posted
I posted on the General Support side and meant for it to be here in Medical.
I am again writing concerning our 27 year old daughter who has recently been diagnosed with LD.
It seems that she has more and more problems with her ability to think logically. I'm just not sure if its the LD or the medications shes taking from her Pain Management doctor.
I can't get her interested in reading about LD on this site or on any other. She doesn't seem to want to find out about the disease, the treatment or anything else.
Her speech is slurred, her short term memory is bad, her thought processes are just not right.
Can anyone speak to the difference between the symptoms of LD and the effects of pain meds like Norco, anti-anxiety meds like Colonopin, and anti-depressants like Zoloft???
Thanks in advance for your input.
Lyme Dad
Posts: 681 | From California | Registered: Oct 2005
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SForsgren
Frequent Contributor (1K+ posts)
Member # 7686
posted
Slurred speech, etc. sounds like symptoms of Lyme.
-------------------- Be well, Scott Posts: 4617 | From San Jose, CA | Registered: Jul 2005
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NP40
Frequent Contributor (1K+ posts)
Member # 6711
posted
She certainly exhibits symptoms of lyme, but, of the anti-depressent's as well. If she has lyme, abx will eventually fix the problems. Maybe a little more background would be helpful ?
How long has she been ill ? Symptoms ? Has she been diagnosed with lyme ? Is she being treated with abx ?
Posts: 1632 | From Northern Wisconsin | Registered: Jan 2005
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I have memory problems, logical thinking problems and was having some rage problems. I take the clonopin for the rage when I need it. I haven't noticed any side effects from it. The memory and logic problems seem to be getting better with antibiotics.
Posts: 441 | From USA | Registered: Jul 2004
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minoucat
Frequent Contributor (1K+ posts)
Member # 5175
posted
It can be extremely difficult to sort out what is caused by a herxheimer reaction, by the meds themselves, and by the disease.
LD, in and of itself (I was not on painkillers or antidepressants), caused me enormous coginitive problems. In the end it was the cognitive stuff, far more than the pain and physical dysfunction, that forced me to leave my job. I was unable to remember meetings I'd been to the day before; I got lost driving to the home I've lived in for more than a decade; and at times was unable to write a coherent sentence or remember the topic of a paragraph I'd just read. My tongue got kind of stiff for a while and my speech was kind of mumbly, and I frequently said the wrong word, as in "I'm cold, please shut the banana" (Really)
In part, this may be why your daughter appears to be uninterested in reading more about LD. She may not be able to process the info.
In addition, at various times I experienced intense depression and anxiety,also caused by LD -- to the point that I'd practically pass out from a panic attack when reading threads about herxes, treatment problems, insurance denials, etc. on this board.
Some antibiotics have a serious interaction with SSRIs like zoloft, but I don't know about interactions with painkillers. Macrolides can cause a massive increase in serum levels of SSRIS: Here are posts about it (there are more good posts on this topic by auntybiotic, Lyddie, and Lymemomtoo): --SSRIs and auntibiotics
And, finally, the stew of antidepressants, painkillers, and anti-anxiety drugs may well be causing problems. Do you have a pharmacist that you trust that you can talk to? It's difficult to sort out, and doctors in general are NOT KNOWLEDGEABLE about drugs and their interactions, and how to manage them. Even (especially) neurologists, in my experience.
Perhaps someone can come along with more specific info. In the meantime -- best wishes for all of you. This illness is terribly hard on the whole family. Your daughter is very lucky to have you in her corner.
PS -- editing to add that after treatment for Lyme disease, AND babesia, AND bartonella (doing my second bart round now), AND yeast, and who knows whatall else that was treated in concurrence -- I'm doing very well and my sx are either vastly reduced or gone. It's a long haul, though.
-------------------- ********************* RECIDITE, PLEBES! Gero rem imperialem! (Stand aside plebians! I am on imperial business.)
posted
My wife has had the same symptoms you described. She was on painkillers, anti-depressants, and more but only recently (2 months ago) developed the neuro symptoms.
She was diagnoised Oct 19th of this year with chronic LD. About 5 days ago she started losing the neuro symptoms after about a week on antibiotics. We still have a long way to go as she has been sick for 6 years but I am glad to have her cognitive function almost fully restored. She still has some short term memory loss but is doing well so far.
Posts: 82 | From Summerville, SC | Registered: Sep 2005
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Carol in PA
Frequent Contributor (5K+ posts)
Member # 5338
posted
LymeDad: I doubt very much that the Zoloft is causing the symptoms that you described. I don't think the pain meds would do that either.
You said, "her short term memory is bad, her thought processes are just not right." I'm on Zoloft, and that helped me, in that it decreased my perception of the pain. The pain was still there, but it didn't hurt as much. Sometimes the pain meds I've taken have seemed to improve my thought processes a little.
However, the Lyme bacteria can affect the brain and the mind. There is a slight inflammation of the blood vessels in the brain, and this causes less blood to be able to flow through the tiniest capillaries.
Decreased blood flow means fewer red cells, means that there is less oxygen to the brain cells. This "hypoperfusion" causes problems in the operation of the neurons in the brain, resulting in symptoms that may result in poor memory, difficulty making decisions, apathy, depression, low motivation, anxiety.
Does that sound like your daughter?
I have all this, plus headaches. I have poor comprehension for intricate subjects that I know little about. One thing I've been able to retain, after months and months of reading, is some of the information about Lyme Disease.
There are some alternative treatments that will help to increase the blood flow to the brain. I'm still working on that, because I really want my mind back.
If your daughter has no interest in looking for information and treatment, you may have to be her advocate.
Good luck. Carol
Posts: 6947 | From Lancaster, PA | Registered: Feb 2004
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posted
Sounds consistent with Lyme ... AND possibly systemic yeast. The slurred speech could be from yeast. Is she following a low carb, sugar-free diet?
posted
Thanks to all who have answered my original post.
SForsgren: Thanks again.
NP40: Nikki was diagnosed has having Fibromyalgia almost 4 years ago. Since that time she has been suffering with acute joint pains, severe migraine headaches, depression, anxiety attacks and insomnia.
She has been to about every specialist we can find, neurologist, rheumatologist, infectious disease specialist, cardiologist, chiropratic and three different GPs.
She just recently tested positive for LD, Babesia and Bartonella. She has not started abx, but has an appointment with Dr. H here in California on Nov 6th.
DJP & minoucat: Thank you for the links and the inputs. I'm going to research each of the links tonight.
cgooge: We're really looking forward to the return of our daughter, she is greatly missed.
Posts: 681 | From California | Registered: Oct 2005
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The information you provided is outstanding. Your list of symptoms sounds like a description of our daughter exactly, especially the apathy and low motivation.
One of our biggest concerns has been the possibility of narcotic addiction. Her pain medication intake is incredible. The doctors have assured us that she is not addicted, but as parents we are quite concerned.
If you find any other info about alternative treatments, I'd really appreciate your feedback.
Lymetoo: I know very little about yeast infections, but Dr. H has Nikki on a very strict no sugar, no carb, no yeast, no flour diet; although she doesn't seem too interested in following it. Another concern of ours.
Lyme Dad
Posts: 681 | From California | Registered: Oct 2005
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lyme_suz
Unregistered
posted
Lymedad,
Lyme is so hard, but it is a more hopeful diagnosis than others because it is treatable and folks get well.
I have my 14yr old girl back 5yrs lyme, 1yr treatment.
She is lucky she has a parent that is able to note symptoms and help evaluate and communicate to dr. I had trouble even knowing what our symptoms were until they were very bad.
posted
She's so fortunate to have you interested enough to get so involved. Doubt she realizes that now. The symptoms for Lyme are so widespread, everything you mention can be Lyme-related. I'm doing so-so right now with an infectious disease doc, psychiatrist specializing in chronic adult diseases, pain mgmt doc and my internist. But I had Lyme 7 years before I was diagnosed (now 4 years into treatment). There's lots of gaps in my memory, my ability to handle even the smallest problem - it can get pretty bad. Just encourage her and see that she gets the right medical support - don't let her give up. We've all wanted to at times, but we're still here!!!
Posts: 108 | From Florida | Registered: Sep 2005
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quote:Originally posted by lymedad: Lymetoo: I know very little about yeast infections, but Dr. H has Nikki on a very strict no sugar, no carb, no yeast, no flour diet; although she doesn't seem too interested in following it. Another concern of ours.
it's very important. She won't feel much better and can feel even worse if she doesn't follow the diet. Hope you can make headway there.
Blessings!
-------------------- --Lymetutu-- Opinions, not medical advice! Posts: 96222 | From Texas | Registered: Feb 2001
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lpkayak
Honored Contributor (10K+ posts)
Member # 5230
posted
lyme dad -i don't have anything new to say...just hang in there and good luck. my 20 yr old daughter is in total denyal and refuses to even be tested. her symptoms are mood swings and hearing sesitivity. i'm sure she has many others she hides. but i don't know what i can do but be here. if and when she hits the wall hopefully i'll be able to pick up the pieces. god bless you. take care.
-------------------- Lyme? Its complicated. Educate yourself. Posts: 13712 | From new england | Registered: Feb 2004
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I understand how your daughter is feeling. My parents came to help and they could not understand and they wanted to help. So they tried to get me to go out to dinner, grocery shopping, reading etc. There is absolutely no way to try to make someone understand what the brain is capable of doing unleashed, holding the body and soul hostage. The world is either spinning way too fast beyond any comprehension or too slow. Making a decision is sooo complicated, it is torture - so I just put it off, even if it is what I am going to have for dinner. Prety soon she is going to come out of her stupor and digest the fear. She will need not the internet for knowledge. Every day, reassure her of her of her beauty, self esteem and confidence. Be well, T.
Posts: 61 | From cosmo | Registered: Nov 2004
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