to work. I like working. But my condition makes it IMPOSSIBLE. Going to the doctor makes me so stressed out from all of the noise, lights, stress and fear that a doctor is going to cry...I can't imagine dealing with people all day....or the lights, or any noise, let alone a boss that might not understand my situation.
If you got through this, go take a nap - you probably need one by now.
-------------------- ---Beautiful Disaster--- IgeneX WB: IgM: 18+, 31+, 41+, 58+, IgG: 31++, 39 IND, 41++, 31kda Epitope Test: Positive Labcorp: IgM: 23+, 41+ No LLMD due to money since Sept 2008. Was on Doxy, I.V. Rocephin (30 days), Flagyl. Also dx with Bartonella. Posts: 139 | From United States, East Coast-ish | Registered: Aug 2009
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posted
Please check out the Lymestrategies group on Yahoo groups. They focus primarily on salt/c and have the guidelines for doing it there, I think. That would be the least expensive way to go.
They can tell you about what salts are ok to use.
Posts: 975 | From California | Registered: Apr 2007
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posted
I have read that Mangosteen juice is a natural antimicrobial. Maybe this could be combined with salt/c.
I made some big strides over the course of 6 weeks (on abx) by raising my body temperature as often as possible. I went in our hot tub almost daily and tried to get my temperature up over 100 degrees. I usually run at around 94 degrees when I am highly symptomatic.
Maybe lots of hot baths...
I have found that coming up with one new strategy on my own has helped me to feel more in control of the situation and makes me motivated to keep tackling the Lyme. Maybe this could work for you.
Good luck!
-------------------- unsure445 Posts: 824 | From northeast | Registered: Jun 2008
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lymie_in_md
Frequent Contributor (1K+ posts)
Member # 14197
posted
The least expensive way to get rid of lyme is buy a 16 dollar bottle of MMS. Eat a diet loaded with fermented foods and greens. If you can afford it get an LED (light emitting diode) device ( I've selected the PE1 ) its about 1,200 dollars. Do an occasional parasite, kidney, and liver cleanse to ensure detoxification. There is a video on youtube by Donna Eden, it tells you how to normalize the energy in your body. So do a youtube search for "donna eden five minute" you'll find it.
Also, learn to do energy testing yourself. Look up how to make your own pendulum and do some research on the internet. Spend some time understanding homeopathy.
If you don't get the LED, everything above might only cost 16 dollars.
Of all the different items i've tried either cleansing, supplements, or gadgets by far the two most powerful were MMS and the PE1 a very close second is some of what Donna Eden has had in these videos.
As far as mangosteen, you could do far better for value just getting a powdered version and putting the powder in a juice like a 100% organic apple juice. Look at www.royaltropics.com there are others who sell it. I also thought the noni was more powerful then mangosteen, imho. I no longer use either, just don't need to.
-------------------- Bob Posts: 2150 | From Maryland | Registered: Dec 2007
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posted
One "cheap" abx wont do anything except possibly some harm. You will need combo of 3-4 minimum . That is about $400 /month when ordered online .
Plus you will need run regular blood test for liver/kidney function so you will need some kind for doctor for that.
Seems only truly cheap option is vitamin /C,GSE, MMS but I frankly never heard one get rid of lyme with those alone.
Rife seems cheap (you can buy machine for $600 -and that one time cost) but efficacy is unknown
Posts: 856 | From MA | Registered: Jul 2009
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posted
One abx might do it--mostly. My brother was on just one for about 16 months and improved. When flagyl was added he really improved. But if there are co-infecions, you would need more than one.
Remember though, there are very strict conditions for long term abx. Like absolutely no alcohol because the abx are so hard on the liver. (I don't know if you drink, that was just one restriction that came to mind). There are many more that I can't think of right now.
I'm sorry things have become so tough. I'm sure you're actually sick, but stress and depression make everything seem worse.
Are there any lyme support groups in your area where you can meet people who actually understand what you're going through?
James
Posts: 872 | From New York City | Registered: Jun 2008
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ping
Frequent Contributor (1K+ posts)
Member # 6974
posted
BD,
Your frustration and pain are felt by many who post here. It's a terrible thing to have TBD and deal with those who don't believe, care or have a clue, etc.
The thing that concerns me about your post is that you start out wanting to know about one abx that would help you, then move onto wanting to know about parasites, Salt / Vit C, etc. If you combine any or all these protocols, you could be in for a world of hurt. If it's just info you want, there are plenty of threads on this site that you can do a search on and find answers.
One poster brought up the question: Co-infections... A huge issue, as it's likely that you have co-infects that require a 2nd abx to eliminate or put it / them into remission.
I take it that the doc(s) that you currently have are not LLMD's? (Dumb question, I know) I fully understand what it's like to have little or no $$$$, behind on the rent, etc.
So what do you really want to do first? Lyme, or co-infects, or parasites? If you do Lyme, you'll like have to do co-infects simultaneously. When you ask about parasites, what type do you mean? Any and all of the things you mention cost more $$$ thn you say you currently possess.
Have you had Igenex testing? Any testing. Can you at least give us more info? Do you have more neuro sx, arthritic sx, or what?
Whatever you decide to do, I truly wish you the best. Been there, done that; hope I never have to again.
ping "We are more than containers for Lyme"
-------------------- ping "We are more than containers for Lyme" Posts: 1302 | From Back in TX again | Registered: Mar 2005
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posted
I've been around for a year and a half but because of personal reasons, I have changed my name numerous times.
I had a very positive Lyme test through IgeneX, plus, one positive from Labcorp. I tested positive for Lyme and Bart. I did I.V. Rocephin, I felt like I was on the right track. I won't go into bashing and who was wrong and what I disagree with, but I just couldn't do it long enough. My doc, who was an llmd, I was referred to him by Lymenet, many ppl know who he is. BUT ANYWAY. My bart was not addressed first. I think I still have Levaquin refills, I hope, and Rifampin, do you think I could do those first to see if I improve?
-------------------- ---Beautiful Disaster--- IgeneX WB: IgM: 18+, 31+, 41+, 58+, IgG: 31++, 39 IND, 41++, 31kda Epitope Test: Positive Labcorp: IgM: 23+, 41+ No LLMD due to money since Sept 2008. Was on Doxy, I.V. Rocephin (30 days), Flagyl. Also dx with Bartonella. Posts: 139 | From United States, East Coast-ish | Registered: Aug 2009
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quote:Originally posted by JamesNYC: One abx might do it--mostly. My brother was on just one for about 16 months and improved. When flagyl was added he really improved. But if there are co-infecions, you would need more than one.
Looks like he wasted 16 month on mono abx - seriously take abx for that long and not be cured??? ? No single abx hits all 3 forms. You can "improve" on single cell wall buster like rocephin or bicillin but you just inviting problems after you discontinue them
people on mono abx just drive BB in cyst/ l-form and it just will resurface later , when they are more vulnerable (could be years ).
Posts: 856 | From MA | Registered: Jul 2009
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His LLMD, and my LLMD (not the same) BOTH do not believe in adding the cyst buster until after around a year with abx.
They say that you want the spirochetes to mostly revert to cysts first.
quote:seriously take abx for that long and not be cured???
I don't know WHAT you mean by this. Are you ACTUALLY saying that, in your opinion, properly treated lyme will be "cured" in some period of time that is less than 16 months?
Please clarify this so I can be sure I understand what your saying before I blast you.
James
Posts: 872 | From New York City | Registered: Jun 2008
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Abxnomore
Frequent Contributor (5K+ posts)
Member # 18936
posted
Coltman I've been following many of your posts and your line of questioning too.
What do you mean by the statement referenced by JamesNY? Do you honestly think that a severe case of late term Lyme and co's can be cured in six months?
Mono therapy or otherwise, no one has the full answer on how to beat this illness. Not even our doctors. Even seeing some of the best LLMD's it is not uncommon for some people to be on every ABX in the book, along with cyst busters and the full arsenal of meds that are employed in this fight for eight years or more and still be plagued with spirochetes eating away at their system.
I'm not saying it is impossible to find a way to make it thru, and many have. Some have have taken different paths and have found wellness some have used ABX and some probably could not even tell you how it happened.
Coltman, please inform me what you seen to know about how to CURE Lyme that the 15,441 members on this forum don't know.
This statment is simply not correct:
"Looks like he wasted 16 month on mono abx - seriously take abx for that long and not be cured???"
Those who have been on combo therapy have mostly not done any better in 16 months time, perhaps, have had improvement but not a CURE; except in cases where they were treated immediately after being bitten and sometimes even in those cases treatment becomes problematic. Yes, I happen to prefer combo therapy but know that it would not cure in six months time.
Posts: 5191 | From Lyme Zone | Registered: Jan 2009
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glm1111
Frequent Contributor (5K+ posts)
Member # 16556
posted
Salt/c has saved my life. Sea salt is loaded with minerals that we desperately need. Salt and Vit C support the adrenals.
It is TABLE SALT that is dangerous because the minerals have been removed. I started with 1/4 tsp each sea salt and vitamin C (ester C powder with bioflavinoids)
I order both from vitacost. I also suggest joining lymesytrategies for more insight. I also use antiparasitic herbs. These are both very inexpensive protocols,
Gael
-------------------- PARASITES/WORMS ARE NOW RECOGNIZED AS THE NUMBER 1 CO-INFECTION IN LYME DISEASE BY ILADS* Posts: 6418 | From philadelphia pa | Registered: Jul 2008
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His LLMD, and my LLMD (not the same) BOTH do not believe in adding the cyst buster until after around a year with abx.
They say that you want the spirochetes to mostly revert to cysts first.
Hmm what is their explanation and logic behind this practice?
I am kinda at loss why would one want to convert them to cyst form and only then start killing them (and BB will just change to another form -the one you not hitting) ? Why not hit them in all forms at same time -so they have no place to hide.
quote:I don't know WHAT you mean by this. Are you ACTUALLY saying that, in your opinion, properly treated lyme will be "cured" in some period of time that is less than 16 months?
I am just saying from all information I read it looks like its pretty pointless to do monotherapy. And its possibly does more harm in long run by building resistance and destroying your beneficial bacteria.
Imagine he could have spent those 16 months hitting all forms all bacteria, he might have had much better result.
p.s. monotherapy aimed at spircohette provides relief, because it doesnt allow BB to revert to active form and keeps them in cysts/ l form. I dont see why on earth you wouldnt want keep those forms intact though
Posts: 856 | From MA | Registered: Jul 2009
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quote: Do you honestly think that a severe case of late term Lyme and co's can be cured in six months?
No idea. Probably not .
quote: Mono therapy or otherwise, no one has the full answer on how to beat this illness.
All research points that BB has 3 forms, it can live in every tissue. - Therefore you need to hit all forms everywhere. No single ABX does it .
This looks so simple to me I don't get why people would argue with this logic. And even find it offensive ( seems like you do). What is so offensive about it?
Now I can understand why sometime just single abx could be effective (one example is your immune system will finish the rest if its good enough shape, heck for some people immune system does good enough job alone!).
quote: it is not uncommon for some people to be on every ABX in the book, along with cyst busters and the full arsenal of meds that are employed in this fight for eight years or more and still be plagued with spirochetes eating away at their system.
Yeah well does it mean you shouldn't run abx ever? The only real research on killing BB was done with ABX. And it proves ABX are effective (to varying degrees ) at it .
That is not saying that other treatments will not work. My point was if you doing abx, why not do them to maximum effectiveness?
quote: Those who have been on combo therapy have mostly not done any better in 16 months time,
So I asked that question and got 0 replies so far. I am seriously curious about people who had long combo abx therapy and didnt get better. Because from the doctors cases it does look like they have high rate of success with combo therapy
I did found some cases where it didnt seem to help , but those seem to be extremely severe cases and I am not sure BB alone is there to blame (there are other factors such as detox capability, overall damage already done+ other health problems, possible abx resistance ,etc etc)
Anyways my point was -what is the logic behind abx monotherapy? From the facts already known about BB it doesnt look like there is much sense in it except when you cannot tolerate combo one (which actually might be the case for quite a few ppl )
Posts: 856 | From MA | Registered: Jul 2009
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I'm interested in your current treatment. I've noticed your replies to many posters and wondered if you are improving on your current treatment.
-------------------- Peggy
~ ~ Hope is a powerful medicine. ~ ~ Posts: 2775 | From MN | Registered: Apr 2001
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Abxnomore
Frequent Contributor (5K+ posts)
Member # 18936
posted
"All research points that BB has 3 forms, it can live in every tissue. - Therefore you need to hit all forms everywhere. No single ABX does it ."
Research is one thing, how it works in practical application is another. Right now, if one is taking the ABX route described above that is the best we have to work with but the "cure" rate is not there. Remission is very difficult as well.
Of course, there are many other factors that come into play. Just killing off the spirochete, if that can be accomplished, will not return one to full health after suffering through such a debilitating illness.
The way you posted your reply implied that you believe that using the above ABX method one should be cured in six months. I was pointing out that this is not the case, whether using mono or combo therapy.
That's how I interpreted your sentence below:
"Looks like he wasted 16 month on mono abx - seriously take abx for that long and not be cured??? ?"
As I said earlier, with either approach it would be unlikely that one would be cured in 16 months unless treatment was begun immediately after being bitten and still there are cases, such as these, that can become complicated and difficult to cure.
Posts: 5191 | From Lyme Zone | Registered: Jan 2009
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posted
I say salt/c also i cant wait to try this. I thought it was pure sodium chloride for the salt part though not sea salt.
-------------------- Let us fight with peace. Posts: 90 | From Niles, Ohio | Registered: Aug 2009
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Abxnomore
Frequent Contributor (5K+ posts)
Member # 18936
posted
Veromia there are many ways to skin a cat. Many people have had success with salt/C and also by using rife technology.
It's about finding what works for you and what is safe.
Sea salt has minerals in it that sodium chloride does not. Himalayan Pink salt is probably the best to use as it's known as the purest salt in the world and has lots of minerals in it.
Posts: 5191 | From Lyme Zone | Registered: Jan 2009
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I think you are overconfident in your knowledge. These 2 experienced LLMDs, one of which is a founder of ILADS disagree with YOUR research.
What is so offensive is your condescending, I-know-best attitude. "Looks like he wasted 16 months". What is wrong with you? By doing some "research" you then think you know enough to say stuff like that? How could you know how long any therapy might have taken?
And exactly how many patients have YOU treated? What is the amount of "doctors cases" you've studied to lead you to these conclusions that makes you more of an expert than LLMDs with years of real-world experience? You think you know more than you do.
The idea of the monotherapy is that it's safe and effective with minimal side-effects. The more abx you take, the greater risk of problems. So, even IF it might take a while longer, it's a good trade off for fewer complications.
I have found nothing convincing that throwing more abx at lyme (without cos) cures it FASTER.
I think it DOES make sense to put the spirochetes under such stress that they have to revert to cysts. THEN to hit them with a cyst buster. At that point, they will have no way to escape.
There are some LLMDs that feel everything should be thrown at the infection right away. One whose articles I've read, then throws in the caveat about complications.
I have been on 3 abx for 15 months, 1 more was added 4 months ago. And I will be adding a 5th in a week or so. I'm also on artemisinin.
Guess what! I'm not cured! I have improved. But I'm not cured.
My mono-therapied brother was far worse off than me, truly debilitated. Now he's doing better than I am. He's been on his abx for longer, but I'm on combo abx. So there you go. Now you have one reply on the issue.
James
[ 09-06-2009, 08:29 PM: Message edited by: JamesNYC ]
Posts: 872 | From New York City | Registered: Jun 2008
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lymielauren28
Frequent Contributor (1K+ posts)
Member # 13742
posted
Boys, boys!! Me thinks there's too much testosterone in the room! But seriously, let's get back to the topic at hand, which is helping one very sick Lymie find her way to wellness in any way that we can, okay?
After all, that's the real reason why we're all here...and very now and again we're bound to step on each others toes along the way - it's just kinda inevitable.
BD, IF you have $350 to spare you can get yourself a brand spankin new Rife machine that will knock the socks off of your Lyme and co-infections. They really DO work!
The salt-c is the cheapest way to go and very effective for many - if you go that route make sure that you get your liver and kidney tests done just like you do when you're on abx.
You can get abx online from 4cornerspharmacy.com. Their abx are listed under "infections". If you go that route make sure you take diflucan to keep the yeast at bay - they have diflucan at 4corners too, so no worries there.
Raw garlic is GREAT also. Kills lot's of stuff, including Lyme and yeast.
Whatever path you choose to take I'm wishing the absolute best. I SO want you to get well - for yourself and your child - and of course because you deserve it. Remember too that you may have to change paths now and again before you get there, but that's okay. Take care and keep us posted on the treatment you choose!
-------------------- "The only way out is through" Posts: 1434 | From mississippi | Registered: Nov 2007
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posted
Lauren, I've always liked you and I appreciate the kind words. If I could just lay in bed all day and cope and tryyyyy to ignore the pain by watching t.v, I would. But I'm on my feet constantly, constantly talking endlessly to my chatterbox wonderful 3 year old. I need to get better. My financial "support" ends in March, I have to make some kind of strides in the right direction. There's no way that I can work like this.
I know that some people think "Oh, she just feels "flu-ish" or "tired", yeah, I'm tired but that's not why I can't work....It's because my job is COPING with the excruciating pain that I am in. Adding having to perform tasks at work, dealing with people, AND dealing with this pain....I think my brain would explode and I would snap.
I have to do something. I know some people with good intentions, I know, write me privately saying how they sell things on Ebay, get rid of their houses, cars, etc...to afford treatment. Well, if I KNEW it was a sure fire way to get better, I would do it in a heart beat, I'm not going to throw away the small things that I do have on a gamble that it "might" work. And even if I sold those things, I couldn't treat for years like most everyone has to. I would run out of money, even if I sold EVERYTHING. I live in an apartment, no house to sell or refinance or whatever it's called. After the big D, I have no money.
I'm late on my rent, struggling to do everything financially. I have to do something. I would rather die trying, then sitting here like a sitting duck waiting for things to get even worse...if that's possible.
I know we've had so many Salt/C discussions. But going through and finding old posts, etc. is too much for my brain. Coming from you guys makes it more simple, I can understand, and it's less daunting.
All I wanted to know is how to start, ramp up, what supps to add, and thanks for the rife idea, I have NO IDEA how to afford even $300, but maybe for Christmas, I can ask for one. lol. I just need some guidance because I'm about to take the leap. I know I've talked about self treating quite a bit, but I'm going to do it. I feel that there are no other options.
I am getting so much worse, month by month. I never thought I would be here right now physically and emotionally. I am NOT a yeller but I find myself getting so angry and things my son can't help. He's 3 and he sleeps in my bed and I very rarely get sleep anyway, so when he pees all over the bed again, I feel so angry, and I even yell. I have never ever ever spanked him, but this rage comes over me and then I feel HORRIBLE. Maybe that's TMI but even my personality is changing because of my disease, because of the pain, because there is no hope to get better. It just makes me angry and I'm not an angry person. He's 3, he doesn't deserve an angry mom. Of course 95% of the time we are cuddly and sweet, but the smallest things make me enraged, not just at him, but in general.
I guess that is Lyme Rage. I never quite understood that. If someone would be kind enough to give me the low down on what to do step by step, then adding supplements, then rife maybe around Christmas, etc...anything because I CAN NOT AFFORD AN LLMD. It's just not gonna happen. I would be eternally grateful if someone would take time of their pain ridden day to help a fellow Lymie, I would return the favor to anyone if something worked for me and I could help guide them along too. I am in no position to help anyone right now. Not even myself, pretty much.
Thanks for the advice and anything else is appreciated. I can use any and all information and guidance, if you don't want to do it for me, do it for my 3 year old, he deserves better than this. Just think of him, all children deserve to be healthy and have healthy parents....or at least happy, semi-functional parents. If it wasn't for all of the burning pain, I would be much happier. I'm sick of chasing medicines, trying new ones, if something isn't working, well, that's another co-pay that I can't afford when I just went a week ago and paid another copay. It's just a hole that it seems that keeps dragging me deeper and deeper into a mess. Medically, financially, and not to forget what this does to my relationships with my family and what little friends I have left. And forget ever having a dating life. I will be alone forever and I'm fine with that, as long as I can be healthy - or as healthy as I can be.
Thanks for listening everyone. Like I said, when people are sick, it's hard to think for yourself, and sometimes, you need someone to hold your hand. I've ALWAYS been the girl in my family to hold people together, to hold their hands, but my family doesn't really return the favor, husband is gone, and I am hoping out of the kindness of someone's heart, we can get something going for me. I could write forever but I will stop now. You know me, I ramble. Thanks for listening, I REALLY appreciate it.
-------------------- ---Beautiful Disaster--- IgeneX WB: IgM: 18+, 31+, 41+, 58+, IgG: 31++, 39 IND, 41++, 31kda Epitope Test: Positive Labcorp: IgM: 23+, 41+ No LLMD due to money since Sept 2008. Was on Doxy, I.V. Rocephin (30 days), Flagyl. Also dx with Bartonella. Posts: 139 | From United States, East Coast-ish | Registered: Aug 2009
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posted
cheap do-it-yourself remedies for lyme/co's: -Rife -MMS -Rizols -Colloidal Silver -Salt/Vit C -GSE -Bulk herbs like cat's claw, quinine bark, amargo, etc.
You can do the above for less than $100 per month
Posts: 655 | From USA | Registered: Sep 2007
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IckyTicky
Frequent Contributor (1K+ posts)
Member # 21466
posted
I have been taking mono-therapy for over a year now and I'm 80% better. Cured, no.. but I've had Lyme at least 20 years. I'm functional. So coltman is dead wrong. I was dying a year ago.
I would not stay on one type of abx for more than 3 months. Switch it up. For instance, I was put on Amox for a few months, then Zith for a few months, then Doxy...
My twin sister has Lyme and just like you can NOT afford an LLMD. She self treats and is feeling better. We both have serious neuro sx. A lot of mine have resolved. I'm still sensitive to sounds, lights, touch and stimulation.. but it waxes and wanes and isn't as severe as it use to be.
I am not currently on Salt/C but I want to try it along with my abx. I'm also about to start a parasite cleanse. Go to the half price book store and see if you can't find Hulda Clark's books "The Cure for All Diseases" and "The Cure for All Cancers". I don't have the first one yet, but I do have the cancer book. I am making my own tincture for parasites. I also recently bought a cheap $55 dollar Zapper.
If you can save up the money, get a rife machine. My LLMD has three of his own, so they must do something. I don't have one yet, have not had the money since I have Lyme, my husband has Lyme, my three children have Lyme.
Salt/C is cheap, you can even learn to make your own Colloidal silver and MMS is cheap as well. Go SLOWLY on whatever you do. It sucks that it has to come down to doing things yourselves, but that isn't exactly our fault now is it?
-------------------- IGM: 18+, 23+, 30+, 31+++, 34+, 39IND, 41++, 58+++, 66+, 83-93IND IGG: 31+, 39IND, 41+ Also positive for Mycoplasma Pneumoniae and RMSF. Whole family of 5 dx with Lyme. Posts: 1014 | From Texas | Registered: Jul 2009
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posted
I don't have any experience with the Salt/Vit C protocol or with rifing.
If you want to start with Salt/Vit C first, I would recommend going to the Yahoo site that is dedicated to just that protocol. You can post here too, but I think you would get more individual help there. The same thing for rifing.
I agree with btmb03 about looking for resources in your community. I don't know of any specific resource, but I could help look for them if you want me to. There is a lot of experience on this board and maybe someone else has information that would help you.
Have you checked out free clinics in your area? In my hometown, two really good doctors started a free clinic.
Are there any programs for your son? Some school districts have preschool programs for 3-5 year olds. My niece went to one of them and the school provided transportation for her.
I hope you can find something to help you & your son.
-------------------- Peggy
~ ~ Hope is a powerful medicine. ~ ~ Posts: 2775 | From MN | Registered: Apr 2001
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posted
If you decide to do salt/C Lyme Strategies is a good place to learn about ramping up on Salt/C. I found I was overwhelmed by all of the other stuff they were saying you should do.
I started off with the initial starting dose of 1/4 t of sea salt and 1,000mg of C. I herxed really bad and was advised to cut that in half.
Since I had herxed so bad I made sure not to ramp up until after the herx was over and did it with small increases.
I stopped the salt/C when I was reinfected and went downhill really bad and fast. I then started seeing a LLMD and treated with abx.
quote: I think you are overconfident in your knowledge. These 2 experienced LLMDs, one of which is a founder of ILADS disagree with YOUR research.
What is so offensive is your condescending, I-know-best attitude. "Looks like he wasted 16 months".
True I could have chosen the words better. Sorry if it offended you
quote: The idea of the monotherapy is that it's safe and effective with minimal side-effects. The more abx you take, the greater risk of problems. So, even IF it might take a while longer, it's a good trade off for fewer complications.
Seems that this is main argument for mono therapy -less sides .Whether it is a good tradeoff though I think is open for discussion
A while longer is significant trade off for me personally .How many more years do I have to waste on "trial and error"? In many cases people end up doing all those abx together in the end, after taking them separately for months or even years.
And I understand why DRs doing it - From Dr point of view anything they do exposes them for liability. Therefore most of them prefer to do nothing or give "safer" non descriptive diagnosis (like CFS,depression etc).
To me it looks like most Drs (and even many LLMDS) are underprescbring and under treating.
Absolute majority of MDs would prefer to do absolutely nothing for chronic conditions unless it is written somewhere in rule book and is 100% mainstream (like IDSA guidelines)
And that is not only the case with lyme .If you had any sort of endocrine problems requiring bio identical hormone supplementation for correction you would find it is very hard to get prescribed as well) - it is general problem.
And that is reason I cant trust MDs - they not interested in making people truly healthy. They main concern is whether you fall into bracket of lab tests they are required to run or not. You are on your own when your health is concerned
quote: I have found nothing convincing that throwing more abx at lyme (without cos) cures it FASTER.
Well I dont know about faster. But I been reading many stories like I been on abx x for xxx month and then added another because of plateau/ relapse etc. Why not do it from start?
quote: I think it DOES make sense to put the spirochetes under such stress that they have to revert to cysts. THEN to hit them with a cyst buster. At that point, they will have no way to escape.
So when you hit them with cyst they will revert to spirochette/ l -form. Unless you keep hitting them with cell wall inhibitor. From research papers I read cell wall inhibitors (e.g. rocephin ) actually hit it pretty fast wherever they can reach it. So it doesnt seem to take years to convert it to other forms -even if that is approach taken.
What seems to be happening with monotherapy is that BB reverts to other forms but you keep taking abx and everytime some of it converts back to vulnerable form those are continuously killed. This also prevents it from multiplying.
I do not like this approach as it seems just inviting resistance building.
quote: Research is one thing, how it works in practical application is another. Right now, if one is taking the ABX route described above that is the best we have to work with but the "cure" rate is not there. Remission is very difficult as well.
Well it is probably my desire to get rid of it fast, therefore my strong bias towards more aggressive and complete protocols. I am determined to do it personally provided I can get all pieces in place ( so it satisfies my criteria of "aggressiveness")
I wish there were more testimonials and cases out there with aggressive approaches for moderate cases (when they start treating multi combo IVs for semi terminal casese like WildCondor's its not exactly a good case).
For example one german research papers has amazing results with roxy+bactrim against BB (excellent concentration ,tissue penetration and killing ). I havent seen single case of a person running it (roxy is not FDA approved so I guess it complicates it)
Posts: 856 | From MA | Registered: Jul 2009
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Pinelady
Frequent Contributor (5K+ posts)
Member # 18524
posted
Good Morning beautiful.
I like the Beautiful Disaster song too.
Gosh I haven't heard that in a while.
Do you have a LLMD lined up?
-------------------- Suspected Lyme 07 Test neg One band migrating in IgG region unable to identify.Igenex Jan.09IFA titer 1:40 IND IgM neg pos 31 +++ 34 IND 39 IND 41 IND 83-93 + DX:Neuroborreliosis Posts: 5850 | From Kentucky | Registered: Dec 2008
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posted
People keep asking if I have an llmd, if you read my posts, there is NO money for an llmd. Read my posts. There's nothing to sell, no house to refinance, I live on child support and alimony, and there isn't a DIME left over. And that's not an exaggeration. And I say that with all due respect.
What is roxy? I always thought of roxy as roxycodone or what ever it is, but I know that's not what you are referring to. What is roxy? Has anyone here heard of it.
I refilled my rifampin and Levaquin and I will probably kill myself trying it. I don't care. Oh yeah, and Flagyl. Does anyone here know what to take, when to take it, etc.? Where does the Flagyl come in? Or does it come in at all? I only filled it because I had like 10 days to fill it or my year was up. I'm working on getting a pcp to try to get on board to test the functions of my other important organs but you know how hard that is. Then, I'm adding Salt/C. I don't know why do try first. Salt/C or abx, or both? All at the same time? Someone here has to know and I know we aren't doctors but we should be considering all of the protocols we've been through. I am responsible for my own actions but advice would be helpful. Thanks again, you are receiving complete gratitude from me.
If you have been on the Rif/Lev combo, can you tell me how you did it? My llmd wrote the directions like chicken scratch and when I told him that I couldn't read them or tolerate the Lev...I was dumped literally 5 days later. It was dated the day that I called to complain about the Levaquin. Does anyone know how the Rifampin/Levaquin works? I don't think you are supposed to take them together?? Or am I wrong? Sorry for the long posts but I'm fixing to take a leap here and want to be informed. I will join the salt c group.
And as my son, as far as I know, he doesn't have it, and he has wonderful insurance through his father, even though I'm losing mine on Oct 7th when our divorce is finalized. So, I'm glad that he has insurance and even more glad that he doesn't have Lyme. There has been some things that make me think "Hmmm" about him but he's bright, sooooooo advanced for his age (and that's no proud mommy talk either), and healthy. So far, so good. We will see.
-------------------- ---Beautiful Disaster--- IgeneX WB: IgM: 18+, 31+, 41+, 58+, IgG: 31++, 39 IND, 41++, 31kda Epitope Test: Positive Labcorp: IgM: 23+, 41+ No LLMD due to money since Sept 2008. Was on Doxy, I.V. Rocephin (30 days), Flagyl. Also dx with Bartonella. Posts: 139 | From United States, East Coast-ish | Registered: Aug 2009
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Abxnomore
Frequent Contributor (5K+ posts)
Member # 18936
posted
Beautiful Disaster why don't you just PM those who do the salt & C on this site and talk with them directly. I don't know much about it, but I don't think you do it with ABX.
Posts: 5191 | From Lyme Zone | Registered: Jan 2009
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lymielauren28
Frequent Contributor (1K+ posts)
Member # 13742
posted
I wouldn't do the salt-C and abx together. That's just too much at once. I can't answer your abx questions specifically because I've never taken Levaquin or Rifampin, so I have no personal experience.
One combo that helped me tremendously was Minocycline and Flagyl taken together. Both are very cheap from 4corners - I think you can get 6 months worth of mino for about $150 and Flagyl is even cheaper. I took 200 mg of mino and 500 mg of flagyl a day for almost a year.
I would highly recommend this protocal for you because of the cost aspect and also because Mino crosses the blood brain barrier better then any other oral antibitioc making it an excellent choice for nuero issues and flagyl hits the cysts of course.
If you go the abx route MAKE SURE that you only start one abx at a time - a few days later you can add the next one. This is so that just in case you have a bad reaction you'll know exactly which one is causing the problem.
I know with salt-c you start out slowly and work your way up - most start with a quarter tsp. of salt and 3 grams (3,000 mg) of C. You work your way up a quarter tsp. of salt at a time until you get to full dose, bt I can't remember what full dosage is. Himalayan salt is best - do a google search for it. You have to drink A LOT of water on the salt c protocal - you don't want to get dehydrated.
As far as supplements: 1)A good multi-vitamin is crucial. 2)Turmeric! I take this every day and it's awesome - it's a natural anti-inflammatory. You can get this at any health food store or vitamin shop. 3)Milk thistle. Very important for the liver and helps your body to get rid of Lyme toxins. 4) Vitamin C. Even if you don't do the salt C protocal you NEED C every day. I take a minimum of 5,000 mg a day. This boosts the immune system and also helps to rid the body of toxins. 5)Probiotics. These keep the gut strong as well as the immune system. Culturelle is a decent one and you can get it at Wal-mart. Take at least 3 a day. 6)Fish oil. This stuff really does help with mood and memory. Very important.
In my opinion, these are the 6 supplements you cannot afford to do without. And taking them every once in a while is pointless. Get these 6 things and take them every day like clock work, no matter what.
Also, green tea. I drink about 5 cups a day. I cannot live without it. The difference in how it makes me feel is crazy. You may not like it, but drink it anyways!! The last thing is lemons (pay the few cents extra and get the organic). Drink AT LEAST 32 oz. of lemon water a day. This will also make a huge difference in how you feel.
Besides just lemon water make sure that your drinking plenty of water period every day. This alone will help your pain issues.
Please don't underestimate the simplicity of the natural remedies I've listed - they are just as important as abx - I had to learn this the hard way.
If you do all these things with determination you will get better. You're not lacking in determination, so you shouldn't have any problems there! This is the best advice I can give you. I'll be happy to help you in any way that I can. If you ever need anything just PM me and let me know...
-------------------- "The only way out is through" Posts: 1434 | From mississippi | Registered: Nov 2007
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quote: I will probably kill myself trying it. I don't care.
Yeah, but your son will care. You need to keep him in mind. He needs you in his life.
Start slow.
Doesn't ANY LLMD have a sliding scale treatment policy? I mean BD has a point. She can't afford the rates LLMDs charge.
Aren't there any LLMDs who will see a few sick people who don't have money? Or are they all just left to suffer? This seems to be a missing component in the lyme care community.
What about nurse practitioners?
There must be someone who can oversee BD's treatment.
James
[ 09-08-2009, 11:12 AM: Message edited by: JamesNYC ]
Posts: 872 | From New York City | Registered: Jun 2008
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quote: roxy? I always thought of roxy as roxycodone or what ever it is, but I know that's not what you are referring to. What is roxy? Has anyone here heard of it.
Roxithromycin .A macrolide with good BBB penetration. One of the few abx out there which actually effective at BBB penetration in oral form. Seems like US LLMD use IV azithromycin when they need that, but it is obviously a lot more expensive option
Posts: 856 | From MA | Registered: Jul 2009
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seekhelp
Frequent Contributor (5K+ posts)
Member # 15067
posted
I just don't think there are any LLMDs giving away discounted/free care. It's a real shame. You'd think some of their $800-$1,000 initial consult fees could cover a few ones for desperate people. These type of gestures may go a long way to making the LLMDs as a community look better too.
quote:Originally posted by JamesNYC:
quote: I will probably kill myself trying it. I don't care.
Yeah, but your daughter will care. You need to keep her in mind. She needs you in her life.
Start slow.
Doesn't ANY LLMD have a sliding scale treatment policy? I mean BD has a point. She can't afford the rates LLMDs charge.
Aren't there any LLMDs who will see a few sick people who don't have money? Or are they all just left to suffer? This seems to be a missing component in the lyme care community.
What about nurse practitioners?
There must be someone who can oversee BD's treatment.
James
Posts: 7545 | From The 5th Dimension - The Twilight Zone | Registered: Mar 2008
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Abxnomore
Frequent Contributor (5K+ posts)
Member # 18936
posted
Have you contacted your local support leader. If it's a solid group with a good leader they can be instrumental in helping you find a compassionate doctor who may help you.
I have seen a good friend, who on the edge of being homeless, benefit from such help.
Posts: 5191 | From Lyme Zone | Registered: Jan 2009
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groovy2
Frequent Contributor (1K+ posts)
Member # 6304
posted
Hi Beautiful
You can go to Mexico and buy ABX at Very Very low prices compared to the US-
I fly to El Paso and there is a bus from the airport that will take you border --
You can get name brand and generic ABX --
No Script in needed --- but you have to have a passport or some type new ID card that I dont know much about-
You can bring back large bags of ABX -No Problem- If you want further info about this PM me --
You can also order from-- MedsMex.com --
Their prices have gone up somewhat lately-
--Jay--
Posts: 2999 | From Austin tx USA | Registered: Oct 2004
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seekhelp
Frequent Contributor (5K+ posts)
Member # 15067
posted
That plane ticket alone would = a LLMD visit Groovy2. Good idea though.
Posts: 7545 | From The 5th Dimension - The Twilight Zone | Registered: Mar 2008
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posted
BD, you asked for opinions about which to do 1st, abx or salt/c. From me, my personal experience, I am sorry I didn't go the abx route 1st off.
I wasn't half as bad then and I wouldn't have gotten reinfected, because the abx would have prevented it.
If your area is as bad as mine for Lyme that is something to keep in mind.
Also, consider Prima Una de Gato (Cat's Claw). My LLMD starts her patients on that 1st and says she has good success with it. If a patient doesn't get better with it than she moves on to abx.
My LLMD has her patients continue with the CC even when they are on abx.
posted
Before you buy online or fly to Mexico check the $4 lists from Walmart or Target. I'm taking Bactrim (generic SMZ-TMP), at Walmart it is $10 for 90 days, cheaper than my insurance co-pay.
Maybe print out the list and bring it to your doc. Ask him to try to select medications from the list. It may not be as effective as the more expensive drugs, but at least its something.
Posts: 11 | From Maryland | Registered: Jan 2009
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quote:Originally posted by terpsicore: Before you buy online or fly to Mexico check the $4 lists from Walmart or Target. I'm taking Bactrim (generic SMZ-TMP), at Walmart it is $10 for 90 days, cheaper than my insurance co-pay.
That is interesting option, but dont you have to have prescription for it though?
Posts: 856 | From MA | Registered: Jul 2009
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posted
Yeah, I need an rx and a doctor who believes that I'm not already cured from my 30 days of Rocephin 1 whole year ago. So many speed bumps, but you all are so helpful.
I need a doctor (can't afford a llmd, so it would have to be pcp and I can barely keep shelling out money for those, I always leave in tears) that believes in Lyme and WANTS to help.
What what is cephalexin? That's not Rocephin, is it?
-------------------- ---Beautiful Disaster--- IgeneX WB: IgM: 18+, 31+, 41+, 58+, IgG: 31++, 39 IND, 41++, 31kda Epitope Test: Positive Labcorp: IgM: 23+, 41+ No LLMD due to money since Sept 2008. Was on Doxy, I.V. Rocephin (30 days), Flagyl. Also dx with Bartonella. Posts: 139 | From United States, East Coast-ish | Registered: Aug 2009
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posted
cephalexin is a cephalosporin abx. I believe rocephin is a version of of this as is Biaxin, Ceftin, Omnicef, etc.
Posts: 872 | From New York City | Registered: Jun 2008
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You can check out drugs on drugdigest.com and find them by generic or brand name and there it will list all the brand names and what they are and what they are used for, generally.
seekhelp
Frequent Contributor (5K+ posts)
Member # 15067
posted
Without the Bionic, would you be where you are now though? Are you saying the LED could've replaced it and you feel you'd be where you are now? Just curious.
quote:Originally posted by sixgoofykids: Don't discount Lymie-in-MD's suggestions. He's better.
I also use an LED and fermented food. It's working way better than heavy doses of hard-core antibiotics did for me. I am close to remission.
Posts: 7545 | From The 5th Dimension - The Twilight Zone | Registered: Mar 2008
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D Bergy
Frequent Contributor (1K+ posts)
Member # 9984
posted
You can treat yourself and have success. You can improve your current condition, and you can do it cheaply.
You know what your options are, so go for it. My wife has never had a physicians treatment, and functions fine. Some minor joint pain on occasion but no other lasting symptoms.
I am confident you can be much better than today.
Dan
Posts: 2919 | From Minnesota | Registered: Aug 2006
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posted
I hope so. Thanks for everyone's advice. So, I think I'm going to take the advice of walk before you run.
Who would agree with this and add or correct what I'm thinking about. Granted, I will not be able to do this for probably a month or so, gotta get some money to get started, not much, just enough to go to a pcp to agree to do blood work check ups, so a 30$ co pay for that, and then to order abx.
I have some Levaquin and I'm going to try it again because I hear a lot of ppl had success with it. It ripped me up last time but I heard that you should start taking Magnesium around 2 weeks before even starting it (which I didn't do last time, or even advised to). If my tendons start hurting, I will back off for a few days and start back up, maybe at a lower dosage or something (then ramp back up, I'll cross that bridge when it comes). So, I'll do the Levaquin that I have now (I still have some left from last time and I have a refill that's ready for pick up, I will finish that bottle too, if my body permits.
THEN, I will try the Rifampin again combined with Doxy (I think I read that I can combine those together) or if someone knows of something more effective or powerful than doxy, let me know what I can combine Rifampin with.
I will get blood drawn to check everything also, so don't worry. Or I will at least do my best!!! It shouldn't be hard to find somewhere to get blood drawn. I just hate how my insurance ends Oct 7th, so that really throws a wrench in everything....such bad timing.
I might forget about Salt C for a while, do most of you agree with that? I'm going after Bart first for as long as I can. Any suggestions on what to order for Bart/BLO combos are apprciated, but I do have a book here by Kenneth Singleton (something like that) that I haven't ever read ( been so sick, chasing ofter kids, divorce, eye pain, just haven't gotten around to it.
I still have probiotics, so I wil be using those also.
Now, I hear that people are very serious about parasite cleansing. Can you tell me at what point I should do a cleanse? Maybe after I finish my Bart meds?
Anything else I need to know? Any other suggestions? Am I missing something?
And, I am going to stop smoking this month, can't afford it and it's just making me sicker, in more ways that one, getting some sunlight, and getting some exercise.
And milk thistle to protect liver, right? Fill in the gaps if I'm missing something crucial.
Thank you so much. I feel like now, I might be able to do something, or at least FEEL like I'm trying to get better, instead of sitting here hopeless. I will sell a lot of very nice baby items on craigslist and some old clothes that I have, to try to fund what I'm trying to do. Please remember that money is veryyyyyyyyy limited, so I can't afford every single supplement. I just need the absolute necessities.
Thanks again.
P.S. Is it okay to go after Bart and Lyme at the same time or do the Bart meds hit Lyme too? Or should I really work and focus on one at a time. At what point do you give up on one and try to treat the other because you aren't seeing improvement?
-------------------- ---Beautiful Disaster--- IgeneX WB: IgM: 18+, 31+, 41+, 58+, IgG: 31++, 39 IND, 41++, 31kda Epitope Test: Positive Labcorp: IgM: 23+, 41+ No LLMD due to money since Sept 2008. Was on Doxy, I.V. Rocephin (30 days), Flagyl. Also dx with Bartonella. Posts: 139 | From United States, East Coast-ish | Registered: Aug 2009
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D Bergy
Frequent Contributor (1K+ posts)
Member # 9984
posted
I have never used Salt-C so I really cannot offer any information on it.
It was on my list of possible treatments, but I was more comfortable with Rife frequency treatments.
Many have had good results with Salt-C, but there also are a few that have had some unintended negative effects. I would look into it thouroughly to try find out what to watch for so you can minimize any risk. Most treatments have risks and this one is no different. Just watch for any problems that may develope.
Dan
Posts: 2919 | From Minnesota | Registered: Aug 2006
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quote:Originally posted by seekhelp: Without the Bionic, would you be where you are now though? Are you saying the LED could've replaced it and you feel you'd be where you are now? Just curious.
Me? No. I am not good at muscle testing myself, have never learned the art. The Bionic has a tried and true method. The other LED's are slightly different (the PE1 is strong), so do not use the same method and no one has developed a tried and true way. We discuss this in the email group (links to that group from the forum).
The three people I know personally who use the other devices with energetic testing, diet, homeopathics, are just as well as I am. Bob is one person I go to for help when I get caught up in what to do next. Every time we come up with something and I move to the next level. (Bob, I am going to beat you to remission )
So, I think Germany and the Bionic are the #1 way right now to do LED. I think that the PE1 is second, but only because there is not a developed protocol. I think both are adequate to fight the infections .... then you just have to add from there to rebuild your body to what it was/should be.
-------------------- sixgoofykids.blogspot.com Posts: 13449 | From Ohio | Registered: Feb 2007
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tickled1
Frequent Contributor (1K+ posts)
Member # 14257
posted
I didn't read everyone's replies so maybe someone mentioned this but Stop and Shop has many abx for free. I recently had to fill a prescription for my daughter for a UTI and went to Stop and Shop and her prescription was free! You'd of course have to get someone to prescribe for you though and find out which ones they offer for free.
Posts: 2541 | From Northeast | Registered: Jan 2008
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lymeinhell
Frequent Contributor (1K+ posts)
Member # 4622
posted
If it were me, and I had already developed tendon issues, I wouldn't go back on the Levaquin - ever (and yes, been there, done that).
Magnesium or no, even people without lyme can get tendonitis from a short period on Levaquin.
Why not start with the Rifampin (baby dose and build up to the 600mg/day) and add in a low dose of Flagyl to hit the cysts.
The rages could very well be Bart.
Remember to take Milk Thistle, as the Rifampin is seriously hard on the liver. Am hoping you will have a pcp at least monitor your bloodwork if you plan on doing this.
Just my humble opinion. Wishing you the will to get through this.
-------------------- Julie _ _ ___ _ _ lymeinhell
Blessed are those who expect nothing, for they shall not be disappointed. Posts: 2258 | From a better place than I was 11 yrs ago | Registered: Sep 2003
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posted
I went after bart and Lyme at the same time. If you go on Levaquin and have tendon problems, don't go back on it.
I did parasite cleansing during bart treatment. After the parasite cleanse and during the bart treatment was the first time I really had a breakthrough in my CNS symptoms.
-------------------- sixgoofykids.blogspot.com Posts: 13449 | From Ohio | Registered: Feb 2007
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ping
Frequent Contributor (1K+ posts)
Member # 6974
posted
quote:Originally posted by lymeinhell: If it were me, and I had already developed tendon issues, I wouldn't go back on the Levaquin - ever (and yes, been there, done that).
Magnesium or no, even people without lyme can get tendonitis from a short period on Levaquin.
Why not start with the Rifampin (baby dose and build up to the 600mg/day) and add in a low dose of Flagyl to hit the cysts.
The rages could very well be Bart.
Remember to take Milk Thistle, as the Rifampin is seriously hard on the liver. Am hoping you will have a pcp at least monitor your bloodwork if you plan on doing this.
Just my humble opinion. Wishing you the will to get through this.
BD,
I think 'lymeinhell' has the plan for you. If you're going to take Levaquin to assist your Rifampin, make the doses very small. Remember that Levaquin is the "push" drug for the Rifampin. At the first sign of joint pain, please stop the Levaquin, else you could end up with permanent damage. Be very careful with the Flagyl; start slow and low dose. Actually, starting low dose with all the drugs is the best thing for you, so you're not knocked on your rear. You might be going through the "Stop and Start-again" process (like randibear is right now) a number of times, so don't get too discouraged.
If you're going to take Mg, take it at least 2 hours after the abx, or 6 hours or more before the abx. As for the Milk Thistle, I don't take these types of supps at all. You might want to wait until you're up-and-running on the abx before adding anything (other than probiotics). Add one at a time so that if you have a reaction, you'll be better able to gauge to what substance is causing it.
Best to you, BD. I know it's terrible; it's HELL to be poor! When you've gotta do it yourself, you've gotta do it, yourself. Hang in there and give us a daily call.
ping "We are more than containers for Lyme"
-------------------- ping "We are more than containers for Lyme" Posts: 1302 | From Back in TX again | Registered: Mar 2005
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Melanie Reber
Frequent Contributor (5K+ posts)
Member # 3707
posted
While I NEVER recommend self-treating... I do understand that it is a necessary evil for many of us. But... PLEASE be very cautious!
-KNOW the links to drug interaction sites and check every single thing you put into your mouth. Many herbs interact with Rx meds.
-Be SURE that there is someone you know who is easily accessible who always is aware of what you are taking, when you are taking it and how much is being taken.
-Befriend an RN. This will prove invaluable.
-Think of joining MedicAlert. They have a program for those who can not afford the fee.
-Keep your local ER or Walk-in clinic on speed-dial, and know how to get there in an emergency.
-PLEASE, only start one thing at a time, start slow and be aware of each med's side effects and recommended dosing.
-Speak with your local support group leaders for more help and attend a few meetings. Those connections will also prove invaluable.
We want to see you well and not hurt further from self-inflicted preventable mistakes, so PLEASE... do everything you can to be smart about this.
Posts: 7052 | From Colorado | Registered: Mar 2003
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Been there, done that; hope I never have to again. ![[Frown]](frown.gif)
It's a real shame. You'd think some of their $800-$1,000 initial consult fees could cover a few ones for desperate people. These type of gestures may go a long way to making the LLMDs as a community look better too. 
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