-------------------- sixgoofykids.blogspot.com Posts: 13449 | From Ohio | Registered: Feb 2007
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sixgoofykids
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posted
quote:Originally posted by UnexpectedIlls: I am still worried about it being able to help someone who is at 10% functioing VS someone who is 70% or more....
Thanks!!
My husband told me I underestimate how badly I'm doing on a bad day. I generally say I vary from 70% - 98% .... he said 45% - 98% is more accurate. It's still better than 10% ....
-------------------- sixgoofykids.blogspot.com Posts: 13449 | From Ohio | Registered: Feb 2007
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Alv
Unregistered
posted
Sixgoofy !
Do you have to be off antibiotics or supplements completly before you start treatment ...If so HOW long ?
Can you at least take IMMUNE BOOSTERS and cleansers ?
Any input will be apreachiated...
I am more concern about the one that have bartonella and babesia activated -they come back preaty fast.
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sixgoofykids
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I was told by Dr. W. to get off my Malarone and Lariam one week before going. I don't know if it's the same for antibiotics. I was told herbs were fine.
As it ends up, the mold exposure made me too nauseous for the meds and I will have been off them for a couple weeks before. I just started taking my herbs again after having been off them, too, for a couple weeks.
-------------------- sixgoofykids.blogspot.com Posts: 13449 | From Ohio | Registered: Feb 2007
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-------------------- "You'll be surprised to know how far you can go from the point you thought it was the end" Posts: 946 | From Massachusetts | Registered: Apr 2008
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sixgoofykids
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-------------------- sixgoofykids.blogspot.com Posts: 13449 | From Ohio | Registered: Feb 2007
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sparkle7
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posted
I think it's unrealistic to expect that if you go to a foreign country for treatment - that they are going to plan out your trip.
You really have to do the planning on your own. It's alot of work but we are visiting them... If you feel you need a translator, you should make the arrangements prior.
Being in a place where English is not the language can be difficult. You can't expect everyone to speak "your" language. Going to a foreign country for medical care can be stressful. You need to plan it out well on your own.
If you make bad travel plans, I don't think it's the doctor's fault. You really need to have the money to do this properly. I'm sorry that someone here had a problem but you have to make proper arrangements.
You can't go to a foreign country & expect that everyone is going to be helpful. Some people are very nice but you have to do the research & make sure you have everything planned out.
I've been to Europe alot. You need to have an itinerary, extra money, know a bit of the language, etc. It's more involved if you are going for medical help where you may need a special diet, be able to understand the doctor, understand the customs of the treatment protocol, etc.
You really have to plan something like this out. If you are ill, it takes even more planning.
Posts: 7772 | From Northeast, again... | Registered: Oct 2006
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NanaDubo
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posted
I had emailed Dr. W before coming here that I would be stopping antibiotics three weeks before I left and he said that was fine. I ended up stopping 4-5 weeks prior to leaving.
I am thankful for having had a car for the first two weeks. It was nice to be on my on schedule rather than the bus and train schedule. You can get where you want to go with the trains but it was just a personal choice.
I have gotten along fine this last week without a car but would have preferred to have one the whole time. Renting a car in Pforzheim was about 400 Euro for 2 weeks.
The health food store is about a half hour drive from the Klein's guesthouse.
Dr. W's office is about a 20 minute drive.
I no longer have lyme
As soon as I let the notion and feelings settle in, I will write more.
Similar to six, I think I gave my self more credit in terms of how well I was or was not than my friends and family did.
I have been through a lot on this journey and just need some time. I feel very good.
Those of you headed this way, let me know if I can help.
Posts: 1129 | From Maine | Registered: Feb 2008
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BUT how can you be sure you no longer have lyme??? I mean do blood tests confirm this??? I dont want to take away from your excitment in ANY way... but I cant help but wonder... especially if I consider going.
-------------------- "You'll be surprised to know how far you can go from the point you thought it was the end" Posts: 946 | From Massachusetts | Registered: Apr 2008
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sixgoofykids
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posted
Unexpected, blood tests can only confirm exposure. There is no blood test that will show whether you do or do not have Lyme. Dr. W. uses energetic testing. It's a hard concept to understand, for sure, but once you have it done, it's very convincing.
For example, my daughter was getting some twitching. I told her to hold her arm out and I energetically tested her for magnesium. As soon as I had her hold the magnesium, her arm became very weak. She was very curious as to why it became weak as I had not told her anything about what I was doing in advance. (That's not enough details to energetically test .... just enough to understand the story).
So, Nana no longer tests for having borrelia in her body. That's how it's determined whether you are Lyme-free or not.
BTW NanaDubo
Just a note - I have been receiving a lot of PM's as the time gets closer for me to go. As always, I'm happy to answer everyone's questions. However, many of the questions are the same, so if you can, please post them on this thread. I realize some of you are not wanting others to know you are considering this treatment .. in that case, feel free to PM ... but otherwise, please don't think you're question is not appropriate for this thread.
Also, I will be turning off my PM feature when I leave for Germany. I will probably check this thread while I'm gone and I will keep you posted by blog (which I haven't decided where to have it yet .... waiting to see if someone gets a website up and running, as I'd like to use it ... hubby is also talking about getting me a personal website).
-------------------- sixgoofykids.blogspot.com Posts: 13449 | From Ohio | Registered: Feb 2007
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Vermont_Lymie
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posted
Sixgoofy,
Have a great time and enjoy the experience in Germany!
Their bread is the best in the world (beer too, but I guess that is definitely off the menu), so if you can handle the gluten, enjoy the food too!
Please let us know where you will be blogging; I will read about your trip with great interest. Be well.
Posts: 2557 | From home | Registered: Aug 2006
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I am just confused as to HOW you can be free of lyme when everything we know tells us that we CANNOT be rid of it ever....
It gets very confusing for me... I dont know, I am happy for Nana though!
-------------------- "You'll be surprised to know how far you can go from the point you thought it was the end" Posts: 946 | From Massachusetts | Registered: Apr 2008
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Ocean
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posted
nana, I'm so happy for you! hurrah!!!
I appreciate all of your updates, I think we are all excited with your progress in such a short time, it's nothing short of amazing!
sixgoofykids
Honored Contributor (10K+ posts)
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posted
Unexpected, that's why we're looking for alternatives to abx ... we KNOW the best we can get with abx is remission.
Vermont, I can eat gluten now .... but I know Dr. W tests you for foods you can't eat through treatment, with my past gluten intolerance, I am fully expecting not to be able to eat it while I'm there. Hopefully, towards the end.
-------------------- sixgoofykids.blogspot.com Posts: 13449 | From Ohio | Registered: Feb 2007
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posted
i know someone asked this before, but i do forget things and am kind of a spaz...
how much is the bionic 880 if you get one over there, and can you buy it through dr woitzel's office to bring home?
if not, can you have it shipped to his office?
thanks a lot, again
john
-------------------- do your best to educate the rest because 9 out of 10 doctors don't know jack about tick borne illnesses Posts: 437 | From shawangunk mountains, ny | Registered: May 2008
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Ocean
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posted
Just wondering, does anyone know how long Nana has had Lyme? I'm awaiting lab results, but pretty sure I have it, tested postive with electrodermal testing, ect. If I get a positive with IGENEX, then I will know that this is what has been wrong for the past 12 years. Will the Machine take longer to get the Lyme out for someone who has had it for over a decade?
posted
I posted earlier that I was planning on seeing Dr. W on Oct. 23rd, but I'm sad to announce I'm most likely going to push back my appointment.
I feel hesitant to announce how I came to this decision, but I hope you'll all keep an open mind.
I started seeing a Dr. B--a chiro--that does NAET & muscle-testing a few weeks ago. She works very closely with Dr. H, and he puts a lot of faith in her work. She has been testing me for sensitivities to supplements & ABx, as well as which ABx work or don't work for for borrelia and the co-infections. Dr. H has been more than willing to work with her recommendations in fine-tuning his antibiotic regimen.
With that said, she muscle-tested me on Tuesday to see if I was ready to get treatment with 880nm light in 3 weeks, and the answer was a clear no. That was without doing further research on the bionic.
Then in the last 2 days, she watched the video I sent her on the bionic 880 & told me she is very knowledgeable about this "entrainment therapy". In physics, entrainment is the process whereby two interacting oscillating systems assume the same period, and that is what the bionic 880 creates between the organism & the light frequency.
Today, she muscle-tested me again with this knowledge in hand, and she said I wouldn't be ready until the last week of November at the earliest.
Some of you may scoff at how much weight I put in her energetic testing. I would have too a few months ago. I've seen my share of charlatans & money-grubbers & become jaded, but she is clearly as good & as well-respected as they get in this field. She thinks we need to spend the weeks before I go detoxing because my body has a genetic weakness in detoxing (she didn't know this, but my HLA-DR is multisusceptible, so yes i have major trouble detoxing). She was afraid that if I went in a few weeks, my body wouldn't be equipped to remove the pathogens the bionic treatment knocks out.
IMHO, this addresses some of the concerns that Shandy and others have had about the readiness of patients that are well below the 70-80% wellness that gigi, six, and nana are hovering around, for the bionic treatment. And frankly, I would think that if you subjectively think you're at that range, you must be feeling pretty good regardless of what the friends & family say. After all, we know our bodies the best. I would say I'm still at 50%-60% functionality, so for me, doing another 2 full months of detox work before the treatment makes sense.
This is just my opinion, and I'm sure some will flout the rationale behind my decision, but it's objective enough for me. Dr. B believes by going in november of later, I'll be able to knock out the borrelia once & for all. I think so too.
-joey
Posts: 713 | From Los Angeles | Registered: Oct 2007
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sixgoofykids
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Well, Joey, I was looking forward to meeting you over there.
I'm glad you're still planning on going. It makes sense that you would want to detox what's already a problem before you go. That is why I was so glad to have found the mold and to be able to take care of that prior to leaving .... it's one less thing to handle over there. Today is my first day off painkillers in a couple weeks time.
I wouldn't go so far as to say I'm feeling pretty good .... I'm just not feeling as bad ..... if that makes sense. I have felt pretty good, but not lately.
-------------------- sixgoofykids.blogspot.com Posts: 13449 | From Ohio | Registered: Feb 2007
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oxygenbabe
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posted
Joey, your decision sounds good and wise. Your practitioner(s) sound excellent.
Six goofy it will be interesting to hear your report.
Re borrelia gone or not, who knows. If you feel good, that's what counts. Maybe energetic testing reveals whether or not the borrelia is active.
Posts: 2276 | From united states | Registered: Jun 2004
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posted
Have not had time to write as I traveled back home today from Germany.
I felt that I had a duty to inform others who are thinking of going. My intention was not to slag off the doctor, I thought I simply reported what happened . However, I did expect to be pulled over the coals by those who will not tolerate anyone who has doubts or who questions anything here.
Nothing has been said regarding my concerns that I was not told to wait to get my amalgams out before starting treatment and that I very easily may have wasted the money for this reason alone. Has anyone been advised that they are doing it too soon I wonder. I had other worries about my adrenal glands but I felt that was waived aside.
I think that what is becoming clear is that if one is a straightforward case then things are different. And of course those who have improved and were satisfied with things say positive things. I am not satisfied however, and even if my views that doctors who are making a lot of money from their patients and have the ability to help with accomodation problems for international patients through knowing the area and having many contacts especially if one of those patients runs into problems, is off the wall, then that should not mean that my other concerns can be brushed aside. As for the language problem you have to know Germany to understand just how accepted it is for them to speak English in business matters and anyone who is running a clinic is in business. My own German landlord is extremely embarrassed and sorry that he cannot speak much English when dealing with me, but we manage as I do speak a little.
Well I knew I would get grilled. Thankyou for the person who has a little sympathy for me now that I am worse. The doctor is dealing with some very sick patients I presume from what others are saying. In many cases there will not be the need of help to enable people to have his treatment. In serious cases, I think it is pretty hard if a doctor is not willing to go beyond the line of duty. But maybe this is a cultural thing. Maybe this is how it is in the US, if you have money then you can pay and you don't expect any help from a fellow human being. It is not like this in England where I know a doctor who takes some very sick patients into her house to treat them and I have been treated myself for free at a time when I had no money.
I gave the doctor a chance to negotiate with me but he says I must communicate now in German. I said I would put my experiences in public which I have already said I felt a duty to do so. I think there are some serious questions about when a patient is ready for treatment and are in a place where they can respond. I had 2 treatments and felt nothing apart from an improvement in my wrist pain which leads me to think that the treatment is effective. Another thing I noticed is that my small red dots on my skin went really dark red during treatment with the BIONIC.
I think that caution is needed till more very ill people report back.
Posts: 148 | From europe | Registered: Apr 2008
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posted
Mati, You are worse now than before you left?
-------------------- "You'll be surprised to know how far you can go from the point you thought it was the end" Posts: 946 | From Massachusetts | Registered: Apr 2008
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posted
Yes the pain in my wrist and arm are worse, I can barely use my arm now. It did improve then it got worse. My knee joints are worse too. For a couple of days last week i had trouble walking, they have never been as bad.
Posts: 148 | From europe | Registered: Apr 2008
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Angelica
Unregistered
posted
Gigi what is in the Biologo Detox? How much does it cost roughly?
posted
Mati, sorry you didn't get what you hoped from the treatment.
I think it is beneficial to know that if one can't complete the treatments entirely, that there is a risk of feeling worse, so thanks for sharing that.
I wonder if it's similar to not completing a course of antibiotics so all you do is activate the lyme and make it worse.
I wouldn't go unless I had ensured I could complete all necessary treatment.
And if you do have a doctor in England who personally cares for patients in her own home, that is an extremely rare thing -- I know of none where I am who would do that.
Posts: 590 | From Canada | Registered: Oct 2007
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sixgoofykids
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I don't know why he would have told you to wait till you had your amalgams out if he didn't think it was necessary for treatment. Nana didn't have hers out and did fine with treatment.
Again, I am sorry for your bad experience. You are right, here in the US we do not expect to have that kind of help from a doctor. In the US we expect to have to do our own trip planning.
I don't know what you mean by very ill patients. I am still disabled by this disease, so I am far from healthy. Yes, I have good days and I have even had days where I have a normal energy level and can be normal. I have even had extended periods like that.
More recently, whether it be the mold exposure and the detox from now being away from the mold, or whether it be from being off antibiotics for a couple months, I feel bad. I estimated myself to be about 70%, but my husband says I'm a dreamer, that it's more like 45%.
I was about 90% right up until I got rid of the mold about three weeks ago. For three days I felt 100%, then I dropped to where I am now. There was a clear relation between getting rid of the mold and my decline. I also have the reaction to cholestyramine that Dr. S mentions on www.biotoxin.info that a Lyme patient will have.
Why do I estimate 70%? Because the "only" symptoms I am having are pain and fatigue. The laundry list of symptoms is gone. I am doing significantly better. Also, I can get up and fix myself something to eat, go to the store, drive the kids somewhere, but generally speaking, when I'm home, I'm lying down. That is my preferred place to be - on the couch or in bed. I am pretty constantly in pain and on painkillers.
I have hit 98% twice during treatment and maintained it for a time ... even a couple months.
This time my decline coincided with getting rid of that mold .... there is a clear relation between the two.
I am telling this information so that all of you have an accurate picture of where I really am in my treatment. If you have questions about it, please ask.
If I see the same results as NanaDubo, I will consider this the miracle treatment.
-------------------- sixgoofykids.blogspot.com Posts: 13449 | From Ohio | Registered: Feb 2007
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lymie_in_md
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posted
Mati, whats done is done, money spent and lost, forget about it. I'm really sorry you had these issues. I also think Dr. W. has a protocol that is uniquely helpful for removing lyme and it will show out in the end.
I also don't as group it would be useful to point fingers at Mati on this. Instead lets take a more helpful take at it. Lets try to understand Mati's situation and try to better advise through it.
I know from my history the dental side is crucial. I posted my experience in another thread about amalgam removal. Also drainage to ensure kidneys, liver, spleen and pancreas are clear. With that in mind Mati seek out a biologic dentist that can cover these areas. As well as cavitations and TMJ disorders. This will take some research on your part.
I haven't done the bionic yet, but I know in my case the bionic would not have put me in remission until the dental portion was taken care of, that I'm sure of. According to my DDS and Doctor my TMJ was severe and the severity was caused by 4 cavitations and the cavitations were exascerbated by having mercury amalgams for way too many years.
One cavitation took me 8 weeks to heal, thats how toxic it was.
And hopefully everyone agrees we should help support Mati through this.
-------------------- Bob Posts: 2150 | From Maryland | Registered: Dec 2007
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Angelica
Unregistered
posted
I agree with you Bob. I think for whatever reason maybe the fact that many of us have Lyme we jump all over each other too readily here and sometimes say things we should not or later regret. We can point things out without making anyone feel raked over the coals.
Just maybe this disease will have some sort of good influence on all of us in the long run and teach us all some more compassion for other humans no matter what they are saying or where they are coming from.
None of us are perfect yet or even come close to it.
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posted
All the evidence points to this Tx as worthless! Clancy's husband got worse and the thread was removed. There are German threads that talk about how this Tx doesn't work, yet there still remain some Believers that keep pushing this nonsense.
Now there is another poster that reports failure with this Bionic light hocus pocus. This post will probably be removed like any other negative comments keep getting deleted, but hopefully some people will read it before it's gone and will not waste their time and money on this thing.
Amalgams, heavy metal issues, and all the rest of the explanations as to why this Tx fails is nothing more than excuses. If it worked, then it would work no matter what. Many have got well without detox, amalgam removal, or any of the other things that these crooks use as reasons for Tx failure.
Sixgoofykids, I hope that you give this Tx a fair evaluation which would mean getting off of all abx. There's no doubt in my mind that you will go downhill rather quickly if you do. It would be great if you do get your own website so that you will be able to tell the truth about your experience without it being deleted by the people that control this website.
Posts: 134 | Registered: Feb 2005
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sixgoofykids
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I have to agree, Bob, that dental issues are critical.
I didn't have to have the same work as you, but I had my TMJ fixed as well. Mine was a matter of wrong placement. I went through three years of dental work to get it fixed - splint, then braces.
Also, I had my amalgams out back in 1991. It's not that I don't think it's necessary .... I was just saying that if Dr. W didn't think it was, then he wouldn't have brought it up. Nana, plans on doing dental work when she gets back, but she did do well with treatment while she was over there. (I'm so excited for her I can hardly stand it, LOL).
I hope nothing I have said has been construed as being critical of Mati.
-------------------- sixgoofykids.blogspot.com Posts: 13449 | From Ohio | Registered: Feb 2007
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GiGi
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posted
With only two Bionic880 photon treatments, it would seem to me from all I have heard, also from other doctors using the photons, that the treatment is incomplete. Probably, the pathogens were activated with the first and second and then stopped before the job could be finished. I imagine it's like doing half a surgery, I imagine. It is no surprise that the doctor was trying to find his lost patient calling half around the world!
But it seems to me is a clear indication that the photons work (as if I had ever doubted it!) In fact I saw it work on my own body when I played with the instrument on my sick foot and got a bull's eye a couple of hours later, even though I had been well for many years. It helped me to get rid of some residue hiding under my big toe, I guess.
I also learned early on that once the Lyme nosodes are on the body, the photons have to be applied right away also. Several factors are at work.
Take care.
I would like to also clear up that lab tests are done before and after the treatment. Unless this has changed. One is an LTT test and another one is a serological test (the latter one is quite expensive and we turned it down; the LTT test is most reasonable). I am not going into details why this is done alongside the energetic testing, it's best to find out from the doctor's office.
The energetic testing is done or was done when we were there with a Biocom 2000. You can google and probably find a photo of one. Things change, doctors change or get different ideas. So that's the way it was in July when we were there.
I did not see Dr. W. muscle testing. or any other form of kinesiology. For a quick check he uses the Biotensor. This is where I turned on to using it -- it is a great self help tool -- I watched him getting these quick answers to questions he had, and I wish I had learned it years ago when I was first introduced to it by a Klinghardt therapist. Now I use it daily.
Take care.
Posts: 9834 | From Washington State | Registered: Oct 2000
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posted
I am very concerned about what Ticktoxic and Mati have to say and hope that this is taken into consideration... I know I like to look at ALL ends of this and not just the "it works"...
I am saddend that this has made 2 people WORSE...
I really wanted to believe in this.... I am not so sure now.. I will keep an eye out on others experiences.
-------------------- "You'll be surprised to know how far you can go from the point you thought it was the end" Posts: 946 | From Massachusetts | Registered: Apr 2008
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sixgoofykids
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posted
Ticktoxic, I am posting elsewhere about my treatment over there, but not for fear of it being deleted, but rather that I want to be able to point family, friends, etc. there and at the same time be able to point all of you to it as well. I also don't want it to be a discussion and there is no blog feature on this website.
And, just to clarify, Clancy's husband is doing much better. He is having the work done here (by that doctor that starts with an "o", LOL, Lyme brain, I can't remember what it's called). Nana know's Clancy and I'm sure she'll pass on any info that Clancy is willing to share.
I AM off all antibiotics. I have been since July. I have gone downhill, lest you think I don't really have Lyme. I have a CDC positive WB (IgG, 8 bands).
I take no offense at your negative opinion. But, let's be accurate ... Mati was not a treatment failure any more than someone who ended abx too early would be. Mati did not finish the treatment.
So far we have GiGi's husband - miraculous cure
Clancy's husband - improving, still off abx
NanaDubo - cured, she feels "very good"
Mati - quit treatment due to non-medical related issues
-------------------- sixgoofykids.blogspot.com Posts: 13449 | From Ohio | Registered: Feb 2007
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sixgoofykids
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I am sorry about the mix up I've made with energetic testing and muscle testing .... I was using the two inter-changeably. Thanks for clearing that up GiGi.
-------------------- sixgoofykids.blogspot.com Posts: 13449 | From Ohio | Registered: Feb 2007
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Ocean
Frequent Contributor (1K+ posts)
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posted
Orthopedic doctor I think you mean, Six! I've had a terrible time remembering words today too!
oxygenbabe
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posted
Gigi's husband-----what symptoms is he experiencing now?
I really just want to hear about symptoms, how you *feel*, at this point, not what you feel it is due to. If you test positive for lyme and you're healthy as an ox, running marathons, the picture of vitality, who cares if you were exposed to lyme as your body is handling it?
If you feel you are negative for lyme but have all kinds of symptoms that you feel are due to heavy metals or fungi, anyway, I'd just like to know about the SYMPTOMS.
It sounds like Nana needed her appendix out anyway and for that alone this trip and good doctors were very useful.
Posts: 2276 | From united states | Registered: Jun 2004
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I'm glad to hear that you are giving it a fair test! I do not doubt that you have Lyme, even before your report.
I would guess that Nanu is still doing other Tx? Plus people should know that Dr W does multiple Tx protocols on his Lyme patients, one of them being IV ozone, which is very effective against Lyme. There would not be any reason to do these other back-up Tx's if the 880 did work.
Clancy's husband is probably back on abx too? And he probably did get some benefits out of the IV ozone and other non Bionic 880 Tx's. Good luck with your trip!
Posts: 134 | Registered: Feb 2005
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sixgoofykids
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posted
No, I said Orthopedic doctor a couple pages ago and was corrected! Osteopath, maybe???
Ticktoxic, my understanding is that Clancy's husband is NOT on abx. Nana would have to confirm that though.
Nana also was NOT on abx, just did Dr. W's treatment. She is now finished and leaves Germany soon, so her supportive therapies are also now finished.
If IV ozone were enough on its own to cure Lyme, surely people would be using it and getting healed. The treatments he uses are for support, to help eliminate toxins, etc. Most of us do this kind of thing in conjunction with abx or other treatment protocols anyway. It doesn't mean the abx don't work.
O2babe, are you asking me about symptoms? Pain - shoulders, neck, back, all left sided (I have "fibromyalgia"). Also, once in a while knee pain and headache. Weakness. Fatigue. Insomnia (though it's getting better). Spleen pain. Air hunger (improving drastically). Loss of appetite. Poor word recall. Nausea.
-------------------- sixgoofykids.blogspot.com Posts: 13449 | From Ohio | Registered: Feb 2007
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posted
TickToxic said "There are German threads that talk about how this Tx doesn't work,"
WHere are these threads?? I want read both sides
-------------------- "You'll be surprised to know how far you can go from the point you thought it was the end" Posts: 946 | From Massachusetts | Registered: Apr 2008
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There are alternative Dr's that are having great success with IV ozone as a stand alone Tx against Lyme. The problem with it is that it doesn't work against some of the aerobic infections that most people get with BORRELIA...ie..Babs and Bart; just like HBOT (Hyperbaric) fails against these aerobic pathogens.
Posts: 134 | Registered: Feb 2005
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Ocean
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posted
Oh, whoops I first thought osteopath and thought, 'nah most of them are regular MD's nowadays, probably an ortho doc!
Glad he's getting help and I feel confident that this technology will help six and whoever else may be going over at the same time!
Also, I was positive with a Bionic machine with the dermal testing last year, so I probably definitely have Lyme?! I am sure I do, but got tested from IGENEX just to see and waiting for results. It's my family who poo pooh's that I have Lyme, my dad especially, just thinks I'm tired from the kids and anxiety is caused by worrying.
lymie_in_md
Frequent Contributor (1K+ posts)
Member # 14197
posted
Ticktoxic -- as far as the LNE crowd who cares, not one of them as offered a single thought on how to get rid of lyme beyond ABX -- imo. And the german post is pretty valueless imo. It doesn't really state pro or con to any depth. If you go to the updated thread same post, they are off trying to buy an 880.
LNE would rather spend their precious time bashing lymenetters. Their choice, pretty sad and pathetic in my estimation.
As far as proof of LED use in healing, there is just way too much positive clinical evidence of it. Just take some time and look, just google "nasa LED" or try this link for size:
Now ticktoxic with this one link, I've proven light as healing modality. I want to see a specific counter argument. And yes I'm challenging YOU to show me a scientific study, not your opinion it doesn't work. Actually take the link to LNE, let them debate over it. Maybe it would give them something useful to do for a change.
-------------------- Bob Posts: 2150 | From Maryland | Registered: Dec 2007
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posted
There was a thread that was translated from Germany about the treatment and it didn't work for those that used it.... That has GOT to be taken into consideration...
I don't think excuses should be made for WHY it didn't work, but just that It DIDN'T work. This could be very harmful for many, by giving out false information and false hope.
I am not disagreeing that this works at all... I just think some need to be careful with saying that this is 100% cure for lyme disease. As far as we all know there is NO cure and certainly no cure in 3 weeks time. I would love for someone to prove me wrong, but for now I think I have made my decision not to waste my family's money.
So far I ahve read more negative reports than positive, and feel that the negative stuff just gets tossed to the wind as if it didnt happen... there is a red flag.
I wish everyone the very very very best with getting this done in Germany!!
-------------------- "You'll be surprised to know how far you can go from the point you thought it was the end" Posts: 946 | From Massachusetts | Registered: Apr 2008
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sixgoofykids
Honored Contributor (10K+ posts)
Member # 11141
posted
Do you have a link to a thread with evidence that it doesn't work Unexpected? I'm wondering because I have seen claims it doesn't, but never by someone who tried it and had it fail.
I read all I could prior to making my decision.
-------------------- sixgoofykids.blogspot.com Posts: 13449 | From Ohio | Registered: Feb 2007
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posted
Six I read the link provided by Ticktoxic... It is a little ways down on the page. I know you have read everything you can, and I trust you and your judgement.
Actually on that thread one said it made them much worse even after using it for a while
-------------------- "You'll be surprised to know how far you can go from the point you thought it was the end" Posts: 946 | From Massachusetts | Registered: Apr 2008
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I totally agree that infrared light has some healing properties, but the healing power that it has proven so far for has only been for what I would call minor injuries such as skin burns, skin cancer, some eye injuries, and even hair loss.
IR light does not have the power or capability to penetrate more than about 1/2 inch below the skin. There are varying opinions on how far exactly it can go; the makers of FAR IR saunas will claim that it can penetrate up to 3 inches in some cases, but they don't produce any valid research to support their claims.
Believe what you want, but all the claims that the Bionic 880 works against lyme are pure testimonials. If that's good enough for you, that's fine. I am not a "Believer", and I especially can't stand the way that any negative comments about this device are deleted by the moderators. This behavior wreeks IMO.
As far as the German thread being worthless; I could make that same claim about the supportive threads for the 880 and lightworks that are on Lymenet . I would love to see sixgoofy just get the 880 Tx and skip the other 4 or 5 modalities that Dr W uses. This would be a true test. I'm sure that she will see some initial improvement from the IV ozone that will give her a false impression of success.
There probably is some benefit from the 880 Tx's as far as detox or immune support, just like there is from IR saunas, but photons do not have the ability to destroy Borrelia, Bartonella, Mycoplasma, or Babesia organisms, and they surely will not penetrate far enough into the body and all the vital organs to get at all the pathogens even if they could destroy them.
Posts: 134 | Registered: Feb 2005
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sixgoofykids
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posted
Oh, yes, I read that. Two on that thread who didn't get better. One got worse but said it wasn't necessarily the machine.
No one is discounting or ignoring the evidence. We are just discussing the treatment modality. Some of us are trying it out. I don't see how this discussion is harmful. All Lyme therapy is experimental.
No one claims it has a 100% cure rate as you mention.
If you are seeing red flags, then maybe it's not right for you.
It's not a hardship for me to go over there and have the treatment done. If I were in the situation where it was a hardship, I would still be waiting to see the results for more people I know.
So far, to me, it looks promising. I'm willing to give it a try and I'm very hopeful.
-------------------- sixgoofykids.blogspot.com Posts: 13449 | From Ohio | Registered: Feb 2007
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sixgoofykids
Honored Contributor (10K+ posts)
Member # 11141
posted
For the record, the moderators are not the ones deleting the threads about the 880 .... it's the people who started the threads.
I would never consider going all the way to Germany to only get the Bionic treatment and not the supportive therapies. Dr. W has come up with a system that works, and I'm going there to be treated. I'm not going over there to prove whether it does or does not work. I am going over there in hopes I get better.
The information you state about penetration is inaccurate.
Here is a Pubmed study about infrared light being used to treat Parkinson's. I don't think you could describe Parkinson's as a minor injury. http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/18440709
The link Bob posted talks about the light and how it works. It also mentions that there will be MS studies in addition to the Parkinson's studies.
Please post accurate information. It's a waste of everyone's time to have the correct the inaccuracies.
-------------------- sixgoofykids.blogspot.com Posts: 13449 | From Ohio | Registered: Feb 2007
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lymie_in_md
Frequent Contributor (1K+ posts)
Member # 14197
posted
There is a person documented from Ohio who had alzheimers went to the U.K. and was treated for alzheimers. 3 weeks after treatment he went from not able to handle a fork and knive to again functional enough to drive a car. Unless you believe alzheimers is just a minor injury, I would say that is significant. Not the 880 but the power of LED technology.
I believe this technology is in it infancy. In other words there is more to discover.
I also talked with a manufacturer who sells a powerfull LED device similar to the bionic 880. He stated the scientist he works with believes based on frequency and output power the LED has a transmission ability of 9 inches into the body.
The science or understanding the science isn't completely understood yet. We need to look to those who have the disposable means to help us find out. And let me ask you TickToxic, if six comes back in remission, would you just think that luck. And by the way, I don't care if there are combo ingredients as part of the solution. If it is a solution leading to remission aren't we all for it?
-------------------- Bob Posts: 2150 | From Maryland | Registered: Dec 2007
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It is accurrate info as far as penetration...as I said, there are varying opinions.
I disagree about the posts and threads deletions. Yes some were deleted by the oringinators, but some were erased completely without a trace, and this is something that only the moderators can do. Just Julie had some negative comments removed by a moderator just last week as far as I know.
My posts are a waste of time? Then don't read them. That's why I usually stay away from reading the Bionic 880 and Lightworks threads.,,,,they are a waste of time IMO. But unfortunately for me, I ventured to take a look at it today and felt a need to warn people who get taken in easily by these sorts of claims. I'm sure that my posts today will be a refreshing change for many that only read, even tho they will infruriate "The Believers"Posts: 134 | Registered: Feb 2005
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I first thought osteopath and thought, 'nah most of them are regular MD's nowadays, probably an ortho doc!
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