LymeNet Flash: Reporting from the IV line. A Cautionary Tale

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»	LymeNet Flash » Questions and Discussion » General Support » Reporting from the IV line. A Cautionary Tale (Page 5)

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Topic: Reporting from the IV line. A Cautionary Tale

Cobweb
Unregistered

posted

quote:
Originally posted by cjnelson:
WOW!!!!!!!!

.Sure dont know about insurance though...scared about that side of things for sure.

I ahve BC/BS of KY (although I am in TN). Any idea on them????

UGH! A road, huh...a long windy ride...kinda like squiggly veings

I have blue/cross blue shield of Mass, and i live in Maryland-go figure.

Infusion company cleared it with insurance before getting involved. Insurance co apporved me for 999 days, as I guess you saw, and I paid nothing the first few months.

But then I forgot about the deductable which we pay at the beginning of each new fiscal year. So now I have a bill-of 500 to be paid off.

But I am getting the treatments, and can pay off the debt in monthly installments.

Ali seems to be having a bit of a different experience then I had-so that's the way it is with all treatments.

My experience has been a good one. I recommend it.
Ali may have a different opinion.

In fact i'm worried now that she hasn't posted here in the last couple of days. YoooHoooo where are Yooooo?

My future dread are the bicillin shots. But by now I'm willing to give it a try. I am more afraid of relapse than I am a pain in the butt.

Good luck-hope this helps you be prepared for all scenerios if you give it a go.

Take Care,
Carol

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AliG
Frequent Contributor (1K+ posts)
Member # 9734

posted

Here I am!!! [Big Grin]

I had a good day & didn't want to jinx myself. The nurse who tried to hurt me to death was back again. She tried to take the blood for labs out of the line. No such luck.

She pulled & pulled on the syringe. Then pushed & pulled & pushed & pulled. The extension & syringe started bubbling with air. (She kept shoving that back & forth, of course [shake]

) Eventually she gave up & stuck the other arm.

I DIDN'T EVEN FEEL IT!!!! I was Soooooooo HAPPY!!!!! [woohoo]

I really should have played the lottery because I think that's about as lucky as I can get. [Roll Eyes]

Today's infusion took an hour and a half again. [Frown]

I'm afraid. That was after chasing my dog around the neighbor's farm for an hour because she jumped the fence AGAIN.

I would highly recommend having something other than the Midline. I"m thinking that there's not enough dilution at that point in the arm to avoid irritating the vein. (I DO have low blood pressure so that may be a factor)

I would also recommend AGAINST having your line put in at home. Especially if you have any parasthesias/nerve sensitivities in your hands or arms. It was cruelty beyond all comprehension for me.

I also recommend that, if you spike the bag & fill the chamber, you RUN THE AIR OUT OF THE LINE!!! Just in case you run into trouble with the saline flush and the nurse kindly "hooks you up" without checking it first. [Eek!]

Seriously - talk about your "cautionary tale". I can't imagine anyone else could possibly have had so much go wrong in their first two weeks. I REALLY hope that I am just an unfortunate exception. [Frown]

Ali

Posts: 4881 | From Middlesex County, NJ | Registered: Jul 2006 | IP: Logged |

Cobweb
Unregistered

posted

Just a reminder- my doctor wrote specific orders that my picc was NOT to be used for blood draws. I have them done every two weeks-and it's always a needle stick in the other arm.

I was told blood draws from picc are not a good idea because of clots. (sure hope you read this in the morning and not just before bedtime!)

Nurse K thinks it's ridiculous because I have such a good line-nevertheless it was in the orders-NO BLOOD DRAWS from picc line.

Take Care,
Carol

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AliG
Frequent Contributor (1K+ posts)
Member # 9734

posted

quote:
Originally posted by Cobweb:

(sure hope you read this in the morning and not just before bedtime!)

SEE HOW UNLUCKY I AM!! [lol]

Thanks for the reminder. I do believe I now remember you having said that before. [Roll Eyes]

I'm not gonna let her try again. (especially after that little bubble-making thing she was doing [tsk]

) I'll just have to tough it out.

Now I lay me down to sleep...... [sleepy]

Posts: 4881 | From Middlesex County, NJ | Registered: Jul 2006 | IP: Logged |

AliG
Frequent Contributor (1K+ posts)
Member # 9734

posted

I took 2 extra-strength Tylenol an hour before I infused this am & put heat on for about 20 minutes before, also.

The saline flush backwashed a bit with some blood out of the site again. [Roll Eyes]

The infusion went well though. [Smile]

The site looked like it might be getting a little bit pink & puffy, but I can't really tell because the Tegaderm bandage is all wrinkled up again. It gets hard to tell what I'm looking at when it scrunches up like that. I hope it's just my eyes. [Roll Eyes]

I put a call in to the nurse, looks like another dressing change may be in order anyway and I'd rather be safe than sorry when it comes to an infection.

I REALLY WISH SHE'D WASH HER FREAKING HANDS!!!!! I don't believe that the santizer stuff is "just as good, if not better". I use it as a secondary precaution, AFTER I wash with the antimicrobial stuff.

I actually think I felt SAFER with the nurse who shot a line full of air in my shoulder. She washed her hands thoroughly and I doubt she'll EVER hook up another patient without checking the line.

I feel like I've been run over by a bus again. That's a good thing, right? I really need to go lie down for a bit before Nurse Assasin comes. Who knows what I could be in for today.

I just thought of something. I wonder if all the patients who had problems with the IV in the studies were actually patients of hers.... [lol]

Posts: 4881 | From Middlesex County, NJ | Registered: Jul 2006 | IP: Logged |

AliG
Frequent Contributor (1K+ posts)
Member # 9734

posted

Hi Carol,

Here's my latest episode.

A new nurse came out this morning.
Did she wash her hands? Noooooooooooo!

She walked with a cane, so I had a tough time asking her to get up and walk over to the sink.

There is truly something wrong with me. Why do I find it so hard to open my mouth and ask these nurses to practice sterile procedure? It just dumbfounds me that they go about their jobs this way.

I had to "bring" her the dressing change kit because she didn't "know where I keep my supplies". (Again I thought of the cane and refrained from saying "I don't mind telling you where they are")

While I was getting the supplies a tube of anti-bacterial hand lotion appeared on the table. I don't know if she actually used it because I didn't see her. I do know that they tell you not to apply "lotion" after the sanitizer because lotion can harbor bacteria.

She had 1/2 inch long nails manicured in dark rust, so I would have no idea what kind of stuff may have been lurking under them.

I'm quite sure it's people like me who make the "risk outweigh the benefit". My apologies to everyone. These nurses are going to kill me & it seems I'm going to let them.

I'm going to post a big sign in my kitchen that says "Cleanliness is next to Godliness, PLEASE WASH YOUR HANDS!!!" I mean REALLY a 15 second scrub, is that too much to ask?!

I just went and re-read the Hibicleanse they sent me. The 15 seconds is for personal use. (That's the same as the Dial Complete liquid antibacterial hand soap).

The surgical instructions actually say scrub 3 minutes with a brush, rinse thoroughly under running water & REPEAT! Now I can see why they don't bother. That's more than 6 minutes of hand washing! Way too much work. So why bother washing at all?

I wonder if the surgeons in the hospital just grab a squirt of anything that says anti-bacterial (if they get caught)& dive right in now. Maybe that's why hospitals have high rates of sepsis.

I think the reason the rates of infection are lower for home infusion than hospital infusion is because people who do their own infusions WASH THEIR HANDS! You only have nurse risk factor in once a week, unless you're a spaz like me. [Roll Eyes]

Oh, almost forgot, no mask or gloves either and I think some of her dandruff may have fallen on my arm.

The good news is, when she got the dressing off & cleaned it with alcohol, it didn't look infected. (YET!!!!!! [shake]

)

She's coming back Monday morning before my LL?ID appt. Somehow I think I'd feel safer taking my chances changing my own dressings. There's something definitely wrong with that.

She was a very nice person, though. I think being a pleasant nurse is equally important as it is to "look good" to an ID duck.

All of my nurses have been SO pleasant. I couldn't help but like them and they ARE GOING TO KILL ME!!!! [Eek!]

Enough about me, how are you today Carol? [Big Grin]

--------------------
Note: I'm NOT a medical professional. The information I share is from my own personal research and experience. Please do not construe anything I share as medical advice, which should only be obtained from a licensed medical practitioner.

Posts: 4881 | From Middlesex County, NJ | Registered: Jul 2006 | IP: Logged |

sometimesdilly
Frequent Contributor (1K+ posts)
Member # 9982

posted

Ali-

it's your life.

please tell your nurse (EMPLOYEE) to wash her hands. enough already. yikes!

you don't need the worry, and maybe telling her will make a huge difference, if not not with you, then with someone else's life.

hugs, dilly

Posts: 2507 | From lost in the maze | Registered: Aug 2006 | IP: Logged |

AliG
Frequent Contributor (1K+ posts)
Member # 9734

posted

quote:
Originally posted by sometimesdilly:

if not not with you, then with someone else's life.

You really know how to get to me, don't you. [Big Grin]

Yes! I can do this to save someone else!! [kiss]

Now I have to figure out what to say so they won't just wash their hands here, but EVERYWHERE!

[group hug]

I've missed you, BTW.
Where have you been?
I HAVE TO CHECK MY E-MAIL!!!!!!
Ooops, So sorry [Frown]

Posts: 4881 | From Middlesex County, NJ | Registered: Jul 2006 | IP: Logged |

Cobweb
Unregistered

posted

Oh Ali- I'm so right there with you.

But I'd like to point out if the Nurse Cane can make it to your house-she can make it to the sink!

Also if you don't feel comfortable about asking her to wash her hands thoroughly-then blame it on yourself with something like:

"Humor me . I'm a nutcase in my fear of sepsis.
And by the way,T-gel shampoo does wonders for dandruff." [Eek!]

Even I am getting scared for you Ali. I think you're right about why fewer home patients get sepsis than in patients.

My supplies, including dressing materials, are delivered every Friday afternoon-then nurse comes out on Monday for dressing change.

I'm doing okay with my picc line-but I don't want to say anything because I'm afraid I'll jinx myself. [Razz]

I'm not liking this Rifampin (oral). I'm feeling sick again-or like I'm getting sick but never really do get sick. Sore throat, glands, neck, muscle aches, headache-low level,not sleeping well. Blah Blah Blah

Mentally I feel like my head is clear-physically I feel like crap. So there you have it.

We keep dialoging - I often wonder how many other current IV Leagueres are reading and can identify?

Hope we didn't scare anyone away. I want to frame my picc when I'm through.

Take Care,
Carol

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Carol in PA
Frequent Contributor (5K+ posts)
Member # 5338

posted

Ali,
Maybe you could set up your supplies on the kitchen table for the nurse's next visit.

Then it wouldn't be so difficult for her to wash her hands before she begins working with the dressing.

"I'm really nervous about contamination. Would you be able to wash your hands first?"

Heh, when my son was to get a booster shot for tetanus, I asked the physician to please scrub the injection site with the alcohol swab.
(They usually just wipe the site with the swab.)

I have found that scrubbing the site with the swab seems to reduce the pain of the injection.
(I explained that to the doctor.)

I was practically telling the doctor what to do, but my son was kind of nervous about the injection, and I didn't want him to go through unnecessary pain.

The doc was good natured about it, and followed my instructions.
Right away, my son told him that it hadn't hurt.

Okay, so I'm bossy.
But you can be that way when you know that you're right.

[Big Grin]

Carol

Posts: 6956 | From Lancaster, PA | Registered: Feb 2004 | IP: Logged |

Cobweb
Unregistered

posted

From C in PA -"Okay, so I'm bossy.
But you can be that way when you know that you're right." I love it.

For C in PA
BTW- I have added:

1. Rifampin to my schedule-I take it on empty stomach first thing in AM with other meds I take "upon wakening"

2. Silymarin (Milk thistle) for liver support which I take 3 X a day with meals.

3. Echinacea 3 x daily which I take with meals,too. LLMD wants me to take this to see if it will help bring my WBC back up .

I think of you every time I consult my chart. I have little snack pack glad ware containers-it feels like I'm playing that pebble game.

Take Care,
Carol

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AliG
Frequent Contributor (1K+ posts)
Member # 9734

posted

Wow Cobby-

It sounds like adding the Rifampin is a good thing! [Big Grin]

I'm sorry (and glad) you're feeling like poop. It really stinks that we have to feel worse to get better.

How long were you on the IV Rocephin before you added it? (Too lazy to figure it out & sure you'll know off the top of your head. [Roll Eyes]

)

I also saw that you added a few more tasty morsels to your incredibly long med list. How the heck do you fit any food in?(or are you just adding condiments at this point [Big Grin]

)

I would say that it sounds like you're doing a really good job of fighting the fight, but I don't want to jinx you either.

About the handwashing.....

Thanks Dilly, Carol & Carol for your suggestions. [group hug]

CPA, the brisk alcohol site scrub is a goodie for me too! ((big grin))

I have found that there's no way for a nurse to avoid sanitizer gel placed directly in front of them, between them & your supplies.

I have also found that they seem to love the CVS brand Lavender & Chamomile sanitizer. I found this in the diaper aisle, after looking through all the bandaging and cold remedy aisles.

I think if you mention that you have Babesiosis & your nurse goes "Huh? WHAT'S THAT?!". You can pretty well count on those gloves going on any time she's near your blood. (maniacal laugh)

I checked with the doctor and found some studies on handwashing vs sanitizer (aka-alcohol rubs). The concensus seems to be that it IS as good. Phewwww! I forgot to ask about the face mask, but will ask today when I go to the hospital to have a PICC put in.

I guess my body failed Midline 101. The nurse changed the dressing on Saturday (after I had another flush-back Friday night & trouble infusing AGAIN in the AM). She decided to call someone before leaving & they told her to yank the line.

Good new is I had a really good unencumbered shower Sunday morning. She came in the afternoon to stick me with a peripheral to hold me until I got to see the doc.

Dr. said another month of ABX and told me I shouldn't have these problems with a PICC. I may have some mechanical Phlebitis from the catheter itself, but hopefully it shouldn't be as bad.

I'd say there is a good bet that I will because I was actually able to feel irritation all the way up my vein, through the catheter, when the flushes went up. Either that or it's just my darn sensitive nerves.

I called the hospital to schedule and guess what. Their radiologists don't take my insurance (Aetna HMO) so if I go there I have to pay OOP. Is there nothing I can do easily?!

Drs office worked with me to find a closer hospital that would accept his orders that would also have covered radiologists, without me having to go play around w/my PCP for a referral.

Now I have to wait for the radiology scheduling to call me and AGAIN I have blood all over my arm. I don't know if I should yank it or make the nurse come out because I have no idea if I'm looking at any time before tomorrow morning's infusion.

Is my life a joke or what?!!!!! [lol]

Oh and hubby called me while I was in the waiting room at the Dr's office to ask what he should do about the tick on his arm [Eek!]

, but that probably belongs in another thread. Sheeesh!

Aren't you feeling pretty good about your IV experience about now, Carol? If you are, then there is some good that has come from my hellish nightmare of continual catastrophies, I can at least smile about that. [Smile]

Ali

--------------------
Note: I'm NOT a medical professional. The information I share is from my own personal research and experience. Please do not construe anything I share as medical advice, which should only be obtained from a licensed medical practitioner.

Posts: 4881 | From Middlesex County, NJ | Registered: Jul 2006 | IP: Logged |

Cobweb
Unregistered

posted

Perhaps we should retitle this thread "The Ying and Yang of PICC."

My gosh AliG-it is distressing to read of all the difficulties you are having.

I want to tell you that I am in the process of moving-so I do not have as much time to exchange information.

I am so looking forward to telling the infusion company that my next supply order is to be delivered to a NEW address.

I notified the currior who brings my supplies and he said he would welcome the change-as he really doesn't like delivering to my current address.

Hopefully the disruption in internet service is only a minor glitch once I unplug the computer and haul it to new place.

Keep up the good fight yourself.
[group hug]

Carol

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AliG
Frequent Contributor (1K+ posts)
Member # 9734

posted

Congratulations on the move! [Big Grin]

I hope it all goes smoothly and easily. I'm really glad that things are getting better for you! [group hug]

My PICC is in place. It only took 1 hr and 10 minutes. (she said sarcastically) It was supposed to take around a half hour.

The radiologist said "it looks like you have a sensitive vein". I had told several people about my stupid veins, I guess the word didn't get to him. [Roll Eyes]

I had to laugh. I told him "It would seem that ALL my veins are sensitive. I think that's why I'm here.".

I won't bore you with all the little details. It's in & I'm still alive, so it could have been worse.

The infusion company just informed me that the orders they got from Dr. were only to extend for two weeks (not the month I had been told).

All I can say is, if I just went through the ordeal of having this PICC placed for two weeks of infusions, I'll be heading up there to do a PICC placement of my own! (& he won't like my choice of insertion sites [lol]

)

I'm sure probably has to do with getting through my insurance or something. I wasn't under the impresssion that he was planning to stop soon. I should be able to find out what's going on Monday.

I'm sending up a prayer for a smooth move. I hope all goes well. [group hug]

Posts: 4881 | From Middlesex County, NJ | Registered: Jul 2006 | IP: Logged |

AliG
Frequent Contributor (1K+ posts)
Member # 9734

posted

This morning my dog came bounding into my room & up onto the bed. Of course she landed her paw right on the insertion sight. [shake]

It hurt quite a [cussing]

bit. I checked it out and I don't think any real damage was done. There was a little blood coming from the site & a little bit from one of the stitches, not really much at all.

My flush and infusion seemed uneventful so I'm guessing no serious harm was done.

I don't want to call the nurse that's covering because my regular nurse is supposed to be coming back tomorrow, I believe.

As long as I can get her to use the sanitizer, I'm golden because she covers all the other bases.

The covering nurse came out to do the 24 hr dressing change. She took a squirt & put one glove on. (better than none) Then she took the glove off and started picking at the stat-lock with her long darkly polished nail.

She told me that if she breaks a nail I'm in trouble. I think that's pretty funny. Don't you think that's pretty funny? I wanted to smack her in the head with the glove and then throw up on her.

If only there was a way to see it coming & stop it before it happens. Once she has her bare nails in there, the sterility's been compromised, so what's the difference at that point?

I also just found out that they're not sending the labs to Quest so my insurance isn't covering them. Yet another call for tomorrow. [Roll Eyes]

I hope the move is going well, Carol. [hi]

Posts: 4881 | From Middlesex County, NJ | Registered: Jul 2006 | IP: Logged |

AliG
Frequent Contributor (1K+ posts)
Member # 9734

posted

Did you ever roll onto the shoulder of your PICCed arm & get fluttering in your chest?

I woke up one morning with the fluttering & a dry cough. I don't know if I had been on that shoulder, but it scared the bejeepers out of me.

I went to go to sleep the other night and, without thinking, rolled onto the PICCed shoulder. The fluttering started again. I immediately rolled off and it stopped. What's that about??? Should that be happening?

[confused]

I've also been having a feeling of pressure in the center of my chest, but I think that started before the IV (not certain). The coughing seems to be continuing today. I think the pressure seems to be relieved somewhat by lying down with a heat pack on my chest. I'm not sure which one is helping or if it's the combo.

The feeling in my chest could just be from all the coughing, I suppose. [Roll Eyes]

Posts: 4881 | From Middlesex County, NJ | Registered: Jul 2006 | IP: Logged |

Cobweb
Unregistered

posted

It is finished.

My picc line has been pulled-but not without putting up a fight.

OMG-it looked like Nurse K was playing tug of war with it, she was pulling on it so hard it got taut.

I just about fainted I was so freaked. I thought those things just slid out easy. Somehow this one was attached.

Finally there was an audible POP when it released and out it came-fibrin sheath and all.

No blood-I expected a geyser, but there wasn't even a trickle.

Look for my handy dandy portable pvc pole for sale on ebay! [Big Grin]

Ali- I still want to keep close tabs on how you are doing-so keep me posted.

I have now earned a PHD(that's a Poopy Head Degree in honor of our dear Cave) from an IV league School of Hard Knocks.

That's All for Now Folks, [Big Grin]

Carol Cobweb

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AliG
Frequent Contributor (1K+ posts)
Member # 9734

posted

HOORAY!!!!

Congratulations on your graduation!!!!! [Big Grin]

(PhD

, I miss Cavey [Frown]

)

Thanks for the warning on the Tug & Pop, that would freak me out too. [Eek!]

8 whole months - you're my inspiration. [Smile]

I'm glad you're doing better. What's next? Bicillin inj? I don't believe that I could survive that.

Though I guess it can't be as bad as the catheter placements, so maybe now I could. Who knows??

Did that fibrin sheath look like a long string of dark bloody slime? If so, that may have been what was messing up my midlines.

[confused]

I really hope someday I can graduate & be a Poopy-head just like you! [Razz]

Though, when it comes to being a Poopy-head, there's a test I should have no trouble passing. [lol]

Posts: 4881 | From Middlesex County, NJ | Registered: Jul 2006 | IP: Logged |

Cobweb
Unregistered

posted

I took a shower for the first time in 8 months!

I mean a REAL shower. Lathered up , scrubbed with a Loufah Sponge from my neck all the way down to my toes. Even used Conditioner on my hair. Wonderful.

No more "quickies" in the shower. [Razz]

Or holding onto the shower rod to keep my left arm out of the way.

No more scheduling time for infusions. No more excuse to do nothing but sit at the computer. [Eek!]

But who really needs an excuse-how about it's raining out?

LLMD is continuing me on oral Omnicef and Rifampin. Every time she brought up Bicillin shots I made horrible faces grimacing. I am such a chicken.

As for the fibrin sheath-Nurse K quickly hid the evidence in the sharps' container while I regained my composure. I have discarded my fantasy of framing the picc line,too.

So now I am a free woman!

I miss Cavey,too. Hope she knows I made it!

Cobby

IP: Logged |

AliG
Frequent Contributor (1K+ posts)
Member # 9734

posted

I AM SO JEALOUS OF THAT SHOWER!!!!!!!

The nurse had given me a day's break back in between pulling the midline & placing the peripheral & you know that's were I was! Scrubbing & lathering & scrubbing, I still remember how glorious it felt. [Big Grin]

I sure hope I don't have to wait another 6 months to do that again. [Frown]

Man I want a good shower! (you can't see me, but I'm stomping my feet [Roll Eyes]

)

The nurse got that midline she yanked concealed pretty fast too, that's why I'm not really sure what I saw, but I have my suspicions.

Oh fooey!! NURSE AT 2:00!!! Look at the time - Gotta Go!

SO JEALOUS!!!!!!!, but good for you!! [hi]

Posts: 4881 | From Middlesex County, NJ | Registered: Jul 2006 | IP: Logged |

beckyM
Member
Member # 13944

posted

Ok Ali...took me awhile...eyes kept going in and out...and I went from points of laughing to being just absolutly disgusted by teh poor practices of nurses out there...oh my god!!!

I couldnt even get a picture of a nurse wearing fake nails trying to pick of your stat lock without gloves! We are not even allowed to (and I would never because of infection) wear fake nails!!! And as for touching you without gloves...I cant even go there!!!

And to be honest...the antibacterial stuff has been proven to be jsut as good...that being said...I ALWAYS WASH my hands, and I do it while the patient is watching...and...THEN I USE THE ANTIBIOTIC stuff...maybe I am over protctive...maybe just crazy...HAHAHA

I am so sorry you guys have all had to go through such nightmares...ughh!!!

Posts: 68 | From Massachusetts | Registered: Nov 2007 | IP: Logged |

AliG
Frequent Contributor (1K+ posts)
Member # 9734

posted

quote:
Originally posted by beckyM:

And to be honest...the antibacterial stuff has been proven to be jsut as good...that being said...I ALWAYS WASH my hands, and I do it while the patient is watching...and...THEN I USE THE ANTIBIOTIC stuff...maybe I am over protctive...maybe just crazy...HAHAHA

Would you be my nurse, PLEASE ?! [Big Grin]

The fingernails were hers,(I think) just long. I don't know whether they were wrapped or just polished.
[shake]

Posts: 4881 | From Middlesex County, NJ | Registered: Jul 2006 | IP: Logged |

beckyM
Member
Member # 13944

posted

I'm there! I'll help with the IV stuff and you can educate me on the Lyme stuff...Deal? [Smile]

Posts: 68 | From Massachusetts | Registered: Nov 2007 | IP: Logged |

AliG
Frequent Contributor (1K+ posts)
Member # 9734

posted

DEAL!

Please feel free to PM me if I don't always catch your posts. [dizzy]

Thanks for all your help! [group hug]

Posts: 4881 | From Middlesex County, NJ | Registered: Jul 2006 | IP: Logged |

Cobweb
Unregistered

posted

"Fact or Crap" ?

I had moved into my new apartment by the time Nurse K came to remove my picc line.

Being conscientious I bought some antibacterial soap just for her to use for the finale.

I followed her into the bathroom for the handwashing ceremony.

She bypassed the soap for a quick rinse under cold water. I pointed out the soap and told her I had bought it just for her.

"you don't need soap" she answered," you really just need friction" [Eek!]

Fact or Crap?????

Cobby

IP: Logged |

beckyM
Member
Member # 13944

posted

CRAP!!! You can tell her that the CDC recommends washing hands with SOAP and water for atleast 20 seconds to avoid the spread of germs!!!

And then, I would be curious how many of your nurses are using paper towels to turn the faucet off after she washes her hands...becuase she turned that faucet on with her dirty hands...right?

So, whatever was on her hands before washing is now on the faucet...so if she uses her clean hands to turn it off...her hands are now dirty again!!!

CDC does recommend alcohol based hand cleansers also but they must be applied and rubbed all over hands and through fingers until dry...

Does this help??? If your lovely home health nurse doesnt believe in soap...print it out from the CDC and nicely hand it to her...hahahaha

Becky

Posts: 68 | From Massachusetts | Registered: Nov 2007 | IP: Logged |

AliG
Frequent Contributor (1K+ posts)
Member # 9734

posted

Carol,

Were you making fun of me? [bonk]

Please tell me she didn't really say that! [shake]

Thanks Becky!

This is for the IV newbies, so they don't have to repeat my experience:

Link to CDC - Hand Hygiene Guideline Fact Sheet

Hand Hygiene Guidelines Fact Sheet

Improved adherence to hand hygiene (i.e. hand washing or use of alcohol-based hand rubs) has been shown to terminate outbreaks in health care facilities, to reduce transmission of antimicrobial resistant organisms (e.g. methicillin resistant staphylococcus aureus) and reduce overall infection rates.

CDC is releasing guidelines to improve adherence to hand hygiene in health care settings. In addition to traditional handwashing with soap and water, CDC is recommending the use of alcohol-based handrubs by health care personnel for patient care because they address some of the obstacles that health care professionals face when taking care of patients.

Handwashing with soap and water remains a sensible strategy for hand hygiene in non-health care settings and is recommended by CDC and other experts.

When health care personnel's hands are visibly soiled, they should wash with soap and water.

The use of gloves does not eliminate the need for hand hygiene. Likewise, the use of hand hygiene does not eliminate the need for gloves. Gloves reduce hand contamination by 70 percent to 80 percent, prevent cross-contamination and protect patients and health care personnel from infection. Handrubs should be used before and after each patient just as gloves should be changed before and after each patient.

When using an alcohol-based handrub, apply product to palm of one hand and rub hands together, covering all surfaces of hands and fingers, until hands are dry. Note that the volume needed to reduce the number of bacteria on hands varies by product.

Alcohol-based handrubs significantly reduce the number of microorganisms on skin, are fast acting and cause less skin irritation.

Health care personnel should avoid wearing artificial nails and keep natural nails less than one quarter of an inch long if they care for patients at high risk of acquiring infections (e.g. Patients in intensive care units or in transplant units

When evaluating hand hygiene products for potential use in health care facilities, administrators or product selection committees should consider the relative efficacy of antiseptic agents against various pathogens and the acceptability of hand hygiene products by personnel. Characteristics of a product that can affect acceptance and therefore usage include its smell, consistency, color and the effect of dryness on hands.

As part of these recommendations, CDC is asking health care facilities to develop and implement a system for measuring improvements in adherence to these hand hygiene recommendations. Some of the suggested performance indicators include: periodic monitoring of hand hygiene adherence and providing feedback to personnel regarding their performance, monitoring the volume of alcohol-based handrub used/1000 patient days, monitoring adherence to policies dealing with wearing artificial nails and focused assessment of the adequacy of health care personnel hand hygiene when outbreaks of infection occur.

Allergic contact dermatitis due to alcohol hand rubs is very uncommon. However, with increasing use of such products by health care personnel, it is likely that true allergic reactions to such products will occasionally be encountered.

Alcohol-based hand rubs take less time to use than traditional hand washing. In an eight-hour shift, an estimated one hour of an ICU nurse's time will be saved by using an alcohol-based handrub.

These guidelines should not be construed to legalize product claims that are not allowed by an FDA product approval by FDA's Over-the-Counter Drug Review. The recommendations are not intended to apply to consumer use of the products discussed.
# # #

CDC protects people's health and safety by preventing and controlling diseases and injuries; enhances health decisions by providing credible information on critical health issues; and promotes healthy living through strong partnerships with local, national, and international organizations.

Here's a link to the 56 page Guideline for Hand Hygiene in Health-Care Settings
Recommendations of the Healthcare Infection Control Practices
Advisory Committee and the HICPAC/SHEA/APIC/IDSA
Hand Hygiene Task Force , if they'd rather read that. [Wink]

Personally I think I would post the fact sheet right near my supplies with a bottle of hand sanitizer. I'd tell the nurse it's so I don't forget. [dizzy]

Then there's no hard feelings & the topic was addressed before it ever even needed to be. [Wink]

Becky, you're beautiful!!!! [kiss]

****Edit to add: updated CDC Hand Hygiene link****

[ 06-02-2013, 09:47 AM: Message edited by: AliG ]

--------------------
Note: I'm NOT a medical professional. The information I share is from my own personal research and experience. Please do not construe anything I share as medical advice, which should only be obtained from a licensed medical practitioner.

Posts: 4881 | From Middlesex County, NJ | Registered: Jul 2006 | IP: Logged |

beckyM
Member
Member # 13944

posted

I love it...I think that is a great idea AliG!!! Everyone with a home health nurse should do that!!!! Thanks for posting the link!!

Posts: 68 | From Massachusetts | Registered: Nov 2007 | IP: Logged |

AliG
Frequent Contributor (1K+ posts)
Member # 9734

posted

To give credit where credit is due-
I could not have done it without you! [Smile]

Just think of how many lives you might be saving, just by mentioning the CDC site. [Big Grin]

Now all we have to do is find a way to get all the IV newbies to read this incredibly long thread. [Roll Eyes]

Maybe treepatrol can stick it in the newbie links thread? Or Betty in the newbie package?
How do we save the IV newbies?

I know! Maybe we can put it in it's own thread & keep it visible on the board for those intimidated by the length of this!

I have another question for you, if you don't mind. [Smile]

I know that the nurse should be wearing a mask when she changes the dressing, to avoid breathing germs onto the site.

Does it matter if you talk over your undressed wound, with your own germs?

[confused]

Posts: 4881 | From Middlesex County, NJ | Registered: Jul 2006 | IP: Logged |

Cobweb
Unregistered

posted

AliG- no way was I making fun of you.

In fact, when she said "friction is all you need" , I thought "oh brother, wait until my cohorts hear this one"

and then I had visions of grabbing my hard loufa sponge and applying a bit of real friction to her hands.

And I think that's a great question about whether the patient themselves should wear a mask for a sterile procedure.

Nurse K declined using my bar soap saying it had my cooties on it , which were okay for me, but not for her.

So that's another Fact or Crap question- Does bar soap harbor the cooties of the last person who used it?

Meanwhile, I am feeling like I won the lottery for surviving my eight months of IV-which didn't seem nearly as harrowing as your experiences so far.

Cavey thought I was using "poetic licensing" with some of the things I reported- but I assured her, or rather I should say, unnerved her ,by confirming I speak the truth.

And thanks for dragging that CDC report to the thread. I plan to print it for any further escapades with home health agencies.

I have a set of scars on my inner arm at the site that looks like a constellation. I think I should name it. Looks like Orion's belt buckle.

Cobby

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beckyM
Member
Member # 13944

posted

Bars of soap...actaully they can harbor germs. Think of it this way, have you ever seen a bar of soap that has been used by someone whose hands are really dirty? The bar of soap looks gross when they are done!

That being said...every Home Health Nurse should have there OWN bottle of soap in their bag!!! I even had my own papertowels!!!

Strong suggestion, buy the antibacterial pump soap.

Just looking out for all of your best interest!!!

Becky [Smile]

Posts: 68 | From Massachusetts | Registered: Nov 2007 | IP: Logged |

beckyM
Member
Member # 13944

posted

AliG,

Ooops, I missed your question when I replied above...so, here is your answer...

Once the nurse is doing the sterile dressing, you SHOULD NOT BE TALKING OVER THE SITE! Even if it is your germs. You should be looking in the other directions!

If you want to see what she is doing, put a mask on. That way, you are protecting yourself.

The chances are probably slim to none that anything would ever happen from your own germs from what I understand...however, I wouldnt take that chance!

Posts: 68 | From Massachusetts | Registered: Nov 2007 | IP: Logged |

Cobweb
Unregistered

posted

"Strong suggestion, buy the antibacterial pump soap. " This is exactly what I did when she shunned my bar soap-and then she shunned that,too. [Frown]

I did provide a roll of papertowels in the bathroom. 1 point for me! [Smile]

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beckyM
Member
Member # 13944

posted

She shunned the pump soap??? Where did she get her nursing lic? On teh back of a cracker jack box? LOL!!!

one point for Cob
zero for the nurse

Looks like your ahead!!! HAHAHAHA

Posts: 68 | From Massachusetts | Registered: Nov 2007 | IP: Logged |

Cobweb
Unregistered

posted

"She shunned the pump soap??? "

Yeah- that's when she said you really just need friction to remove the germs!

You know-I never did ask to see her license. [Eek!]

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AliG
Frequent Contributor (1K+ posts)
Member # 9734

posted

Thanks Becky!

I was keeping my head the other way & holding my breath when I'd turn to look. I was actually wondering if I was being unnecessarily paranoid. [Roll Eyes]

I just read a thread in medical where nobody felt much pain with the PICC insertion. TWO KIDS had kitchen table midlines put in without much pain to speak of!!!!!!

WHAT ON EARTH IS WRONG WITH ME?! I darn near died from the pain with my midlines & my PICC insertion hurt as well, no where near the midline, but still.

Is it because I have parasthesias in my hand? Are my nerves more sensitive?

I think I'm going to tell the LLMD that he can't stop the IV until he can stick me with a cath insertion needle without me needing to scream.

Becky,

Do you know why it would have hurt ME so much worse than other people? I ALMOST PASSED OUT FROM THE PAIN!! I wasn't taking dramatic license, I really did.

The Midline was worse than unmedicated childbirth with artificially intensified contractions!

I didn't want to post this in that poor kid's thread because apparently there's something REALLY wrong with me. I'm just gonna pray that whatever's wrong with me isn't wrong with him too.

I think I really have to ask the Dr. about this. [shake]

Posts: 4881 | From Middlesex County, NJ | Registered: Jul 2006 | IP: Logged |

beckyM
Member
Member # 13944

posted

Hey AliG,

Hmmmm...I can't say for sure, I can only take a guess as to why yours hurt so much...

If you have parathesias then you obviously have nerve involvement. The nerves in your arms and going up to your spinal cord are already at a disadvantage.

The only GUESS, and it is just that, a guess, is that you have such a large amount of nerve involvment from the Lyme that your sympathetic nervous system (your fight or flight) is "OVERSTIMULATING" itself in an attempt to protect you.

I would def. ask your doctor, if anything, jsut to see what his opinion is on this...

Becky

Posts: 68 | From Massachusetts | Registered: Nov 2007 | IP: Logged |

AliG
Frequent Contributor (1K+ posts)
Member # 9734

posted

Thanks Becky [Smile]

I wonder if I AM the only one who's had this type of experience or if others who've had parasthesias experienced the same type of pain response.

I think I'll post a thread to ask.

[hi]

Posts: 4881 | From Middlesex County, NJ | Registered: Jul 2006 | IP: Logged |

Cobweb
Unregistered

posted

quote:
Originally posted by beckyM:
Bars of soap...actaully they can harbor germs.
Becky

I will never look at a bar of soap the same way again!

Ali- I have experienced Paresthesia in the past. I say in the past because that's when it was most predominant-from the top of my head down to my feet-flooded with very strong tingling sensations.

During a med reaction once medics took me to ER because they thought I might be having a transient stroke.

Now I would liken my paresthesia to a "sprinkling of tingles" localized -usually my legs.

The only part of my picc insertion that hurt was the shot to numb the area.

I do not think it effects my reaction to pain. I will repost this if you do run a poll.

Cobby

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beckyM
Member
Member # 13944

posted

Oh...and AliG...I forgot to tell you...YOU DONT NEED TO "HOLD YOUR BREATH" shen she changes your dressing...

I have visions of you turning blue and passing out just so you dont get germs on your insertion site... [bonk]

Just look the other way... [Big Grin]

Posts: 68 | From Massachusetts | Registered: Nov 2007 | IP: Logged |

AliG
Frequent Contributor (1K+ posts)
Member # 9734

posted

ROFLMAO!

Thanks a lot Becky!!!!

Give me a little credit! [bonk]

I would only hold it when I felt the need to see what was going on, then I would turn away & BREATHE!!!!

If I didn't look, I wouldn't have known that she was picking at the statlock with her fingernails! [Eek!]

Posts: 4881 | From Middlesex County, NJ | Registered: Jul 2006 | IP: Logged |

AliG
Frequent Contributor (1K+ posts)
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posted

alright, I may have come close to turning blue once. [Wink]

Posts: 4881 | From Middlesex County, NJ | Registered: Jul 2006 | IP: Logged |

Cobweb
Unregistered

posted

I don't even look for a simple blood draw!

After watching about half an hour of videos from the other thread posted by MysteryGirl, I sure am glad I was already horizontal when they inserted the picc line.

I am well practiced in counting ceiling tiles.
And I always thank the few techs who take the time to tape up interesting pictures.

Sometimes I watch the Nurse's face to get a feel for whether the procedure is going well, or hitting a few snag.

As was the case literally when my picc was removed. I could tell by the expression on her face, and the grunting , that this was not going according to plan.

Hence I took a quick look-now I need a few more sessions for PTSD. Maybe if I hadn't seen the movie Aliens I wouldn't have gotten so freaked.

Later-kid says she needs computer for homework-yeah right! Better believe I'll be a POS. [Big Grin]

Cobby

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AliG
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posted

I just wanted to mention that I believe the rash that started under my dressing/statlock had something to do with fungus, probably caused by moisture that built up there while washing the Thanksgiving dishes.

After trying all kinds of things to heal the stupid rash & stop it from spreading, I finally was able to get it under control with Desitin ointment. The area outside the present dressing, of course.

It had started improving about 5 days in on Diflucan. Then about 3-4 days after the Rx ran out, it started getting worse again. It has continued to spread & worsen under the dressing.

Fungus is the only thing I can think of that would have caused it to spread to the previous midline statlock area and get as bad as it did there. I had noticed a couple of tiny red spots there, so after I had put neosporin on the rest of the rash, I rubbed some there too.

That probably spread spores, held them on the skin, and kept the area moist allowing them to get a foothold there too.

I'm just posting this in the hope that nobody else should repeat my stupidity and to offer up Desitin as a solution if they do. [Roll Eyes]

Posts: 4881 | From Middlesex County, NJ | Registered: Jul 2006 | IP: Logged |

Cobweb
Unregistered

posted

Are your dressings changed once a week?

Hope you're not planning to wash the Christmas dishes,too. I used paper plates for Thanksgiving. Some might call it tacky-I called it practical.

Anybody who complains about paper plates for Christmas can do the dishes.

I have been meaning to pass on another tidbit-I have quite a collection of cutoff sock cuffs-so I started to wear them as "palm protectors" when I am on the computer.

Since they don't make fur lined mouse pads the sock cuff acts as a buffer. The palm of my hand still gets red, but it does not feel so tender or irritated.

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AliG
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posted

quote:
Originally posted by Cobweb:
Are your dressings changed once a week?

Yes, but that's all over now. [Roll Eyes]

I'm getting yanked on Tuesday.

Thanksgiving was always my big holiday. I couldn't even attempt it last year & this year was out too. [Frown]

My MIL had it at her house and, since she would usually help me with the dishes, I felt sort of obliged to reciprocate.

I know how much I appreciate the help when I spend a good week prepping & a couple of days cooking. It was just the right stupid thing to do.

That's a good idea with the sock cuffs. I'm glad to know I'll still have a use for them after Tuesday. [Big Grin]

I'm so afraid that I'm going to sink back into my Lymed-stupidity after only 10 weeks of ceftriaxone, but I guess I just have to hope for the best.

This has not been fun for me and I'll be really glad when it's over. I can't even think about the possibility of ever having to repeat it right now. [shake]

How's everything been going with you?

--------------------
Note: I'm NOT a medical professional. The information I share is from my own personal research and experience. Please do not construe anything I share as medical advice, which should only be obtained from a licensed medical practitioner.

Posts: 4881 | From Middlesex County, NJ | Registered: Jul 2006 | IP: Logged |

Cobweb
Unregistered

posted

I'm continuing on oral Omnicef-in the same family as Rocephin. I really got depressed when Fallon's study came out because I was afraid I would get lost in La La LymeLand again.

Whether it's the placebo effect, or true effect I see Omnicef as a safety net. Fallon's study did not include any follow up on orals. So I hope this is the difference between marching forward or sliding backwards.

I am continuing to feel better and more myself. I'm sorry you were not able to continue on the Rocephin longer. But that doesn't mean things won't continue to improve for you,too.

Keep the Faith Baby,
Carol

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AliG
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Member # 9734

posted

So I guess the oral Omnicef might not be such a bad thing. I had taken oral Cefixime, a couple of ABX before the ceftriaxone, & it was pretty much useless. I do hope the Omnicef will work better for me.

I thought you were doing Bicillin shots. Did you finish that or weasel out of it?

--------------------
Note: I'm NOT a medical professional. The information I share is from my own personal research and experience. Please do not construe anything I share as medical advice, which should only be obtained from a licensed medical practitioner.

Posts: 4881 | From Middlesex County, NJ | Registered: Jul 2006 | IP: Logged |

Cobweb
Unregistered

posted

Taking the path of least resistance-much easier to pop a pill in my mouth than jab a needle in my butt-ox. [Razz]

So- did you get your picc pulled?? Did I miss the update somewhere else?

Carol

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AliG
Frequent Contributor (1K+ posts)
Member # 9734

posted

OOOOOOOOOOOPS!!!!! [Embarrassed]

Sorry about that. [Roll Eyes]

It was yanked the Tuesday before Christmas. I'm pretty sure I posted it somewhere. Where? I have NO clue. [dizzy]

I guess the Omnicef isn't working quite as well for me.

Since last Thursday, I've been having quite a bit of pain (neck, shoulders, back, & just above knees), headaches too (come & go). I'm not sure what the heck it means. Is it a drug side effect, some co-infection or the yeast again???

I think it's too fast to be the Bb. The yeast could be a factor, but the Rocephin sure wouldn't have been holding that back.

Side effect or co-infection, care to place a bet? I go back to "LLIDMD" 1/3. I'm debating on whether to call & give him the "heads up" before hand, so he's not thinking I'm all "honky dory".

The insurance company sent me a letter, which I opened the evening before Christmas Eve. They're refusing to cover the IV. They say I needed to get a pre-certification(?)(or some such crap) from my PCP, PRIOR to the IV & that it needed to show that it was of "Life-threatening" necessity.

Did I mention that I was 12 hour late with a dose BECAUSE THEY HAD TO GET THE INSURANCE APPROVAL before they would send the meds?!!!!!! [cussing]

The delay in GETTING STARTED was because THEY HAD TO GET THE INSURANCE APPROVAL!!!!!!!!! [Mad]

why???.....

[Frown]

Ali

PS- I hope you had the loveliest of holidays! [group hug]

Posts: 4881 | From Middlesex County, NJ | Registered: Jul 2006 | IP: Logged |

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